[C320-list] Buying a 1997 C320
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Kim Chapman
Aug 8, 2021, 12:34:10 PM8/8/21
to C320
Hi there, I am seriously looking at buying a 1997 C320. I think the
hull number is 416...could be wrong.
I currently own a C400 which is used in the winter for cruising the
Bahamas and stored in Florida through the summer and fall.
Wondering if there are any common issues that I should be aware of
before handing over the cash for this little beautie ?
Thanks !
Kim Chapman
C400 #249
Quiescence
Potential owner of:
C320 #416
No Pressure
Lies in Toronto
hull number is 416...could be wrong.
I currently own a C400 which is used in the winter for cruising the
Bahamas and stored in Florida through the summer and fall.
Wondering if there are any common issues that I should be aware of
before handing over the cash for this little beautie ?
Thanks !
Kim Chapman
C400 #249
Quiescence
Potential owner of:
C320 #416
No Pressure
Lies in Toronto
Bill Aleshire
Aug 8, 2021, 12:36:34 PM8/8/21
to C320...@catalina320.com
Can you tell us a price range? Has anything major been added to the boat?
Bill Aleshire
AleshireLAW PC
3605 Shady Valley Dr.
Austin, Texas 78739
512 320-9155 phone
512 750-5854 cell
512 320-9156 fax
Bi...@AleshireLaw.com
Bill Aleshire
AleshireLAW PC
3605 Shady Valley Dr.
Austin, Texas 78739
512 320-9155 phone
512 750-5854 cell
512 320-9156 fax
Bi...@AleshireLaw.com
John Meyers
Aug 8, 2021, 2:04:12 PM8/8/21
to C320...@catalina320.com
Kim,
We bought our 1997 #406 about 12 years ago. This boat has always been in
the Great Lakes - no salt water. We have not identified any major design
or construction problems. We replaced the hot water heater and hoses a few
years back when WE thought it was time and before the heater told us it was
time. I am all for preventative maintenance and thinking that within a year
we will replace all the hoses on the engine which has a little less than
1000 hours. No hose leaks now but I don't want any surprises.
We have no leaks to the bilge and it is normally bone dry after the shaft
packing decides to close up a few weeks after splash.
Standing rigging is still the original unless the PO changed it. We have it
checked by a rigger every couple years and all looks good.
We have a few minor mystery leaks on the windows.
We love the boat. But it takes maintenance.
If you have any questions please let me know.
John Meyers
Wind Chime 1997 #406
Muskegon, MI
On Sun, Aug 8, 2021 at 12:34 PM Kim Chapman <kim.c...@sympatico.ca>
wrote:
We bought our 1997 #406 about 12 years ago. This boat has always been in
the Great Lakes - no salt water. We have not identified any major design
or construction problems. We replaced the hot water heater and hoses a few
years back when WE thought it was time and before the heater told us it was
time. I am all for preventative maintenance and thinking that within a year
we will replace all the hoses on the engine which has a little less than
1000 hours. No hose leaks now but I don't want any surprises.
We have no leaks to the bilge and it is normally bone dry after the shaft
packing decides to close up a few weeks after splash.
Standing rigging is still the original unless the PO changed it. We have it
checked by a rigger every couple years and all looks good.
We have a few minor mystery leaks on the windows.
We love the boat. But it takes maintenance.
If you have any questions please let me know.
John Meyers
Wind Chime 1997 #406
Muskegon, MI
On Sun, Aug 8, 2021 at 12:34 PM Kim Chapman <kim.c...@sympatico.ca>
wrote:
John Frost
Aug 8, 2021, 2:26:30 PM8/8/21
to C320...@catalina320.com
We used what is below when we bought our 2007.
It was compiled by list members
John
2009 C320MKII
Hull #1118
Lake Guntersville, AL
Buying a Catalina 320 - Part 1
In response to a question that was posed on the Catalina 320 list by a prospective buyer of a Catalina 320 looking for problem areas to be aware of, I wrote the following response. This response has been refined by input from others, and has been improved from the original email for publication.
Catalina 320 Review and Known Issues
By Doug Treff, September Song, Hull 350
In my opinion, the Catalina 320 is a fine vessel for the purpose that it serves me - cruising the Chesapeake Bay. As with any boat, there are pluses and minuses with the design. Every boat design is a compromise of form and function. I believe that Catalina hit a home run with the 320, and its continued popularity, even after being replaced by a newer model, bears that theory out. The strong C320 owners association adds value as well, since we all share ideas and solutions to problems. Below is a list of things I Love, things I don’t love, common repair issues and design flaws for the C320.
Things I Love:
• The Aft cabin - Having the Aft cabin really makes a huge difference in the amount of space on board for accommodating guests. It also offers more privacy than other boats without this feature. At the 2015 boat show in Annapolis, I toured the current models. The 315, which Catalina considers an equivalent new model to the discontinued 320, does not have the same size aft cabin. You need to move up to a 355 to get a similar aft cabin now.
