Altrenative Litter Materials

[Teoman Naskali]

I know this is off topic, but i do believe the people subscribed to this would be extremely interested.

Where i live the granules cost quite a bit, about 40 usd for 1lbs. (Cartridges also cost the same) And my cats manage to spill out about 1lbs in 2-3 months.

So i decided that this not acceptable spending, so i started trying out some other materials for the litter.

Renting a house that had already everything (including full kitchen) i found some old corn kernels ready for popping. (1 usd per 1lbs) and i pured those in. Results were good, backtracking was quite low. I was very happy with the result, however, occasionally when the machine is working i can hear that some corn gets in to the blades of the flushing motor and makes it a bit noisy. And i am worried about the blades getting damaged.

So i tried putting some red lentils in. They seem to be more friendly to the blades, back tracking is ok, slightly less than original plastic granules. However, when they are wet,  they change surface texture which makes them a bit sticky. So the scoop end up pouring quite a bit in to the device to be flushed with the excrement.

Then i found some old rice. I believe that it is rice that hasnt been %100 processed and it still contains the shells for the granues. I was hoping for these to work better (because of the more shiny shell). And they are doing ok but becasue they are lighter i get a lot more back tracking compared to the plastic granules.

To sum it up:

1 - Corn: Good but may harm the blades.
2 - Red Lentils: Ok, but some get poured in to the machine with the excrement.
3 - Rice with Shells: Lots of backtraking too light a material.


So no i am looking for the ideal orgnaic litter, some red lentil sized stuff that have a shell like corn would be ideal. Preferably ones that you can buy from the supermarket.


What have you experimented with?


Teoman

[Michael Conner]

Teoman,

I also have been searching for an alternate. There  are several 

reasons that I don't like the oem litter. First it's flat, rather than 

round.   2nd it's too expensive, and 3rd no matter how many 

cycles I run the Cat genie there's that odd smell.

In the mean time I made a few changes to my litter approach. 

For about a year now, I only place about 1/8 ht inch of the oem 

litter. This does help drain the fluids faster and I seem to have

a better clean & dry cycle. And it might be tracking less. But I still 

have a long cloth floor mat in front of the litter box. 

The only round plastic substitute that have found so far that I found that works are the round bards from a Hobby shop. The beads have a hole in them  and there used for making items like necklaces and bracelets.

My objections are, there too expensive and the hole is a concern because bacteria might be able to survive the clean and dry cycle.

But, as an experiment these little colored beads worked well. 

My first test was a 50 / 50 mix of the oem and the colored beads. 

The colored beads track much less and the Cats don't seem to object to the colors. Oddly enough the colored beads will move the center of the bowl in the cleaning and drying cycle. 

The solids, being damp, will still stick to the beads but not quite at the level of the oem litter, which might be because they are round

My house is so air tight, that I usually scoop the solids if I know...

I've been looking for round plastic litter because of how they fit next to each other, like marbles or ball bearings. Topically called "Body centered Cubic" or another "Face centered Cubic"

Round "Beads" or Organic litter will allow the liquids drain faster and that's my 2nd goal, first being a litter that's low cost !!

Since it's Summer and I'll prob have more time to deal with this irritation, I'll be looking into a better Sphere. 

But, now you have me wondering about the smaller beans that need to be soaked for hours prior to cooking. I'm going to check our local fee tore and ask them what they have in stock.

I'll post me findings, good or bad..

Michael....

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[Robert Deliën]

> I know this is off topic, but i do believe the people subscribed to this would be extremely interested.

No problem; We're all interested.

> Renting a house that had already everything (including full kitchen) i found some old corn kernels ready for popping. (1 usd per 1lbs) and i pured those in. Results were good, backtracking was quite low. I was very happy with the result, however, occasionally when the machine is working i can hear that some corn gets in to the blades of the flushing motor and makes it a bit noisy. And i am worried about the blades getting damaged.

Size matters. I nearly killed my pump motor by using a bag LittlerFree granules I still had laying around. The LitterFree was the predecessor of the CatGenie and it uses significant larger pellets. A couple wedged into the hopper grinding mill, blocking the motor, almost burning it out.

The size should be small enough to pass through the hopper without change of blocking the mechanism and large enough not to pass through the bowl slits. Around 3mm should be fine. The granules' density should be high enough to make them sink in water.

> So i tried putting some red lentils in. They seem to be more friendly to the blades, back tracking is ok, slightly less than original plastic granules. However, when they are wet, they change surface texture which makes them a bit sticky. So the scoop end up pouring quite a bit in to the device to be flushed with the excrement.
>
> Then i found some old rice. I believe that it is rice that hasnt been %100 processed and it still contains the shells for the granues. I was hoping for these to work better (because of the more shiny shell). And they are doing ok but becasue they are lighter i get a lot more back tracking compared to the plastic granules.

I would stay away from anything organic, like seeds and stuff. No matter how they are processed, they will turn into mush sooner or later.

> To sum it up:
> 1 - Corn: Good but may harm the blades.
> 2 - Red Lentils: Ok, but some get poured in to the machine with the excrement.
> 3 - Rice with Shells: Lots of backtraking too light a material.
>
> So no i am looking for the ideal orgnaic litter, some red lentil sized stuff that have a shell like corn would be ideal. Preferably ones that you can buy from the supermarket.

To be honest: I have used nothing but original granules. Alternatives may be cheaper to buy, but having them sent to Europe makes them just as expensive as the original. I have considered small flint glass beads, often used as boiling beads in the chemical industry. They're inert, smooth and the round shape makes them stick less, because there are no sharp edges digging deep into the paws. But getting a bowl full will cost a fortune and their extra weight may strain the motors. As soon as I can find a cheap supplier, I will give it a go.

You can find a cheaper alternative in fish filter material, or surplus injection mold beads:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-lbs-Black-plastic-pellets-Sinking-Rock-tumbling-Cornhole-bag-Bio-filter-media-/221418389835
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-lbs-White-ABS-Resin-plastic-pellets-beads-Sinking-bio-filter-media-Corn-Hole-/371061436506

Good luck and please keep us posted!

[George Scott]

You can find a cheaper alternative in fish filter material, or surplus
injection mold beads:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-lbs-Black-plastic-pellets-Sinking-Rock-tumbling-Cornhole-bag-Bio-filter-media-/221418389835
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-lbs-White-ABS-Resin-plastic-pellets-beads-Sinking-bio-filter-media-Corn-Hole-/371061436506

I've been using cheap injection mold ABS pellets like these off eBay for
over 2 years and they work/perform just like OEM pellets at a fraction of
the cost.

George

[Teoman Naskali]

You are right about the mush issue, but when that happens the device usually gets rid of them. The other granules crush them and they are ejected with the wash cycle. My cats usually end up emptying the litter before there is any mush formation :S

[Jason Floyd]

The cat genie pellets claim to be biodegradable and septic safe, are you worried about flushing all the plastic?

George

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[Robert Deliën]

> The cat genie pellets claim to be biodegradable and septic safe, are you worried about flushing all the plastic?

