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597. FHWA proposes to add a new section numbered and titled, “Section 9B.16
Bicycles Use Shoulder Only Sign (R9-21)” to describe the use of this proposed new sign that is an option to use on freeways or expressways. Also, FHWA proposes a new plaque
R5-10dP that is an option to use on freeways to prohibit bicycles on ramps leading to an
adjacent or parallel freeway. The Guidance provided in this section proposes that the
Bicycles Use Shoulder Only sign (R9-21) only be placed adjacent to the on-ramp or
entrance to the freeway at or near the location where the full-width should resume beyond
the entrance ramp taper. FHWA proposes this sign because there are places where
bicycles are permitted on a freeway but are required to travel on an available and usable
shoulder."
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On Dec 11, 2020, at 8:46 PM, Jim Baross <jimb...@cox.net> wrote:
" FHWA also proposes to add new Guidance paragraphs discouraging raised
pavement markers with bicycle lanes or shared-use paths and also recommending that if
raised pavement markers used around bicycle facilities that they are not immediately
adjacent to the travel path of bicycles. FHWA proposes this Guidance because raised
pavement markers create collision potential for bicyclists by placing fixed objects
immediately adjacent to the travel path of the bicyclist.”
How about “Bicycles (or bicyclists) can use full lane”
Rick
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"FULL LANE" certainly has no legal definition in our, or any other state's, vehicle code.
Signs on Highway 1 – Mission St, Santa Cruz:
Rick H.
From: cabo...@googlegroups.com <cabo...@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of Gary Cziko
Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2020 3:27 PM
To: Michael Graff <michae...@pobox.com>
Cc: Karl Rudnick <rudnick...@gmail.com>; Pete Penseyres <cyclo...@yahoo.com>; CABOforum <cabo...@googlegroups.com>; Jim Baross <jimb...@cox.net>; bikerick <bike...@att.net>
Subject: Re: [CABOforum] FHWA press release on new MUTCD
"Control" means total domination!
I'm dressed, are you?
On Sun, Dec 13, 2020 at 3:22 PM Michael Graff <michae...@pobox.com> wrote:
On Sun, Dec 13, 2020 at 2:19 PM Karl Rudnick <rudnick...@gmail.com> wrote:
"FULL LANE" certainly has no legal definition in our, or any other state's, vehicle code.
That's an excellent point.
First we had "share the road", with "share" being undefined.
Now we have "may use full lane", with "full lane" being undefined.
In both cases, we're dancing around what we *really* mean: Cyclists may *control* the lane. Of course, we probably should define what "control" means.
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| 9:02 PM (40 minutes ago) | ![]() ![]() | ||
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In your photo there will ALWAYS be a BICYCLES MUST EXIT to avoid the obvious danger.
Caltrans indifference to bicyclist use of freeways differs from
District to District in my experience. With the exception of the
heavily used I-5 'tween San Clemente and Oceanside, I've never
seen a sign expressly offering bicycle access.
As Karl says, we ride onto the fwy when there's no sign
prohibiting us (usually). But I think there may be on/off ramps
where Bikes Must Exit signs are missing. Knowing we're in "car
territory" we must be careful hopping from shoulder to shoulder at
those ramps. There are uphill sections where the added grade of
the offramp motivates me to cross it rather than exit.
On Dec 24, 2020, at 3:45 PM, Pete van Nuys <petev...@cox.net> wrote:
Caltrans indifference to bicyclist use of freeways differs from District to District in my experience. With the exception of the heavily used I-5 'tween San Clemente and Oceanside, I've never seen a sign expressly offering bicycle access.
<Bikes Permitted When Old 101 closed.PNG>/
As Karl says, we ride onto the fwy when there's no sign prohibiting us (usually). But I think there may be on/off ramps where Bikes Must Exit signs are missing. Knowing we're in "car territory" we must be careful hopping from shoulder to shoulder at those ramps. There are uphill sections where the added grade of the offramp motivates me to cross it rather than exit.
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Pete van Nuys Exec. Dir. Orange County Bicycle Coalition ECI, LCI, CSI 949 492 5737
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Jim, did you want us to review his spreadsheet and comment or just note his comments?
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Time to reflect by more effected citizens is a good thing. I need
help reading between the lines. Perhaps a meeting to discuss?
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I saw some things in passing that gave me pause.
1. Section 5B.06 Traffic Control for Bicycle Facilities: "To
better accommodate machine vision used to support the automation
of vehicles, bicycle facilities should be segregated from
other vehicle traffic using physical barriers where practicable.
Road markings should indicate the end of a bike lane that is
merged with other traffic."
This is a dangerous trend, and for anyone who objects to
advocates such as ourselves using the word "segregation," whelp,
there it is, it's proposed right in the draft MUTCD, and I for one
don't like it. I am quite disturbed by the notion that segregation
must be increased to accommodate machine vision of AVs.
2.Section 9B.14 Bicycles May Use Full Lane Sign (R4-11). "'The
Bicycles May Use Full Lane (R4-11) sign may be used on roadways
where no bicycle lanes or adjacent shoulders usable by bicycles
are present and where travel lanes are too narrow for bicyclists
bicycles and motor vehicles to operate side by side.' This seems
overly restrictive and unnecessary. In most states there's no law
that wouldn't let a person biking use the full lane next to a bike
lane or shoulder."
I thought bicyclists couldn't be required to use shoulders.
3. Section 9B.21 LEFT TURN YIELD TO Bicycles Sign (R10-12b). "'The LEFT TURN YIELD TO Bicycles sign is used to emphasize the requirement for motorists to yield to bicycles in situations where the motorist is turning across a bicycle movement that may be unexpected in direction, location, or some other quality that would run counter to the typical bicycle lane.' This seems very concerned with limiting the application of these signs."
This begs the question, what about the elephant in the room, i.e. all the talk about "right turn yield to bicycles signs" to deal with right crosses across protected bikeways? And what exactly does the phrase "typical bicycle lane" mean?
4.Section 9E.09 Shared-Lane Marking. "'The shared-lane marking should not be placed on roadways that have a speed limit of 40 mph or more.' I don't understand why this was raised from 'above 35 mph.' I think that most guidance would have lowered the applicable speed, maybe as low as 25 mph. Bicycle Friendly Community application currently does not ask about shared lane markings on roadways over 35 mph."
What our group more commonly calls sharrows should be usable with 35 mph roadways, and I support raising the mph to 40.
Scott Mace
Scott, excellent points. Thank you for your comments.
Pete
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