[C320-list] Yanmar 3GM issues

[Louis Friedman via C320-list]

Hi all, looking for thoughts here- went out for a sail today -engine took a lot of priming to start but then was fine. After 2 hrs sailing it wouldn’t turnover despite more priming. Had to sail it into the mooring. Someone suggested maybe a fuel line clog or I need to change the primary fuel filter? Both fuel filters were changed upon launching in May- would it make sense to change again ? Picked up Nigel Calders book on diesels but still learning.

Lou
S/v Miss Adventure
#623
Sent from my iPhone

[Aaron Laskowski via C320-list]

I had a similar issue on my older 87 Catalina 34. After much troubleshooting and frustration, I finally found the root cause of the issue (for me at least). The fitting off the fuel tank had a metal ball check valve built into it that got gummed up and blocked free fuel flow. Once cleaned up, all was well again. Might be worth checking.

Sent from my T-Mobile 5G Device
Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg>
________________________________
From: C320-list <c320-lis...@lists.catalina320.com> on behalf of Louis Friedman via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2024 4:49:49 PM
To: C320...@catalina320.com <C320...@catalina320.com>
Cc: Louis Friedman <lou...@gmail.com>
Subject: [C320-list] Yanmar 3GM issues

[Steve Weinstein via C320-list]

Lou,Before you go crazy, check the Racor filter.  It's pretty easy to get that clogged up if there is crud in the tank, or a buildup of water.  I'd start right there.  If the Racor is clogged, also check the fuel filter on the engine.  Depending on what you find, if there is stuff in the filters, you might want to look into having the tank cleaned and the fuel polished.One other thought, how old are your fuel lines?  I've seen this on old cars.  If the hoses are old, the inner lining can separate and cause a blockage in the line.  Fuel won't flow, or you just get a trickle.  Just something to keep in mind.
Steve Weinsten,2000 C320 #722, Vega

[Jack Brennan via C320-list]

Wouldn't turn over or wouldn't start?

If it wouldn't turn over, it's probably electrical. Dead or low battery. A bad electrical connection or blown fuse somewhere.

Start by using a multimeter to check the voltages on your battery bank. Should be 12.3 volts or above.

Then try to start the engine. If the voltage plunges and doesn't come back, it's the batteries.

If that's OK, use a screwdriver to remove the gauge panel at the helm. Use the multimeter to measure the voltage at the start button.

If you get no volts, work your way backwards. There is an electrical connection, I think, inside the housing box in the aft cabin.

From there, it goes back to the engine. Trust Calder on this, not my memory.

I believe the Yanmar wiring harness has a fuse in it.

Jack Brennan
Sonas, 1988 Catalina 320
Tierra Verde, Fl.





Sent via the Samsung Galaxy A32 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: Louis Friedman via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com>
Date: 7/14/24 4:52 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: C320...@catalina320.com
Cc: Louis Friedman <lou...@gmail.com>
Subject: [C320-list] Yanmar 3GM issues

[Bob Borelli via C320-list]

Both probable.

Is inline fuel valve open?
Visually inspect primary bowl for water in fuel
Check for air leaks along fuel hoses, look & smell for diesel fuel, rag wipe hoses any fuel?
Look for fuel leaks at hose clamps, air getting in?
Possible primary filter body needs another turn into Racor head, loose filter a potential air leak.
New Racor filter gaskets installed correctly in place?
Vent plug & plunger on Racor head tightened?

Bleed the system for Primary thru secondary filter, ensure no air bubbles.
If like on my Perkins, the Secondary pump handle pumps fuel out of vent plug, the fuel pump is working & not the problem.
Try to start engine.

Still no start? Change the Racor primary filter. If its 2 mil filter could get filled fast.
If boat rocking around on mooring or during sailing its possible debris stirred up from bottom of tank, may see debris on top removed primary filter.
New filter than bleed system.

Try to start engine.

Let us know your results.