• It's competitive compared to other models - I am continually amazed how I can hang with larger boats when out sailing. Boats that should have a speed advantage due to sail area and waterline length, yet I can keep pace with them.
• The Cockpit is comfortable and roomy for entertaining, and the large wheel makes it easy to sit outboard and see around the cabin while steering the boat. Bonus - the walk-through transom.
• A full shower in the head - This is my first boat with a shower and it was a huge selling point.
Things I Don't Love:
• Side-loading aft berth - Whoever sleeps closest to the door to the aft cabin will be disturbed when the other person needs to get up in the middle of the night for any reason. Unfortunately, in this size vessel, there's no other way to design an aft berth this large.
• Cabin Storage Space - There is limited storage space on the boat. Due to the location of the batteries and sewage tank, the starboard settee is not very useful for storing things. I would never put food in there and you really shouldn't pile a lot of stuff around the batteries.
• Sail handling locations - When single-handing, the helmsman will need to leave the helm completely to tend the main sheet due to its location on the cabin roof. I generally don't like Hunters but one of the things I've admired about them is the arch with the main sheet right at the helm station. Same comments apply for the Jib sheets. The primary winches need to be about 2 feet further aft for handling by the helmsman.
• She rounds up easily - Due to the very wide aft cross-section, when the boat heels too far, the rudder loses effectiveness, causing the boat to round up, often resulting in an unexpected tack. Especially troublesome when considering the other problem regarding sail handling. If single-handing, you cannot dump the sails quickly while also tending the wheel. The solution is keeping heel angle under control through sail trim, and reef early. I recommend that every C320 owner make it a priority to properly rig the reefing setup and practice using it so they can do it efficiently when needed.
Common C320 Repair Issues:
There are very few inherent problems that span across all C320 model years. During the production run, Catalina made changes to their design based on customer feedback. The 320 is a good example of a reliable production boat and many survey problems are due to poor or deferred maintenance. Below is a list of known problems and issues that has been pulled from monitoring the C320 list for a number of years. It will give you a good check list.
• Early models of the C320 did not have solid fiberglass in the deck around the chain plates to protect the core from water leaks. Sometime later, they started doing solid Fiberglass in these areas. Nobody has been able to definitively state when that change was made, so exercise caution here and address chain plate leaks ASAP.
• Stemhead fitting – There is a known flaw in the design of the original stemhead fitting which could lead to rig failure if a crack develops. The stemhead fitting on all C320s should be examined closely per the article here. It might be wise to share the following information with your surveyor. http://www.catalina320.com/filemgmt_data/files/Stemhead%20Article.pdf
• Sewage tank vent design flaw – Catalina uses a 5/8” vent fitting on a ¾” hose. The vent is too small and the screen often clogs. Easy to fix, but this can cause all kinds of holding tank problems due to poor venting of tank. See the association site for a fix to this issue.
• Older 320's may need a fuel tank replacement. If you search the 320 forum, you'll find discussions of fuel tank leaks over the years. Consensus seems to be 15-25 years is about when the failures start in Catalina aluminum tanks. Replacement tanks are available and they DO fit in and out of the boat without cutting any fiberglass.
• Slow water leak from Aqua-Lift muffler box - You'll need to have your mechanic check for this during the sea-trial. Not a huge amount of water, but it can contribute to an exhaust odor in the cabin over time.
Design flaws – other issues:
• Port List – Not every boat, but many C320 owners have noticed a slight list to port. This could be different from one boat to the next depending on installed options like air conditioning, or extra batteries.
• 1996 and older models do not have a molded toe rail aft of the cabin. This is a safety issue and I have already nearly gone overboard twice because my foot slipped right off the boat.This issue was rectified with the 1997 model year.
• Early models (1995 and older) had a shallow bilge. The deeper bilge is more desirable if you can find one.
As you can see, no boat is without inherent design flaws and common problems. Don't let this list scare you off. The majority of the C320 fleet out there today is well loved and cared for. Hopefully you now will be better armed to uncover some of the common issues.
Catalina 320 Pre-Purchase Inspection
By Doug Treff, September Song, Hull 350
General things to look for in your prospective purchase:
First of all, hire a competent marine surveyor in your area. Don't rely on your broker to recommend one. Find someone who has no "skin in the game". Many times, marina owners and managers will recommend a good surveyor. Your surveyor will look for all of the following, but you can save some money by educating yourself and eliminating any boats that have obvious problems. In addition to the usual Yacht Pre-Purchase survey, I always recommend people to have the engine surveyed by a diesel mechanic, including oil analysis. Many times this can be combined with sea trial and survey day. In the long run, this is money well spent. Most marine surveyors are not engine mechanics and they will usually clearly state that you should hire a mechanic for a complete engine inspection. Major engine work or re-powering a sailboat is expensive and you’ll want to know ahead of time, so you can make an appropriate allowance in your offer.
