Why a Mystic?
Ariel
Why would a person venture down this road.
Maybe the sound of the word is enough for some people. a Nice title of
some sort. There should be a big gap between Christian philosophers
and Christian mystics. I, for one, struggle to separate the two. a
Mystic should LIVE his believes and somehow this life should manifest
in society as a whole - I don't see that happening!
What is happening to a mystic on his travels - Is there somebody out
there with expierence and some modern day
travel scars to show.
I know there is a lot to learn from yesterday's mystics. But, there
are a lost generation or two out there that needs a way to follow, not
old dusty books to read.
I think to be a real Christian mystic is to be one for the sake of
other people that are not prepared to walk down this road. To go out
there and find answers to questions not yet asked, to leave markers on
this road for others to follow - without signing your name.
I think a real Christian mystic is somebody that influence everybodies
lifes but who nobody willl remember - only your fellow wanderers.
soma
are applying out of the rut thinking, new thoughts away from
prejudice, ignorance and manipulation of modern thought.
Christ taught us that God is love, and we saw a sample of it in his
compassion and suffering for the mediocre sinners in this world.
Through Christ a new concept of God emerged because prior to him most
people feared God. This teaching of love is more demanding and more
important than his other lessons because it is the main belief of all
Christians. I believe that Christian Mysticism is an inner path to
understand that meaning of love. Love maintains our sense of unity
with a presence and power that is greater than what we think we are.
Mysticism is an experience of that unity and love that can't be placed
with words so people try to describe the experience or how to obtain
it. This might be new to some people and it might be dismissed as New
Age similar to what I am sure Jesus experienced with his teachings. I
think the experience says it all. thinkunity.com
Salutations to the divinity within you.
Art as Servant
Have you had a chance to read through the Purpose ad greetings page?
http://groups.google.com/group/christian-mysticism/web/the-purpose-and-greetings-page-start-here?hl=en
Paul Kiler
On Dec 21, 2:49 pm, Ariel <j...@duvenhage-net.com> wrote:
soma
On Dec 22, 11:07 am, Art as Servant <paul.ki...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Great thought shere, and appreciated...
>
> Have you had a chance to read through the Purpose ad greetings page?http://groups.google.com/group/christian-mysticism/web/the-purpose-an...
Peter VanGee
There should be a big gap between Christian philosophers
and Christian mystics.
Ariel
> one with God then Christian philosphy should lead to mysticism.
and "discuss" mysticism, then you are busy with Christian Philosphy. I
used to do that a lot - not very satisfying. Christian mysticism is a
path and it is the footsteps on the path. Mysticim is all about the
journey and not about a destination.It is like SOMA said:"I believe
that Christian Mysticism is an inner path to understand that meaning
Along the way you will expierence the power of being able to love
people you don't even know and the most wonderfull experience of all,
to receive the ability to exept real love from others. - I need this
stuff to be practical, or else I'll just be another religious dude!
And religion sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Peter VanGee
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Chuck Neville
describe existential relation with God but to me that
seems all that there is when it comes to spirituality.
You can't know what needs to be known just with your mind. Your mind
needs to be illuminated by the Spirit.
But we can point the way and can proclaim that we have been illuminated
and encourage others to search
in silence for the living God who will not ignore us.
Chuck
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Ariel
> needs to be illuminated by the Spirit.
> But we can point the way and can proclaim that we have been illuminated
> and encourage others to search
> in silence for the living God who will not ignore us.
Ja! I love this!
It is so difficult to get out of the traps your own mind is laying
down for you. You are so right - My experience was that the Spirit
illuminated the traps for me long before I could see anything else. It
is sort of a strange experience,for a while I felt realy lost and
alone somewhere on a far away planet. But as you so rightly said: "the
Living God Who will not ignore us.", was there, waiting.
I guess we should never give up searching even when we think we found
something.
Every little Spiritual gem we find is a clue for the next journey.
> >http://groups.google.com/group/christian-mysticism?hl=en.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Ariel
> 3) Religion is awesome. Merry Christmas
>
> Know the Lord,
>
> Peter J. VanGee
>
Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.
Napoleon
>
> On Thu, Dec 24, 2009 at 12:40 AM, Ariel <j...@duvenhage-net.com> wrote:
> > > I don't understand the need for a gap. If the goal of our faith is to be
> > > one with God then Christian philosphy should lead to mysticism.
