Speaking of the DMV...
Scott en Aztlán
they've been like doctor's appointments: you show up at the appointed
time, only to sit in the waiting room because the doctor either
overbooked or is running behind.
The last time I tried to make an appointment at the DMV (a couple of
years ago), the first available appointment was OVER A MONTH AWAY. I
couldn't afford to wait, so I ended up spending two hours waiting in
the "walk-up" line. I had similar expectations when I went to the web
site on Tuesday to make an appointment to clear up this SNAFU caused
by my mailman (see my post form yesterday). Imagine my surprise when I
was offered an appointment for the very next day! AMAZING, I thought -
either it's the holiday season and nobody is going to the DMV, or the
DMV has become much more efficient at clearing the backlog.
When I arrived at the DMV yesterday, I saw two long lines: one of them
was in front of the "appointments" desk. It wasn't as long as the
non-appointments line, but it was still ridiculously long. While I
waited, more than one confused person came in with the silly idea that
having an appointment meant that they didn't have to wait in some
ridiculously long line. Silly naive DMV virgins!
When I finally got up to the front of the "appointments" line, the
clerk took my appointment confirmation printout and set it down
without even looking at it. For all she knew (or cared), I could have
simply printed out a page from the DMV web site and had no appointment
at all.
This leads to two possible conclusions: the "appointments" line was
long because the DMV is seriously overbooking their appointments, or
the line was long because a bunch of sly people from the
non-appointments line had caught on to the fact that appointments were
not being checked and decided to bail out of the longer line. :-/
When I first moved to CA back in 1995, I was able to make it through
the entire "new arrival" process (getting a CA DL, taking the written
test, registering my vehicles) in under an hour, WITHOUT an
appointment (in fact, I don't even recall having the optioin to make
one). In the intervening decade, everything involving automobiles,
from the DMV to the roads, has been steadily drowning in an
overwhelming increase in drivers and vehicles. So how many new roads,
new/expanded DMV facilities, etc. do you suppose are we planning to
build?
Whatever those numbers are, it's not going to be enough.
[/soapbox]
The Real Bev
> DMV "appointments" have always been bullshit. From the beginning
> they've been like doctor's appointments: you show up at the appointed
> time, only to sit in the waiting room because the doctor either
> overbooked or is running behind.
No. At the very beginning they scheduled them 6 minutes apart and sometimes
you'd even get in early if the people ahead of you had simple stuff to do. I
was doing a lot of motorcycle registrations at the time and it was wonderful.
Then after a number of years (when I had to organize the crushing of my
Sentra, actually) I found out the hard way that making an appointment just
meant you got to stand in a shorter line -- there was no attempt to organize
the people waiting by time at all.
Shitheads. They had a good system and then ruined it.
> When I finally got up to the front of the "appointments" line, the
> clerk took my appointment confirmation printout and set it down
> without even looking at it. For all she knew (or cared), I could have
> simply printed out a page from the DMV web site and had no appointment
> at all.
At the Whittier office you stand in the line to tell the droid you have an
appointment and then wait for your number to be called. All chairs filled,
crowded, many people have brought their lunch. Two chairs reserved for the
handicapped, which was thoughtful. Could have been worse, I guess. Haven't
been to the Pasadena office for at least 5 years, but they had no
number-system then.
> This leads to two possible conclusions: the "appointments" line was
> long because the DMV is seriously overbooking their appointments, or
> the line was long because a bunch of sly people from the
> non-appointments line had caught on to the fact that appointments were
> not being checked and decided to bail out of the longer line. :-/
They seem to have paperwork ready for the "appointments" people, but maybe
it's quick and easy to print stuff out.
> When I first moved to CA back in 1995, I was able to make it through
> the entire "new arrival" process (getting a CA DL, taking the written
> test, registering my vehicles) in under an hour, WITHOUT an
> appointment (in fact, I don't even recall having the optioin to make
> one). In the intervening decade, everything involving automobiles,
> from the DMV to the roads, has been steadily drowning in an
> overwhelming increase in drivers and vehicles. So how many new roads,
> new/expanded DMV facilities, etc. do you suppose are we planning to
> build?
>
> Whatever those numbers are, it's not going to be enough.
Everything is dumbing down. That's a good enough explanation for just about
anything that happens now.
> [/soapbox]
Ha! Like we believe that!
--
Cheers,
Bev
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Screw the end users. If they want good software,
let them write it themselves." -- Anon.
Scott en Aztlán
<bas...@myrealbox.com> wrote:
>Scott en Aztlán wrote:
>
>> DMV "appointments" have always been bullshit. From the beginning
>> they've been like doctor's appointments: you show up at the appointed
>> time, only to sit in the waiting room because the doctor either
>> overbooked or is running behind.
