[C320-list] Cutless bearing replacement

[Graeme Clark]

I am making my own removal tool (as I am on the other side of the pond, so loaner program is not an option!)

I thought the bearing was 4 inches long, for a 1 inch shaft with an outside diameter of 1-1/4 inch so I ordered a suitable piece of steel tube and cut it lengthwise so that this will go either side of the shaft and then I will use this to push out the old bearing.

My own boat is still in the water, being hauled out at the end of the month, so I tried it for size on a friend’s C320. Given that he doesn't need his bearing replaced, this was limited to just sliding the two halves of the ‘extractor tube’ along the shaft until it touched the bearing.

Now it seemed to me that the overall 1-1/4 inch outside diameter of the tube is actually too large to fit into the “p-bracket” (shaft support bracket that contains the cutless bearing).

So thats easy enough to solve, i can get a thinner tube with a wall thickness of just 1/16 inch and thus an overall outside diameter of 1-1/8”

BUT - is the bearing itself actually smaller? Did Catalina change the spec at all (my boat is ’96, my friend’s is 99)

Obviously i want to pre-order the bearing, ready for when my boat is hauled out, so I need to get it correct. Its going to be expensive to have her sat on the hard whilst I wait for a re-delivery of a wrongly ordered item!

If anyone on this list actually has the removal tool in their possession, could they send me a photo and better still measure the outside diameter of the extraction piece.

All other info gratefully received.

Thanks

Graeme Clark
#366, 1996
“Jaskar”, Poole, England.

[KEN GEIGER]

See             https://www.catalinadirect.com/shop-by-boat/catalina-38/engine/props-etc/cutlass-bearing-cp-26-c-27-c-28-lt-724-c-270-c-30-c-320-c-34-c-36/
Also try Google for tool ideas. 

Ken GeigerNorthern Dream  #765 2000

[Joe Luciano]

Better yet, why not contact Strut-Pro and simply purchase the specific split collets for a 1” shaft? Then you can use them directly for the tool you wish to make. Those are the only precision required pieces for the tool to work. I bought the Strut-Pro tool about a year ago and used it last summer to replace my cutlass bearing last summer. Worked like a champ. Tool cost was about $350 as I recall. But, they will sell just the split collets for various shaft sizes.

Joe Luciano
Second Wind
#1044

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 5, 2022, at 9:51 AM, Graeme Clark <c...@skyflyer.co.uk> wrote:
>
> I am making my own removal tool (as I am on the other side of the pond, so loaner program is not an option!)

[Graeme Clark]

Thanks Ken

That confirms my understanding of the size of the bearing.
I guess it may be the case that slight iregulrities on the inside of the tube I am using arestopping it from sitting snugly on the shaft. Either way, I think if I use a 1-1/8 OD tube that will do the job. Its simple and cheap enough to make so I will have bothe and at least one will work!
Graeme

[Graeme Clark]

NoWell the short answer to that Joe, is that I am too tight to spend $50 on collets and $50 on international shipping when I can build the whole thing for under $50 at home. They're not rocket science! Also I am making it dual purpose so that I can use it as a prop puller as well!

Having said that I am making a big assumption here - namely that the fact that the bearing has two retaining grub screws means that it isnt going to be THAT tight a fit in the bracket!

We shall see

Cheers

Graeme

[sail-ability sail-ability]

make sure that there are no TWO grub screws holding the bearing in
place! occasionally I've seen two in the same hole, the outer one being
used as a lock, which is not necessary.
Good Luck
JohnM
1999#574

------ Original Message ------
From: c...@skyflyer.co.uk
To: C320...@Catalina320.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2022 1:24 PM
Subject: Re: [C320-list] Cutless bearing replacement

NoWell the short answer to that Joe, is that I am too tight to
spend $50 on collets and $50 on international shipping when I can build
the whole thing for under $50 at home. They're not rocket science!
Also I am making it dual purpose so that I can use it as a prop puller
as well!

Having said that I am making a big assumption here - namely that the
fact that the bearing has two retaining grub screws means that it isnt
going to be THAT tight a fit in the bracket!