Your job here is to locate show-stoppers that would cause you to not buy the boat. This will save you money by preventing the survey of multiple vessels. Use the very simple inspection list below to weed out boats that need work. You will be astonished by what you can find with no more than a critical eye and a slightly cynical nature. This list is NOT comprehensive and is meant only to help you find obvious problems on your own. Your surveyor will do the rest. Bring with you a small flashlight and a note pad for this inspection. Signs of shoddy workmanship or amateur looking repair jobs should lead you to question everything. Take lots of notes – if you’re looking at multiple boats they will all start to run together. If appropriate, use your smart phone to snap some photos as well.
1. If the boat is out of the water, walk the perimeter at ground level and examine the rub rail from below. You are looking for any deformities that may indicate impact damage. The rub rail is made of aluminum and will show bends and deformities where serious collisions may have occurred. These may also be potential leaks inside to examine later.
2. Examine the bottom closely. Make note of excessive paint build-up or peeling bottom paint, as
Bent Rudder Shaft
3. this will be a job facing you at some point if there's 10-20 years of paint built up. The bottom should be fair and smooth. Look for signs of blistering. While you're down there, closely examine the propeller and shaft, looking for signs of pitting or corrosion that could indicate an electrolysis problem. Stand directly behind the center-line of the boat and check that the rudder is properly aligned with the keel, not bent to either side.
4. While you're walking around the boat on the ground, stand back and walk slowly, examining the hull from a distance. Wear a pair of polarized sunglasses. Often they will reveal things that escape the naked eye.
5. Walk the entire deck and feel for soft spots that indicate serious structural problems. Gently test life line stanchions and other deck fittings for soundness.
6. Look around at the attachment points for the standing rigging. Any signs of rust or hairline cracks could indicate a serious problem.Look for cracks in the swaged fittings and also in the chain plates where they attach to the deck.
7. First impressions: Upon entering the cabin, is it clean and tidy, or a cluttered mess? Messy owners are often lazy about proper maintenance.
8. Use your nose. Does it smell like mildew, diesel, or sewage? All these odors could be signs of potential problems - and of course each smell will have a specific cause. You'll want to examine what could be causing any odors, because it could be costly to clear up later. Sewage odors have many causes, one of which is noted in this post. Generally the holding tank related problems noted on C320’s are easily repaired and documented on the C320 site. Diesel odors? Mildew smell? Pull up the floor boards and look for stagnant water or signs of an oil slick on the bilge water. This could contribute heavily to any odors, especially fuel or oil leaks, as well as mildew odors from stagnant water in the bilge. If you find oil or fuel in the bilge water, alert the marina manager and do not turn on the bilge pump!
9. While you have the floor boards up, examine the visible structural grid below them for any signs of stress cracks or repair jobs. This may be difficult due to limited access.
10. Also in the cabin, look for signs of leaks. Leaky decks can be a real problem once the core gets wet and starts to delaminate. Water stains on wood bulkheads and floors, peeling varnish, drip spots or stains on upholstery are signs of trouble. Feel the acorn nuts in the cabin roof for water droplets. Look on those nuts for discoloration or deposits that might indicate leaks. Examine the interior areas around the chain plates and mast base, looking for signs of water intrusion. Anything that looks like it's been leaking for a long time is a potential serious problem. A good strategy is to examine the interior of a boat within hours of a rain event. Not always possible, but it helps.
11. If your broker will allow it, pull the forward engine cover and examine the fiberglass drip pan
under the engine, looking for any obvious signs of leaking. While you're looking at the engine, check the belt tension (not too tight or too loose), and just look over the engine. Most well cared-for marine engines are (nearly) spotless, and show little sign of oil or grease build-up. Yanmar paints everything including the hoses. If you're looking at a boat that is 20 years old and the hoses are painted like the engine, there's a strong possibility that the hoses are 20 years old as well. Look at the raw water pump. Feel around on the underside for any dripping water that could indicate a leaky system. Take a white paper towel or rag and wipe around some of the joints in the diesel fuel system. Off-Road diesel in the US is usually dyed pink and will show up clearly on a clean white paper towel. You should not find any fuel leaks. Feel the bottom edge of the oil filter and the lowest point on the engine and see if it has any oil drips forming. If you see a can of Quick Start (pictured) sitting in the engine bay, that's a sure sign the owner is having starting issues. Don't use this stuff. Get your engine repaired before you destroy it.
12. Look around the batteries and examine the fiberglass below them for any signs of acid damage from leaky batteries. Even if current batteries are good, there may be damage from battery leaks gone by.
13. Glance around the cabin for any signs of amateurish or non-standard repairs. Electrical
components should look professionally installed, and there should not be any loose or dangling wires of unknown origin. Automotive battery chargers have no place on a boat!
