Parking in Gwydir St

[Vir Campestris]

I just went into town yesterday evening, and got the last place in
Gwydir St car park. And only because the lady in front of me missed it
in the shadows.

The reason why it was full is simple. About a third of the car park is
now electric car charging spaces, and cannot be used for parking
ordinary cars.

Is it like this all over town?

Andy

[tony sayer]

In article <ukagcs$1e5ak$1...@dont-email.me>, Vir Campestris <vir.campestr
i...@invalid.invalid> scribeth thus

Not that I'm aware of, but there still is a large shortage of electric
charging points like most all the streets off mill road and christ knows
how they are to sort that!...
--
Tony Sayer


Man is least himself when he talks in his own person.

Give him a keyboard, and he will reveal himself.

[Tim Ward]

On 01/12/2023 10:51, tony sayer wrote:
>
> Not that I'm aware of, but there still is a large shortage of electric
> charging points like most all the streets off mill road and christ knows
> how they are to sort that!...

Put charging points into the P&R car parks, then people can cycle or
catch the bus back to Romsey Town? There need to be fewer permanently
parked cars there anyway, to make space for more bike parking.

--
Tim Ward - 07801 703 600
www.brettward.co.uk

[Alan]

On Fri, 01 Dec 2023 12:08:01 -0000, Tim Ward <t...@brettward.co.uk> wrote:

> On 01/12/2023 10:51, tony sayer wrote:
>> Not that I'm aware of, but there still is a large shortage of electric
>> charging points like most all the streets off mill road and christ knows
>> how they are to sort that!...
>
> Put charging points into the P&R car parks, then people can cycle or
> catch the bus back to Romsey Town? There need to be fewer permanently
> parked cars there anyway, to make space for more bike parking.
>

P&R buses are slowly dropping in frequency and reliability, not the
panacea when they were introduced :-)

Also, is leaving an EV all day at a charging point, when it only needs two
or three hours, the best use of resources? Unless you are suggesting all
parking spaces at P&R sites have charging points.

--
Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

[Tim Ward]

All night, I was thinking, whilst the spaces aren't being used for their
primary purpose.

[Theo]

Tim Ward <t...@brettward.co.uk> wrote:
> On 01/12/2023 12:21, Alan wrote:
> > On Fri, 01 Dec 2023 12:08:01 -0000, Tim Ward <t...@brettward.co.uk> wrote:
> >
> >> On 01/12/2023 10:51, tony sayer wrote:
> >>>  Not that I'm aware of, but there still is a large shortage of electric
> >>> charging points like most all the streets off mill road and christ knows
> >>> how they are to sort that!...
> >>
> >> Put charging points into the P&R car parks, then people can cycle or
> >> catch the bus back to Romsey Town? There need to be fewer permanently
> >> parked cars there anyway, to make space for more bike parking.
> >>
> >
> > P&R buses are slowly dropping in frequency and reliability, not the
> > panacea when they were introduced :-)
> >
> > Also, is leaving an EV all day at a charging point, when it only needs
> > two or three hours, the best use of resources?  Unless you are
> > suggesting all parking spaces at P&R sites have charging points.
>
> All night, I was thinking, whilst the spaces aren't being used for their
> primary purpose.

The problem is that only works if you're a car commuter, who drops off the
car in the evening and collects the next morning. I suspect a lot of Romsey
town folks only use the car occasionally, and need somewhere to park it the
rest of time.

Although I suppose an economical overnight electricity deal could be
attractive purely as an EV charging service if you don't have an offstreet
space, and not intended so much to declutter the Romsey town streets.

(if you aren't a daily driver, you only need to fill up your 200-300 mile EV
maybe once or twice a month. If using a public rapid charger like at
motorway services could pay 2-3x a standard domestic tariff and 5-10x a
cheap overnight EV tariff)

Theo

[Roland Perry]

In message <ukd1jp$1ubdi$1...@dont-email.me>, at 16:28:44 on Fri, 1 Dec
2023, Tim Ward <t...@brettward.co.uk> remarked:

Charging EVs at night, when there's no solar power available, sounds
like plan to me. A completely broken plan, but still a plan.

As for the wider issue of public parking spaces being reserved for
EV-users to squat on all day, it's a growing problem.
--
Roland Perry

[Alan]

On Fri, 01 Dec 2023 17:54:31 -0000, Roland Perry <rol...@perry.co.uk>
wrote:

As some are finding out when their PCN arrives for outstaying parking
times to fully charge in private car parks like Tesco with a three hour
limit.