 

They probably are. But 'biodegradable' means that they break down in 8 to 16 weeks under composting conditions. This propertie only involves people with a sceptic tank. And even then I still wonder if they really break down there.

 

One thing you can be sure of: ABS, polycarbonate and polystyrene don't break down for sure. PLA may become prematurely soft and mushy later.

[George Scott]

“Claim” to be, being the operative word here!  I have found pellets in my yard years later (I have had a CG since they came out) and no break down what so ever.  I hate the idea of sending any kind of plastic to land fills, but I don’t believe one kind or the other will not make any difference at that point.  And people with a septic, still doesn’t matter because they are NEVER going to fill up a septic tank before the next time you have to have it pumped anyway.  And guess where that pumped tank goes?  Where I live, it goes right to the place everyone’s sewer lines end up.

 

I would love to see proof there is anything good or biodegradable about those pellets....  My 2 cents of course......

 

I have a design for an alternative type of litter device that would not send even one pellet down the drain, just no time to build the prototype.  Maybe some day.

[Robert Deliën]

I'm with George here; If you fill up your sceptic tank with CatGenie pellets, you've got different problems. And the claim is highly dubious indeed. The only realy biodegradable plastic I know is PLA. I use it in my 3D printer, but it is in fact too biodegradable to be of any use outdoors or in wet environments. I once printed a coffee mug and decided to use it for a day as a gag. After the first use, the plastic had softened already. And after a ride in Square Betty (=diswahser), it was completely limp. My point being: Real biodegrable plastics are unsuitable for the box and suitable platics are not biodegradable.

[Michael Conner]

The cat genie pellets claim to be biodegradable and septic safe, are you worried about flushing all the plastic?

No, I don't see how the original cat genie pellets are Bio-degradable. 

I keep aprox 1/8 inch of their pellets in both CG litter boxes. My Cats, all four, don't seem to track the pellets nearly as bad as what I've read. 

I don't have to re-fill either litter box for several moths. Plus  I've stored their pellets in glass water filled jars, nothing seems to be dissolving. 

I do have a new septic system, and I do exercise caution to what goes in the drains !!  But, a very small of plastic litter is a minute quantity to what some many flush down their drains that are certainly not bio-degradable.

I've been interested in the Pellets used in injection molding, but what I desire are round pellets - So I am still searching.

For Me, the keys elements of a suitable pellets replacement is, 

Low Cost, Round, Non-Toxic. Non-Toxic is not often mentioned, but Cats do Vigorously wash their feet.

Michael

On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 4:27 AM, Robert Deliën <rob...@delien.nl> wrote:

I'm with George here; If you fill up your sceptic tank with CatGenie pellets, you've got different problems. And the claim is highly dubious indeed. The only realy biodegradable plastic I know is PLA. I use it in my 3D printer, but it is in fact too biodegradable to be of any use outdoors or in wet environments. I once printed a coffee mug and decided to use it for a day as a gag. After the first use, the plastic had softened already. And after a ride in Square Betty (=diswahser), it was completely limp. My point being: Real biodegrable plastics are unsuitable for the box and suitable platics are not biodegradable.

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[Teoman Naskali]

Catman,

I am getting a good 3d printer next month. I would be more than happy printing any designs and sending them to you.

[Teoman Naskali]

I have lentils in the unit now, red lentils. Although they have not gone mushy yet, the have broken up a bit. But the worst part is that there is a lot of backtracking. The lentils stick to the cats feet. I had close to 400gr of lentils in the unit, and in about 10 days half of it is gone.

I had very good results with corn, but i am worried about the blades being destroyed. You ideally want something that has a shiny outside layer. I have some quinowa that i got, but that is a bit too expensive over here.


How much does that metal shaft/blades assembly cost?


I now have bird seed that i want to try, but i will wait for the lentils to completely dissapear.

Teoman

[John Morgali]

Whats this about a metal shaft and blades assembly?  I would like more info on this, I seem to have missed it.  

John Morgali
www.morgali.net
425-628-4643

[Teoman Naskali]

It is the main shaft of the pump.

If you open up the unit, it is where the shit is dumped. YOu can pull it out, it has a couple of tabs and when you undo them you get access to the part that I am talking about.

[Teoman Naskali]

I tried bird seed for a while, the type for small canaries. And it caused a lot of backscatter.

now i am back to corn (popcorn). It seems to work best for me so far.

[Teoman Naskali]

This is what it looks like.

I also find that the large granular structure of the corn somewhat limits the blowdried excrement from flying out of the machine in a fine plume. (As can be visible on the corner of the picture).

[Michael Conner]

Corn is a good idea, but I think your correct. 

I'm going to have to stop at a nearly Injection Molding Plant to see if obtaining "Round" pellets is an option. Guess it is time to make the trips too all of the Hobby Shops again.

Michael..

[Teoman Naskali]

I have noted one thing,

Lentils are good, corn does create some logs so i wont be using it anymore.

When using organics, if you have a blockage/ malfunction/ delay you need to address the problem immediately. If left soaking it really does create a mess.

On Monday, 12 May 2014 20:29:11 UTC+3, Teoman Naskali wrote:

[Sa Vocat]

Has anyone tried anything else successfully? Two of my three cats have pudding for stools on a regular basis and we are losing granules at a rate of 1/3 cup a day.

I'm leery about these ABS pellets backing up my plumbing!

I've heard about biodegradable bags made from corn

[Robert Deliën]

> Has anyone tried anything else successfully? Two of my three cats have pudding
> for stools on a regular basis and we are losing granules at a rate of 1/3 cup a day.

Pudding, right? I'm not coming to diner to your house, that's for sure ;-)

But seriously; This group is dedicated to CatGenius, alternative firmware to operate your box. So you many not get many responses to side topics like this, even though we're all interested in using alternative granules. You many find more information on pellet alternatives here:
http://www.litterbox-central.com/litter-box/catgenie

> I'm leery about these ABS pellets backing up my plumbing!

Personally I haven't got any experience with alternative pellets. I still use original pellets because most alternatives need to be shipped from the US to Europe and will end up being just as expensive.
The original pellets are bio degradable, but I don't think they break down quickly enough to prevent clogging. Bio degradable usually means that they break down in 3...4 months under composting conditions. In a cold wet sewer that may take years.

> I've heard about biodegradable bags made from corn

Again, no experience here, but I would stay away from seeds and any other biological material, unless you're prepared to refresh the entire contents every week or so. Seeds tend to go mushy when emerged in water; That's what evolution taught them to do.

[Greg Moeller]

I know I'm resurrecting a very old thread but all the source material has vanished (cat litter central)

Is anyone using alternative granules?  What have you tried?

I found this on eBay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-lbs-Washable-Genie-Crystals-Sani-Kitty-Cat-Litter-Granules-Replacement-/190683570342?var=&hash=item2c65a060a6

$42 is a bit much for plain ABS pellets but a good price for Cat Genie magic granules.

[Robert Deliën]

> I know I'm resurrecting a very old thread but all the source material has vanished (cat litter
> central)

Yeah, it's a real pity.

