Considering a Cabo Rico...

[Jonathan Welsh]

Hello All,

   I found this Cabo Rico Owner's Group via Dave Newberg's excellent website devoted to SV Cigano (his gorgeous CR34 up in Michigan), and Cabo Rico boats have also now made "the short list" of long-term cruisers for us to use in our later years (we are both 47 years-old now) for  sailing to/from the east coast to the Caribbean a couple of times a year.  We just began sailing about 5 years ago & have really gotten bitten by the "bug" (or is that just sea-sickness?).  We have chartered with friends 5 times, we have completed ASA101, and by the end of October will have completed ASA103/ASA104 & ASA118 (Docking certification).  We are decent sailors already, but there is a great deal more we need to learn.  To that end, we are utilizing the Maryland School of Sailing & Seamanship for our formal training…we are VERY excited.

   We are looking for well-built, seaworthy, and reasonably well-performing sailboats for the two of us (we have always been "child-free" and have always LOVED it!!).  I am 6'4" tall and my wife is 5'7" tall.  I enjoy sailing faster than she does & also enjoy getting the windward hull out of the water on our Hobie Getaway catamaran.  I enjoy riding motorcycles and don't mind excessive speed…my wife HATES it.  I know it will be difficult to find a boat that suits both of our wants, but here's a start...Our "short list" of boats we're considering are:

-Cabo Rico 34 or 38 (though I have read that the 34 is a better performer…faster, points better, etc.)

-Island Packet 350 or Estero (very expensive though)

-Pacific Seacraft Crealock 34

-Tartan 3400

-Cape Dory 33 or 330

I have already enjoyed reading the thoughts of the nice folks on this forum, and I look forward to hearing any suggestions/problems/etc. you might have.

[Leslie.Owen]

As an owner of a CR 34 and ride fast motorcycles...welcome Jonathan!

Clay

S/V Tango

Lankford Bay Marina

Chesapeake Bay, Md.
Sent from my iPad

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[Acierno]

Hey and welcome soon to the club. It is exceedingly unlikely that the 34 will overcome the shorter waterline and sail faster than the 38, but the more important point is that these boats were built for safe stable comfortable passages, not speed.  They certainly aren't slow, and with the correct sails I'd bet the title on my 38 against any 34. With respect to other faster brands, if you want to arrive in Bermuda  a day later, fully rested, and with a wife who wants to go on to the Azores rather than fly home, then get the CR over a lighter faster boat. Full disclosure, Mine is "casually" for sale. I'm always looking for an excuse to go out, and if you feel like a trip to charleston for a test sail to see the boat in action, come on down. 

Ron Acierno, PhD

Associate Dean for Research & Professor

Medical University of South Carolina

College of Nursing

843-792-2949

On Aug 31, 2014, at 6:41 PM, Jonathan Welsh <jona...@appoutfitters.com> wrote:

--

[Leslie Owen]

Jonathan, the courses with the Maryland School are held at our marina.  Let us know when you will be attending and we may be there if you wish to see Tango.  She will be out at Hartge's for work on electronics this Fall but if we are there, you would be welcome to see one of these lovely vessels.

You are the second person to say the little sister of the beautiful 38 sails better.  The other person was a boat broker who was trying to show us an IP 35.  We were turning her down and cancelling the appointment as we had decided on our CR34.  Can't really say one CR is better than the other but I do know that the 34 is a very surefooted vessel.  We viewed the 38 was more for us to take care of.  That is what made us focus on the smaller vessel.  It is the old "wax on, wax off" thought that goes through our heads but maybe you will hire people to work on your vessel?  We do what we can ourselves so try to keep it under control.