>
>No. At the very beginning they scheduled them 6 minutes apart and sometimes
>you'd even get in early if the people ahead of you had simple stuff to do.
What year was this?
> Then after a number of years (when I had to organize the crushing of my
>Sentra, actually) I found out the hard way that making an appointment just
>meant you got to stand in a shorter line -- there was no attempt to organize
>the people waiting by time at all.
>
>Shitheads. They had a good system and then ruined it.
Their focus has definitely shifted. With their new system (which,
ironically, AZ was using for years before CA adopted it) they now keep
all of their clerks as busy as possible, rather than trying to
minimize waiting time for any particular "customer."
>At the Whittier office you stand in the line to tell the droid you have an
>appointment and then wait for your number to be called. All chairs filled,
>crowded, many people have brought their lunch.
And it's only going to get worse. The DMV either needs more and bigger
facilities, or it needs to expand the number of things you can do on
their web site. They can start by adding a way to pay off an "RDF"
online.
>> This leads to two possible conclusions: the "appointments" line was
>> long because the DMV is seriously overbooking their appointments, or
>> the line was long because a bunch of sly people from the
>> non-appointments line had caught on to the fact that appointments were
>> not being checked and decided to bail out of the longer line. :-/
>
>They seem to have paperwork ready for the "appointments" people, but maybe
>it's quick and easy to print stuff out.
At Laguna Hills they either handed people in the appointments line a
pre-printed form to fill out, or generated a number for their queueing
system.
As an aside, the beauty of this system is it can give the illusion of
being fair (i.e. first come, first served) yet they can change any
individual's position in the queue transparently without any of the
people who were skipped even noticing, much less getting pissed off.
Next time you go, pay close attention to which windows serve which
letters. If window #10, let's say, serves a bunch of G numbers in a
row, and then suddenly switches to servig B numbers, it's probably
because the supervisors made some adjustments to the relative
priorities, boosting the B people and dropping the G people (perhaps
to clear a backlog of Bs).
I definitely noticed that some people who arrived AFTER I did were
called to a window BEFORE I was. Shame, shame!
>> [/soapbox]
>
>Ha! Like we believe that!
OK, so I have multiple soapboxes. ;)
The Real Bev
> <bas...@myrealbox.com> wrote:
>
>>Scott en Aztlán wrote:
>>
>>> DMV "appointments" have always been bullshit. From the beginning
>>> they've been like doctor's appointments: you show up at the appointed
>>> time, only to sit in the waiting room because the doctor either
>>> overbooked or is running behind.
>>
>>No. At the very beginning they scheduled them 6 minutes apart and sometimes
>>you'd even get in early if the people ahead of you had simple stuff to do.
>
> What year was this?
No idea, sorry. Whenever it started up. Maybe in the 80s...
>> Then after a number of years (when I had to organize the crushing of my
>>Sentra, actually) I found out the hard way that making an appointment just
>>meant you got to stand in a shorter line -- there was no attempt to organize
>>the people waiting by time at all.
>>
>>Shitheads. They had a good system and then ruined it.
>
> Their focus has definitely shifted. With their new system (which,
> ironically, AZ was using for years before CA adopted it) they now keep
> all of their clerks as busy as possible, rather than trying to
> minimize waiting time for any particular "customer."
My mom's ophthalmologist said that the office's goal was to get each patient
out the door within an hour of his nominal appointment time. I didn't ask him
if that was local option or standard of the industry.
>>At the Whittier office you stand in the line to tell the droid you have an
>>appointment and then wait for your number to be called. All chairs filled,
>>crowded, many people have brought their lunch.
>
> And it's only going to get worse. The DMV either needs more and bigger
> facilities, or it needs to expand the number of things you can do on
> their web site. They can start by adding a way to pay off an "RDF"
> online.
RDF? Renew... I can see that tests (written and driving) need to be done in
the office, but there's a humongous amount of stuff that could be done on line
if it were available -- give discounts and take credit cards.
>>> This leads to two possible conclusions: the "appointments" line was
>>> long because the DMV is seriously overbooking their appointments, or
>>> the line was long because a bunch of sly people from the
>>> non-appointments line had caught on to the fact that appointments were
>>> not being checked and decided to bail out of the longer line. :-/
>>
>>They seem to have paperwork ready for the "appointments" people, but maybe
>>it's quick and easy to print stuff out.
>
> At Laguna Hills they either handed people in the appointments line a
> pre-printed form to fill out, or generated a number for their queueing
> system.
Probably the same. Sometimes Pasadena had roving representatives who would
ask the line-standers what they were there to do and direct them to the proper
line.