> Is anyone using alternative granules?

Nope, I'm using original granules only.

> What have you tried?

I have tried the bag of LitterFree granules I still had around, but those larger granules wedge themselves between the impeller and the hopper case, seizing the pump, overheating the pump motor and possibly ruining it.

> I found this on eBay:
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-lbs-Washable-Genie-Crystals-Sani-Kitty-Cat-Litter-Granules-Replacement-/190683570342?var=&hash=item2c65a060a6
> $42 is a bit much for plain ABS pellets but a good price for Cat Genie magic granules.

Not to mention the additional $66.25 it costs to ship 10lb of dead weight transatlantic to The Netherlands. That basically sums up why I haven't tried any alternatives: They're just too expensive. I'm all for alternatives, but to me they're a means, not a cause ;-).

[Teoman Naskali]

Check out the makerspaces.

They have abs and pla that looks to be the same size.

3d printing guys extrude it to make filament.

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[Greg Moeller]

You need to buy something else and have them use the ABS as packing material!  :)

Actually, Teoman's idea might help you, there has to be Maker groups doing their thing in Europe, maybe hunt around to see what they're doing for ABS.

[Benjamin]

Ever since switching over to the CatGenius firmware I have used Safflower bird seed instead of granules. The seeds work great, they don't track as much as the original pellets and they don't smell while drying (an issue I had with the original pellets). I haven't had noticed any rotting seeds either after in the 2 (?) years that I've been using them. 

[Jason Floyd]

Seeds that you provide water and heat (cleaning cycle) don't germinate and sprout?  

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[Teoman Naskali]

If you do not clog the machine, they should not be wet more tgan a few minutes at a time.

If you have a blockage... you end up with a bowl full of mush.

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[Benjamin]

Even with occasional clogs its not been a problem yet. The seed is sold as bird seed at my local grocery store. Perhaps it is treated so that it wont sprout? I add seed to the bowl occasionally because some gets flushed and the cats kick some out. Then every 6 months when I take the thing apart to clean it I toss the old seeds and put new seed in.

[Benjamin]

This is the exact seed that I use. Locally it is $5-$10. 

http://www.amazon.com/Kaytee-Safflower-Seed-5-Pound-Bag/dp/B0002DKBGI

[Cassie Humphreys]

I totally forgot about trying safflower seeds. Thank you for posting this. I have officially bought some, and been going strong for a month now. I just love using safflower seeds. Less is tracked from the litter, and I feel better not putting plastic down into our waterways.

Anyone out there wanting to give it a try, I say go for it!

[Kyle Kimsey]

I might give those a go. I'm currently using the plastic pellet needs you can get in bulk from plastic supply. They're used for injection molding and work great. I think 5lbs is around $20/shipped and I'm not even close to running out.

[Robert Deliën]

> I might give those a go. I'm currently using the plastic pellet needs you can get in bulk from plastic
> supply. They're used for injection molding and work great. I think 5lbs is around $20/shipped and
> I'm not even close to running out.

Am I missing half of the dialog? Couldn't find anything in my spam filter though...

[Michael Conner]

Robert,

I think this was part of several of His emails... However, I'm also using similar ABS pellets, sort of Almond shaped. The pellets work well and do not stink

RE a new CG-120 Controller Board. I'm working on two unrelated designs. An you'll be pleased to know I've decided to utilized the Raspberry Pi controller board. Once I get some of the basic features operating , including the Bluetooth link, I'll move to the Camera and  start experimenting with movement ans recognition. 

Michael.  

[Teoman Naskali]

Sounda good.

Think about adding a fan with a hose,  where the hose is fed to an air vent. On minimun power during standby, low to medium if device waits between visits. And full blast during the drying phase.

What will your raspberry pi be doing? Are you designing a full blown controller? Or using the existing controller but sending the commands over the serial port?

Keep us updated and feel free to bounce back ideas.

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[Teoman Naskali]

I had intention of adding an arduino based webserver that would log the visits and such but then i could not think of a single use for cat excrement data. :)

[Jason Floyd]

Keeping track of your cat's litter box usage pattern might be able to help alert you if to possible medical problems earlier if there's a change in the typical pattern.

[Teoman Naskali]

I would think that eating pattern and weight tracking would be better.

And with current sensors on device you have no means of distinguishing between cats (if you have more than one).

[Mark Magness]

I've been using safflower seed for about a week now, off the back of the comments on this thread. Seems to be working fantastically! It doesn't track as much or smell as bad when being dryed. I'll post again if I get any issues with it.

[Jason Floyd]

Careful not to overload it, my first bowl full of them had too much and they never dried and all started sprouting.

On Mon, Mar 14, 2016 at 3:11 AM, Mark Magness <magne...@gmail.com> wrote:

I've been using safflower seed for about a week now, off the back of the comments on this thread. Seems to be working fantastically! It doesn't track as much or smell as bad when being dryed. I'll post again if I get any issues with it.

--

[Teoman Naskali]

The problem i had with corn is that if for some reason the machine soes not dry it it quickly turns to mush

Sent from my iPhone

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[Mark Magness]

It seems to be drying ok, I've just filled it to the normal level that the granules should go up to.

[Mark Magness]

I was wondering with corn whether a fault condition could occur where the hot air blower was on but the bowl stopped turning, thus resulting in the corn actually popping :D. I have a popcorn popper which is basically a hot air blower.

[Teoman Naskali]

Mine never popped. I do not think that the air is hot enough. Hair dryer vs hot air gun, not enough heat in the air.

--

[Cassie Humphreys]

I've been using 1/2 Safflower & 1/2 Cat genie granules. I use to use 100% Saff, but it kept clogging the hose and needing a big pull apart & clean. I also had to replace the hopper impeller, cause it got too clogged and broke the stem. The 1/2 mixture has been working great. It saves money and reduces tracking. 

    

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[Ryan Bernard]

My first round of using safflower seeds ended poorly. I loaded the machine to the fill level with the seeds. I noticed some started to turn brown right away. After a couple weeks, they were all brown and then the machine clogged up and I had to empty everything out and give it a good cleaning. I'm trying again now with a smaller amount of seeds. Any further advice on how to best use (avoid clogs) the safflower seeds or other biodegradable products would be appreciated! After years of using the plastic granules I've finally realized how terrible they are for the environment (I don't believe they break down to anything other than smaller pieces of plastic).

[Jason Floyd]

My first time with safflower was the same experience. Discoloration, and even sprouting. I believe it was due to simply adding too much (also filled to the line).  

I started over with 2/3rds or so of the original amount and things are working much better a month later. 

[Mark Magness]

Strange, I'm still running with the same batch of seeds with no problems at all. Differences in available seeds perhaps?

[Benjamin]

I have used several different bags of the Kaytee brand seeds. They have sat in water for extended periods of time, but I haven't had any problems with them becoming soggy or discolored.
One problem I do have is clogs, which I have attributed to the larger size of the seeds and sharp edge. I have a hose connected to a tap nearby that I use to push water back through the drain hose to clear the clogs quickly.

