Sparkling Cider w/ Residual Sugar

[Mike Rose]

I've probably read "The New Cider Maker's Handbook" 3-4 times already, but I wanted to double-check my assumptions with bottling a cider w/ residual sugar.

Is it safe to assume that over a span of 20 days the gravity drops 0.001 (5 FSU) that it's safe to bottle?

I recently discovered Domaine Dupont's Cidre Bouché (http://www.calvados-dupont.com/en/cidre-bouche.htm) — a keeved French (Normandy) cider that's simply amazing. I found with my own apples that a good amount of residual sugar is required to help balance the high acid and tannins. This year I got a good semi-dry cider at 1.010 (without keeving), but probably bottled it too late to get the amount of bubbles I like.

On Domaine Dupont's website they give away a lot of variables. Starting gravity of 1.060, bottled at 1.024, and with a final ABV of 5.5%. It's easy to figure out that the final gravity is 1.018 based on the starting gravity and final ABV. Based on the gravity drop (0.006) and the amount of carbonation it as (somewhere between pétillant and full sparkling) it looks like they also bottle around 5 FSU? 

OG 1.060

BOTTLE 1.024

FG 1.018 (based on 5.5% ABV on bottle)

Is this a safe ballpark to assume? I usually bottle with 900g champagne bottles and have no problem opening a few 1, 2, and 3 months in to test the progress. I just want to be sure I'm not way off base with my assumption.

Also, regarding this passage in the book: "The ciders for which the method may be suitable are those where the fermentation speed is between 4 to 7 FSU while the SG is between 1.015 and 1.025."

Is there any reason why you wouldn't do with with an SG higher than 1.025? Say in the 1.030-1.040 range? I ask because I started a late season cider at an OG of 1.085, taking it down to 1.025 wouldn't make it pretty strong. :)

Thanks!

Mike

Sault Ste. Marie, MI

[Claude Jolicoeur]

Le mardi 17 mars 2015 09:47:35 UTC-4, Mike Rose a écrit :

I've probably read "The New Cider Maker's Handbook" 3-4 times already, but I wanted to double-check my assumptions with bottling a cider w/ residual sugar.

Is it safe to assume that over a span of 20 days the gravity drops 0.001 (5 FSU) that it's safe to bottle?

There is a little more than just 2 SG measurements, because of lack of precision of hydrometers. Ideally, you should plot the fermentation curve and the FSU curve, and extrapolate from these curves where the fermentation will stop naturally. The 4 to 7 FSU is a guideline.
 

On Domaine Dupont's website they give away a lot of variables. Starting gravity of 1.060, bottled at 1.024, and with a final ABV of 5.5%. It's easy to figure out that the final gravity is 1.018 based on the starting gravity and final ABV. Based on the gravity drop (0.006) and the amount of carbonation it as (somewhere between pétillant and full sparkling) it looks like they also bottle around 5 FSU? 

They would also do a yeast cell count on the microscope. They know by experience how many cells per ml they need to get just the right fizz, and will either add dry yeast if not enough, or filter if too many.
 

Is this a safe ballpark to assume? I usually bottle with 900g champagne bottles and have no problem opening a few 1, 2, and 3 months in to test the progress. I just want to be sure I'm not way off base with my assumption.

I would suggest you make your first trials bottling at fairly low FSU (i.e. 4 or 5) and low SG (1.015) - you might not get as much sparkle, but this is on the safe side. And as you gain confidence and knowledge in the way your ciders behave, you can start bottling at higher SG anf FSU to get more fizz and more residual sugar.
 

Also, regarding this passage in the book: "The ciders for which the method may be suitable are those where the fermentation speed is between 4 to 7 FSU while the SG is between 1.015 and 1.025."

Is there any reason why you wouldn't do with with an SG higher than 1.025? Say in the 1.030-1.040 range? I ask because I started a late season cider at an OG of 1.085, taking it down to 1.025 wouldn't make it pretty strong. :)

Try it! But then have some test bottles that you keep at room temperature - test one a month, and if it gets too sparkling, then you'll need to hurray drinking it all!

Claude

[Mike Rose]

There is a little more than just 2 SG measurements, because of lack of precision of hydrometers. Ideally, you should plot the fermentation curve and the FSU curve, and extrapolate from these curves where the fermentation will stop naturally. The 4 to 7 FSU is a guideline.

I did graph the SG measurements of this years cider, basically copying what you had in your book (http://d.pr/i/113cx). I think the second racking wasn't necessary, as combined with the cold (30-40F) for that long period of time, it brought the FSU way down. Next year I'm going to let it get cold again, but hopefully with a slightly higher FSU, then rack in the spring once it warms up and gets moving again.

Is there a FSU where you usually rack and then start to look for this 4-7 FSU range. For example if it was 50 FSU and you rack does that generally bring you down to 5 FSU. I know there are 100 variables in this procedure — I'm just looking for observations through experience and general guidelines.

  

Try it! But then have some test bottles that you keep at room temperature - test one a month, and if it gets too sparkling, then you'll need to hurray drinking it all!

I think I will. If it doesn't work out, it will be good practice for next fall. Have you done any high alcohol and sweet/sparkling ciders? I'm trying to estimate what ABV I should take it to. The juice is very high tannin. This is my current plan:

Starting: 1.085

Bottle: 1.035

Final: 1.030 (7.2%)

I have some other cider fermenting along with it that was a much nicer 33 brix, I'll let that one stay as the traditional ice cider.

Thank you very much!

Mike 

[Claude Jolicoeur]

Le mardi 17 mars 2015 13:12:36 UTC-4, Mike Rose a écrit :

I did graph the SG measurements of this years cider, basically copying what you had in your book (http://d.pr/i/113cx). I think the second racking wasn't necessary, as combined with the cold (30-40F) for that long period of time, it brought the FSU way down. Next year I'm going to let it get cold again, but hopefully with a slightly higher FSU, then rack in the spring once it warms up and gets moving again.

For my part, I would have made the first racking earlier, maybe around 1030-1035 - speed would have started to slow down earlier. But now you are there at 1010 - this is a bit low to have both residual sweetness and sparkle. If you take 5 point for sparkle, you will be at 1005, quite dry. You could add sugar before bottling though. It is good also to plot the FSU, gives a good view of the evolution.
 

Is there a FSU where you usually rack and then start to look for this 4-7 FSU range. For example if it was 50 FSU and you rack does that generally bring you down to 5 FSU. I know there are 100 variables in this procedure — I'm just looking for observations through experience and general guidelines.

As you say, this is highly variable. But going from 50 down to 5 in one racking is asking a bit much. Maybe to 10 or 15 after the racking, then it will slow down by itself as the yeast die and population decreases.
 
Claude