14. Examine the hull for signs of repair work and the deck as well. When anti-skid is repaired, it becomes quite obvious due to the intricate pattern. Learn the standard anti-skid patterns of the C320 and question anything that looks non-standard. Repair work is not necessarily a problem if done well. Trust, but verify that work is done right. Closely examine the transom area for crazing where the swim ladder touches when lowered. There is a lot of stress on this area when the ladder is being used.
By this time, you should have a fairly good idea if the boat you are examining is sound or not. After you've decided to make a purchase, make your offer contingent on a successful pre-purchase survey, engine survey and sea trial. Don't skip these steps.
After you’ve bought your C320, please visit the C320 IA web site and join the association for additional access to resources and information about your boat.
Now go sailing!
Posted by Doug Treff at 6:00 AM
It was compiled by list members
John
2009 C320MKII
Hull #1118
Lake Guntersville, AL
Buying a Catalina 320 - Part 1
In response to a question that was posed on the Catalina 320 list by a prospective buyer of a Catalina 320 looking for problem areas to be aware of, I wrote the following response. This response has been refined by input from others, and has been improved from the original email for publication.
Catalina 320 Review and Known Issues
By Doug Treff, September Song, Hull 350
In my opinion, the Catalina 320 is a fine vessel for the purpose that it serves me - cruising the Chesapeake Bay. As with any boat, there are pluses and minuses with the design. Every boat design is a compromise of form and function. I believe that Catalina hit a home run with the 320, and its continued popularity, even after being replaced by a newer model, bears that theory out. The strong C320 owners association adds value as well, since we all share ideas and solutions to problems. Below is a list of things I Love, things I don’t love, common repair issues and design flaws for the C320.
Things I Love:
• The Aft cabin - Having the Aft cabin really makes a huge difference in the amount of space on board for accommodating guests. It also offers more privacy than other boats without this feature. At the 2015 boat show in Annapolis, I toured the current models. The 315, which Catalina considers an equivalent new model to the discontinued 320, does not have the same size aft cabin. You need to move up to a 355 to get a similar aft cabin now.
• It's competitive compared to other models - I am continually amazed how I can hang with larger boats when out sailing. Boats that should have a speed advantage due to sail area and waterline length, yet I can keep pace with them.
• The Cockpit is comfortable and roomy for entertaining, and the large wheel makes it easy to sit outboard and see around the cabin while steering the boat. Bonus - the walk-through transom.
• A full shower in the head - This is my first boat with a shower and it was a huge selling point.
Things I Don't Love:
• Side-loading aft berth - Whoever sleeps closest to the door to the aft cabin will be disturbed when the other person needs to get up in the middle of the night for any reason. Unfortunately, in this size vessel, there's no other way to design an aft berth this large.
• Cabin Storage Space - There is limited storage space on the boat. Due to the location of the batteries and sewage tank, the starboard settee is not very useful for storing things. I would never put food in there and you really shouldn't pile a lot of stuff around the batteries.
• Sail handling locations - When single-handing, the helmsman will need to leave the helm completely to tend the main sheet due to its location on the cabin roof. I generally don't like Hunters but one of the things I've admired about them is the arch with the main sheet right at the helm station. Same comments apply for the Jib sheets. The primary winches need to be about 2 feet further aft for handling by the helmsman.
• She rounds up easily - Due to the very wide aft cross-section, when the boat heels too far, the rudder loses effectiveness, causing the boat to round up, often resulting in an unexpected tack. Especially troublesome when considering the other problem regarding sail handling. If single-handing, you cannot dump the sails quickly while also tending the wheel. The solution is keeping heel angle under control through sail trim, and reef early. I recommend that every C320 owner make it a priority to properly rig the reefing setup and practice using it so they can do it efficiently when needed.
Common C320 Repair Issues:
There are very few inherent problems that span across all C320 model years. During the production run, Catalina made changes to their design based on customer feedback. The 320 is a good example of a reliable production boat and many survey problems are due to poor or deferred maintenance. Below is a list of known problems and issues that has been pulled from monitoring the C320 list for a number of years. It will give you a good check list.
• Early models of the C320 did not have solid fiberglass in the deck around the chain plates to protect the core from water leaks. Sometime later, they started doing solid Fiberglass in these areas. Nobody has been able to definitively state when that change was made, so exercise caution here and address chain plate leaks ASAP.
• Stemhead fitting – There is a known flaw in the design of the original stemhead fitting which could lead to rig failure if a crack develops. The stemhead fitting on all C320s should be examined closely per the article here. It might be wise to share the following information with your surveyor. http://www.catalina320.com/filemgmt_data/files/Stemhead%20Article.pdf
• Sewage tank vent design flaw – Catalina uses a 5/8” vent fitting on a ¾” hose. The vent is too small and the screen often clogs. Easy to fix, but this can cause all kinds of holding tank problems due to poor venting of tank. See the association site for a fix to this issue.