[Michael Moore]

http://www.amazon.com/Purrfect-Pellets-Replacement-Granules-Automatic/dp/B01C4FI3AM

Not sure if anyone has seen or tried those.  Think I'm going to use the seed mentioned previously since I'm on septic and these don't mention being biodegradable, but I thought others might be interested in it.

[Robert Deliën]

> http://www.amazon.com/Purrfect-Pellets-Replacement-Granules-Automatic/dp/B01C4FI3AM
>
> Not sure if anyone has seen or tried those. Think I'm going to use the seed mentioned previously since I'm on septic and these don't mention being biodegradable, but I thought others might be interested in it.

I didn’t see them before, but goods as heavy and cheap like this aren’t worth to have shipped over to Europe, so I’m not going to try. But I’m sure that your tip is useful to many of our US based members. Thank you very much!

What’s important with alternative litter materials is that it sinks, so it will help scraping the bowl clean, and that the pellets are no bigger than the original, so they won’t jam the drain pump impeller. For some people biodegradability may be a point, but the originals degrade so slowly that they many not be called that here in Europe. And the fast degradable PLA gets mushy after a couple of washes.

[Cho Shops]

Anyone try silica gel beads, the round ones not the crystals? I tried the crystals but they tend to clump and not dry well, plus there is more breakage.

[Benjamin]

On Thursday, May 5, 2016 at 7:02:29 PM UTC-4, Michael Moore wrote:

http://www.amazon.com/Purrfect-Pellets-Replacement-Granules-Automatic/dp/B01C4FI3AM

Not sure if anyone has seen or tried those.  Think I'm going to use the seed mentioned previously since I'm on septic and these don't mention being biodegradable, but I thought others might be interested in it.

These remind me of ABS pellets used in injection molding. I have seen people use these as alternatives successfully before. You can get them pretty inexpensively on Ebay, like this listing: http://www.ebay.com/itm/20-lb-Virgin-ABS-resin-Pellets-for-injection-molding-White-Polylac-PA-746-/111984087041

[Michael Conner]

​No, I haven't used Silica.

But I  have been using ABS 3D plastic Pellets. 

They are Almond shaped, white, much larger and dry  quickly. They self drain faster after my Cats urinate and my Cats seem to like them better.

I purchased my supply from,,, "3D Supply Store"  P/N # GP35 for a small 5 pounds bag that lasts me for 3 to 4 months.with two machines and four cats.

Michael

--

[R. Gray]

I realize this is an old thread, but has anyone tried airsoft BB's. They are round and come in different sizes. 

Abbeytoo

On Monday, May 12, 2014 at 10:29:11 AM UTC-7, Teoman Naskali wrote:

I know this is off topic, but i do believe the people subscribed to this would be extremely interested.

Where i live the granules cost quite a bit, about 40 usd for 1lbs. (Cartridges also cost the same) And my cats manage to spill out about 1lbs in 2-3 months.

So i decided that this not acceptable spending, so i started trying out some other materials for the litter.

Renting a house that had already everything (including full kitchen) i found some old corn kernels ready for popping. (1 usd per 1lbs) and i pured those in. Results were good, backtracking was quite low. I was very happy with the result, however, occasionally when the machine is working i can hear that some corn gets in to the blades of the flushing motor and makes it a bit noisy. And i am worried about the blades getting damaged.

So i tried putting some red lentils in. They seem to be more friendly to the blades, back tracking is ok, slightly less than original plastic granules. However, when they are wet,  they change surface texture which makes them a bit sticky. So the scoop end up pouring quite a bit in to the device to be flushed with the excrement.

Then i found some old rice. I believe that it is rice that hasnt been %100 processed and it still contains the shells for the granues. I was hoping for these to work better (because of the more shiny shell). And they are doing ok but becasue they are lighter i get a lot more back tracking compared to the plastic granules.

To sum it up:

1 - Corn: Good but may harm the blades.
2 - Red Lentils: Ok, but some get poured in to the machine with the excrement.
3 - Rice with Shells: Lots of backtraking too light a material.


So no i am looking for the ideal orgnaic litter, some red lentil sized stuff that have a shell like corn would be ideal. Preferably ones that you can buy from the supermarket.


What have you experimented with?


Teoman

[Robert Deliën]

Hi (again and welcome back) Abbeytoo,

> I realize this is an old thread, but has anyone tried airsoft BB's. They are round and come in
> different sizes.

I was not aware they came in different sizes, so I looked it up and currently popular calibers are .177 (4.5mm), .20 (5mm) and .22 (5.5mm). All of those are too large. I once tried to use the old pellets I still had for my old LitterFree, but they jammed between the hopper housing and the impeller, seizing the hopper motor, almost causing it to burn up, hadn't I caught it in time.

Whatever alternative you select, the pellets should be able to travel through the pump freely, in any orientation. So the pellet diameter at the widest point shouldn't exceed 3mm.

Cheers,

        Robert.

[Teoman Naskali]

Have a look at the propeller and components. If the bb pellets will block it. If not the go for it and report back. How m uch dothey cost per kg??

Sent from my iPhone

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[Cathy Johannes]

Someone recently posted the mm size of pellets that could be used in the CatGenie.  I have searched my email, but I can’t find it in my email again.  Would you please repost that again?

 

I have been getting mine from Carl Sievering for years now.  I have never had a problem with what he sends me.  I usually get a colorful mix. I have no affiliation with Carl other than being a repeat customer.

 

He has several different products that work.  He is very helpful at getting you what you want.

 

Here is a link to his eBay store:

http://www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?_odkw=&_ssn=carlsievering&item=230674811343&_osacat=0&ssPageName=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT&_from=R40&_trksid=p2046732.m570.l1312.R1.TR11.TRC2.A0.H0.Xcat.TRS1&_nkw=cat+genie+pellets&_sacat=0

Carl Sievering

ca...@greenhills.net       
660-247-5723

 

I hope this will be helpful ,

 

Cathy   

From: catg...@googlegroups.com [mailto:catg...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Conner
Sent: Sunday, May 8, 2016 9:32 AM
To: catg...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [catgenius] Re: Alternative Litter Materials

 

​No, I haven't used Silica.

 

But I  have been using ABS 3D plastic Pellets. 

 

They are Almond shaped, white, much larger and dry  quickly. They self drain faster after my Cats urinate and my Cats seem to like them better.

 

I purchased my supply from,,, "3D Supply Store"  P/N # GP35 for a small 5 pounds bag that lasts me for 3 to 4 months with two machines and four cats.

 

Michael

 

 

[Teoman Naskali]

Whatever alternative you select, the pellets should be able to travel through the pump freely, in any orientation. So the pellet diameter at the widest point shouldn't exceed 3mm.

Copy pasted

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[Cathy Johannes]

Thank you for the information.  Do you have the mm size for the smallest size not to fall through the slots?  I do not have calipers to measure for myself.

 

Thank you for your help.

[Robert Deliën]

> Do you have the mm size for the smallest size not to fall through the slots?  I do not have calipers
> to measure for myself.

