Re: [Cider Workshop] WAS: Labels (how much sugar for fizz)

[Nat West]

On Sat, Jul 24, 2010 at 4:01 AM, <r_curtis_ha...@hotmail.com> wrote:

By the way, I would be interested to know how much sugar you add to give the fizz. Last time I added sugar at 6 grams per half litre (27 bottles had 6 oz in total) and this is way too much. Even after weeks in the fridge and very careful handling and opening it fizzes like mad and disturbs the sediment.

Andrew's book and site says 10g per liter but I have found that to be too much. Or at least my American-conversion of it is too much (a little over 1 1/2 tsp per 750ml bottle). I wonder if maybe half that would be good.

-Nat West, Portland Oregon

[Andrew Lea]

On 25/07/2010 00:19, Nat West wrote:

>
> Andrew's book and site says 10g per liter but I have found that to be
> too much. Or at least my American-conversion of it is too much (a little
> over 1 1/2 tsp per 750ml bottle). I wonder if maybe half that would be good.

That's a fair point. If you use a cultured especially a champagne yeast
and it scavenges all that sugar you will get lots of fizz. With weaker
wild yeasts which give up before it's all consumed I think you get
rather less. Remember the whole exercise also depends on how much
residual (sub-saturation) CO2 is already left in solution (because you
are essentially adding to that) and so how the bulk has been stored. If
the cider has been stored at ambient pressure for a while before priming
you may get less fizz than if you try to prime it immediately because
some of that dissolved CO2 may have dissipated.

Andrew

--
Wittenham Hill Cider Pages
www.cider.org.uk

[ja...@ashridgecider.co.uk]

How much is too much? (Fizz) Different champagne method producers will have
their own desired amount.

I think it is normally measured in Europe as bar pressure and there is a
neat gizmo to measure this by plunging a long needle in through the cork.

If you are using a "wild yeast" fermentation for the first fermentation the
wild yeasts often leave some sugars unfermented. I find it important to have
the cider analysed before secondary fermentation to see what sugars remain.
As Andrew says, the champagne type yeasts are much more aggressive and will
scavenge for any remaining fermentable sugars. The one exception being
sorbitol in Perry. I think I am right in saying that this sugar which is
always in Perry is unfermentable even with a champagne yeast.

So in summary have your cider analysed if you want a constant amount of
fizz, take off the grams per litre of sugar remaining and add accordingly.

I use 20g/l. total so if there is 5.5.g/l in the cider I add 14.5g/l sugar
for 3 to 4 bar final pressure after disgorging.

All the best, Jason

________________________________________
Ashridge Cider
Barkingdon Farm
Staverton
Totnes
Devon TQ9 6AN
Tel/Fax: 01364 654749
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E: ja...@ashridgecider.co.uk
W: www.ashridgecider.co.uk

Andrew

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[Andrew Lea]

On 26/07/2010 09:10, ja...@ashridgecider.co.uk wrote:

> sorbitol in Perry. I think I am right in saying that this sugar which is
> always in Perry is unfermentable even with a champagne yeast.
>

That is correct. Sorbitol is a polyol (sugar alcohol), not a sugar, so
it is not fermentable by any normal yeast. Sorbitol is widespread in
Rosaceous plants (and is actually the means by which carbohydrate gets
from the leaves to the fruit. When it gets there it is converted to
normal sugars and starch). It occurs in apples but to a lesser extent
than in pears (about 25%). It is higher in plums and cherries.

Andrew