• Older 320's may need a fuel tank replacement. If you search the 320 forum, you'll find discussions of fuel tank leaks over the years. Consensus seems to be 15-25 years is about when the failures start in Catalina aluminum tanks. Replacement tanks are available and they DO fit in and out of the boat without cutting any fiberglass.
• Slow water leak from Aqua-Lift muffler box - You'll need to have your mechanic check for this during the sea-trial. Not a huge amount of water, but it can contribute to an exhaust odor in the cabin over time.
Design flaws – other issues:
• Port List – Not every boat, but many C320 owners have noticed a slight list to port. This could be different from one boat to the next depending on installed options like air conditioning, or extra batteries.
• 1996 and older models do not have a molded toe rail aft of the cabin. This is a safety issue and I have already nearly gone overboard twice because my foot slipped right off the boat.This issue was rectified with the 1997 model year.
• Early models (1995 and older) had a shallow bilge. The deeper bilge is more desirable if you can find one.
As you can see, no boat is without inherent design flaws and common problems. Don't let this list scare you off. The majority of the C320 fleet out there today is well loved and cared for. Hopefully you now will be better armed to uncover some of the common issues.
Catalina 320 Pre-Purchase Inspection
By Doug Treff, September Song, Hull 350
General things to look for in your prospective purchase:
First of all, hire a competent marine surveyor in your area. Don't rely on your broker to recommend one. Find someone who has no "skin in the game". Many times, marina owners and managers will recommend a good surveyor. Your surveyor will look for all of the following, but you can save some money by educating yourself and eliminating any boats that have obvious problems. In addition to the usual Yacht Pre-Purchase survey, I always recommend people to have the engine surveyed by a diesel mechanic, including oil analysis. Many times this can be combined with sea trial and survey day. In the long run, this is money well spent. Most marine surveyors are not engine mechanics and they will usually clearly state that you should hire a mechanic for a complete engine inspection. Major engine work or re-powering a sailboat is expensive and you’ll want to know ahead of time, so you can make an appropriate allowance in your offer.
Your job here is to locate show-stoppers that would cause you to not buy the boat. This will save you money by preventing the survey of multiple vessels. Use the very simple inspection list below to weed out boats that need work. You will be astonished by what you can find with no more than a critical eye and a slightly cynical nature. This list is NOT comprehensive and is meant only to help you find obvious problems on your own. Your surveyor will do the rest. Bring with you a small flashlight and a note pad for this inspection. Signs of shoddy workmanship or amateur looking repair jobs should lead you to question everything. Take lots of notes – if you’re looking at multiple boats they will all start to run together. If appropriate, use your smart phone to snap some photos as well.
1. If the boat is out of the water, walk the perimeter at ground level and examine the rub rail from below. You are looking for any deformities that may indicate impact damage. The rub rail is made of aluminum and will show bends and deformities where serious collisions may have occurred. These may also be potential leaks inside to examine later.
2. Examine the bottom closely. Make note of excessive paint build-up or peeling bottom paint, as
Bent Rudder Shaft
3. this will be a job facing you at some point if there's 10-20 years of paint built up. The bottom should be fair and smooth. Look for signs of blistering. While you're down there, closely examine the propeller and shaft, looking for signs of pitting or corrosion that could indicate an electrolysis problem. Stand directly behind the center-line of the boat and check that the rudder is properly aligned with the keel, not bent to either side.
4. While you're walking around the boat on the ground, stand back and walk slowly, examining the hull from a distance. Wear a pair of polarized sunglasses. Often they will reveal things that escape the naked eye.
5. Walk the entire deck and feel for soft spots that indicate serious structural problems. Gently test life line stanchions and other deck fittings for soundness.
6. Look around at the attachment points for the standing rigging. Any signs of rust or hairline cracks could indicate a serious problem.Look for cracks in the swaged fittings and also in the chain plates where they attach to the deck.
7. First impressions: Upon entering the cabin, is it clean and tidy, or a cluttered mess? Messy owners are often lazy about proper maintenance.
8. Use your nose. Does it smell like mildew, diesel, or sewage? All these odors could be signs of potential problems - and of course each smell will have a specific cause. You'll want to examine what could be causing any odors, because it could be costly to clear up later. Sewage odors have many causes, one of which is noted in this post. Generally the holding tank related problems noted on C320’s are easily repaired and documented on the C320 site. Diesel odors? Mildew smell? Pull up the floor boards and look for stagnant water or signs of an oil slick on the bilge water. This could contribute heavily to any odors, especially fuel or oil leaks, as well as mildew odors from stagnant water in the bilge. If you find oil or fuel in the bilge water, alert the marina manager and do not turn on the bilge pump!
9. While you have the floor boards up, examine the visible structural grid below them for any signs of stress cracks or repair jobs. This may be difficult due to limited access.