Bob Borelli 1995 Perkins M30 on hull no. 209 Sassafras River MD

________________________________
From: C320-list <c320-lis...@lists.catalina320.com> on behalf of Louis Friedman via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com>

Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2024 4:49 PM
To: C320...@catalina320.com <C320...@catalina320.com>

Cc: Louis Friedman <lou...@gmail.com>
Subject: [C320-list] Yanmar 3GM issues

[KEN GEIGER via C320-list]

Lou, just a word of caution about long cranking of the engine.  There likely is a caution sign on your boat somewhere.  Cranking more than 30 seconds can lead to filling the muffler with water leading to back filling the cylinders with water and a hydro lock and engine damage, bent rods.  It's real, it's Not a myth.  Google it and be careful.
Ken GeigerOn Northern Dream on Georgian Bay#765 a 2000

Sent from AOL on Android

On Sun, Jul 14, 2024 at 4:51 p.m., Louis Friedman via C320-list<c320...@lists.catalina320.com> wrote: Hi all, looking for thoughts here- went out for a sail today -engine took a lot of priming to start but then was fine. After 2 hrs sailing it wouldn’t turnover despite more priming. Had to sail it into the mooring.  Someone suggested  maybe a fuel line clog or I need to change the primary fuel filter? Both fuel filters were changed upon launching in May- would it make sense to change again ?  Picked up Nigel Calders book on diesels but still learning.

[Jeff Smith via C320-list]

How many hours on the engine? This is how many problems started on my
Perkins with approx. 1,150 hours. After much troubleshooting, I had my
injectors and injection pump rebuilt (not at the same time). That solve the
issue.

The advice the shop gave me was to start with a clean container of diesel
and work backwards from the injection pump. It is probably with changing
the two filters first (approx. $50), before you start taking fuel lines
loose and plugging them into the clean tank of diesel. However, this method
is how I diagnosed my issue.

I also installed ann electric fuel pump. I simply turn it on after changing
the filters. It usually eliminates the need to bleed the system, or it
makes bleeding extremely easy.

Good luck,
Jeff
#121

[Bob Borelli via C320-list]

When I have trouble starting my M30 engine,
And need to continuous turning over hoping to start
I remove the drain plug on the Aqua Filter (9/16" wrench)
So I can turn the engine over at 30 second or more intervals
with no worry about back filling the exhaust hose, elbow, exhaust manifold
which would be a very serious error!
Easy to pump water out of the bilge & return drain plug to Aqua Filter.
When lucky enough to have solved hard to non start problem.
To date my problems have been air leaks & a brand new dirty primary filter from debris stirred up from bottom of tank.
I've have had a work request to polish the fuel with hope to get the bottom debris out of the tank.
And I keep several spare primary & secondary filters onboard for the next unexpected time diesel fades or hard to start.

I'm thinking of replacing the 3 injectors with new from Part4Engines
instead of sending to shop for test and rebuild.
M30 has 1650 engine hours.

Bob 1995 C320 no. 209 moored on the Sassafras
________________________________
From: C320-list <c320-lis...@lists.catalina320.com> on behalf of Jeff Smith via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2024 6:11 PM
To: C320...@catalina320.com <C320...@catalina320.com>
Cc: Jeff Smith <svsailm...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [C320-list] Yanmar 3GM issues

[Louis Friedman via C320-list]

thanks all. lots of good advice here. I will take a look this week. We
were heeling a bit today so I wonder if some crud did get in the fuel line.

Lou

--
Louis Friedman, DO, FACP
Woodbridge Medical Associates
www.woodbridgemed.com
732-634-0036

[Louis Friedman via C320-list]

thanks all. I recruited someone more experienced than me at out club(not
hard to do!) and it turned out to be a loose nut at the point the fuel hose
enters the secondary fuel filter. Seems to be running good now but I need
to clean up a pile of diesel fuel today!

Lou

[Allan Field via C320-list]

Louis - Is the loose nut you are describing on the secondary fuel filter
the bleed screw? If so, there is a copper "crush washer" between the bleed
screw and the top of the housing that should be changed out periodically as
it will crush down and eventually leak. I change it prophylactically after
each filter change, just to be safe. Sometimes it's not a loose nut but
rather a crushed crush washer!

