Speeding ticket in California Highway. 22349(A)
Patrick Harper
Here is my case:
Sometime early this month I got a speeding ticket from the California
Highway Patrol.
Code and Section: 22319(A)VC
Marked as an Infraction, not a misdemeanor.
Max speed was 65 mph. My "aprox. speed", according to the officer, was
either 75 mph or 95 mph. (His hand writing is not clear and he didn't
tell me). For worst case scenario purposes, let's assume it's 95 mph.
My background: first speeding ticket (or any other kind of ticket for
that matter). I have been driving for over 10 years.
Court appearance was set for early next month (5-7-02).
I'm planning to fight this ticket. First I will file a "Written Not
Guilty Plea" 40519(b). Also, I'll request a Trial by Written
Declaration pursuant to CVC 40902.
Before my arraignment, I plan to file an "Informal Discovery Request"
(not sure if this needs to be/can be done in the "Not Guilty Plea"
document).
1- In order to send the "Not Guilty Plea" to the County Clerk, I need
to know the bail amount. I phoned the County Clerk yesterday. I was
told I am still not on the computer and that they will delay the court
appearance until I am. Should I trust them and not show up on
"5-7-02"? Can I send a Not Guilty Plea without the bail check and ask
them to contact me when they set bail?
2- What are the "dangers" of writing a Not Guilty Plea? Will my
chances of getting traffic school diminish if I'm found guilty? Will
the ticket amount increase as a result?
Thanks for your time.
Patrick
Unknown
If you can get it taken off by going to traffic school, go for it.
You will lose that option if you try to fight it by pleading not guilty.
If you do fight it, get it moved to the county seat court if it's
not already here, and ask for a delay after you have a definite
court time set. You want it so that 200 people with tickets show up
in court when the officer wants them to, and you apear all olone in a
different court on a different date. This increases your chance of
having the officer not show up.
Go to amazon.com and get a bunch of books on traffic tickets.
They will be cheaper than the increased insurance costs of being
found guilty of speeding.
D. Stussy
>Hello all,
>
>Here is my case:
>
>Sometime early this month I got a speeding ticket from the California
>Highway Patrol.
>Code and Section: 22319(A)VC
>Marked as an Infraction, not a misdemeanor.
>
>Max speed was 65 mph. My "aprox. speed", according to the officer, was
>either 75 mph or 95 mph. (His hand writing is not clear and he didn't
>tell me). For worst case scenario purposes, let's assume it's 95 mph.
>
>My background: first speeding ticket (or any other kind of ticket for
>that matter). I have been driving for over 10 years.
>
>Court appearance was set for early next month (5-7-02).
>
>I'm planning to fight this ticket. First I will file a "Written Not
>Guilty Plea" 40519(b). Also, I'll request a Trial by Written
>Declaration pursuant to CVC 40902.
>Before my arraignment, I plan to file an "Informal Discovery Request"
>(not sure if this needs to be/can be done in the "Not Guilty Plea"
>document).
I'm not a lawyer but have worked with them often enough - you will need to
submit your discovery request as a separate document because it represents a
separate phase of the proceeding. It may be enclosed in the same envelope, but
needs its own proof of service.
>1- In order to send the "Not Guilty Plea" to the County Clerk, I need
>to know the bail amount. I phoned the County Clerk yesterday. I was
>told I am still not on the computer and that they will delay the court
>appearance until I am. Should I trust them and not show up on
>"5-7-02"? Can I send a Not Guilty Plea without the bail check and ask
>them to contact me when they set bail?
Since you weren't arrested on the spot, you should also argue for ROR without
bail.
>2- What are the "dangers" of writing a Not Guilty Plea? Will my
>chances of getting traffic school diminish if I'm found guilty? Will
>the ticket amount increase as a result?
That, I don't know.
Brent P
>
> My background: first speeding ticket (or any other kind of ticket for
> that matter). I have been driving for over 10 years.