10. Also in the cabin, look for signs of leaks. Leaky decks can be a real problem once the core gets wet and starts to delaminate. Water stains on wood bulkheads and floors, peeling varnish, drip spots or stains on upholstery are signs of trouble. Feel the acorn nuts in the cabin roof for water droplets. Look on those nuts for discoloration or deposits that might indicate leaks. Examine the interior areas around the chain plates and mast base, looking for signs of water intrusion. Anything that looks like it's been leaking for a long time is a potential serious problem. A good strategy is to examine the interior of a boat within hours of a rain event. Not always possible, but it helps.
11. If your broker will allow it, pull the forward engine cover and examine the fiberglass drip pan
under the engine, looking for any obvious signs of leaking. While you're looking at the engine, check the belt tension (not too tight or too loose), and just look over the engine. Most well cared-for marine engines are (nearly) spotless, and show little sign of oil or grease build-up. Yanmar paints everything including the hoses. If you're looking at a boat that is 20 years old and the hoses are painted like the engine, there's a strong possibility that the hoses are 20 years old as well. Look at the raw water pump. Feel around on the underside for any dripping water that could indicate a leaky system. Take a white paper towel or rag and wipe around some of the joints in the diesel fuel system. Off-Road diesel in the US is usually dyed pink and will show up clearly on a clean white paper towel. You should not find any fuel leaks. Feel the bottom edge of the oil filter and the lowest point on the engine and see if it has any oil drips forming. If you see a can of Quick Start (pictured) sitting in the engine bay, that's a sure sign the owner is having starting issues. Don't use this stuff. Get your engine repaired before you destroy it.
12. Look around the batteries and examine the fiberglass below them for any signs of acid damage from leaky batteries. Even if current batteries are good, there may be damage from battery leaks gone by.
13. Glance around the cabin for any signs of amateurish or non-standard repairs. Electrical
components should look professionally installed, and there should not be any loose or dangling wires of unknown origin. Automotive battery chargers have no place on a boat!
14. Examine the hull for signs of repair work and the deck as well. When anti-skid is repaired, it becomes quite obvious due to the intricate pattern. Learn the standard anti-skid patterns of the C320 and question anything that looks non-standard. Repair work is not necessarily a problem if done well. Trust, but verify that work is done right. Closely examine the transom area for crazing where the swim ladder touches when lowered. There is a lot of stress on this area when the ladder is being used.
By this time, you should have a fairly good idea if the boat you are examining is sound or not. After you've decided to make a purchase, make your offer contingent on a successful pre-purchase survey, engine survey and sea trial. Don't skip these steps.
After you’ve bought your C320, please visit the C320 IA web site and join the association for additional access to resources and information about your boat.
Now go sailing!
Posted by Doug Treff at 6:00 AM
John Morrison
Aug 8, 2021, 2:30:40 PM8/8/21
to C320...@catalina320.com
I’m assuming you’re going to get it surveyed ? If not ensure U do!
Good luck
JohnM
1999#574
Sent from my iPhone
> On Aug 8, 2021, at 2:04 PM, John Meyers <jcme...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Kim,
Good luck
JohnM
1999#574
Sent from my iPhone
> On Aug 8, 2021, at 2:04 PM, John Meyers <jcme...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Kim,
Kim Chapman
Aug 8, 2021, 3:40:42 PM8/8/21
to c320-list
Asking $80K CAN ($64K US). I think it is overpriced. It is a bare bones
stock boat. Been neglected a bit.
Kim
stock boat. Been neglected a bit.
Kim
John Morrison
Aug 8, 2021, 3:55:41 PM8/8/21
to C320...@catalina320.com
I just replaced ALL the hoses on my 1999 including the propane hosing. The exhaust hose was replaced after it developed a leak on a cruise last year. Always keep a roll of Magic Wrap onboard, it got us home!
I also just replaced the water heater after it developed a leak in the coolant heat exchanger; not a mess you want to contend with!! I’ve documented it and will submit for a Mainsheet article.
Regards
>
> Asking $80K CAN ($64K US). I think it is overpriced. It is a bare bones
I also just replaced the water heater after it developed a leak in the coolant heat exchanger; not a mess you want to contend with!! I’ve documented it and will submit for a Mainsheet article.
Regards
JohnM
1999#574
Sent from my iPhone
> On Aug 8, 2021, at 3:40 PM, Kim Chapman <kim.c...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
1999#574
Sent from my iPhone
>
> Asking $80K CAN ($64K US). I think it is overpriced. It is a bare bones
Kim Chapman
Aug 8, 2021, 4:16:54 PM8/8/21
to c320-list
Thanks to everyone for the very helpful tips. I will look forward to
being active on this forum.
Kim Chapman
C400 #249
Quiescence
C320 #416
No Pressure
Lying in Toronto
being active on this forum.