Allan S. Field
Sea Shadow - C387, #103 (formerly C320)
Columbia, MD & Herrington Harbour South



On Tue, Jul 16, 2024 at 8:43 AM Louis Friedman via C320-list <

[ART HARDEN via C320-list]

Lou:

Get some laundry detergent that is specialized for mechanics. it will help dissipate the diesel smell. mix it with water and use a sprayer to clean up the spilled diesel.

Sent from my iPhone
Art Harden
Catalina 320 "Tortuga" E-62
937.885.9380 (o)
937.477.5544 (m)

> On Jul 16, 2024, at 8:42 AM, Louis Friedman via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com> wrote:
>
> thanks all. I recruited someone more experienced than me at out club(not

[Louis Friedman via C320-list]

Thanks for the tips. I suspected it will smell like diesel down there for
a bit. I'll pick up some Grease X or Fast orange? detergent. the loose
nut was not the bleeder screw but I'll keep an eye out for that.

[Troy Dunn via C320-list]

Glad to hear it was as simple as a loose banjo bolt. If it starts leaking
again change out the washers, they are once and done. ( you can reheat them
to re anneal and re use but they are so cheap…). As far as the washers on
the two screws on top of the housing. I believe one of those is a bleed
screw and the other is for some other purpose that escapes me at the
moment. Also one of them has a copper washer and one actually has a
delrin or nylon washer. I'm fairly sure the bleed screw has the plastic
washer. Anyhow…as mentioned do not over tighten the bleed scew. In
fact, go super easy on that screw, just nip it up snug and call it done, it
is super easy to over tighten that screw and then the next time it won’t
seal. I keep spare washers on hand for this reason.

As another thing to watch out for. The RACOR filter has a few of orings
inside it. Mine started to leak last fall ever so slightly. It was
getting an oily surface and starting to smell but not leaving any drips in
the bildge. I could not figure out where the leak was coming from and
eventually removed it from the boat took it home and completely rebuilt it
with all new seals and Gasoila sealant on the threads. No more leaks, but
finding all the right viton orings involved the grand tour of hardware
stores in my area.

FWIW

Troy Dunn
Hull #514

[Bob Borelli via C320-list]

So it was an air leak.
Another good lesson to check for simple fix first to diesel hard or not starting.

Thank you for letting us know!

Bob no. 209 Sassafras River MD
________________________________
From: C320-list <c320-lis...@lists.catalina320.com> on behalf of Troy Dunn via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 16, 2024 9:07 PM
To: C320...@catalina320.com <C320...@catalina320.com>
Cc: Troy Dunn <troutw...@gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [C320-list] Yanmar 3GM issues

[Louis Friedman via C320-list]

one question for all - I only had a few crescent wrenches in my on board
tool box which worked fine but I wonder if you
have recommendations for fixed wrench sizes to keep handy or other tools
that are a must?

Lou

[Jeff Smith via C320-list]

I carry a full set of metric and SAE open/box end wrenches, 3/8” sockets (both), screw drivers, pliers, and crescent wrenches. The last time I did not do this and had a problem, I frantically had to get creative with a Leatherman.

Cheers,
Jeff
#121

[Bob Borelli via C320-list]

Wrench List
3/8” for oil change plug.
9/16” 14 mm for Oil Change threaded nipple fitting
9/16” 14 mm for Aqua Muffler drain plug.
11/16" 17 mm Gearbox dip stick
18 mm Bleed Secondary Fuel Filter bleed screw.
14 mm Bleed Lift Pump bleed screw
17 mm Bleed Injectors with box wrench.
10 mm Sea Water Pump Impeller cover plate.
24 mm Crankshaft bolt 24 mm socket.
Exhaust Elbow 12mm & 13mm box wrench
Alternator Fan Belt Wrench List replacement:
12 MM Long Socket
12 MM Short Socket

Along with alot of other tools. I try to minimize tools so I determine what I need I keep in small tool boxes to keep out of the way.

