A14 news: J33 dedicated slip open

[David Williams]

From A428Cat on Twitter at 08:50 today.

Good Morning, we're pleased to let you know that the A14
eastbound to A10 northbound dedicated slip lane at Milton J33
is now open to traffic following work carried out last night.

Contain your excitement. It was just one night of work, with the
A10 closed between J33 and Butt Lane. I don't expect to see more
than changes to signage and white lines, on that lane only.

In any case, for the next couple of weeks, traffic on the A10
northbound will meet traffic lights for gas mains work between
Milton and Waterbeach. At peak times, the queue has been starting
somewhere south of the Butt Lane junction. (I haven't seen the
southbound queue but I guess it behaves similarly.)

BTW, A428Cat has started calling J33 a "gyratory". What, why?

--
David

[Roland Perry]

In message <87h7h6h...@yahoo.co.uk>, at 09:59:56 on Wed, 7 Jul 2021,
David Williams <davi...@yahoo.co.uk> remarked:

>From A428Cat on Twitter at 08:50 today.
>
> Good Morning, we're pleased to let you know that the A14
> eastbound to A10 northbound dedicated slip lane at Milton J33
> is now open to traffic following work carried out last night.
>
>Contain your excitement. It was just one night of work, with the
>A10 closed between J33 and Butt Lane. I don't expect to see more
>than changes to signage and white lines, on that lane only.

What about restoring the white lines on the main roundabout? Southbound
clockwise coming out of the A10 was still a mess a couple of months ago.

>In any case, for the next couple of weeks, traffic on the A10
>northbound will meet traffic lights for gas mains work between
>Milton and Waterbeach. At peak times, the queue has been starting
>somewhere south of the Butt Lane junction. (I haven't seen the
>southbound queue but I guess it behaves similarly.)
>
>BTW, A428Cat has started calling J33 a "gyratory". What, why?
>

--

Roland Perry

[David Williams]

Roland Perry <rol...@perry.co.uk> writes:

> In message <87h7h6h...@yahoo.co.uk>, at 09:59:56 on Wed, 7 Jul
> 2021, David Williams <davi...@yahoo.co.uk> remarked:
>>From A428Cat on Twitter at 08:50 today.
>>
>> Good Morning, we're pleased to let you know that the A14
>> eastbound to A10 northbound dedicated slip lane at Milton J33
>> is now open to traffic following work carried out last night.
>>
>>Contain your excitement. It was just one night of work, with the
>>A10 closed between J33 and Butt Lane. I don't expect to see more
>>than changes to signage and white lines, on that lane only.
>
> What about restoring the white lines on the main roundabout?
> Southbound clockwise coming out of the A10 was still a mess a couple
> of months ago.

Nothing is new on the surface of the roundabout, lines nor
tarmac. They have repaired some of the barriers on the inside of
the roundabout over the past months and are still doing
"something" big on the westbound entry slip but that's it.

There are other finishing and repair works scheduled but I think
those affect other places on or near this section of the A14 and
the A428 to the Madingley junction.

ObQuiz: "clockwise" - when do you go round a roundabout
anticlockwise?

-

I used the new lane late morning and there's nothing unexpected.
All cones have gone, there's clear hatching and lane marking on
the dedicated slip and a couple of signs say "Merge 150 yards".

My first impressions are that the turn in the slip lane is
concentrated at the roundabout, making it a corner linking two
straight-ish sections rather than one smooth curve. Also, the tarmac
approaching that corner has a few minor bumps and the merge is
fairly abrupt so I won't be racing towards it.

>>In any case, for the next couple of weeks, traffic on the A10
>>northbound will meet traffic lights for gas mains work between
>>Milton and Waterbeach. At peak times, the queue has been starting
>>somewhere south of the Butt Lane junction. (I haven't seen the
>>southbound queue but I guess it behaves similarly.)
>>
>>BTW, A428Cat has started calling J33 a "gyratory". What, why?
>>

--

David

[Mark Carroll]

On 07 Jul 2021, David Williams wrote:

> ObQuiz: "clockwise" - when do you go round a roundabout
> anticlockwise?

Well, as I live in Tennessee... (-: Certainly weird when one's first
getting used to it though.