You were overdue for harvesting.
> 1- In order to send the "Not Guilty Plea" to the County Clerk, I need
> to know the bail amount. I phoned the County Clerk yesterday. I was
> told I am still not on the computer and that they will delay the court
> appearance until I am. Should I trust them and not show up on
> "5-7-02"? Can I send a Not Guilty Plea without the bail check and ask
> them to contact me when they set bail?
NEVER TRUST WHAT THE DRONES TELL YOU ON THE PHONE. More times than
not it will get you into deeper trouble.
Patrick Harper
I went to the bookstore and got myself a book.
I read most of it, and I have the following question:
The book says that the "base fine" for "speeding 26 mph and more above
the speed limit" is "$100 (plus a mandatory court appearance)."
What does the "mandatory court appearance" mean? Can I still mail a
"Written Not Guilty Plea". Can I request a Trial by Written
Declaration? What if I decide to pay up... Do I still have to go to
court? Can I just send the amount?
Where in the law does it talk about the mandatory court appearance?
Wow, those were a lot of questions, thanks again for your time.
Patrick
Joe Bramblett, KD5NRH
Harper) wrote:
>Max speed was 65 mph. My "aprox. speed", according to the officer, was
>either 75 mph or 95 mph. (His hand writing is not clear and he didn't
>tell me). For worst case scenario purposes, let's assume it's 95 mph.
Simple; point out that the 15mph he clearly wrote you the ticket for
doing is well under the posted limit.
Joe Bramblett, KD5NRH
kd5...@kd5nrh.net
http://www.kd5nrh.net
Joel Garry
>In article <e1275920.02042...@posting.google.com>, Patrick Harper wrote:
>>
>> My background: first speeding ticket (or any other kind of ticket for
>> that matter). I have been driving for over 10 years.
>
>You were overdue for harvesting.
LOL!
>
>> 1- In order to send the "Not Guilty Plea" to the County Clerk, I need
>> to know the bail amount. I phoned the County Clerk yesterday. I was
>> told I am still not on the computer and that they will delay the court
>> appearance until I am. Should I trust them and not show up on
>> "5-7-02"? Can I send a Not Guilty Plea without the bail check and ask
>> them to contact me when they set bail?
>
>NEVER TRUST WHAT THE DRONES TELL YOU ON THE PHONE. More times than
>not it will get you into deeper trouble.
>
Agreed. But of course, the same may apply to usenet.
jg
--
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http://www.garry.to Oracle and unix guy.
mailto:joel-...@nospam.cox.net Remove nospam to reply.
moocat
>
> What does the "mandatory court appearance" mean? Can I still mail a
> "Written Not Guilty Plea". Can I request a Trial by Written
> Declaration? What if I decide to pay up... Do I still have to go to
> court? Can I just send the amount?
>
> Where in the law does it talk about the mandatory court appearance?
My 79/55 ticket in Virginia requires a mandatory court
appearance. However, I called the court and they said that I
don't have to show up and if I do not, I will be tried in my
absence and basically be sent a bill if I am found guilty.
[I live in New York] Try calling the court -- you should
just be able to send in a letter.
Also, $100 for going 25 mph over is pretty good! In some
states it's much worse.
--
If you flame me, then the terrorists have won.
he...@nospam.com
traffic school. You will most certainly be given that option. Pleading
"not guilty" would remove the traffic school option if you are not
successful.
Christopher Green
(1) You have to send in your bail with the written plea or notice of
intent to plead not guilty. If they're slow about setting the amount
of your bail, you can either believe them (if it's a rural county or a
county with a messed-up bureaucracy like LA, I wouldn't) or request a
continuance without posting bail (CVC 40506.5).
(2) If you plead not guilty, you can't request traffic school. It's
one or the other. Doesn't affect the fine, though.