> As an aside, the beauty of this system is it can give the illusion of
> being fair (i.e. first come, first served) yet they can change any
> individual's position in the queue transparently without any of the
> people who were skipped even noticing, much less getting pissed off.
> Next time you go, pay close attention to which windows serve which
> letters. If window #10, let's say, serves a bunch of G numbers in a
> row, and then suddenly switches to servig B numbers, it's probably
> because the supervisors made some adjustments to the relative
> priorities, boosting the B people and dropping the G people (perhaps
> to clear a backlog of Bs).
Feh. If I can't shoot the bastards there's not much point in worrying about
how their system sorks.
> I definitely noticed that some people who arrived AFTER I did were
> called to a window BEFORE I was. Shame, shame!
Too many people at the DMV to notice, but that pisses me off at doctors' offices.
>>> [/soapbox]
>>
>>Ha! Like we believe that!
>
> OK, so I have multiple soapboxes. ;)
I'm gonna borrow one. This week I took my mom to one of her doctors. Check
in. Recepdroid says "But Dr. Shithead is on vacation today" as if we should
have somehow divined that in spite of the fact that the appointment was made
two months previously AND that the exact thing had happened at the previous
appointment three months ago AND that nobody had called her then either.
We both started yelling this time (last time it was just me; my mom is an
inherently polite person). The office manager insisted on taking us out of
the waiting room into her office at the far end of the building. Only one
person in the waiting room anyway, and she heard at least some of the yelling.
As you might imagine, my mom and I are quite articulate in our wrath.
Goddam office manager apologized over and over again, even after we assured
her that her apology was worthless unless some sort of recompense was in
order. No dice, unfortunately. You can't even get a freebie because with the
proper medicare plan it's ALL free. What I want is something that will
require those people to fill in forms and make explanations to their angry
supervisors and perhaps even get their paychecks docked. An hour in the
stocks being pelted with garbage would probably be OK.
And to top it off, we had to pay a buck for parking. SHITHEADS[1].
--
Cheers,
Bev
***********************************************************
"Everyone ought to stop and smell crayons once in a while."
-- DA
[1] Email for reference. Put 'bubblehead' in the subject line.
Scott en Aztlán
<bas...@myrealbox.com> wrote:
>> And it's only going to get worse. The DMV either needs more and bigger
>> facilities, or it needs to expand the number of things you can do on
>> their web site. They can start by adding a way to pay off an "RDF"
>> online.
>
>RDF? Renew...
You can't renew on the DMV web site unless you have a "RIN" (Renewal
Identification Number?) which does not appear anywhere on the RDF.
Believe me, if I had had that option, I would have used it.
The other problem is an utter lack of explanation regarding what the
RDF was and why I had received it. If the pencil-pusher in Sacramento
had only taken a moment to explain (even a Post-It Note would have
suifficed) what had happened and what I needed to do, I could also
have avoided standing in line. But no, that DMV employee in Sacramento
either assumed that everybody in the whole state knows what an RDF is
and what to do with one, or decided "it's not my job" to write up an
explanation.
>I can see that tests (written and driving) need to be done in
>the office, but there's a humongous amount of stuff that could be done on line
>if it were available -- give discounts and take credit cards.
LOL!!! Last time I checked, they charged a CONVENIENCE FEE to take a
credit card for your vehicle renewal on the DMV web site. That's why I
never used it before - it's cheaper for me just to mail in a personal
check. But even a "convenience fee" is preferable to waiting around at
the DMV.
>>>> [/soapbox]
>>>
>>>Ha! Like we believe that!
>>
>> OK, so I have multiple soapboxes. ;)
>
>I'm gonna borrow one.
No need to return it - just keep it. Consider it my Xmas gift to you.
;)
>This week I took my mom to one of her doctors. Check
>in. Recepdroid says "But Dr. Shithead is on vacation today" as if we should
>have somehow divined that in spite of the fact that the appointment was made
>two months previously AND that the exact thing had happened at the previous
>appointment three months ago AND that nobody had called her then either.
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice... and it's time to get
another friggin' doctor!
>Goddam office manager apologized over and over again, even after we assured
>her that her apology was worthless unless some sort of recompense was in
>order. No dice, unfortunately. You can't even get a freebie because with the
>proper medicare plan it's ALL free. What I want is something that will
>require those people to fill in forms and make explanations to their angry
>supervisors and perhaps even get their paychecks docked. An hour in the
>stocks being pelted with garbage would probably be OK.
Send that cunt a bill for the time she wasted. Use an hourly rate
equal to what your doctor charges you - one hour minimum, of course.
Multiplied by two, since both your time and your mother's time were
wasted. If they don't pay it net 90, send it to a collection agency.
;)
>And to top it off, we had to pay a buck for parking. SHITHEADS[1].
Be sure to add that to the bill!