Do come introduce yourself if you get to Lankford Bay Marina.  Always nice to meet other lovers of the Cabo Rico boats.

with kind regards,

Leslie

Leslie Owen

s/v Tango, CR34

Lankford Bay Marina

Chester River, MD

[Jonathan Welsh]

Ron,

   Wow!!  Thanks for the very kind offer of a test sail.  We live in Greenville, SC & own a small hiking/backpacking/adventure travel shop called Appalachian Outfitters.  This October will mark our 20th anniversary of business.  With regards to me reading that a 34 performs better than a 38…it just proves that just because I found someone who said it on the internet doesn't make it true…who knew?…Your logic makes perfect sense: how could the shorter boat outperform the longer?  Like I said, I greatly appreciate and look forward to all responses to my questions about Cabo Rico boats.

   If you're ever up towards Greenville, look me up at:

Appalachian Outfitters 

191 Halton Road

Greenville, SC 29607

(864) 987-0618

Cheers,

     Jonathan Welsh

[Jonathan Welsh]

Leslie,

   Thanks very much for your kind offer.  Because we own a small retail shop in Greenville, SC, and because our manager unexpectedly resigned 2 weeks ago, my wife and I are forced to attend the Maryland School courses separately.  Diana (my wife) will be at Lankford Bay Marina on Friday afternoon (Sept 5th) in preparation for her ASA103 class beginning on Saturday 06 Sept.  She then will complete the ASA104 class about a week later.  I will be at work in Greenville ("holding down the fort" until she returns).  Then, on 26 September, I will arrive at Lankford Bay Marina (late afternoon) in preparation for my ASA103/ASA104 Combo class beginning on 27 September.  I would be greatly honored to see your CR34 if we can make the scheduling work (and as long as it is not inconvenient for you).

Again, I am humbled by the kindness of the folks on this website.

Most Graciously,

    Jonathan Welsh

[Dave Newberg]

Hello Jonathan,

To your short list of boats you might want to consider adding a Mason 33 - they are also set up perfectly for a cruising couple and like CRs, are exceptional, high quality boats. 

I'm glad you found our website useful. It's there because info about the CR34 was nigh impossible to find. We compiled everything we gathered from others, comments based on inquiries we received after owning Cigano for a number of years, also a bunch of general commentary. We tried to be comprehensive, objective, and honest. I also believe in karma - give something of value to others and it comes back . . .

A few comments about the CR34 vs 38. In terms of performance I would put my money on the 38 beating the 34 in virtually all conditions probably even in very light wind. I'm surprised to hear of anyone claiming that the 34 is faster - it just doesn't make sense considering the similar designs and waterline length difference. We've sailed both, and both are sweet sailing boats in their prescribed element which is not racing around the buoys but cruising in comfort. I commented on our web site to the effect that we thought the 34 may feel a bit more responsive than the 38, but that's a pretty logical assumption considering the 34's length/displacement ratio advantage and the 38's extra 5,000 or more pounds. 

The headroom in the 34 is not 6'4", perhaps 6'1" or 6'2". Check with the CR38 owners here on the forum for their measurements if that is a factor for you. If headroom is not a deal breaker, choosing between the two depends on your intended use. If I was crossing oceans, I would opt for the 38 in a heartbeat, more tankage, more waterline for faster passages and smoother ride, more stowage space and capacity for provisions, etc. As for coastal cruising and island hopping, each boat has it's particular merits in that category. For sailing around the great lakes with our typical outings of three weeks or less (even a month), and for an occasional weekend guest or two in the aft cabin, there is not another boat we can think of that we'd prefer over the CR34 - it simply works for us. Both boats can be managed by two, singlehanded too I believe. I can sail Cigano myself including docking, although I prefer another crew. I think the 38 is a bit more difficult to dock but doable singlehanded. We all love our boats - I suspect that every one on this forum considers themselves to be some of the luckiest folks on earth to be sailing a CR.