Watch out for "over 65" violations (it's 22349(a), 22319(a) doesn't
exist). You can't invoke the basic speed law, 85th percentile, or
speed trap arguments on these -- if it can be shown you were traveling
the speed you were cited for, it's conclusive that it was unlawful.
You weren't charged with "over 100", so there won't be serious
consequences even if you get slam-dunked.
--
Not a lawyer,
Chris Green
Rick Damiani
>1- In order to send the "Not Guilty Plea" to the County Clerk, I need
>to know the bail amount. I phoned the County Clerk yesterday. I was
>told I am still not on the computer and that they will delay the court
>appearance until I am. Should I trust them and not show up on
>"5-7-02"? Can I send a Not Guilty Plea without the bail check and ask
>them to contact me when they set bail?
Do not trust them. Show up on the 7th and, if you still aren't in the
system, get some sort of document showing that you were there on the
day you promised to appear. It is your responsibility to show up, and
the clerks will not testify on your behalf if you don't.
The good news is that you might be able to get the ticket dismissed
for lack of prosecution. I'd certainly give it a shot if they aren't
ready for you on the 7th.
>2- What are the "dangers" of writing a Not Guilty Plea? Will my
>chances of getting traffic school diminish if I'm found guilty? Will
>the ticket amount increase as a result?
Depends on the court. Some of them won't let you take traffic school
if you waste their time trying to fight the ticket. Some of them let
you change your mind and plead guilty after seeing that the cop did,
in fact, show up. The bail/fine will be the same in either case.
--
A host is a host from coast to coast ..................... Rick Damiani
and no one will talk to a host that's close .... ri...@nospam.paton.com
Unless the host (that isn't close) ......... ri...@nospam.earthlink.net
is busy, hung or dead ..............................NGI# T695 DoD #2659
'99 Triumph Sprint ST (Guppy) ....... '86 Yamaha Radian (Fire Breather)
Rick Damiani
$100.00 + 170% penalty assessment + $1.00 night court fee = $271.00.
rick++
for more than 25 miles over.
Second, try to get it off your record by school or court.
If you sample some insurance quotes on the webs, you'll see it goes
up by about 40% (for up to five years by some companies).
A $75 traffic school is a bargain over a couple thousand additional
insurance.
Wiggums
> patrick...@yahoo.com (Patrick Harper) wrote:
>
> Do not trust them. Show up on the 7th and, if you still aren't in the
> system, get some sort of document showing that you were there on the
> day you promised to appear. It is your responsibility to show up, and
> the clerks will not testify on your behalf if you don't.
Once I got a ticket dismissed in court due to court error. The judge
said to appear on the 30th for the trial while the bailiff wrote down
13th. I showed up on the 13th with the SAME paper from the bailiff
and the judge told me to come back on the 30th. I threw a shit fit
and said that I had to make scheduling changes to appear on the 13th
and it was next to impossible to do the 30th. The judge: "Fine,
dismissed."
Patrick Harper
> system, get some sort of document showing that you were there on the
> day you promised to appear. It is your responsibility to show up, and
> the clerks will not testify on your behalf if you don't.
>
> The good news is that you might be able to get the ticket dismissed
> for lack of prosecution. I'd certainly give it a shot if they aren't
> ready for you on the 7th.
You have a good point. When I signed the ticket, I promised to appear.
At the same time, for a 22349(A) infraction, I have the right to write
a "Not Guilty Plea" by mail. In order to do that, I need to send the
letter by certified mail 5 days prior to appearance. If I do not know
the bail amount, aren't they taken that legal right away from me by
not having me in the system 5 days prior to the scheduled court
appearance?
Also, when do you suggest to try to get a dismissal for lack of
prosecution?
Thanks for your time.
Patrick.
Patrick Harper
> intent to plead not guilty. If they're slow about setting the amount
> of your bail, you can either believe them (if it's a rural county or a
> county with a messed-up bureaucracy like LA, I wouldn't) or request a
> continuance without posting bail (CVC 40506.5).
