And so it begins

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petevannuys

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Aug 8, 2022, 12:04:58 PM8/8/22
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Rad ebikes dued for death of a child passenger



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Jim Baross

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Aug 8, 2022, 12:16:45 PM8/8/22
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Are the requirements for brakes on a Bicycle the same as for eBikes; Per CVC 21201, "... to make one braked wheel skid on dry, level, clean pavement"?

Jim Baross
Board Member, League of American Bicyclists
President, Calif. Assoc. of Bicycling Organizations
Board Member, San Diego County Bicycle Coalition

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William Sellin

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Aug 8, 2022, 12:27:36 PM8/8/22
to Jim Baross, Pete van Nuys, CABO Forum
If they are legally defined as bicycles - I would think so… but who wants a skid at 20 mph? (or @ any speed really)

If they are able to throttle over 20 mph they are not bicycles and are not legal to ride on any public road and prohibited from any bikeway… 
but still selling like hotcakes - RAD calls their 750 watt device a “Beast”.
No one NEEDS 750 watts any more than anyone NEEDS a high powered sports car - but marketing…

Tragic death, but completely understandable if a parent doesn’t secure a device like that from their 12 year old driving it. 
I don’t have a child but would never leave out any dangerous devices for a kid to play with.

Legal for a 12 year old to ride a Class 2 throttle eBike in California - but no reasonable person would encourage it (other than a purveyor of eBikes trying to get rich)
Pushing the limit of a 750 watt motor on a heavy device that handles more like a moped will logically result in such bad results, even if ‘designed for adults’.
12 year olds should ride acoustic bikes, not electric bikes.  



Infrastructure Review Committee
      OCBike.org

Area Director for Caltrans District 12
      CABOBike.org

clint.sandusky

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Aug 8, 2022, 12:30:27 PM8/8/22
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Hello Jim,

Standby for a follow-up email.  I have both the legal and practical answers.

Clint Sandusky⚡️



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Clinton Sandusky

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Aug 8, 2022, 1:05:24 PM8/8/22
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Hi Jim,

As Pete knows:

LEGAL REQUIREMENTS FOR CA AND U.S.

Per CVC 24016(c): Every manufacturer of an electric bicycle shall certify that it complies with the equipment and manufacturing requirements for bicycles adopted by the United States Consumer Product Safety Commission (16 C.F.R. 1512.1, et seq.) - 16 CFR § 1512.5 - Requirements for braking system. | CFR | US Law | LII / Legal Information Institute (cornell.edu).  Note: Be sure to read all subsections to 16 C.F.R. 1512.5 (also 1512.1 - 1512.20).

PRACTICABLY AND SAFELY

All modern and quality e-Bikes are now equipped with hydraulic disc brakes (front and rear) and with beefer rotors.  As an example, Trek's Service/Police Electric Model eMTB has 203mm rotors with 4-pistons per caliper.  BEEFY AND VERY EFFICIENT!!!

AVOID AFTERMARKET E-BIKE "CONVERSION KITS!"  The guy who just serviced my double-door garage door today told me of his injury while riding a conversion kit e-Bike.  JUST DON'T DO IT!  BUY QUALITY AND LEGALLY COMPLIANT E-BIKES ONLY!  LEARN HOW TO RIDE THESE FASTER, HEAVIER AND LESS NIMBLE AT TIMES E-BIKES OUT IN TRAFFIC (CyclingSavvy - Empowerment to Ride Anywhere. Ride Awesome! and E-Bike Etiquette, Misconceptions, and Mixed-Group Riding - CyclingSavvy).

I hope this helps,

Clint Sandusky
Retired Police Cyclist
CA POST Bike Patrol Instructor & SME on Bicycles/E-Bikes
IPMBA e-Bike Task Force member
Cycling in Traffic Expert & Educator
E-Bike Instructor & Presenter
CABO, District 8 Rep.

petevannuys

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Aug 8, 2022, 1:08:23 PM8/8/22
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I don't know about accepted industry standards, and I have wondered if that minimal CVC standard was all that was required by law. Since their wide accepted in the market ( roughly 2013...) however, front and rear discs have been standard on ebikes. 
  The torque driven tendency of the front brake to want to eject the front wheel is demonstrable. But does it loosen the front QR? Doubtful; much much more likely user error.
  And did the Rad model indeed have pegs for the passenger? Rads are generally spec'd better than most Chinese junk, but that's a question the court will need to decide. 
  Fortunately only one passenger was involved. I've seen four tweener girls on one bike several times. 



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-------- Original message --------
From: Jim Baross <jimb...@cox.net>
Date: 8/8/22 09:16 (GMT-08:00)
Cc: CABO Forum <cabo...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [CABOforum] And so it begins

petevannuys

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Aug 8, 2022, 1:09:31 PM8/8/22
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Thanks, Clint.



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Clinton Sandusky

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Aug 8, 2022, 1:17:51 PM8/8/22
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As you know Pete, education and training for e-Bike use is EVEN more important -- especially for older adults and kids!

As an example, body position during a "maximum/emergency braking" event must be as far back and low as possible behind the saddle!  We say at police bike patrol trainings ("Pedals, Butt, Brakes, Stay Back until bike comes to a complete stop!).

Modern and quality e-Bikes, especially eMTBS, all come with much beefier and staple "thru-axles!" QR (Quick Release skewers) are dinosaurs!

Clint



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