-- Mark

[Alan]

On Wed, 07 Jul 2021 14:09:37 +0100, David Williams <davi...@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:

>
> I used the new lane late morning and there's nothing unexpected.
> All cones have gone, there's clear hatching and lane marking on
> the dedicated slip and a couple of signs say "Merge 150 yards".
>
> My first impressions are that the turn in the slip lane is
> concentrated at the roundabout, making it a corner linking two
> straight-ish sections rather than one smooth curve. Also, the tarmac
> approaching that corner has a few minor bumps and the merge is
> fairly abrupt so I won't be racing towards it.
>

I used it this morning as well, and like you, I thought it a very tight
turn, which might catch a few late night boy racers.

I also thought the merge was interesting as markings seem to give priority
to A14 traffic, over the roundabout traffic. Might be interesting point
of confrontation in evening rush hours with the cars out of Cambridge
expecting priority.

--
Alan

Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

[Tim Ward]

Oh, are there roundabouts in the USA? - I'm sure we've always been told
they don't have any.

--
Tim Ward - 07801 703 600
www.brettward.co.uk

[Mark Carroll]

On 07 Jul 2021, Tim Ward wrote:

> On 07/07/2021 14:14, Mark Carroll wrote:
>> On 07 Jul 2021, David Williams wrote:
>>
>>> ObQuiz: "clockwise" - when do you go round a roundabout
>>> anticlockwise?
>>
>> Well, as I live in Tennessee... (-: Certainly weird when one's first
>> getting used to it though.
>
> Oh, are there roundabouts in the USA? - I'm sure we've always been told
> they don't have any.

It varies markedly from state to state, and also over the years. E.g., I
didn't see any in Ohio for years and there was no hint of such in their
highway code equivalent, but then these very-short circular roads
started appearing in a couple of places with "yield" signs on the
entries - effectively a roundabout in all but name. Then, travelling a
bit more, I found they did exist elsewhere but by different names, e.g.,
they seemed established in Massachusetts but are "rotaries" instead.
Here in Tennessee they do call them roundabouts but they may be more a
thing from the past decade or so, I don't recall happening to bump into
them on rather earlier visits to the state, and they're not especially
frequent. My guess is: mostly they don't have them, except for in some
states and just somewhat, but they're growing a little more popular, and
by various names. Off-hand I also don't recall seeing them in Ontario
but I was more surprised by things like the green light of the traffic
lights flashing at me.

-- Mark

[Roland Perry]

In message <87czrug...@yahoo.co.uk>, at 14:09:37 on Wed, 7 Jul 2021,

David Williams <davi...@yahoo.co.uk> remarked:
>Roland Perry <rol...@perry.co.uk> writes:
>
>> In message <87h7h6h...@yahoo.co.uk>, at 09:59:56 on Wed, 7 Jul
>> 2021, David Williams <davi...@yahoo.co.uk> remarked:
>>>From A428Cat on Twitter at 08:50 today.
>>>
>>> Good Morning, we're pleased to let you know that the A14
>>> eastbound to A10 northbound dedicated slip lane at Milton J33
>>> is now open to traffic following work carried out last night.
>>>
>>>Contain your excitement. It was just one night of work, with the
>>>A10 closed between J33 and Butt Lane. I don't expect to see more
>>>than changes to signage and white lines, on that lane only.
>>
>> What about restoring the white lines on the main roundabout?
>> Southbound clockwise coming out of the A10 was still a mess a couple
>> of months ago.
>
>Nothing is new on the surface of the roundabout, lines nor
>tarmac. They have repaired some of the barriers on the inside of
>the roundabout over the past months and are still doing
>"something" big on the westbound entry slip but that's it.
>
>There are other finishing and repair works scheduled but I think
>those affect other places on or near this section of the A14 and
>the A428 to the Madingley junction.
>
>ObQuiz: "clockwise" - when do you go round a roundabout
>anticlockwise?

The alternative to clockwise, is across the centre :)

I was trying to give a mental picture that the damaged/confusing lane
markings aren't just at the A10 traffic lights, but *around* the
roundabout as well

>I used the new lane late morning and there's nothing unexpected.
>All cones have gone, there's clear hatching and lane marking on
>the dedicated slip and a couple of signs say "Merge 150 yards".
>
>My first impressions are that the turn in the slip lane is
>concentrated at the roundabout, making it a corner linking two
>straight-ish sections rather than one smooth curve. Also, the tarmac
>approaching that corner has a few minor bumps and the merge is
>fairly abrupt so I won't be racing towards it.