Cheers

Dave

- Cigano

[Jonathan Welsh]

Dave,

   Thanks so much for reply.  I have greatly enjoyed reading your website & look forward to actually sailing a Cabo Rico...this virtual sailing thing is a drag, man!  Regarding the CR34, the 6'4" headroom isn't a deal-breaker for me; I'm MUCH more concerned about my wife feeling secure and safe aboard (I'm accustomed to hunching).  From everything I've read, either the 34 or the 38 would suit our desires/needs/requirements.  I am fairly handy so I don't feel intimidated by working on a project, but I don't want a "hole to throw money into".  CRs seem like they are extremely well-made, durable boats.

Keep up the great work on the website!

Most Graciously,

   Jonathan Welsh

[Clay]

Just to throw in a monkey wrench CR did make a few 36's..just an extended 34. An occasional one does pop up on Yacht World.

Clay 

s/v Tango  

[Tom Fuhs]

Jonathan,  I just noticed your google+ profile.  If you choose a Cabo Rico, you would not be the only motorcycle rider in the group.  I'm pretty sure that Clay rides a BMW, and I ride a Harley Davidson.  There may be others.  

With regard to your original question, all the boats in your list are quality boats.  The Pacific Seacraft 34 will be considerably smaller inside than the CR 34.  Just something to consider.  Also, the IP-350 is bigger inside than the CR38. It feels very large by comparison.  They are beamy and carry their beam pretty far aft.   I've looked at a number of IP's for some friends (a sort of pre-survey) and they are very spacious below.  I don't think they perform as well as the CR's however.  I think the Cape Dory 36 is more in line size wise with either the CR 34 or 38.  Bill Crealock drew the CR34 in a time when most boats were beginning to carry beam further and further aft, whereas the 38 has a proportionally narrower stern.  This means the the CR34 has more volume below than a CR38 would have if it were only 34 ft.  Another way to put it is that proportionally, the 34 is bigger than the 38 even though in absolute volume, the 38 is larger.  Hope that makes sense.   

Tom Fuhs

S/Y Eclipse

CR 38 #115

Rock Hall,  Md.

[Leslie.Owen]

Tom-

Just a side note...Les has a URAL... :)

Clay

Sent from my iPad

[Tom Fuhs]

Ha!   That's awesome and doesn't surprise me!  Do you get to ride in the side car?

-Tom

[Bill Jones]

And I have a Harley:)  As an aside I single hand my Cabo 38 with ease.  When I was docked in the Santa Cruz Harbor I would practice docking under sail, single handed, including a 180 deg turn as part of the procedure.  In general I have found the Cabo Rico to be very user friendly:)

Bill

Alakazam

[charlie kelly]

Hello all Charlie Kelly here with a 1976 Tiburon 36 which I understand is the early CR and that the problem with the poor sales was it had no V birth and so Crealock extended the mold two feet aft and made the 38. He reconfigured the interior and added the V berth. I have this from what I consider a very reliable source. Any other Tiburon owners in this group? We to (two) love our CR, Charlie & Margalynn in Fort Myers Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

[Jonathan Welsh]

I have owned over 30 motorcycles in my life and have always enjoyed riding.  Earlier this summer I took a solo motorcycle trip from Greenville, SC to the highest roads in ALL of the states in the Northeast...8 days, 3200 miles of riding!  My shortest day was about 10 hours of saddle time,; my longest was 13.5 hours.  My wife (and even my riding buddies) said that I had lost my mind.  I had a blast!!

That level of passion & commitment is finding its way toward my sailing too.  I genuinely desire to improve my skills, safety, and confidence.  CRs seem to be very well-respected boats...

[ron Gmail]

Yes. If you want to go anywhere, as in anywhere in the world from anywhere in the world, and you want to be able to do it yourself or with shot crew, and not be beaten to death in the process but actually enjoy the ride, this is your vessel. 

Sort of like your Harley vs a Yamaha fj. Both are built For "cruising" but I guarantee your butt and back will feel much better after cruising on your Harley vs cruising on my old f J. 

from phone, please forgive siri spelling

Ron Acierno, PhD

Professor and Associate Dean for Research

Medical University of South Carolina

College of Nursing, 
99 Jonathan Lucas St. MSC 160
Charleston SC 29425-1600

P: (843) 792-2949
F: (843) 792-6698
acierno@musc.edu
http://www.musc.edu/nursing

MUSC Nurses Change Lives!