We don't know if the slot size is the bottom limit for the granule size. I do not know of anybody experimenting with different sizes of granules exploring the bottom limit.
The slots are sub-millimeter and I wouldn't go that small. But if you do, you'd be the first and we'd all be very curious about your results!

[LanchPad]

From the slits on the litter pan for water drainage, I would suggest staying above 1mm to keep your material from falling through.

In short; the granule size should be above 1mm and below 3mm.  

That said, I'm jumping on the saff flower seed wagon.  I'll post if I have a bad experience.

- LanchPad

[Benjamin]

Could you post what brand you use when you post your results? I've used Kaytee for the last couple years and its been great, but I moved recently and I'm having trouble finding it locally. Once I run out I'm going to try a new brand, but my concern is that it may not be sterilized and it will sprout and rot from the water and heat. As far as I know there haven't been any brands of seed recommended yet. 

[ron klo]

Michael posted about using GP-35 pellets from 3D Supply store.  That's a great price, I'm tempted, but a little leary after reading the data sheet... and concerns for my cat's health..   http://3dsupplysource.com/docs/3dSS/GP35.pdf

Ron

[Jason Floyd]

I tried safflower seeds as suggested by someone on here.  Low tracking, cheap and haven't had an issue.  Just make sure you don't add too many and they don't fully dry. 

[Twombles Jones]

So I don't know what they are made of but I have confirmed they are biodegradable.  They must be in standing water (or sewage) to begin the degradation process.  How quickly they degrade is directly proportional to the temperature of the water they are standing in.  I only know this because I have a very ghetto home brew septic system comprised of two 55 gallon barrels and a small leech field.  During the winter months in Alaska when the tank temperature is close to freezing there is very slow degradation of the pellets, but in the summer months when the liquid in the tank is about 50 degrees the pellets will break down in a couple weeks.  It is also why the pellets have tracking problems.  I don't know if you've noticed, but when you have a fresh box of pellets the cats don't track them out of the box as much, but once they have been soaked in water for a few months of cleaning cycles the outside starts to break down, becomes slightly tacky, and has a tendency to stick to things (like cat paws) more (especially when wet with warm urine).

On Tuesday, May 13, 2014 at 3:27:48 AM UTC-8, MindBender wrote:

I'm with George here; If you fill up your sceptic tank with CatGenie pellets, you've got different problems. And the claim is highly dubious indeed. The only realy biodegradable plastic I know is PLA. I use it in my 3D printer, but it is in fact too biodegradable to be of any use outdoors or in wet environments. I once printed a coffee mug and decided to use it for a day as a gag. After the first use, the plastic had softened already. And after a ride in Square Betty (=diswahser), it was completely limp. My point being: Real biodegrable plastics are unsuitable for the box and suitable platics are not biodegradable.

[Twombles Jones]

So much useful information in this thread, I'm ordering some Kaytee safflower seeds today to give them a try.  For anybody wondering or who can't get them locally you can get them on Amazon https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002DKBGI/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I'm also looking into having some custom made Airsoft biodegradable 3mm bb's as a cheaper alternative to the granules.  If anybody would have an interest in this let me know as I'm sure the price will go down significantly the more that I buy.  I also suspect the round polished shape will have less of a tracking tendency than the stock granules.

[Twombles Jones]

It might sound weird, but I could use cat excrement data especially now that I'm down to one cat.  I had two but my 20 year old diabetic cat passed recently from lots of cancerous tumors.  My other cat is almost 20 now and has had bowel problems for several years.  He had to get surgery to get part of his large intestines removed due to mega colon.  He has still struggled with bowel movements since and occasionally will have to have an enema.  When he's having trouble going he will visit the box much more frequently (but unsuccessfully) and this sort of data would be a red flag for me that it might be time for enema unpleasantries.  For now I have to review camera footage on high speed once a week to make sure he's been having regular BM's.  I find the idea of a cat box security cam kinda funny and so I gave it a domain with the hope there's nobody out there that thinks this falls under the 34th rule of the internet :) http://watchmycatpee.unusualperson.com username/password:guest

 
On Monday, October 26, 2015 at 8:05:24 AM UTC-8, Teoman Naskali wrote:

I had intention of adding an arduino based webserver that would log the visits and such but then i could not think of a single use for cat excrement data. :)

On Oct 26, 2015 6:02 PM, "Teoman Naskali" <t...@200iq.com> wrote:

Sounda good.

Think about adding a fan with a hose,  where the hose is fed to an air vent. On minimun power during standby, low to medium if device waits between visits. And full blast during the drying phase.

What will your raspberry pi be doing? Are you designing a full blown controller? Or using the existing controller but sending the commands over the serial port?

Keep us updated and feel free to bounce back ideas.

On Oct 26, 2015 5:52 PM, "Michael Conner" <ocea...@gmail.com> wrote:

Robert,

I think this was part of several of His emails... However, I'm also using similar ABS pellets, sort of Almond shaped. The pellets work well and do not stink

RE a new CG-120 Controller Board. I'm working on two unrelated designs. An you'll be pleased to know I've decided to utilized the Raspberry Pi controller board. Once I get some of the basic features operating , including the Bluetooth link, I'll move to the Camera and  start experimenting with movement ans recognition. 

Michael.  

On Mon, Oct 26, 2015 at 3:55 AM, Robert Deliën <rob...@delien.nl> wrote:

> I might give those a go. I'm currently using the plastic pellet needs you can get in bulk from plastic
> supply. They're used for injection molding and work great. I think 5lbs is around $20/shipped and
> I'm not even close to running out.

Am I missing half of the dialog? Couldn't find anything in my spam filter though...

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[Knight]

I must admit.  I too have a security camera on my Cat Genie.  ...  but, for a slightly different reason.  I was testing my Raspberry Pi scripting and wanted to confirm things were happening the way I was expecting them to. But it is funny to have my camera feeds having a cat box in them.  I joke with my family that it's my kitty porn.

Knight.

[Knight]

Sorry for the double post...  You might be interested in this.  https://twitter.com/nibblerpoop

A guy setup a weight scale under his cat box, and weighs the frequency of BM's from his cat, then tweets the data.  He can determine length of time in the box, as well as weight of cat.  So he gets a good idea if the cat is sick, and how much he's...  outputting per visit.

On Wednesday, March 29, 2017 at 5:24:03 AM UTC-6, Twombles Jones wrote:

[dbe...@gmail.com]

There's definitely value in having stats on your cat's bathroom time. I've been using a raspberry PI along with CatGenius for many years now to do things like: 

Control when the Catgenie cleans (I live in a small condo and don't want the Catgenie to run when I'm sleeping (midnight - 9am)

Send email when the soap cartridge runs low

Send an alert when my cat's catbox visits appear to be abnormal (too few/too many)

Control the CatGenie cleaning process via Siri and OpenHab

This all really paid off last summer when I got an alert from my CatGenie's raspberry pi regarding my cat's cat box visits. Looking at the graphs from my raspberry pi,  I could see right after Monday May 30, he was visiting his cat box with much more frequency. I immediately brought him to the vet and discovered he had crystals in his urine. Graph can be found below:

[Twombles Jones]

Many cat porn jokes have been made between my parents and friends.  They're the ones that suggested a website as a joke, but I thought it would be hilarious so I brought it to life.