> > How can philosphy Lead anyone to mysticism? If you only "think about"
> > and "discuss" mysticism, then you are busy with Christian Philosphy. I
> > used to do that a lot - not very satisfying. Christian mysticism is a
> > path and it is the footsteps on the path. Mysticim is all about the
> > journey and not about a destination.It is like SOMA said:"I believe
> > that Christian Mysticism is an inner path to understand that meaning
> > of love." With "love " the traveling mode and not the destination.
> > Along the way you will expierence the power of being able to love
> > people you don't even know and the most wonderfull experience of all,
> > to receive the ability to exept real love from others. - I need this
> > stuff to be practical, or else I'll just be another religious dude!
> > And religion sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> > --
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Peter VanGee
Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.
The rich that Napoleon speaks of are already dead. Do me a favor. Don't be a dick your whole life or you'll end up just like them.
Ariel
> > The rich that Napoleon speaks of are already dead. Do me a favor. Don't
Hey man
Relax ! No harm intended.a Smile now and then is a good thing.
I wonder at what stage religious people lose there sense of humour.
Maybe it is a sin?
But seriously now - I AM SORRY PETE !!!!!!!!!!
Art as Servant
It's great having our conversations, isn't it...?
And we are discussing subjects with multiple levels of meaning, and
words with many meanings to many people...
My wife and I struggle through words sometimes, She didn't learn
English until she was an adult, and from baaaadd English teachers
too...
Her English has improved drastically since she came to the US, and now
after several years of marriage, our arguments over what was meant by
a word have lessened, but they still happen occasionally...
The word "religion" is one of those nebulous words. I didn't know
that I was or wasn't a "Religious", when I was asking for prices for
something, and the person to whom I was talking to came from
Catholicism.
That was a completely new application of the word for this WASP. Of
course, I could be described as a religious person, but not according
to the imposed definition being employed by my interrogator.
Only by His Marvelous Grace,
Paul Kiler
Ariel
English is not my first language and it is difficult sometimes to
express your feelings and thoughts in a other language.
So please pardon my grammer and spelling.
It is great talking to you guys, although I am sitting on the other
side of the globe in 35 degrees C with a fan running.
But, ja, back to our topic, I guess.
Ron Crawford
sucks then 84% of the American population sucks. I guess it depends on your
definition of religion. What is your definition Ariel and Peter. As far as
mysticism that is just one of the charisms that God has afforded us to
obtain, just like teaching. So where does the conflict of religion come in,
you sem to confuse me. I feel at times that I have the charism of
mysticism,but am not absolutely sure, Yes I do wake in the night to pray for
people that I do not know but are in great pain, and yes I have been given
there name to pray for and what there pain is. But you confuse me with the
word or definition of religion.
Ron
Napoleon
--
christian-mysti...@googlegroups.com.
Paul Kiler
Can I assume you are all Catholic, or of what faith are you?
WASP here...
you seem to confuse me.
My thoughts too, the word has as many meanings as people that use it....
"Mystic" too, has many aspects and meanings to people, doesn't it...?
I feel at times that I have the charism of
mysticism,but am not absolutely sure,
I'm not so concerned as for Mysticism being a charism, so much as it is a lifestyle, a way of being and interaction with God by being in intimate harmony and communication with God.
I was watching a new version of the Ten Commandments last night, (on my less than favorite Christian Television Broadcaster...), but I paid attention to the scene when Moses was at the Red Sea, before parting it. When God Spoke and said, "You know my voice".
To me, that is Mysticism, Knowing the Voice of God.
Back to the Word, "Religion"
I've heard many times something similar to the quotes below:
Quote #1 Religion is man's limited attempt to reach out and understand God. Spirituality is God reaching down to man and inspiring man's mind to understand and know Him. God is a Spirit the only way to relate to God is spiritually, the word spirit in the ancient Greek text means "life". Being religious is following after a religious teaching about God. Being spiritual is seeking after the truth to know God, to know life. So, if want to "know" God you have to learn to "know" Him on a spiritual level. If you want to know "about" God then you join a denomination or some religious sect where men will teach you "about" God.
Quote #2 "What is the difference between religion and spirituality?"
Spirituality comes from within you. Religion comes from outside of you.
Re: quote #1: If we use those definitions for a moment, I actually think that both approaches are valid and needed, We need to learn about God, (Religion), and we need to relate to God spiritually (Spirituality).
This is the essence of my Greetings page thoughts.
But Still, going beyond this definition, "Religion", can mean many things, let's be charitable with each other, and allow for multiple definitions due to frame of reference, and understandings of Language...