Bob Borelli no. 209 'Elusive'
________________________________

From: C320-list <c320-lis...@lists.catalina320.com> on behalf of Jeff Smith via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com>

Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2024 2:31 PM
To: C320...@catalina320.com <C320...@Catalina320.com>
Cc: Jeff Smith <svsailm...@gmail.com>

> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.woodbridgemed.com%2F&data=05%7C02%7C%7C4007ef614e604903d22a08dca68ed89b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638568379658162338%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=ijC48pCmLymOxq%2FxvrpO8n%2FEaYXFeZ8ts5O%2BX93o4UU%3D&reserved=0<http://www.woodbridgemed.com/>
> 732-634-0036

[Louis Friedman via C320-list]

wow, thank you. will start stocking.

On Wed, Jul 17, 2024 at 3:37 PM Bob Borelli via C320-list <

www.woodbridgemed.com
732-634-0036

[SARA SCHROEDER via C320-list]

In addition to keeping what I need in one place, I wrapped different colors of rescue tape on them so in case of an emergency I don't have to look at the size. Red rescue tape is for the critical parts, orange not so critical and yellow least critical.

Must have done that on a day I was bored.

Sara
Wandering Star
Seattle
#707/2000

[Troy Dunn via C320-list]

Ace hardware often sells small 1/4” and 3/8” metric socket sets. Grab
them when they are on sale and throw them on the boat. Buy extra 10mm and
8mm sockets…these you will sacrifice to the bilge gods. I have a set of
thumb screw screwdrivers and sockets. They come in handy in super tight
spaces. Also a set of small right angle screwdrivers also super handy in
tight spaces. Buy a Klein 11 in 1 screwdriver. This is hands down the
best screwdriver you can own in the "affordable" price range.
Actually…buy 2 because once you own one..you will need it for the house as
well. I also keep a cordless drill, set of bits and most importantly a
fan that will run off the same batteries. The fan on low will last a
couple nights on a 5Ah battery and is way better than the hardwired fans.
I put it on the shelf in the vberth on nights at anchor in a gunk hole
where the wind scoop gathers no airflow. It’s a game changer. Those are
my reccos. Don’t ask me what I carry…let’s just say no one on the dock
has asked me for a tool I don’t have on the boat….usually…yes I cart many
of them back and forth, I hate to "call the guy" and ruin a perfectly good
weekend. I keep way too many spares as well.

FWIW

T

[Tim Van de Water via C320-list]

Bob,

Great list. What engine is this for? Do you know if it is the same for
all of the OEM engines installed? I've got the Yanmar 3GM30f.

SV Coda #537 (1998)


*Tim Van de Water*404.790.2208
tj.van...@gmail.com


On Wed, Jul 17, 2024 at 3:37 PM Bob Borelli via C320-list <

[Bob Borelli via C320-list]

My Wrench List is for the Perkins M30.

I'm sorry, I should have indicated that in the email.

Bob Borelli 1995 C320 no. 209
________________________________
From: Tim Van de Water <tj.van...@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2024 8:57 AM
To: C320...@catalina320.com <C320...@catalina320.com>
Cc: Bob Borelli <cassa...@hotmail.com>

Subject: Re: [C320-list] Yanmar 3GM issues

Bob,

Great list. What engine is this for? Do you know if it is the same for all of the OEM engines installed? I've got the Yanmar 3GM30f.

SV Coda #537 (1998)

Tim Van de Water
404.790.2208
tj.van...@gmail.com<mailto:tj.van...@gmail.com>

On Wed, Jul 17, 2024 at 3:37 PM Bob Borelli via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com<mailto:c320...@lists.catalina320.com>> wrote:
Wrench List
3/8” for oil change plug.
9/16” 14 mm for Oil Change threaded nipple fitting
9/16” 14 mm for Aqua Muffler drain plug.
11/16" 17 mm Gearbox dip stick
18 mm Bleed Secondary Fuel Filter bleed screw.
14 mm Bleed Lift Pump bleed screw
17 mm Bleed Injectors with box wrench.
10 mm Sea Water Pump Impeller cover plate.
24 mm Crankshaft bolt 24 mm socket.
Exhaust Elbow 12mm & 13mm box wrench
Alternator Fan Belt Wrench List replacement:
12 MM Long Socket
12 MM Short Socket

Along with alot of other tools. I try to minimize tools so I determine what I need I keep in small tool boxes to keep out of the way.

