Valid Apple Anthracnose Treatment?

[CiderSupply.com]

This last weekend I had a conversation with a local chessnut and apple orchardist concerning cutting out anthracnose and cankers to stop trunk and large branch damage from continuing girdling the trunk or main branches. Cutting or burning out cankers is very destructive to the tree and does not work well. This is because the canker follows the cambium considerable distance above and below the visible canker just to blow-out the following year.

During the discussion he said he uses an old method from 1800s Europe where he packs the canker and above and below the canker area with soil and mud and wraps with cellophane (instead of burlap and leather). The 2-inch thick soil or mud pack is left on the area for one year. When removed the canker damage is permently stopped dead in its tracks from growing larger by following the cambium.

Apparently the natural bugs and organisms in the soil effectively prey on the canker bugs so to speak in the bark and dead trunk material. But more importantly the soil stimulates the tree to send rooting chemicals to the soil pack area (canker area) that by coincidence also fights and prevents the canker from traveling farther through the cambium. The canker is blocked within the capillary paths by rooting compounds. After one year the soil pack is removed before any real root initials are started and the area returns to trunk behavior instead of rooting behavior.

I find this at least logical, and will try it, but I am really interested if anyone has tried this approach or have heard about it. Especially from my Peers in cider apple tree growing.

Best regards
Chris Rylands
Renaissance Orchards

[Patrick Mann]

I'm also experimenting with this method - started last year so still too early to really assess its effectiveness.

I actually found a report on a somewhat scientific trial - though I seem to remember that it was conducted on nut trees - that reported good results. Unfortunately I can't provide a link.

In some places it's also customary to use mud as a wound sealant when grafting, which seems consistent with the anti-bacterial claim.

Doesn't hurt to try. I wouldn't be suprised though if results varied, since the local soil organisms will be different from place to place.

Patrick

1785 Cider

[bryanhart]

I had a discussion with a tree surgeon a few years ago when we had a problem with honey fungus on a cherry tree. If you don’t know honey fungus it spreads through a cherry tree causing weeping wounds through the cambium and eventually the tree rot’s and dies from the inside. It’s modus operandi is different from a canker but there is no modern treatment.  

He told me a story of the old days where woodsmen would look for other fungi in the woods, cut out sections with a root and strap / graft the fungi to the honey fungus. The combinations of mitochondria interacted and mitigated the effects of the honey fungus and eventually the fungal strings through the tree change and the effects of the honey fungus is reduced and eventually eradicated. I tried this method and it worked.

This just demonstrates that some of the old practices to tackle problems may still be valid in a world where the first stop is chemicals and sprays. I am going to try this canker treatment on a tree I have in mind as I am loathed to spray with Bordeaux mixture or such like. From Patricks note it may be a while before I can report any outcomes.

 

Brilliant forum by the way guys, I learn so much every week.

Bryan

Chiltern Cider

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[Charlotte Robinson]

Skyrmes Kernel

We have identified what we think are two trees of this variety using Ray William's key.  Both are relatively young trees   which w taken as grafts from two differe old North Devon orchards.   Our tree was mis-identified as Tommy Knight and the other never had a name. T wenty years ago  information was less available let alone coloured photographs, although these can also be misleading.

I understand that it is a very uncommon apple in the UK, although an old variety.  However it appears to have been exported to the US in the 1940's. I understand that Berwood have re-introduced  it but have not been in touch.  It  is sharp, with out much bitter and as a late apple is valuable. Any thought very welcome

Charlotte

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[CiderSupply.com]

Thanks Patrick and Bryan, I'm glad to hear that there seems to be some background to this. I also will try the process on a few cankers and see if the damage stops in its tracks. I was especially surprised about the fungi approach for cherry.

I know that the orange Lobster Mushrooms in the supermarket are not an actual mushroom but a different mushroom that is attacked by an orange predatory fungi. I may this season sacrifice one of these mushrooms with the orange fungi and put it in a blender with some water and paint a tree that has anthracnose and see what happens. Maybe out of a streak of luck the orange fungi will go after the anthracnose?

[jitd...@aol.com]

Would these sorts of treatments be of any use against what we in the UK call apple canker (Neonectria ditissima)?  

JD

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[CiderSupply.com]

You know I am not sure but worth a try, if you do let us know how thigs went.

[Gloria Bell]

Manure has a high bacterial count and aged has high fungal count.  It also used to be used to wrap in with a graft wound or any wound.  When I branch renew, I take ground and rub it into the cut.  Competitive advantage.  Less likely hood for bad pathogens to adhere as there is more other strains already present.  They tend to like a clean slate...
Has worked for me.

[Charles Claus]

Very Interesting - anyone else fighting "bad guys" with other "guys?"

Charles

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[Les Price]

I'm on my third year of using green teas and compost teas. It's been a steep learning curve with plenty of bad information online. I got interested in this for 2 reasons, one I have ongoing battles with Anthracnose and prior to 3 years ago I was using a lot of nasty stuff that would leave my orchard in a sterile state, Oxidade, Thyme oil, etc. These things definitely killed the active Anthracnose but trying to come up with a program to re inoculate the orchard showed me that the cure was worse than the disease.

Anyway, in my experiments with teas I started having very, very healthy trees. 

I really like using the green teas as I have a lot of accumulator species growing, as weeds of course, on the farm. Nettles, Horsetail, Knotweed and garlic are my mainstay plants. I actually freeze large amounts of these so that I can start brewing and get an early jump on my spring sprays before these weeds start to grow naturally. 

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[Gloria Bell]

Thanks Les!

Charles - I like to think of competitive advantage much like having a good biome around to help ward off the baddies.   Using manure or effective microbes (I also use liquid kelp) does a similar thing.  Colonizes the area.  Plus manure and/or kelp, or any biodynamic paste, should help feed the cambium directly and if its in a paste form it will for longer. I've seen some big cankers begin to heal and many heal over in time completely.  Of course it's not something you do once and maybe not applicable commercially.  When I see a canker I always remove the 'scab' bark and let the sun in too before I paste it.  There's almost always some larva living in there too.  I don't wrap with anything like plastic.  Just manure/kelp/EM and if you want to a sticker like local clay you can but if it rains a lot - it has a limited lifespan.  Tried adding some white paint in there and that works too - just not as breathable and I'm not sure it helps quite as much.  Breathability I think is part of the healing process

[O K]

A few years ago, a farmer originally from the SW UK, told me that it was an old practice to push some soil onto cuts, when removing canker as the organisms in the soil would swamp the canker. I’ve been trying this since, and usually the tree heals over. I don’t have many affected trees, and overall I only have about 30 trees in total , so it’s easily manageable for me.

More recently, on some younger trees, I’ve started using the fermented nettle soup that Les mentioned below, (as a spray and a feed about 3 times during the season). The trees seem to be more vigorous and healthy but I’d need another season to be sure about this.

Olly

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[Charles Claus]

Here in the Pacific Northwest of North America we have lost more apple trees to Anthracnose Canker than anything else.

I think this approach is exciting.

Any other similar stories out there of fighting canker along these lines?

Charles

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[Miguel A. Pereda]

When I need to prune branches of a certain thickness, I use moistened earth or clay to paint the cut section. I have been doing it this way for years and for me it is the best and most effective healing paste there is.