Kim Chapman
C400 #249
Quiescence
No Pressure
Lying in Toronto
Greg Flanagan
Aug 8, 2021, 8:36:32 PM8/8/21
to C320...@catalina320.com
Seems pricey, I had my Hoop Dancer in charter from new (2006) until 2012. When I took it out of charter I had to pay tax (GST) on the market value of it. I did regression analysis on the price of every Catalina 320 in the world (at least on the internet) to support my value estimate for tax. The value I estimated was $110 Cdn. So a six year old 320 was worth ~70% of its cost. You have to consider the value of 1999 boat in 2021 (22 years old) that would have cost far less than a 2006 edition.
Best luck in negotiations,
Greg
Hoop Dancer #1726
Sidney, BC
> On Aug 8, 2021, at 12:43 PM, Kim Chapman <kim.c...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>
> Asking $80K CAN ($64K US). I think it is overpriced. It is a bare bones
Best luck in negotiations,
Greg
Hoop Dancer #1726
Sidney, BC
> On Aug 8, 2021, at 12:43 PM, Kim Chapman <kim.c...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>
> Asking $80K CAN ($64K US). I think it is overpriced. It is a bare bones
KEN GEIGER
Aug 8, 2021, 9:28:04 PM8/8/21
to C320...@catalina320.com, Kim Chapman, c320-list
Covid has caused a demand that has affected pricing mostly upward. You need to find comparable boats, age and fittings and condition and usage (fresh or salt water) and shipping cost if any and determine fair market value, not easy.
We bought our 2000 #765 nine years ago in Ontario, as well maintained, well outfitted always fresh water boat for CAD 74,000. Comparable to USA boats at the time. Dollar exchange rate was much better for Canadians at about 1 to 1.
We are retired and our C320 is our 3rd and last boat. Sailing on Georgian Bay
Sent from the all-new AOL app for Android
On Sun., 8 Aug. 2021 at 15:40, Kim Chapman<kim.c...@sympatico.ca> wrote: Asking $80K CAN ($64K US). I think it is overpriced. It is a bare bones
We bought our 2000 #765 nine years ago in Ontario, as well maintained, well outfitted always fresh water boat for CAD 74,000. Comparable to USA boats at the time. Dollar exchange rate was much better for Canadians at about 1 to 1.
We are retired and our C320 is our 3rd and last boat. Sailing on Georgian Bay
Sent from the all-new AOL app for Android
On Sun., 8 Aug. 2021 at 15:40, Kim Chapman<kim.c...@sympatico.ca> wrote: Asking $80K CAN ($64K US). I think it is overpriced. It is a bare bones
Jack Brennan
Aug 8, 2021, 9:46:28 PM8/8/21
to C320...@catalina320.com
In Florida, a well-equipped, well-maintained 320 from the late ‘90s – AC, all electronics, recent autopilot, newer rigging, newer sails, etc. – might go for 65K US. One in average condition might go for 40 or 45K, especially if all of the gear is older.
I bought my 1998 for 22.5K, but it was an odd situation. The boat had been repossessed by a bank, and someone had spent some time doing odd bits of vandalism, plus the P.O. had not fixed anything – if it broke, it stayed broke because he only day sailed it once or twice a month.
The bank just wanted to dump the boat, so I worked them down from 40K as the list of broken and vandalized parts I identified grew.
My “deal” became less alluring when I spent another 20K fixing everything that was worn out and/or defective. Still, I have a boat in great shape for the price of one in average condition. That’s not counting hundreds of hours of free labor on my part.
That’s what you have to watch for. If the boat is not well maintained, you can easily toss 20K into making it right. In which case you would have been better off buying the more expensive one in good shape.
Jack Brennan
Sonas, 1998 Catalina 320
Tierra Verde, Fl.
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
I bought my 1998 for 22.5K, but it was an odd situation. The boat had been repossessed by a bank, and someone had spent some time doing odd bits of vandalism, plus the P.O. had not fixed anything – if it broke, it stayed broke because he only day sailed it once or twice a month.
The bank just wanted to dump the boat, so I worked them down from 40K as the list of broken and vandalized parts I identified grew.
My “deal” became less alluring when I spent another 20K fixing everything that was worn out and/or defective. Still, I have a boat in great shape for the price of one in average condition. That’s not counting hundreds of hours of free labor on my part.
That’s what you have to watch for. If the boat is not well maintained, you can easily toss 20K into making it right. In which case you would have been better off buying the more expensive one in good shape.
Jack Brennan
Sonas, 1998 Catalina 320
Tierra Verde, Fl.
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
Doug Treff
Aug 9, 2021, 11:41:28 AM8/9/21
to c320...@lists.catalina320.com
Hi Kim,
First, I love the C400. It's always been a dream of mine to move up to one. Interesting that you're moving down to a C320.