There isn't a proper joined up solution to EVs yet (and I'm buying one -
so not anti).

[Tim Ward]

On 01/12/2023 17:54, Roland Perry wrote:
>
> Charging EVs at night, when there's no solar power available, sounds
> like plan to me. A completely broken plan, but still a plan.

There's not a lot of solar at all at this time of year. Some days
there's plenty of wind though.

[Tim Ward]

On 01/12/2023 17:46, Theo wrote:
>
> The problem is that only works if you're a car commuter, who drops off the
> car in the evening and collects the next morning. I suspect a lot of Romsey
> town folks only use the car occasionally, and need somewhere to park it the
> rest of time.

When I lived in Romsey Town my landlord was one of those - he had a car
typically parked in Thoday Street which he (and/or us, his tenants, who
could borrow it at cost) didn't use most days, and probably not most weeks.

As for "need somewhere to park it", I can't find the mayor who said "if
you buy a cow do you expect the city to provide you with somewhere to
keep it?".

[Tim Ward]

On 01/12/2023 17:46, Theo wrote:
>

> The problem is that only works if you're a car commuter, who drops off the
> car in the evening and collects the next morning. I suspect a lot of Romsey
> town folks only use the car occasionally, and need somewhere to park it the
> rest of time.

When I lived in Romsey Town my landlord was one of those - he had a car
typically parked in Thoday Street which he (and/or us, his tenants, who
could borrow it at cost) didn't use most days, and probably not most weeks.

As for "need somewhere to park it", I can't find the mayor who said "if
you buy a cow do you expect the city to provide you with somewhere to
keep it?".

[Theo]

Tim Ward <t...@brettward.co.uk> wrote:
> On 01/12/2023 17:54, Roland Perry wrote:
> >
> > Charging EVs at night, when there's no solar power available, sounds
> > like plan to me. A completely broken plan, but still a plan.

A lot of electricity suppliers have cheap periods for EV charging overnight,
so they must get cheap electricity from somewhere. Offshore wind perhaps?
Maybe we need EV drivers to pay attention to the Shipping Forecast?

> There's not a lot of solar at all at this time of year. Some days
> there's plenty of wind though.

I'm on the Octopus/UKPN trial where you get free electricity at certain
times when there's too much generation in the local area and the grid can't
take it. Since they started in August it's been a couple of hours once or
twice a week - it's handy to run various appliances like the washing and
dishwasher.

I was surprised to be given a slot 11am-1pm on Wednesday, when it was frosty
white and still outside, but sunny. So I assume that, since there's a lot
of solar farms hereabouts, the solar is actually generating enough to
generate a surplus even on a winter's day.

Theo

[Tim Ward]

On 01/12/2023 21:19, Theo wrote:
>
> I'm on the Octopus/UKPN trial where you get free electricity at certain
> times when there's too much generation in the local area and the grid can't
> take it. Since they started in August it's been a couple of hours once or
> twice a week - it's handy to run various appliances like the washing and
> dishwasher.
>
> I was surprised to be given a slot 11am-1pm on Wednesday, when it was frosty
> white and still outside, but sunny. So I assume that, since there's a lot
> of solar farms hereabouts, the solar is actually generating enough to
> generate a surplus even on a winter's day.

Yeah, the free electricity doesn't always seem to correlate with any
actual weather. But it could be (the electricity market is absolutely
bonkers) some fall-out from a wrong purchasing decision someone made
months ago.

Really weird at the moment is that the free electricity periods seem to
be alternating on a daily basis with "saving sessions", when they pay
you to use less electricity than normal. Or, in my case, to buy
electricity from them at 2am for 20p and sell it back to them at 4pm for
£4 - the solar panels aren't doing much at this time of year but the
battery is still there.

[Roland Perry]

In message <-Yt*3n...@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>, at 21:19:27 on Fri,
1 Dec 2023, Theo <theom...@chiark.greenend.org.uk> remarked:

>Tim Ward <t...@brettward.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 01/12/2023 17:54, Roland Perry wrote:
>> >
>> > Charging EVs at night, when there's no solar power available, sounds
>> > like plan to me. A completely broken plan, but still a plan.
>
>A lot of electricity suppliers have cheap periods for EV charging overnight,
>so they must get cheap electricity from somewhere. Offshore wind perhaps?