We shall see

Cheers

Graeme


> On 5 Apr 2022, at 18:16, Joe Luciano <jnlu...@comcast.net> wrote:
>

[pto...@4square.net]

mmm... Maybe I missed this but why not use the club's kit? I used it last month and it work wonderfully. I even left a few extra set screws in the kit just in case somebody drops one.

Pat Tormey
Blue Skies s/v
Newport, RI USA

-----Original Message-----
From: C320-list <c320-lis...@lists.catalina320.com> On Behalf Of Graeme Clark
Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2022 12:50 PM
To: Catalina list <C320...@Catalina320.com>
Subject: [C320-list] Cutless bearing replacement

[KEN GEIGER]

He is in the UK is the short answer.
Ken Geiger Noether Dream 765

Sent from the all-new AOL app for Android

On Tue, 5 Apr 2022 at 16:57, pto...@4square.net<pto...@4square.net> wrote: mmm... Maybe I missed this but why not use the club's kit? I used it last month and it work wonderfully. I even left a few extra set screws in the kit just in case somebody drops one.

[David Nolte]

Hi Pat,

Graeme is across the Big Pond…

David Nolte
Beach House 0004

David Nolte
SuspenderStore
800-393-4508

[Graeme Clark]

Pat - see my first paragraph! You missed that bit indeed :-) But thanks for the suggestion anyway!
Graeme

Sent from my phone. Excuse typos!

> On 5 Apr 2022, at 22:09, David Nolte <dcn...@mac.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Pat,

[Albert Kitten]

I made my own tools as well for a 1 inch shaft.

However taking a few thow of the dia of the tube is better than selecting a
much smaller dia pushing tool as it will preserve the end of the new
bearing during fitment and the old one during removal, especially if the
bearing has a brass outer skin.
They can grow into the housing and I don't use that type.
I push the bearing inward and cut it off the shaft with a skinny cutting
disc. It just easy !!
I bought a foot of 1 1/4 od 316 off cut for $5
Have replaced 7 bearings that way since our new 320 in 2008

(Always ensure the shaft remains free to turn during the replacement and a
hint is to warm the p bracket with a heat gun so it expands slightly)
Happy days.

[Jeff Smith]

Graeme,

I am a little late to the conversation and this may not be helpful, but I used a 3-jaw puller (or 2-jaw would also work) (in the States you can get them for $20) to remove the propeller. I don’t know if that helps you or not, but it might be easier to just build the tool without trying to make it dual purpose. One note - if you have a bronze shaft, make sure you use the cap or you will put a dimple in the end of your shaft (or so I have heard…)

Jeff
Sailmates, #121

[Graeme Clark]

Update

Well, I made my own bearing puller using 1/4 in steel plate and three 3/8 in threaded rods. Couldn’t shift it at all. In the end the plates started to bend!

So the plan is to soldier on with the existing bearing which will hopefully last one more season and replace next year, using a beefed up Mk2 puller with thicker plates and larger rods!

As far as I know the bearing on my boat is original (1996) so it’s had a long time to corrode in place!

My question to anyone who has done this job before, using the loaner puller, is whether the bearing slides out gradually or releases suddenly with a pop or a bang? I’m really not sure how much pressure to put it under and be safe!

Plan B is remove the shaft and cut out the bearing from the inside, but that is a job for next winter. Does anyone know what clearance is needed beneath the keel in order to drop the rudder?

Many thanks
Graeme
1996,
#366
England

Sent from my iPad

> On 5 Apr 2022, at 18:18, Graeme Clark <c...@skyflyer.co.uk> wrote:
>
> Thanks Ken

[Mark Cole]

Graeme;

I borrowed the association’s loaner bearing puller to replace the cutless on my 1994 C320. Not sure if it was original, but it was in pretty rough shape and heavily corroded. I did have to put quite a bit of pressure on the wrench, and even use a cheater bar for extra leverage and just about when I thought I was approaching too much pressure, the bearing broke loose with a start. No bang, but a noticeable jump of movement. It slid right out after that first jump. Just before the bearing popped loose, I was contemplating tapping the strut lightly with a hammer to break things loose.