The box weight idea is cool, but a sensitive scale would have to be used and I'd think things like liter loss,excess water that didn't drain, and solids/water in the drain tube would be hard to compensate and adjust for automatically.

[Twombles Jones]

Is there some tutorials / source code somewhere on how to get a raspberry pi integrated with the CatGenie?  Even seeing increased frequency would help me because when he can't go he tries to go much more often.  As far as the things you can do with it all have the nerd in me giggle with excitement.

Control when the Catgenie cleans (I live in a small condo and don't want the Catgenie to run when I'm sleeping (midnight - 9am) - My 2 boxes are literally 5' from my head so setting allowed hours by a clock would be amazing.

Send email when the soap cartridge runs low - I don't have a need for this because I rigged up 1/4" tubing from a large reservoir into two cleaning solution cartridges with original nipples.  I use this stuff https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005N2DGJW/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1 mixed at a 1/100 ration (more than 2x stronger than required). I'm only about 1/2 way through my first gallon I bought for this 2 years ago.  This was the stuff they used at the animal shelter to clean out all the cages.  I can post pictures of my cartridge setup if you like, cost me like 10 bucks at Home Depot.

Send an alert when my cat's catbox visits appear to be abnormal (too few/too many) - for sure usefull with my cat.

Control the CatGenie cleaning process via Siri and OpenHab - Do you make the programs for this or get them from somewhere else?  Either way could you provide some links and/or information?

I've got a prospect on getting some 3mm biodegradable airsoft BB's manufactured at significantly less cost per pound than the cat genie granules.  The more I get the cheaper they'd be.  I was considering just selling them online as alternatives to the CatGenie ones.  Originally I was going to tell them just any color, but I've read people talking about using a camera as a sensor to determine if waste in box is solid or liquid by color then adjusting the cleaning cycle accordingly.  Knowing this I might just go for an off white to match the box.

Thanks for the info, super awesome group here.  I had no idea there were this many people into modding their CatGenie.  When google shut down the cat genius group and there weren't any updates on tickets or anything I thought people had just lost interest in this sort of thing.  Glad to see I was wrong.

[Robert Deliën]

> The box weight idea is cool, but a sensitive scale would have to be used and I'd think things like liter loss,
> excess water that didn't drain, and solids/water in the drain tube would be hard to compensate and adjust for
> automatically.

It is feasible, but you'd have to tare the scale after each washing, because the amount of water left behind differs between washes. You'd also need to suspend the water and drain hoses in a way they produce similar results between weighing, and before and after a cat jumps in and out.

And if you have a cat like one of ours, who prefers to do his business why the box is blowing hot air, it won't work at all.

[Twombles Jones]

LOL, thinking of your cat taking a hot air treatment deuce with the bowl on a merry go round spin cycle made me giggle.

[Teoman Naskali]

Our little friends do have very peculiar and sometimes awkward habits :)

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[Drew Spangler]

what firmware??

On Sunday, September 6, 2015 at 9:24:14 PM UTC-4, Benjamin wrote:

Ever since switching over to the CatGenius firmware I have used Safflower bird seed instead of granules. The seeds work great, they don't track as much as the original pellets and they don't smell while drying (an issue I had with the original pellets). I haven't had noticed any rotting seeds either after in the 2 (?) years that I've been using them. 

On Wednesday, September 2, 2015 at 8:08:45 AM UTC-4, Greg Moeller wrote:

I know I'm resurrecting a very old thread but all the source material has vanished (cat litter central)

Is anyone using alternative granules?  What have you tried?

I found this on eBay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-lbs-Washable-Genie-Crystals-Sani-Kitty-Cat-Litter-Granules-Replacement-/190683570342?var=&hash=item2c65a060a6

$42 is a bit much for plain ABS pellets but a good price for Cat Genie magic granules.

[M Williams]

Has anyone tried airsoft pellets?  they come in colors...even glow in the dark and there are some that are biodegradable! 

[Robert Deliën]

> Has anyone tried airsoft pellets? they come in colors...even glow in the dark and there are some that are biodegradable!

They are too big.

[Flyboy BC]

What happens when you try to use them? Do they not fall through the scoop or are they just too big for the ones that get into the drain?

How about this stuff? http://www.ebay.ca/itm/332004324653?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRKAMEBIDXAIT

Gary.

[Robert Deliën]

> What happens when you try to use them? Do they not fall through the scoop or are they just too big for the ones that get into the drain?

They will jam between the impeller and the hopper housing, blocking the motor and burning it out.

> How about this stuff? http://www.ebay.ca/itm/332004324653?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRKAMEBIDXAIT

That seems the right size. Check the project page or group archive to be sure.

Polycarbonate is NOT biodegradable, though. So it’s not safe (or wise) to flush.

[Flyboy BC]

Yes, After reviewing past posts I have found the least expensive solution.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/231907303053?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRKAMEBIDXAIT

For my location in western Canada it's half the price of 3.5 lbs of Genie granules. It is not biodegradable either but I am not using Genie cartridges, have installed the thin mylar washer under the bowl and I run the genie on HOT water. This combination seems to have nearly eliminated all tracking and very little of the granules ever stick to the scoop. I am watching for the melting washer issue that was reported with hot water usage but after 2.5 years of HOT water the flow seems to be the same as ever. My Genie is a later serial number than the one that reported the melting issue. Perhaps they changed the washer? 

Gary.

[Wolfwalker]

Hello,

I am new to the group. I found a suggestion on a blog suggesting to use this specific type of birdseed, and it does work well (3 months no clogs) but still tracks about quite a bit. The same person has switched to popcorn kernels, I was very uneasy about the size of the birdseed, the size of popcorn kernels kinda scares me into thinking it will get caught up and burn out the motor, but from the other blog (which I don't have a link to as I found late one sleepless night :) ) it does not get tracked around by the 3 or 4 cats that use that CatGenie. 

My cats had no problem with my switching to the birdseed, btw, my older one was slightly hesitant for about a minute until he had to do his business, now neither of them care. I don't fill it up to the fill line, but slightly below (not much) as recommended by that other person. Sorry I don't have the link it was rather interesting to read and they had posted pictures of the bird seed and the popcorn kernels. 

Sorry if this information is a repeat, as I look over the thread.

I included a link to where I got the birdseed (petco) not recommending you get it there just wanted to make certain that y'all had access to the correct product information. I believe it is also available on amazon.com

Kaytee Safflower Seed

SKU: 355038

Brand: Kaytee

[Twombles Jones]

I've been using the Kaytee Safflower seeds for several months now and they work great.  There is still some tracking, but noticeably less than the catgenie granules.  I've also noticed a large reduction in smell during the drying cycle and less of the seed seems to stick to the poo and get flushed.