Important question: if the speeding was over 26 mph (still under 100
mph) and the penalty carried a "Mandatory Court Appearance", can I
still send the Written Not Guilty Plea?
Thanks
Patrick
Patrick Harper
> (1) You have to send in your bail with the written plea or notice of
> intent to plead not guilty. If they're slow about setting the amount
> of your bail, you can either believe them (if it's a rural county or a
> county with a messed-up bureaucracy like LA, I wouldn't) or request a
> continuance without posting bail (CVC 40506.5).
Let me rephrase my question:
if the speeding was over 26 mph the max speed limit (65mph) (still under 100
Patrick Harper
Golden California Girls
What section number is for "Mandatory Court Appearance"?
Christopher Green
Mandatory court appearances are a matter of county ordinance; the
state doesn't require a court appearance on an uncomplicated traffic
infraction unless you're a minor. The current standard fine for 26 or
more over is $100 + $170 in penalty assessments = $270, or $271 if the
county charges the $1 night court assessment. That doesn't trigger a
mandatory appearance unless the county requires it, or you're a minor.
If you're stuck with a mandatory appearance, you can still notify them
of your intent to plead not guilty, but then they'll set a trial date,
and you'll have to show up anyway.
Some counties use mandatory court appearances as a way of inflicting a
little extra punishment; for example, if a ranger cites you for
cutting switchbacks in Devil's Postpile, you get to make a mandatory
court appearance in Madera, some 180 miles away.
Rick Damiani
>You have a good point. When I signed the ticket, I promised to appear.
>
>At the same time, for a 22349(A) infraction, I have the right to write
>a "Not Guilty Plea" by mail. In order to do that, I need to send the
>letter by certified mail 5 days prior to appearance. If I do not know
>the bail amount, aren't they taken that legal right away from me by
>not having me in the system 5 days prior to the scheduled court
>appearance?
I don't think that it's a right so much as a legally sanctioned
procedure. If the system happens to break down (as it appeared to in
your case) then you won't be able to take advantage of those
procedural rules. The promise you make on the ticket is to appear.
There is no requirement for the court to give you any more notice than
what is on the ticket.
>Also, when do you suggest to try to get a dismissal for lack of
>prosecution?
I'd try to see the judge on the 7th when you appear for the ticket, or
at least get a date to see the judge. You gotta see the judge to get
it dismissed.
Personal experience: I got a ticket in Burbank a couple of years ago.
The officer scribbled over my driver's license number, so the ticket
got sent back to him and was not available on my appearance date, nor
was it in their system. After making a fuss, I got a piece of scrap
paper stamped with the court's seal and the date. The clerk's
supervisor (who gave me the stamp) said that the fact that I appeared
would be entered into the computer, and that it was now the court's
responsibility to notify me of my new appearance date.
Well, six months later they notified me alright. By sending me a
letter telling me that my license was suspended and I had a bench
warrant issued for 'failure to appear'. I went to court the day after
I got the letter, paid the bail for my 'failure to appear' and got a
court date. I asked for night court, and the judge allowed it, but the
clerks mistakenly recorded the time for the trail as 2:00PM instead of
the correct 4:30PM, causing me to be found guilty in my absence.
I went to court again the next day, and the judge recognized the error
caused by the sloppy clerk. He re-instated my bail and set a new court
date. The officer failed to appear for that one, so the whole thing
got dismissed.
Had I the opportunity to do it over again, I would have asked for the
ticket to be dismissed the first time I went to the courthouse, which
would have prevented the failure to appear. That is why I suggest that
you do the same. It may not work, but it can save you a hell of a lot
of trouble if it does, and you won't be penalized for making the
request. In my case, it would have saved me from the difficulties I
had with my insurance company, who I had switched to about a week
before the warrant was issued, as well as the three days of work I
lost.
Oh, I am not a lawyer. Just someone who got run through the wringer by
one. YMMV, and all that.