I’m not sure if you have seen the loaner bearing puller, but I have a photo on my C320 “Fiddler’s Green” owner’s album that shows the puller in good detail set up on the shaft and ready to go. Here is the link to the album: https://c320.org/mediagallery/album.php?aid=328&page=1 <https://c320.org/mediagallery/album.php?aid=328&page=1>

I hope this helps.

Mark
Fiddler’s Green #8

[Joe Luciano]

Hi Graeme,

I’ve done this job twice on my 2005 C-320. Once with the loaner tool from the club, and once with my own tool. I’m sure you loosened the two set screws before getting started. Both times I’ve done it, the bearing eases its way out, and every few times you put pressure on it, it makes a slight pop as it works its way out. But it never jumps much of a distance. I never looked into the manufacture of the collets used in the tool, but they could be a hardened steel to prevent any bending. The large yoke and bolts of the tool put a great deal of force on the collets. That was why I suggested you might want to purchase just the 1” shaft collets that are available and weigh very little to ship. Sorry it didn’t work out for you this time around.

Joe Luciano

#1044

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 26, 2022, at 8:19 AM, Graeme Clark <c...@skyflyer.co.uk> wrote:
>
> Update

[RONALD HODEL]

I have heard of people taking a hacksaw blade and cutting through the Cutlass bearing itself being careful not to go into the strut itself. Obviously you can’t do it with the propeller shaft in place. Sounds like risky business to me and once you start you’re committed but I guess if it has to be done that might be one way to do it. I haven’t done it myself, I don’t think I would. I’ve only heard about it from people who have heard of people doing it.

Ron Hodel
#1070. Lokomaikai

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 26, 2022, at 9:11 AM, Joe Luciano <jnlu...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> Hi Graeme,

[Dave Hupe]

I used the loaner tool set and it worked perfectly/easily on my 1994 boat to extract the old and install the new bearing.  I assume that wasn't the first time it had been done on my boat but don't have any record.
Actually a friend has a 2000 C320 and we split the cost of shipping the loaner tools and we helped each other do our boats one after another.
The bearings did not jump but instead came out smoothly and slowly as the 2 large bolts are turned ( my friend and I each worked about simultaneously on each side of the tool).
Dave Hupe 1994 C320 #32Holland, MI

On Tue, Apr 26, 2022 at 12:47 PM, RONALD HODEL<ronan...@me.com> wrote: I have heard of people taking a hacksaw blade and cutting through the Cutlass bearing itself being careful not to go into the strut itself. Obviously you can’t do it with the propeller shaft in place. Sounds like risky business to me and once you start you’re committed but I guess if it has to be done that might be one way to do it. I haven’t done it myself, I don’t think I would. I’ve only heard about it from people who have heard of people doing it.

[Graeme Clark]

Thanks folks. Looking at the photos and videos you linked to, it is now clear my home made puller was way undersized. Those end plates look to be well over half an inch thick, maybe even 5/8 and the rods are pretty chunky too!

I’ll make a new updated one and try again next winter when there’s less time pressure!

Thanks to everyone

Graeme

Sent from my phone. Excuse typos!

> On 26 Apr 2022, at 18:23, Dave Hupe <hoop...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I used the loaner tool set and it worked perfectly/easily on my 1994 boat to extract the old and install the new bearing. I assume that wasn't the first time it had been done on my boat but don't have any record.

[Chris White]

Graeme
First time I dug a hole and lowered the rudder down and out.Hole depth depends on height boat is above ground level.My hole was 750mm deep.I was lucky where the boat was at the time, I can't see many boatyards allowing this.The rudder was very heavy.Then you have to disconnect the shaft at the back of the gearbox, and slide it out.To get the cutlass bearing out was brute force and ignorance.I got there in the end but don't recommend this method.
The second time it was done by Marine Power at Deacons Yard on the River Hamble.They made a split tube to drive out the bearing and the whole job was done in 4 hours.They would probably send an engineer down to Poole to do it for you.
Regards
Chris WhiteC320 Dandy #449UK