I would not recommend using popcorn kernels as their size is on the borderline that can jam between the impeller and hopper which will burn out the motor as @MindBender previously stated.  They are hard enough that the impeller won't be able to grind/break them.  As MindBender also previously stated to avoid jamming the impeller the product you use can be no wider than 3mm at it's widest point.  I used a caliper to measure various types of popcorn available in my area and most if not all the kernels I checked exceeded this 3mm measurement.

[Teoman Naskali]

I have used popcorn kernels. It worked for a while. Then there was a clog, and once the kernels were soaked for a short time they lost their rigidity and it became a bit of a mushy mess (think sweet peas in the bowl). So i abandoned that idea.

I cannot find safflower seeds where i live so i have no experience with them.

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[Twombles Jones]

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002DKBGI/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

$11 usd per 5 pound bag with free delivery vs $27 usd per 3.5 pound for the cat genie granules, to me it seems to be a no brainer.

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[Cathy Johannes]

I have been getting my alternative  pellets from Carl Severing on Ebay for probably around 8 years now.  He has a lot of product, and box sizes, and prices to choose from.  I usually have him send me a mixed assortment of colors in the same box as I like color in my life. 

I have found him to be very easy to work with, and I do like the color assortments.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?_odkw=&_ssn=carlsievering&hash=item4d4ef2b32c%3Ag%3AOakAAOSwiDFYL5Qm&item=332037010220&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2046732.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.XUSE+IN+CAT+GENIE.TRS2&_nkw=USE+IN+CAT+GENIE&_sacat=0

 

 

From: catg...@googlegroups.com [mailto:catg...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Twombles Jones
Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2017 7:33 AM
To: catg...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [catgenius] Re: Altrenative Litter Materials

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002DKBGI/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

$11 usd per 5 pound bag with free delivery vs $27 usd per 3.5 pound for the cat genie granules, to me it seems to be a no brainer.

On Sun, May 14, 2017 at 3:05 AM, Teoman Naskali <t...@200iq.com> wrote:

I have used popcorn kernels. It worked for a while. Then there was a clog, and once the kernels were soaked for a short time they lost their rigidity and it became a bit of a mushy mess (think sweet peas in the bowl). So i abandoned that idea.

 

I cannot find safflower seeds where i live so i have no experience with them.

On 14 May 2017, at 0.47, Twombles Jones <dta...@gmail.com> wrote:

I've been using the Kaytee Safflower seeds for several months now and they work great.  There is still some tracking, but noticeably less than the catgenie granules.  I've also noticed a large reduction in smell during the drying cycle and less of the seed seems to stick to the poo and get flushed.

 

I would not recommend using popcorn kernels as their size is on the borderline that can jam between the impeller and hopper which will burn out the motor as @MindBender previously stated.  They are hard enough that the impeller won't be able to grind/break them.  As MindBender also previously stated to avoid jamming the impeller the product you use can be no wider than 3mm at it's widest point.  I used a caliper to measure various types of popcorn available in my area and most if not all the kernels I checked exceeded this 3mm measurement.

On Saturday, May 13, 2017 at 10:37:50 AM UTC-8, Wolfwalker wrote:

Hello,

 

I am new to the group. I found a suggestion on a blog suggesting to use this specific type of birdseed, and it does work well (3 months no clogs) but still tracks about quite a bit. The same person has switched to popcorn kernels, I was very uneasy about the size of the birdseed, the size of popcorn kernels kinda scares me into thinking it will get caught up and burn out the motor, but from the other blog (which I don't have a link to as I found late one sleepless night :) ) it does not get tracked around by the 3 or 4 cats that use that CatGenie. 

My cats had no problem with my switching to the birdseed, btw, my older one was slightly hesitant for about a minute until he had to do his business, now neither of them care. I don't fill it up to the fill line, but slightly below (not much) as recommended by that other person. Sorry I don't have the link it was rather interesting to read and they had posted pictures of the bird seed and the popcorn kernels. 

 

Sorry if this information is a repeat, as I look over the thread.

 

I included a link to where I got the birdseed (petco) not recommending you get it there just wanted to make certain that y'all had access to the correct product information. I believe it is also available on amazon.com

Kaytee Safflower Seed

SKU: 355038

Brand: Kaytee

 

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[Craig Gilding]

That's a great shout. Just need to find a uk source as it's nearly £20 for postage from USA!

Still looking for a scoop if anyone has one to sell

[Scott Blomfield]

Has anyone tried Millet or Milo? Milo might be a bit large, but Millet seems about the right size, and a fair bit rounder than Safflower... (I had seen someone indicate roundness was key to less tracking)

Our cats seem to be tracking more and more of the original pellets lately - I wouldn't put it past them to be doing it on purpose somehow - so I'm very interested in alternative materials too... 

I've also given serious thought to trying non-holed plastic beads such as http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cheap-1-5MM-2MM-2-5MM-3MM-Opaque-Round-Bead-Solid-Plastic-Small-Beads-No-Hole-/272837266403

anyone tried those in 2-3mm or something like them? I'm just not sure what they're made of, so until I could find out if it is ABS/PLA/something else I'm a bit reluctant to move forward. Hopefully the seller can help me out there.

Thanks,

Scott

On Sunday, May 14, 2017 at 7:33:11 AM UTC-5, Twombles Jones wrote:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002DKBGI/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

$11 usd per 5 pound bag with free delivery vs $27 usd per 3.5 pound for the cat genie granules, to me it seems to be a no brainer.

On Sun, May 14, 2017 at 3:05 AM, Teoman Naskali <t...@200iq.com> wrote:

I have used popcorn kernels. It worked for a while. Then there was a clog, and once the kernels were soaked for a short time they lost their rigidity and it became a bit of a mushy mess (think sweet peas in the bowl). So i abandoned that idea.

I cannot find safflower seeds where i live so i have no experience with them.

On 14 May 2017, at 0.47, Twombles Jones <dta...@gmail.com> wrote:

I've been using the Kaytee Safflower seeds for several months now and they work great.  There is still some tracking, but noticeably less than the catgenie granules.  I've also noticed a large reduction in smell during the drying cycle and less of the seed seems to stick to the poo and get flushed.

I would not recommend using popcorn kernels as their size is on the borderline that can jam between the impeller and hopper which will burn out the motor as @MindBender previously stated.  They are hard enough that the impeller won't be able to grind/break them.  As MindBender also previously stated to avoid jamming the impeller the product you use can be no wider than 3mm at it's widest point.  I used a caliper to measure various types of popcorn available in my area and most if not all the kernels I checked exceeded this 3mm measurement.

On Saturday, May 13, 2017 at 10:37:50 AM UTC-8, Wolfwalker wrote:

Hello,

I am new to the group. I found a suggestion on a blog suggesting to use this specific type of birdseed, and it does work well (3 months no clogs) but still tracks about quite a bit. The same person has switched to popcorn kernels, I was very uneasy about the size of the birdseed, the size of popcorn kernels kinda scares me into thinking it will get caught up and burn out the motor, but from the other blog (which I don't have a link to as I found late one sleepless night :) ) it does not get tracked around by the 3 or 4 cats that use that CatGenie. 