On Sep 3, 2014, at 6:21 PM, Jonathan Welsh <jona...@appoutfitters.com> wrote:

I have owned over 30 motorcycles in my life and have always enjoyed riding.  Earlier this summer I took a solo motorcycle trip from Greenville, SC to the highest roads in ALL of the states in the Northeast...8 days, 3200 miles of riding!  My shortest day was about 10 hours of saddle time,; my longest was 13.5 hours.  My wife (and even my riding buddies) said that I had lost my mind.  I had a blast!!

That level of passion & commitment is finding its way toward my sailing too.  I genuinely desire to improve my skills, safety, and confidence.  CRs seem to be very well-respected boats...

[Charlie Purdum]

Sailing and motorcycling share the same experience, it's all about the journey vs. the destination.

Charlie

Ex CR-34/015 Owner and missing her!

Charlie Purdum

814.441.8394 (office)

860.912.2380 (cell)

On Sep 3, 2014, at 18:21, Jonathan Welsh <jona...@appoutfitters.com> wrote:

I have owned over 30 motorcycles in my life and have always enjoyed riding.  Earlier this summer I took a solo motorcycle trip from Greenville, SC to the highest roads in ALL of the states in the Northeast...8 days, 3200 miles of riding!  My shortest day was about 10 hours of saddle time,; my longest was 13.5 hours.  My wife (and even my riding buddies) said that I had lost my mind.  I had a blast!!

That level of passion & commitment is finding its way toward my sailing too.  I genuinely desire to improve my skills, safety, and confidence.  CRs seem to be very well-respected boats...

[S/V Corsair]

I am 6'5" and own 1980 CR38 Hull #31.  The headroom is generally 6'3" throughout the salon but there is 2-3 foot section of the salon just forward of the Galley where the sole drops down 2 inches and before the cabin roof drops down where I can stand up and have about 1" clearance.  I am not sure this is the case in later models but it is my sweet spot on the boat.  Here is a video of the interior I made a few months ago in which I describe/demonstrate the headroom clearance.

http://youtu.be/H15UA9XmBmI?list=UU8dsJQ_9CEwRmur_HFSXezA

My boat is at Herrington Harbour South in Deale MD.  If you are around during the week give me a shout. I am always looking for crew.  

[gerard.s...@gmail.com]

Ron,

 

I am also new to this group.  I learned to sail in 2007-2008 when i lived in St. Croix and have dreamed of owning my first big boat ever since.  i have been saving and preparing for many years now and am "casually" starting my journey to purchasing my very own.  i have not started visiting listed boats, as im not wanting to waste owners time showing them just yet, however i have all but sold myself on a CR.(i know this is a big no no when buying but i am hard pressed to find another boat that offers so much)  the reason im writing is your offer to Jonathan caught my attention.  i read somewhere else on this board that the difference in the way two identical hulls sail due to 25 years of maintenance or lack there of is considerable.  what im looking for is a chance to sail on a boat that has been well cared for as a basis for comparison when i begin my treck to ownership.  if you would be willing, i would love the opportunity to go out with you for a day when it warms up a bit maybe in a few months.  thanks for your time.

 

Cheers,

Gerard Satterlee

[Ron Acierno]

absolutely, its another chance for me to sail, and I can tell the wife its a potential buyer, which doesn't count against my hourly allotment on the water away from chores. when you can get to Charleston, let me know. this past weekend we had beautiful 15 knots wind against 3 knot current in Charleston harbor...as we comfortably sipped scotch under yankee and reefed (new) main, first into, and then with the resulting washing machine harbor.  I sail every weekend and when it get's darker later, at least one weeknight. drop a line a bit in advance and welcome.

ron

[gerard.s...@gmail.com]

absolutely will do.  Thank You!