And for how many years have they guaranteed that tariff will be
available into the future?

>Maybe we need EV drivers to pay attention to the Shipping Forecast?
>
>> There's not a lot of solar at all at this time of year. Some days
>> there's plenty of wind though.
>
>I'm on the Octopus/UKPN trial where you get free electricity at certain
>times when there's too much generation in the local area and the grid can't
>take it. Since they started in August it's been a couple of hours once or
>twice a week - it's handy to run various appliances like the washing and
>dishwasher.
>
>I was surprised to be given a slot 11am-1pm on Wednesday, when it was frosty
>white and still outside, but sunny. So I assume that, since there's a lot
>of solar farms hereabouts, the solar is actually generating enough to
>generate a surplus even on a winter's day.

gridwatch.uk

At this moment: 68% gas, 15% nuclear... 4% wind, 0% solar.

At noon on Wednesday: 54%, 10%, 6%, 8% respectively.
--
Roland Perry

[Tim Ward]

On 02/12/2023 07:25, Roland Perry wrote:
>>
>> I was surprised to be given a slot 11am-1pm on Wednesday, when it was
>> frosty
>> white and still outside, but sunny.  So I assume that, since there's a
>> lot
>> of solar farms hereabouts, the solar is actually generating enough to
>> generate a surplus even on a winter's day.
>
> gridwatch.uk
>
> At this moment: 68% gas, 15% nuclear... 4% wind, 0% solar.
>
> At noon on Wednesday: 54%, 10%, 6%, 8% respectively.

We've got more free electricity starting in half an hour. (Must get
dressed so the PJs can go in the washing machine.) Currently 60% fossil
fuels. Weird.

[Vir Campestris]

On 01/12/2023 20:26, Tim Ward wrote:
>
> When I lived in Romsey Town my landlord was one of those - he had a car
> typically parked in Thoday Street which he (and/or us, his tenants, who
> could borrow it at cost) didn't use most days, and probably not most weeks.
>
> As for "need somewhere to park it", I can't find the mayor who said "if
> you buy a cow do you expect the city to provide you with somewhere to
> keep it?".

AIUI that's the position in Japan. If you don't have an off-road space
you aren't allowed a car. Seems reasonable to me. Apart from anything
else it would make visiting my non-car-owning son a lot easier!

But the car charging problem isn't just the charging points. We don't
have reliable generation capacity to replace petrol & diesel.

Then look at Babraham road P&R. Apparently they've shut half of it to
install charging points. When that's done they are going to extend it.

Why they didn't extend it into a new area with charging point being
fitted to the new spaces is beyond me.

Andy

[Tim Ward]

On 03/12/2023 21:19, Vir Campestris wrote:
>
> Why they didn't extend it into a new area with charging point being
> fitted to the new spaces is beyond me.

I expect that there are hundreds of pages of detailed explanation on a
council web site somewhere. They're not always easy to find, mind you -
you tend to have to know which meeting of which committee considered the
issues.

[Theo]

Vir Campestris <vir.cam...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> Then look at Babraham road P&R. Apparently they've shut half of it to
> install charging points. When that's done they are going to extend it.
>
> Why they didn't extend it into a new area with charging point being
> fitted to the new spaces is beyond me.

I'm not very familiar with the site, but it seems like they've fitted PV
(and chargers?) to a part nearest the terminal building, and they probably
want that to be more convenient and attractive to use than putting it in an
extension in the next field over.

Theo

[Roland Perry]

In message <9Yt*Q5...@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>, at 11:36:09 on Mon,
4 Dec 2023, Theo <theom...@chiark.greenend.org.uk> remarked:

False dichotomy. What they could have done is extend the car park *then*
close a section of the old site to fit chargers.

In addition to "near the terminal building" being attractive to users,
it would also reduce that amount of digging required to get power to
those spaces. Although I don't suppose the building has sufficient
existing spare capacity, so they are going to have to dig that from
somewhere else (the main road perhaps, or potentially the nearest
substation).
--
Roland Perry

[Theo]

That's interesting - we've never had a free slot on the weekend. Maybe
there's more demand in town during the week (people at work) and more out of
town at the weekend (people at home), which would be why you get them at the
weekend and we do midweek?

Since it seems to be giving different people free slots at different times,
it may be based on hyper-local conditions: eg depends how much generation
and what type your particular grid segment has. We have both solar and wind
(16MW) locally, so maybe we get more from those?

Theo