Flame simulation and electric field
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Amelia
Jul 23, 2015, 8:18:02 AM7/23/15
to Cantera Users' Group
Hello everyone,
my goal is to simulate a flat flame under the influence of an electric field. Since I am a complete novice using Cantera I have no idea where to start or if it is possible at all.
Does Cantera offer the possiblity to include an electric field in any of the example files? (freeFlame.py, etc.)
Do I have any information concerning the ionization state of my reactants? I planned on simulating a CH4/air flame, using GRI30 mechanism. But if it is easier to use H2/O2 mechanism, I would start from there.
Is there any straight forward way to do it?
If all this involves a lot of programming on my part, would it be better to use C++ or python. Up to now I only varied the example files for python, but I have some experience with C++ through OpenFOAM.
Best regards,
Amelia
my goal is to simulate a flat flame under the influence of an electric field. Since I am a complete novice using Cantera I have no idea where to start or if it is possible at all.
Does Cantera offer the possiblity to include an electric field in any of the example files? (freeFlame.py, etc.)
Do I have any information concerning the ionization state of my reactants? I planned on simulating a CH4/air flame, using GRI30 mechanism. But if it is easier to use H2/O2 mechanism, I would start from there.
Is there any straight forward way to do it?
If all this involves a lot of programming on my part, would it be better to use C++ or python. Up to now I only varied the example files for python, but I have some experience with C++ through OpenFOAM.
Best regards,
Amelia
Nick Curtis
Jul 23, 2015, 9:56:30 AM7/23/15
to Cantera Users' Group, ellus...@hotmail.de
Hi Amelia,
I believe there is some support for electric potentials and transport by electric conductivity in Cantera, however I don't know it's extent or how up to date it is, and I doubt if it has been integrated into the freeflame or any of the other 1-D examples; they're mostly targeted at chemical kinetics. Ray Speth may be able to give a better answer on the actual capabilities of Cantera in this area, but for a case like yours you will probably need to dig into the code base to see what's there anyways. You will probably want to start here and start looking for references to EMF and following up in the code to see what they actually do.
In the end I imagine you will likely want to work both in C++ and Python; implementing the governing equations in C++, and exposing them to the Cython interface (which is what the Python interface is built upon), to integrate them into the existing Python flame examples. The good news is that if you know some C++, you've already gotten the hard part out of the way, exposing the core C++ code to Python is relatively simply by comparison and we will be happy to show you how / help you out as we can.
Nick
I believe there is some support for electric potentials and transport by electric conductivity in Cantera, however I don't know it's extent or how up to date it is, and I doubt if it has been integrated into the freeflame or any of the other 1-D examples; they're mostly targeted at chemical kinetics. Ray Speth may be able to give a better answer on the actual capabilities of Cantera in this area, but for a case like yours you will probably need to dig into the code base to see what's there anyways. You will probably want to start here and start looking for references to EMF and following up in the code to see what they actually do.
In the end I imagine you will likely want to work both in C++ and Python; implementing the governing equations in C++, and exposing them to the Cython interface (which is what the Python interface is built upon), to integrate them into the existing Python flame examples. The good news is that if you know some C++, you've already gotten the hard part out of the way, exposing the core C++ code to Python is relatively simply by comparison and we will be happy to show you how / help you out as we can.
Nick
Ray Speth
Jul 23, 2015, 5:04:26 PM7/23/15
to Cantera Users' Group, ellus...@hotmail.de
Amelia,
Cantera's 1D flame model does not include any of the physics associated with the presence of an electric field, so you would need to implement those equations and their effects on the other governing equations in C++. If it's the case that the electric field is imposed and only weakly affected by the species, and the interest is in capturing the effect of the field on the charged species, then I think this could be a fairly simple modification. If you expect bidirectional coupling, then I think this will be a lot more complicated.
Cantera can represent charged species, but the GRI mechanism does not include any charged species, so you would also need to find or develop a chemical mechanism that includes ionized species.
Regards,
Ray
On Thursday, July 23, 2015 at 8:18:02 AM UTC-4, Amelia wrote:
Amelia
Jul 25, 2015, 6:53:29 AM7/25/15
to Cantera Users' Group, ellus...@hotmail.de
Hello Nick, Ray,
thanks for your answers, that already helped me quite a bit.
Have a nice weekend,
Amelia
thanks for your answers, that already helped me quite a bit.
Have a nice weekend,
Amelia
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