Gas Phase Radiation

[John Sullivan]

I want to include gas phase radiation in my burnerflame model.  Has anyone added this heat loss term already?  If so, please let me know.

At this point, if we have to add this feature, I am hoping to do this without changing the source code.  I would calculate radiation heat loss with a correlation that is a function of temperature and partial pressure (some optically thing approximation, at this point a set of curve fits from Sandia CRF from 2003 looks promising).  I would calculate the heat that was removed from each cell.  This would be done in Python, to avoid changing any Cantera code.  I would use this result to set my gas temperatures to make a final run.  This may require a few iterations, since gas properties will change with the change in temperature, but I think this will converge rapidly.  If I estimate my gas phase radiation within 20%, I will have achieved my goal.

Any thoughts on this?

[Ray Speth]

Hi John,

An optically-thin radiation model for CO2 and H2O was recently added to Cantera (see mainly this commit), and can be used if you are using the current development version of Cantera. You can see an example of how to use it here.

I think the approach you suggested can't currently be implemented because there is no interface for specifying an arbitrary heat loss as a function of space in the 1D solver.

Regards,

Ray

[John Sullivan]

Hi Ray,

When you say "current development version of Cantera" do you mean version 2.2a or just a more recent download of version 2.1.2?  I'm happy to use the development version 2.2a if that's what it takes to get the gas phase model.  That model was exactly what I was looking for.

John

[Bryan W. Weber]

Hi John,

The most recent development version is indeed 2.2a. If you need help to compile it, please let us know!

Best,

Bryan

[John Sullivan]

Hi Bryan,

If I need 2.2a to get the gas phase radiation model, then "Yes" I do want 2.2a.  So, just to be clear:  Do I need 2.2a to use the gas phase radiation model that Ray mentioned in his e-mail?

If the answer is yes, and I can get access to 2.2a, then I'm probably not quite ready to compile.  I have some reading to do to make sure I know which versions of the different codes and compilers that I have before I get started.  I used to work from a Python 2.7 directory, but now I am using the Anaconda Spyder development environment.  I know there are some instructions about compiling in the Cantera.org manual.  I think I better read those instructions before I use any of your time.

Thanks so far,

John

On Monday, April 27, 2015 at 8:51:36 AM UTC-7, John Sullivan wrote:

[Bryan W. Weber]

Hi John,

Yes, the newest developer version is the only one (so far) that contains the gas radiation code. I'm not sure when we plan to have another release, but until that time, you'll have to do the compilation of the developer version (2.2a) yourself.

In addition to the official documentation: http://cantera.github.io/dev-docs/sphinx/html/compiling.html (note the "dev" before "docs", both Nick Curtis and I have instructions on our websites for setting up on Windows: http://bryanwweber.com/writing/personal/2014/08/24/how-i-set-up-a-cantera-development-environment-on-windows-7/ https://chemicalkinetics.wordpress.com/2014/01/29/compiling-cantera-x64-on-windows-with-visual-studio/ (beware, they may be slightly out of date), and I also have a post about Linux: http://bryanwweber.com/writing/personal/2014/01/08/installing-cantera-on-ubuntu-12.04.3-from-scratch-source-with-Intel-compilers/ If you use Mac, I'm not aware of any additional instructions, except those posted in the official documentation, sorry!

Keep in mind, these are our personal experiences and not officially endorsed by the project; its just what's worked for us! :-) Best of luck, and welcome to the wonderful world of Cantera!

Bryan

[John Sullivan]

Ray and Bryan,

I was in touch several months ago, but never got around to loading and using 2.2a.  I just went online and I see that version 2.2 has been released with gas phase radiation included.  Thanks.  For me, that is a very useful and welcome addition to the code.  Is using it as simple as adding radiation_enabled = "True" ?  Or is there anything else I should know? 

Thanks,

John Sullivan

On Monday, April 27, 2015 at 8:51:36 AM UTC-7, John Sullivan wrote:

[Ray Speth]

John,

Yes, all that's needed is to set

f.radiation_enabled = True

where f is the "flame" object. There is a method "set_boundary_emissivities" as well, but I think it doesn't normally have much of an effect on the solution.

Regards,

Ray

[Ahmet Resul]

Hi all,

A related question. Is this radiation model only relevant to counterflow diffusion flames or one can also use it for, say, burnerflame?

Thanks,
Kind regards

[Ray Speth]

Ahmet,

Yes, you should be able to use the radiation model with any of the flame types modeled in Cantera.

Regards,

Ray