Class II bikeway + posts = Class IV bikeway?

[Serge Issakov]

On La Costa Ave in Encinitas there is a class II bike lane the entire length from El Camino Real west to the coast highway. Recently, along this section, at Sheridan Rd, Encinitas placed six green flex posts in the buffer along a 20 foot length to prevent cars from driving into the bike lane to get around cars stopped waiting to turn left. See photo below. 

I filed a report because these posts are a hazard to cyclists. The buffer is technically part of the bike lane and often used for travel by cyclists due to debris, other cyclists and just for conspicuousness and improved sight lines.  Also, the standards don’t allow physical separation in class II bike lanes.

Here’s the reply:

Regarding your point about class II bike lanes, it should be noted that this segment of the bikeway on La Costa Ave is actually a class IV bikeway because of the vertical separation. Class II bikeways can't have vertical separation but class IVs can.

Really?  Class II can’t have vertical separation but you can still add the vertical separation because that converts it to a class IV?

That seems sketchy. Huge loophole! Suggestions?

Serge

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[Judy Frankel]

Obviously as soon as.they put separation it turns into a.class 4. I said the same thing.where they put bollards on Leucadia blvd but its still marked with Bike Lane stencils. The TE thinks that ok. Someone was killed.  There needs to be bile lane end sign. 200 ft transition to merge.out. And sharrows next.to.the class 4.  Same.entering the class.4 on coast.highway from Salona Beach bike lane transition.to class 4 in Encinitas.  A warning and an out is needed.

sent from semi smart phone. please excuse short responses and typos

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[Michael Graff]

They should, but they won't. Outside of this forum, everybody thinks Class IV is twice as good as Class II.

I feel like we've talked about this loophole before. Bikeways that flit back and forth between Class II and IV, simply by installing flimsy barriers. 

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[Adam Bickett]

There was a fatality this weekend (skateboarder) at the site of another recent popup bollards installation (Voigt Dr @ UCSD)  that struck me as particularly unnecessary and dangerous. Terrible. Not advisable to skate down that road, but it seems reasonably likely to me that the bollards on that steep downhill / narrow road contributed. 

https://patch.com/california/lajolla/ucsd-student-killed-campus-skateboard-accident-idd

On Tue, Feb 9, 2021 at 4:30 PM Judy Frankel <judyf...@att.net> wrote:

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[Serge Issakov]

When I saw the headline (skateboarder fatality on UCSD campus) I immediately suspected the cycle trap on Voigt. The article confirmed it was on Voigt, but not whether it was in the cycle trap section. Later I was able to confirm it was there at the bottom of the dip that he was run over. But Phil Young contacted SDPD and they told him they have not discovered anything that indicates the bollards caused the skateboarder to crash.  But there were no witnesses (the motorist who ran him over arrived "some time later" after the crash and so did not see what caused the crash, or even if he was riding anywhere near the bollards when he lost control).  We will probably never know.

Serge

[F Lehnerz]

I can’t help but notice the “drive thru greens” sign in Serge’s photo as well as the private driveway (presumably to the business selling those greens) in the distance just after what is perhaps the state’s shortest Class IV Bikeway segment. 

Good thing Encinitas doesn’t have any bicyclist fatalities in any of their other magic wand 2+2=5 Class II to Class IV conversion projects.

Satire aside, are Professional Engineers protected by “design immunity” (i.e. no skin in the game bureaucrats) also immune from the Engineering Code of Ethics? 

On Feb 9, 2021, at 16:20, Serge Issakov <serge....@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Pete Penseyres]

I agree with Judy. They trap themselves when they say it is a Class IV because it is no longer required per CVC 21208.  It is no longer part of the roadway. You can legally ride in the middle of the remaining narrow roadway lane. To make it clear that it is no longer a Class II it should be dashed for 200 ft before the first post to allow cyclists enough distance to negotiate with traffic and safely merge left. And sharrows should be installed in that section.

However, the City will likely not follow that logic. 

Sorry, I have no other ideas except legally taking the lane whenever you ride there. And then you might have to deal with a citation.

Pete

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/caboforum/CAEy9bH6bFo1uOC-MPDWPhP_VLpbWnfoA1QyE0PLyATqBBRRJ2w%40mail.gmail.com

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[John Eldon]

What angers me most is that so few motorists understand how to initiate a right turn properly, i.e., from the curb, and now cities are installing posts that force them to turn from the wrong place, across a through lane, or at least encourage them to do so with paint. 

Enroute back from campus this morning after my COVID shot, I rode the Class Whatever-It-Is on Voigt. Dr., the one on n/b Torrey Pines Rd. approaching the 3-way intersections w/ Genesee, and the Cardiff cycletrap. 

Voigt. posts continue all the way to the intersection at Hopkins Dr., OK if you want to turn right, as most of the automobile traffic is doing there, but not OK if you want to go straight or left. They even put a Portland style bike box at the intersection itself. Whatever ...  . It's a 4-way stop, by the way.

For those not familiar, the one on TPR corrals cyclists into a perfect right hook setup from TWO RTO lanes. Fortunately, the posts are far enough between, with no damnable berms, that I was able to merge safely into the rightmost of the two LTO lanes. There used to be a bike lane between the two LTOs and the two RTOs, and many of are angered that it got removed.  

Finally, I braved the n/b cycletrap in Cardiff (I refuse to be caught in the s/b disaster) and noted once again the extreme hazard the Las Olas driveway presents. 

This afternoon I drove Leucadia Bl. both ways with my wife. The Moonstone Ct. bollards now stop before the intersection, but there is still no "yield to bikes" etc. signage. Similarly, e/b there are driveway cuts just east of I-5, and the posts continue right up to them. It would sure be nice to get competent traffic engineers to work for the city of Encinitas and the UCSD campus/northern La Jolla area. 

John E.

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/caboforum/E589D410-06B3-46E0-9644-D740C8700338%40gmail.com

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[Serge Issakov]

Here's what I sent them.

Serge

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Abe et al,

Regarding this (in City of Encinitas - Request Closed - REQ-20 - Bike Hazard): "it should be noted that this segment of the bikeway on La Costa Ave is actually a class IV bikeway because of the vertical separation. Class II bikeways can't have vertical separation but class IVs can."

So, you're ending the Class II bike lane and starting a Class IV bikeway mid-block?  If so, then you need R3-17 and R3-17bP signs (see below) 200 feet before the first hazardous post, followed by a 200 foot long transition section, BMUFL signs, and sharrows in the travel lane, to make clear that CVC 21208 does not apply to the Class IV section and cyclists may use the full travel lane there.

That should help mitigate crash risk, but it's only a matter of time before someone is taken out by those posts.  And adding these controls does not address the increased risk of a right hook at Sheridan due to the posts. These posts create a dynamic eerily similar to the one that killed a cyclist in a right hook crash on Leucadia at Moonstone Court in November.

So, my suggestion is to remove the hazardous posts.

Regarding the stated purpose of the Class II to Class IV conversion being for the safety of cyclists, as far as I know there have been no actual incidents here involving westbound motorists using the bike lane to drive around cars waiting to turn left/south, and it's highly unlikely there ever will be one.  It's much more likely the posts themselves will cause a crash.

In any case, please know the original 2/2/21 report about this hazard constitutes an official legal notice of a hazardous condition.

Serge