Ariel
No I am not catholic.
I guess you can call me Kingdom minded rather than denomination or
sect orientated.
Above all I cherish a personal relationship with our Creator and
Father! No human made organisation or fellowship can replace that.
I am certain that you have the "charism of mysticism". And be sure of
it - it is because of your relationship with Father God and not your
church membership.
I myself belong to a church, a reform church as old as our nation!
But .......I am part of the congregation because their systems and
programs stood the test of time.If something needs to be done, there
is a comitee to do it with al the necessary knowhow to make a succes
of it.a Well run church can make things lot easier - If you want to
serve your community in one way or the other - you will find a place
somewhere in the church structures. It is a nice social club,a place
to receive teaching and where you can make new friends.
It is a place where your need for human contact and fellowship can be
met.Human beings need this kind of interaction. But sometimes the
system becomes God and people will defend this human machine with
everything they got because their own identity is interwoven with it.
But it can never replace a one on one relationship with God,never.
Your spiritual growth depends on this relationship with God. It
becomes a way of life, overshadowing al other traditions, thoughts and
actions. You start to life your life according to this relationship,
your business practises change, your relationship with employees
change, There is a subtle change in the way you treat your immediate
family.
This IS NOT A CHANGE because you repented your sins and became a new
man. That allready happened a while ago. This is something new.
Just keep on going.
If you receive a prayerlist with names and stuff, use it as a tool.
What happens WHILE you pray for this people is the real mystic
experience,because you are talking to God about other people and their
problems.
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Ron Crawford
or Jesus Christ built and wanted churches for the reason of worship and
community of those that loved each other and called family? Yes I believe in
the charism of mysticism and feel that there are those that have that God
given ability. But prayer plays a very important part to that and without my
one on one time with my best friend Jesus Christ the mysticism would not be
possible. I teach and I learn of God and the Gospel at my Church, I have
those that I pray for always and worldly things that I pray for, I spend at
least three hrs a day in meditation and prayer and some days this is
accomplished in the churches adoration room or in my quiet area of my house,
as you can se by the time I have been awaken to the desire to be with God
and pray, meditate and now discussion with you.I feel my inclusion and
involvement within the Church strengthens my relationship with God, just as
my work with certain orders of Sisters, and their missions and their
spiritual guidance leads me to a deeper relationship with God, and to the
mystic possibilities.I am not saying I am a mystic but I have seen things or
predicted them before they occurred and I know the words were from God. I
know I pray for people I do not know but that I do know of there pain, this
too must come from God, I know my prayers have been answered maybe not
because of me but just because God is always listening.I have at times been
able to see the outcome of someone's illness but not mine? Maybe that is
what God intends. I picture myself as a spiritual being on a human journey.
Different than most and it is how I live that human journey that is the
deciding factor, but my spiritual being directs or can if allowed my human
journey. Thanks for the discussions, I appreciate and enjoy them.
ARIEL
If you are happy in your church, work hard to keep it like that
You are one of the lucky ones, I guess
How does the rest of your congregation feel, If they agree you surely
have a winners recipe.
> athttp://groups.google.com/group/christian-mysticism?hl=en.-Hide quoted
soma
quiet, God speaks. With that said, I feel the ideas and convictions in
the mind help us to find a meaning in life that enables us to find our
place in this vast universe. If we are convinced that our ideas make
sense, they will give us a positive attitude that can withstand the
most incredible difficulties. Usually, we don't seek out a philosophy
or contemplate about the meaning of life and its perplexing and
painful experiences until suffering comes our way. To avoid suffering
and to make our life healthy, happy and whole, I feel to study
regularly mentally expanding material and to consistently place our
minds in optimistic producing situations help so the intellect is
quiet and God can speak. Contemplation and learning are two examples
that can draw out the best in the mind. Education enables one to
concentrate upon and solve the difficult problems of life before they
arise.
We can hire others to work for us, to take care of our physical needs,
but there are some things we must do ourselves. We must set ourselves
right, put ourselves in harmony with life. This change of
consciousness does not come by wishing or just studying, but by going
through the layers of the mind and realizing that pure consciousness
binds everything together in one complete aggregate within us. This
spiritual experience and first-hand knowledge of what is true and real
is the way to find peace and comfort. All great religions say we need
peace of mind, but it means nothing unless we experience peace of
mind. What peace does for the mind must be done through the mind.
Religion can help some, but I don't think it is necessary.