Does AB 705 disallow even offering pre-transfer level math?

[Nick Strobel]

My college's throughput rate for pre-transfer level math is less than starting out at transfer level math. AB 705 says we cannot place students in pre-transfer level math. Can we even give students the option by offering/scheduling pre-transfer level math courses in fall 2022? My admin says no, we cannot even offer students the choice to take the courses, so we have to delete them entirely. Is this true?

[David Morse]

Actually, to be clear, AB 705 did not say most of what is being said to colleges now.  Here is the link to the bill text: https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=201720180AB705.  It said that “A community college district or college shall maximize the probability that a student will enter and complete transfer-level coursework in English and mathematics within a one-year timeframe” and that we cannot place students into remedial courses unless “placement research that includes consideration of high school grade point average and coursework shows that those students are highly unlikely to succeed in transfer-level coursework in English and mathematics.”  That is pretty vague language, giving no definition of highly unlikely.  The current idea that we have to get rid of all remedial courses and cannot even give students the option is an interpretation coming from the Chancellor’s Office, and one that I do not think is supported by the bill language that was passed into law. Of course, there can always be new legislation that really does outlaw remedial classes, which I fear is a real possibility, but that is not what AB 705 said.

 

David W. Morse, PhD

Professor of English, Long Beach City College

President, Academic Senate for California Community Colleges 2014-2016

(562) 938-4458

 

 

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Date: Wednesday, March 9, 2022 at 12:14 PM
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Subject: [Google Group CCCSenates] Does AB 705 disallow even offering pre-transfer level math?

 

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My college's throughput rate for pre-transfer level math is less than starting out at transfer level math. AB 705 says we cannot place students in pre-transfer level math. Can we even give students the option by offering/scheduling pre-transfer level math courses in fall 2022? My admin says no, we cannot even offer students the choice to take the courses, so we have to delete them entirely. Is this true?

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[Nick Strobel]

While I agree that there's a significant difference between the language of AB 705 and how it's been implemented by the CCCCO, it may be irrelevant now since College Promise and SEAP funds are tied to AB 705. My question should be "does the CCCCO disallow even offering/scheduling pre-transfer level math courses in Fall 2022 so we have to delete them entirely?"

[Freitas, John E]

The maddening thing is that there is the provision in AB 705 that exempts students who have goals other than transfer, and intermediate algebra remains the graduation requirement.  This exception even remains in the new AB 1705 (https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml?bill_id=202120220AB1705). So, what are we going to do for our non-transfer CTE students who don’t require transfer-level math to complete their degrees?  And if they never had Algebra II, in high school, then what?

 

 

John Freitas, Professor of Chemistry

Los Angeles City College

Articulation Officer

DAS Parliamentarian

323-953-4000 ext.2605

frei...@lacitycollege.edu

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