You'll see a write-up in this thread that was my original article, now turned into a two-part blog entry. I'll link below.
http://savvysailor.blogspot.com/2016/05/buying-catalina-320-part-1.html
http://savvysailor.blogspot.com/2016/05/buying-catalina-320-part-2.html
It's a 24-year-old boat, so there could be many things nearing the end of their useful life span, most of them are repairable as long as the structure is sound. The biggest thing (with any boat) is to look for signs of water leaks and be suspicious of the condition of the core in the deck wherever there is an active leak.
One example of a maintenance issue but not a show-stopper: Be sure to look in the port aft locker and identify the refrigerator compressor. It's sitting on a shelf along the hull. Many people have discovered that the fridge compressor has started to rust away from water drips. Mine rusted away because the propane locker tub above it was leaking rainwater onto it. When the control board got wet, all the magic smoke escaped and it stopped working. Not a show-stopper by any means, but if your reefer is dead or damaged, you'll want to make a suitable allowance in your offer. The parts alone (From West Marine) cost me $1300. If you're hiring someone to do the work, add labor costs.
And be sure to fix the source of the leak as well.
That reminds me... I should update the article...
Good luck!
--
Doug Treff
do...@treff.us
First, I love the C400. It's always been a dream of mine to move up to one. Interesting that you're moving down to a C320.
You'll see a write-up in this thread that was my original article, now turned into a two-part blog entry. I'll link below.
http://savvysailor.blogspot.com/2016/05/buying-catalina-320-part-1.html
http://savvysailor.blogspot.com/2016/05/buying-catalina-320-part-2.html
It's a 24-year-old boat, so there could be many things nearing the end of their useful life span, most of them are repairable as long as the structure is sound. The biggest thing (with any boat) is to look for signs of water leaks and be suspicious of the condition of the core in the deck wherever there is an active leak.
One example of a maintenance issue but not a show-stopper: Be sure to look in the port aft locker and identify the refrigerator compressor. It's sitting on a shelf along the hull. Many people have discovered that the fridge compressor has started to rust away from water drips. Mine rusted away because the propane locker tub above it was leaking rainwater onto it. When the control board got wet, all the magic smoke escaped and it stopped working. Not a show-stopper by any means, but if your reefer is dead or damaged, you'll want to make a suitable allowance in your offer. The parts alone (From West Marine) cost me $1300. If you're hiring someone to do the work, add labor costs.
And be sure to fix the source of the leak as well.
That reminds me... I should update the article...
Good luck!
--
Doug Treff
do...@treff.us
Kirk Mueller
Aug 11, 2021, 5:21:53 PM8/11/21
to C320...@catalina320.com
To whom it may concern,
My dad received these emails but I ask that you remove him from your list
as he passed away on June 9th. His name was Kirk Mueller & his email was
kirk...@gmail.com.
Thank you,
His daughter, Lisa Martin
My dad received these emails but I ask that you remove him from your list
as he passed away on June 9th. His name was Kirk Mueller & his email was
kirk...@gmail.com.
Thank you,
His daughter, Lisa Martin
Allan Field
Aug 11, 2021, 6:15:38 PM8/11/21
to C320...@catalina320.com
Hi Lisa - I can't help you with getting off the Catalina 320 Association
list-serve but I do just want you to know how terribly saddened I am to
hear about your dad. He was our Association Commodore several years ago and
a friend. I lost touch with him after he sold his boat but always will have
fond memories of Captain Chaos sailing "We Go Now." Please know that you
and your family are in Linda's and my thoughts and reflections at this time.
Allan S. Field
list-serve but I do just want you to know how terribly saddened I am to
hear about your dad. He was our Association Commodore several years ago and
a friend. I lost touch with him after he sold his boat but always will have
fond memories of Captain Chaos sailing "We Go Now." Please know that you
and your family are in Linda's and my thoughts and reflections at this time.
Allan S. Field
Doug Treff
Aug 12, 2021, 9:44:02 AM8/12/21
to c320...@lists.catalina320.com, kirk...@gmail.com
Lisa,
Deepest condolences to you and your family. I had numerous email exchanges with Kirk and he was always a pleasure to deal with.
Removal from the list is a self-help procedure. If you visit the following site, you can log in and unsubscribe.
http://lists.catalina320.com/options.cgi/c320-list-catalina320.com
In the event that you don't know his password, there is a way to reset the password via email, then you can log in and unsubscribe.
--
Doug Treff
do...@treff.us
Deepest condolences to you and your family. I had numerous email exchanges with Kirk and he was always a pleasure to deal with.
Removal from the list is a self-help procedure. If you visit the following site, you can log in and unsubscribe.
http://lists.catalina320.com/options.cgi/c320-list-catalina320.com
In the event that you don't know his password, there is a way to reset the password via email, then you can log in and unsubscribe.
--
Doug Treff
do...@treff.us
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