Ratbert
> LOL!!! Last time I checked, they charged a CONVENIENCE FEE to take a
> credit card for your vehicle renewal on the DMV web site. That's why I
> never used it before - it's cheaper for me just to mail in a personal
> check. But even a "convenience fee" is preferable to waiting around at
> the DMV.
They stopped doing that! Now it's free* to renew with a credit card.
*Well, not FREE, exactly, you still have to pay.
The Real Bev
Cool, now we get 1% back instead of paying 37 cents. Speaking of postage,
when does it go up and how much? Wait, I can do this...
OK, It goes up January 8 to 39 cents. Second ounce is/will be 24 cents.
http://www.usps.com/communications/news/stamps/2005/sr05_056.htm
--
Cheers, Bev
====================================================================
Paranoid schizophrenics outnumber their enemies at least two to one.
Bob Vaughan
NoNoNo.. Use an hourly rate equal to your doctors, or equal to your highest
rate of pay (after all, it is your time being wasted). Double it, call it
your consulting rate. Charge a 4 hour minimum, per person, plus travel costs,
and a processing fee. Make sure you charge for both trips, and any time you
spend preparing the bill, as well as any costs incurred.
They screwed up once, and you gave them a second chance. They screwed up
again, so they should be forced to pay dearly for their incompetence.
Make sure to send the invoice certified mail, return receipt requested
(and make sure to add the charges to the bill.)
If you have to send it to collections, make sure to add those charges, and
any time you spend dealing with that.
>
>>And to top it off, we had to pay a buck for parking. SHITHEADS[1].
>
>Be sure to add that to the bill!
>
--
-- Welcome My Son, Welcome To The Machine --
Bob Vaughan | techie @ tantivy.net |
| P.O. Box 19792, Stanford, Ca 94309 |
-- I am Me, I am only Me, And no one else is Me, What could be simpler? --
Scott en Aztlán
Heh heh - sounds like they finally wised up. ;)
Letting us pay by credit card actually SAVES them money, since it
takes less labor to process an electronic payment than to pay some
droid op rip open an envelope, handle a paper check, fill out a
deposit slip, and put the bundle of checks into the bank deposit bag.
Yet the greedy bastards thought they could charge people a fee and
make a little extra profit (as if the goddamn VLF wasn't profit
enough). I guess most people were seeing through the BS and opting to
send in paper checks, so they gave up on it.
BWAAAAHAAAHAAAHAAAA!!!!!! Citizens of CA: 1; DMV: 0. ;)
Scott en Aztlán
<bas...@myrealbox.com> wrote:
>Ratbert wrote:
>
>> Scott en Aztlán wrote:
>>> LOL!!! Last time I checked, they charged a CONVENIENCE FEE to take a
>>> credit card for your vehicle renewal on the DMV web site. That's why I
>>> never used it before - it's cheaper for me just to mail in a personal
>>> check. But even a "convenience fee" is preferable to waiting around at
>>> the DMV.
>>
>> They stopped doing that! Now it's free* to renew with a credit card.
>>
>> *Well, not FREE, exactly, you still have to pay.
>
>Cool, now we get 1% back instead of paying 37 cents.
Yeah, I'm going to start using it, too. At least, I will when I have
the opportunity...
Ratbert
> BWAAAAHAAAHAAAHAAAA!!!!!! Citizens of CA: 1; DMV: 0. ;)
>
Wouldn't it be more like:
Citizens: 1
DMV: 100
This isn't the only stupid policy they've implemented, but I can't think
of any other stupid policy they've withdrawn.
The Real Bev
April for me. Only one vehicle needing renewal. Yay.
Being able to charge insurance payments and get a rebate takes 1% of the sting
out of pounding money down a rathole. The CC companies have really figured
out a good thing here -- I now charge stuff I always paid cash (or check) for.
I wish it hadn't worked well enough at the 1% level for misc.stuff -- then
they would have decided to give 5% for everything.
--
Cheers,
Bev
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
"If anyone disagrees with anything I say, I am quite prepared
not only to retract it, but also to deny under oath that I
ever said it." -- T. Lehrer
Scott en Aztlán
<ratb...@eat.my.shorts.spammers.myway.com> wrote:
>Scott en Aztlán wrote:
>> BWAAAAHAAAHAAAHAAAA!!!!!! Citizens of CA: 1; DMV: 0. ;)
>>
>
>Wouldn't it be more like:
>Citizens: 1
>DMV: 100
Man, are you a wet blanket or what?
:)
Michael R. Kesti
Perhaps, but he's not a whiner.
8-|
--
========================================================================
Michael Kesti | "And like, one and one don't make
| two, one and one make one."
mrkesti at comcast dot net | - The Who, Bargain