Bob Borelli no. 209 'Elusive'
________________________________

From: C320-list <c320-lis...@lists.catalina320.com<mailto:c320-lis...@lists.catalina320.com>> on behalf of Jeff Smith via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com<mailto:c320...@lists.catalina320.com>>

Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2024 2:31 PM

To: C320...@catalina320.com<mailto:C320...@catalina320.com> <C320...@Catalina320.com>
Cc: Jeff Smith <svsailm...@gmail.com<mailto:svsailm...@gmail.com>>

Subject: Re: [C320-list] Yanmar 3GM issues

I carry a full set of metric and SAE open/box end wrenches, 3/8” sockets (both), screw drivers, pliers, and crescent wrenches. The last time I did not do this and had a problem, I frantically had to get creative with a Leatherman.

Cheers,
Jeff
#121

> On Jul 17, 2024, at 2:18 PM, Louis Friedman via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com<mailto:c320...@lists.catalina320.com>> wrote:
>
> one question for all - I only had a few crescent wrenches in my on board
> tool box which worked fine but I wonder if you
> have recommendations for fixed wrench sizes to keep handy or other tools
> that are a must?
>
> Lou
>
> On Wed, Jul 17, 2024 at 2:14 PM Bob Borelli via C320-list <
> c320...@lists.catalina320.com<mailto:c320...@lists.catalina320.com>> wrote:
>
>> So it was an air leak.
>> Another good lesson to check for simple fix first to diesel hard or not
>> starting.
>>
>> Thank you for letting us know!
>>
>> Bob no. 209 Sassafras River MD
>> ________________________________

>> From: C320-list <c320-lis...@lists.catalina320.com<mailto:c320-lis...@lists.catalina320.com>> on behalf of
>> Troy Dunn via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com<mailto:c320...@lists.catalina320.com>>

>> Sent: Tuesday, July 16, 2024 9:07 PM

>> To: C320...@catalina320.com<mailto:C320...@catalina320.com> <C320...@catalina320.com<mailto:C320...@catalina320.com>>
>> Cc: Troy Dunn <troutw...@gmail.com<mailto:troutw...@gmail.com>>

> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.woodbridgemed.com%2F&data=05%7C02%7C%7C4007ef614e604903d22a08dca68ed89b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638568379658162338%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=ijC48pCmLymOxq%2FxvrpO8n%2FEaYXFeZ8ts5O%2BX93o4UU%3D&reserved=0<http://www.woodbridgemed.com/><http://www.woodbridgemed.com/>
> 732-634-0036

[ART HARDEN via C320-list]

Having tools on board are great idea. However, a lot of the tool kits are not very waterproof or moisture proof. I have three different plastic ammunition boxes, which I use for protecting tools. I have one small one back in the engine compartment under the aft berth which has a fuel filter, shaft, seal, packing, seal, wrenches, packing removal tools, engine impeller, and several other miscellaneous items.

I have two other ammo boxes which contain drillbits, wrenches, small hammer, pliers, and other miscellaneous tools. The reason for the ammo boxes is that they are waterproof and protect all the tools from rusting. However, I must admit I do have a tool kit in its factory case, and I have not had much issue with rust since I finally was able to control water in the bilge. After the dressing, my Catalina smile, resealing the keel bolts, replacing the knot and depth transducers, I now have a dry bilge. That made a big difference in the moisture in the boat.

Sent from my iPhone
Art Harden
Catalina 320 "Tortuga" E-62
937.885.9380 (o)
937.477.5544 (m)

> On Jul 18, 2024, at 5:46 PM, Bob Borelli via C320-list <c320...@lists.catalina320.com> wrote:
>
> My Wrench List is for the Perkins M30.