My cats had no problem with my switching to the birdseed, btw, my older one was slightly hesitant for about a minute until he had to do his business, now neither of them care. I don't fill it up to the fill line, but slightly below (not much) as recommended by that other person. Sorry I don't have the link it was rather interesting to read and they had posted pictures of the bird seed and the popcorn kernels. 

Sorry if this information is a repeat, as I look over the thread.

I included a link to where I got the birdseed (petco) not recommending you get it there just wanted to make certain that y'all had access to the correct product information. I believe it is also available on amazon.com

Kaytee Safflower Seed

SKU: 355038

Brand: Kaytee

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[Benjamin]

For the last 8 months I have been using Pennington Safflower Seed. I had been using Kaytee Safflower seeds for 4+ years, but I moved and couldn't get it locally anymore. 

The new seed has been great so far, with no noticeable difference from the Kaytee seed. The cat barely tracks it. Even with a dome he does kick it out of the genie so we get a pile around it, but it doesn't make it any further than that. If I step on it barefoot I track it around, but it doesn't hurt like the original plastic pellets do. I add more to the bowl when its kicked out or flushed, and I replace all of the seeds in the bowl when I do a 6 month deep clean. I haven't had any issues with clogs or sprouting, I think it is sterilized.

I don't recall the exact price,  it was around $10 at walmart for a 7 pound bag. With the one cat a bag lasts me about 4 months. 

https://www.pennington.com/all-products/lawn-garden/wildbird/bird-food/select-seed-and-blends/select-safflower-seed

[Benjamin]

I haven't seen anyone try those before. Did you decide on using anything in particular Scott?

Millet seed looks interesting. The size looks good and it costs less than safflower per pound. 

A concern would be the seed trying to sprout. According to reviewers on amazon for Shafer and Cole's brand seed it sprouts. 

Might still be worth a try. Anyone here know if sterilizing seeds on the oven/microwave might work or cause problems?

[Jason Floyd]

I've been using safflower seed for years now was well.  It works great and only had 'sprouting' problems the first time when I used too much and they didn't dry fully.

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[Scott Blomfield]

Hi Benjamin - Sterilization in the oven for Milo or Millet should work - you basically just want to kill the seed so it won't germinate... but I haven't switched yet.

I have a large volume of original granules from when I was on the auto-delivery plan with CatGenie... and I'm trying to work my way through it - unless someone has experience with that ABS I linked (or something very similar), I probably won't wander from the OEM granules until my existing supply runs dry. Although my feet would swear my cats track a good pound of those granules out a week, in actual fact it is far less... much like small Lego pieces, my feet have become adept at locating them unfortunately.

On an unrelated note, has anyone heard anything about Cartridge genius here lately? I'm on the list, but they're out of stock right now. Until the new replacement board happens, I'm interested in picking one up so I can revert the box to stock if needed.

Cheers,

Scott

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[Robert Deliën]

> On an unrelated note, has anyone heard anything about Cartridge genius here lately?

I did ;-).

> I'm on the
> list, but they're out of stock right now.

There should be stock again from 11-11 and I think the email went out already. Though even MailChimp sometimes ends up in spam filters.
http://cartridgegenius.com/

> Until the new replacement board happens, I'm interested in picking one up so I can revert
> the box to stock if needed.

The biggest problem on that front is the connector pin-out for the RaspberryPi. I would like to make convenient internal PiZero mounting possible, but connecting a RaspberryPi 3 mounted on the exterior with a flatcable should be possible too, and I'm trying to find a solution for that.

[Robert Deliën]

> I've also given serious thought to trying non-holed plastic beads such as http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cheap-1-5MM-2MM-2-5MM-3MM-Opaque-Round-Bead-Solid-Plastic-Small-Beads-No-Hole-/272837266403
> anyone tried those in 2-3mm or something like them? I'm just not sure what they're made of, so until I could find
> out if it is ABS/PLA/something else I'm a bit reluctant to move forward. Hopefully the seller can help me out there.

Besides the size, it is important that they sink in water. If they float, your box will not clean properly.

[M Williams]

Yes, i've used these now for 6 months and they do work. 

[Craig Gilding]

I've been using some I found in the UK on eBay. They're supposed to be for 3D printers. They seem to work great so far!

[Michael Conner]

I've been using 3D printing granules for several years now. Certainly less tracking and less costly. I use a much smaller amount in the CG-120, about 1/4 to 3/8th inch deep.

These certainly dry much quicker.. Anyone interested in shortening the dry time ??

I'm now gathering the parts to change to warm water. I have been starting a manual warm once a month or so and adding hot water by hand. Cleans the CG-120 much better than cold water !! 

I use a mild liquid diluted bathroom cleaner with a low percentage of chlorine which works well removing stains.

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[Flyboy BC]

I have been using popcorn for about a month now. I was using HOT water but I changed to warm when I put in the popcorn. I was looking for safflower seeds but they are more expensive than Cat Genie granules!

I am STUNNED at how well popcorn is working out~!

I use a little glass cleaner, hand soap, water and perfume as my sani solution. Sometimes I use dishwashing liquid.

I filled it 3/4th of the way to the line as it seemed heavier than the granules. 

The cats do not paw at it as much as the regular granules (less noise at night), it dries nicely, does NOT stick AT ALL to even a wet scoop, and it BARELY tracks at all! I have just examined the freshly cleaned popcorn and it is not degrading in any way. It is turning from yellow to white and it seems to be shrinking (as though it is drying out even more than it was when new) but there are no little pieces of kernels or outer shells in the mix and it does not seem to have gotten soft or anything. The only downside is the sound it makes when a kernel is in the drain-pump/grinder but that only lasts a second or two. If/when it starts to degrade I will report how long it lasted.

My cats are very used to the Genie and I can tell they don't like the popcorn quite as much as the granules but I was running VERY low by the time I decided to try popcorn so they are just glad to have the volume back! They have taken to it just fine but as I said they scratch at it a lot less than the original granules. This tells me they enjoy it less but who cares as long as they still use it? I do other things for them that they enjoy just fine. 

I still have tracking but 99% of it is the two tablespoons of granules that were still there! I can't wait to dump all of this out and replace it with 100% popcorn. You get NONE stuck to the scoop, some do get stuck to solid waste and 1 or 2 kernels are tracked out per day by two cats! 1 or 2 kernels!

So far popcorn is VASTLY superior to CatGenie granules! I think if the Kernels were smaller the cats would enjoy scratching at it more so I am watching the dollar stores for cheap bags of popcorn as I believe the cheapest garbage popcorn IS generally smaller. 

Again, I will report my results. Finally I am completely free of CatGenie (the company). Nice product, POS company.

Don't hesitate to try popcorn it WORKS.

[Flyboy BC]

Oh another thing! With popcorn the scoop ALWAYS gets ALL of the solid waste after only one scoop! There is NO need for the next two scoop cycles! No "brownies" either! I am not sure WHY this has been the case but if I confirm this or discover why I will let you all know. I guess I should simply watch the cycle carefully. Perhaps the popcorn adheres to solid waste better than granules do so "brownies" get picked up even though they normally slip right through the scoop!