--
Roland Perry

[Roland Perry]

In message <87pmvun...@ixod.org>, at 11:06:02 on Wed, 7 Jul 2021,
Mark Carroll <mt...@kings.cantab.net> remarked:

>>>> ObQuiz: "clockwise" - when do you go round a roundabout
>>>> anticlockwise?
>>>
>>> Well, as I live in Tennessee... (-: Certainly weird when one's first
>>> getting used to it though.
>>
>> Oh, are there roundabouts in the USA? - I'm sure we've always been told
>> they don't have any.
>
>It varies markedly from state to state, and also over the years. E.g., I
>didn't see any in Ohio for years and there was no hint of such in their
>highway code equivalent, but then these very-short circular roads
>started appearing in a couple of places with "yield" signs on the
>entries - effectively a roundabout in all but name. Then, travelling a
>bit more, I found they did exist elsewhere but by different names, e.g.,
>they seemed established in Massachusetts but are "rotaries" instead.

Washington DC has a number of "Circles". Some of which are famous
landmarks in their own right https://goo.gl/maps/BYhtL1J67y8MyN399
--
Roland Perry

[Mark Carroll]

On 08 Jul 2021, Roland Perry wrote:

> Washington DC has a number of "Circles". Some of which are famous
> landmarks in their own right https://goo.gl/maps/BYhtL1J67y8MyN399

Aha, good point, I've not driven there since 2004, other times I've used
varieties of public tranport, like driving to Rockville and taking the
red line in from there. Other times I have visited the area, e.g., to
visit Dahlgren or Gaithersburg, I did not have to go into DC itself.

Incidentally, I have also used roundabouts in Michigan and Rhode Island,
but, again, at least back when I was last there, they were hardly
commonplace. On my everyday routes here in East Tennessee, I don't come
across any at all, though I hazily recall there being one somewhere
hereabouts.

-- Mark

[David Williams]

Valid answer and first, so take a bow. (I mainly had in mind an
answer that doesn't require driving on the right.)

Mind you, when I'm a paid writer for a US readership I write
"counter-clockwise" but that's a matter of being understood
easily rather than avoiding collisions and other unpleasantness
on the road.

--
David

[Mark Carroll]

On 08 Jul 2021, David Williams wrote:

> Valid answer and first, so take a bow. (I mainly had in mind an
> answer that doesn't require driving on the right.)

Thank you. (-:

> Mind you, when I'm a paid writer for a US readership I write
> "counter-clockwise" but that's a matter of being understood
> easily rather than avoiding collisions and other unpleasantness
> on the road.

I do try to adapt my writing and speech for my audience but I am far
from perfect at it, I think I let a "color" slip in to a recent cam.*
article, and it is doubly difficult when writing /about/ things in one
country for those in the other. Plus, of course, transplants, such as my
Ohio-born children still in Perthshire. I also have interlocutors from
rather different populations in the different weechat buffers of my
instant messaging. Alas, I still sometimes find my fingers aiming for
M-x greed.

-- Mark

[David Williams]

There you go, giving yourself and 4x4 drivers a bad name.

> I was trying to give a mental picture that the damaged/confusing lane
> markings aren't just at the A10 traffic lights, but *around* the
> roundabout as well

We, and others, have agreed that here before. Even A428Cat
replied to a tweet yesterday with "we continue to engage with
Cambridgeshire County Council on the surfacing and white lining
of the Milton junction."

I have no idea whether that engagement is about design, timing or
finance. Time, perhaps lots of it, will tell.

My impression is that it's possible to follow every rule and hint
of good practice in road design and still produce something wrong
or least "off" - counter to user expectation, vulnerable to
obscured signage or misinterpretation... If there isn't a design,
test, repeat approach before implementation then the public does the
testing.

-

BTW, a few months back you posted a link to a video of somebody
cutting in front of you to use the westbound entry slip. Nothing
showed that you did anything wrong and I was going to sympathise
but I failed to reply when I drifted into developing a completely
foolproof design for the whole roundabout - and unfortunately the
margin of this post remains too narrow to hold it. :-)

--
David

[Clive D.W. Feather]

In article <87czrug...@yahoo.co.uk>, David Williams
<davi...@yahoo.co.uk> writes

>ObQuiz: "clockwise" - when do you go round a roundabout
>anticlockwise?

[Yes, I'm way behind. So what?]

I (or rather, SWMBO) did it today, at J1 of the M40, where it becomes
the A40 into London. The roundabout at the intersection is two-way
traffic.

(We were being redirected by the satnav to avoid the stationary traffic
on the M25 because of all the people unable to read the dozens of "M4
CLOSED" signs.)

More generally, when you're turning right at a ring junction such as the
one in Hemel Hempstead or the one that used to be where the A13 crossed
the A130.

--
Clive D.W. Feather

[Clive D.W. Feather]

In article <sc4d8n$6qq$1...@dont-email.me>, Tim Ward <t...@brettward.co.uk>
writes

>Oh, are there roundabouts in the USA? - I'm sure we've always been told
>they don't have any.

The only ones I've driven round were in Massachusetts and some mini-
roundabouts in Oregon, but I see from the thread that there are others.

Hmm, I have vague memories of a Charlie Chaplin film where he mistakes a
helmet dropped by a soldier for a mini-roundabout. That was set in the
USA.

--
Clive D.W. Feather

[David Williams]

A somewhat stale coconut to that man, which seems ungenerous
given the two examples new to me. Thanks.

Ring junctions were the UK answer that I had in mind. I think
Hemel Hempstead is the only one I have driven, perhaps using it
six times a year. It has never seemed a problem, but I have to
toss a mental coin to choose a side when going straight
ahead. I'm unsure I'd be as confident on less regular layouts
such as the magic roundabout in Swindon.

Your other examples were new to me and I had to search to locate
the A13/A130 junction at Sadlers Farm (near Canvey Island). The
change to the current layout was a non-trivial project.

The Wikipedia article on roundabouts introduced me to terms for
other variants, some from the Netherlands, but nothing that
quite matched Cambridge's "Dutch" roundabout.

-

Back on topic, the J33 to A10(N) dedicated lane seems to have been
trouble-free but I may have missed some news. It's still early
days...

--
David

[Roland Perry]

In message <87sfxyk...@yahoo.co.uk>, at 12:19:05 on Tue, 21 Sep

2021, David Williams <davi...@yahoo.co.uk> remarked:

>Back on topic, the J33 to A10(N) dedicated lane seems to have been
>trouble-free but I may have missed some news. It's still early
>days...

I was there yesterday and it mirrors the same new layout as at the "BP"
roundabout west of Ely, merging two lanes of traffic into one rather
abruptly.

https://goo.gl/maps/e7CWnZyxscDfxGR2A

Where one notes that both the Streetcar and the white van both took the
short-cut, which is supposed to be for traffic from Chatteris
direction[1] to filter into the northbound. Whereas the grey hatchback
above has taken the 'official' (if not entirely obvious to a stranger
from the lane markings) route.

[1] eg the light grey hatchback here:
<https://goo.gl/maps/X23JfNgBXW1BzqES6>
--
Roland Perry

[tim...]

"Clive D.W. Feather" <cl...@davros.org> wrote in message
news:zA4ao6Aj...@davros.org...

> In article <sc4d8n$6qq$1...@dont-email.me>, Tim Ward <t...@brettward.co.uk>
> writes
>>Oh, are there roundabouts in the USA? - I'm sure we've always been told
>>they don't have any.
>
> The only ones I've driven round were in Massachusetts and some mini-
> roundabouts in Oregon, but I see from the thread that there are others.

There's one in the centre of Gettysburg, which at the time I was there had
warning signs as you approached it detailing how you should use it

I see from street view that they have taken these signs away now

[Rink]

Op 19-9-2021 om 22:36 schreef Clive D.W. Feather:

> In article <87czrug...@yahoo.co.uk>, David Williams
> <davi...@yahoo.co.uk> writes
>> ObQuiz: "clockwise" - when do you go round a roundabout
>> anticlockwise?
>
> [Yes, I'm way behind. So what?]
>
> I (or rather, SWMBO) did it today, at J1 of the M40, where it becomes
> the A40 into London. The roundabout at the intersection is two-way
> traffic.

That's not a roundabout. That's a kind of ring road.
As you can see hear, there are 4 roundabouts in that road.

< https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5611783,-0.4957036,535m/data=!3m1!1e3>

>
> (We were being redirected by the satnav to avoid the stationary traffic
> on the M25 because of all the people unable to read the dozens of "M4
> CLOSED" signs.)
>
> More generally, when you're turning right at a ring junction such as the
> one in Hemel Hempstead or the one that used to be where the A13 crossed
> the A130.
>

As you can see a normal roundabout with one direction with traffic
lights that goes over a small part of the roundabout.
Not the whole roundabout is anticlockwise, but only a small part.

<https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5664085,0.5404841,3a,75y,74.93h,92.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sbgmf9JO2wf0KAgLQCDOoGQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656>




A better answer at the ObQuiz question is:
"all over Europe except the UK."

Rink