Derivation of Hora from Ahoratra

[Raja Roy]

Dear learned scholars,

I have seen it mentioned in many books and articles that hora is derived from Ahoratra. But how do the first and last letters get dropped? Besides, ahoratra is one day and night, while hora is an hour. Some articles mention that Varahamihira has said so. Does anyone have an exact reference for that? I would like to hear from Sanskrit experts whether such a derivation is feasible.

Best regards,

Raja

[Shrikant Jamadagni]

Sanskrit horaa is not from ahoratra

Apte, Vachaspatyam etc give derivation as hu + ran

Besides it has other meanings than hour.

होरा [Printed book page 1177-a]
होरा [हु-रन्]

1 The rising of a zodiacal sign.

2 Part of the duration of a sign.

3 An hour.

4 A mark, line.                 

Shrikant Jamadagni
Bengaluru

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[Kushagra Aniket]

I have also heard the derivation अहोरात्रम् --> होरा from Prof. Girija Shankar Shastri in one of his introductory lectures on the बृहज्जातकम्. However, if I remember correctly, he mentioned it as an alternative derivation, not necessarily the most grammatically sound one. I understand that this type of dropping of letters sometimes happens in Jyotisha.

I am attaching the link to the lecture series here. I am leaving the exact lecture where he said this to your perusal (should be in the first 5 lectures):

https://youtu.be/NHMKS4_Q_tg

Kushagra

Kushagra Aniket

Economist and Management Consultant

Columbia University'21

Cornell University'15

New York, NY, U.S.A.

ka...@cornell.edu

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[Raghuram RP]

Unfortunately the video of parichayam has gone viral and many people are so astonished by this fact.

Now there's a trend to depict that everything was in our ancient texts. Not sure what is real, what's extrapolation 

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[Raja Roy]

Dear Shrikant ji,

Thank you for the valuable information.

Best regards,

Raja

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[Raja Roy]

Dear Kushagra ji,

Thanks for your reply and link to the talks by Prof. Girija Shankar Shastri.

Best regards,

Raja

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[Raja Roy]

Dear Raghuram ji,

Thanks for your reply. It is very unfortunate that Prachyam is using its social media influence to spread misinformation. I was under the impression that these people are genuinely interested in seeking the truth, but unfortunately this is not the case. Even after they knew of my work refuting Mr. Nilesh Oak's work on dating of Ramayana, they released a video on Ramanavami claiming that Lord Rama was born in 12240 BCE and there are over 500 objectively tested evidence for it. (Ramayan True? | Birth Certificate of Bhagwan Ram | Prachyam - YouTube ,t = 3:12). I challenged them to produce these over 500 verses from Ramayana and they did not respond. Just for information, here are links to my 10-part detailed refutation of 12209 BCE dating of Ram-Ravana yuddha and my 2-part refutation on Sangam Talks.

Refutation of Nilesh Oak’s Astronomical Dating of Ramayana to 12209 BCE | by Dr. Raja Ram Mohan Roy | Medium

Dating the Ramayana - Part 1 l Dr Raja Ram Mohan Roy | #SangamTalks - YouTube

Dating of the Ramayana - 2 l Dr. Raja Ram Mohan Roy | #SangamTalks - YouTube

Similarly, I have comprehensively debunked 12000 BCE dating of Surya Siddhanta in my two articles and a talk on Sangam Talks. Links are here:

Surya Siddhanta was NOT written over 14,000 years ago | by Dr. Raja Ram Mohan Roy | Medium

Surya Siddhanta was NOT written over 14,000 years ago (Response to questions raised by Rupa Bhaty) | by Dr. Raja Ram Mohan Roy | Apr, 2022 | Medium

Dating the Surya Siddhanta | Dr. Raja Ram Mohan Roy | #SangamTalks - YouTube

Even after all these efforts and making sure that Prachyam knows about it, I expect Prachyam to claim that Ramayana happened in 12209 BCE and Surya Siddnanta was updated in 12000 BCE in their forthcoming films. Duping the gullible Hindus is a very good business and I am sad to see that even influential intellectuals have fallen for the intellectually dishonest claims.

Best regards,

Raja

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[Subrahmanyam Korada]

नमो विद्वद्भ्यः

होरा -- अहोरात्रम् --- विद् राजा राय् -- श्रीकान्त जमदग्निः

वेदे  ( कृष्णयजुर्वेदः - काठकाः - संज्ञानम् - 39 ) --

यो ह  वा अहोरात्राणां नामधेयानि वेद । नाहोरात्रेष्वार्तिमार्छति । संज्ञानं विज्ञानं दर्शा दृष्टेति । एतावनुवाकौ पूर्वपक्षस्याहोरात्राणां नामधेयानि । प्रस्तुतं विष्टुतग्ं सुता सुन्वतीति । एतावनुवाकावपरपक्षस्याहोरात्राणां नामधेयानि । नाहोरात्रेष्वार्तिमार्छति । य एवं वेद ।

व्याकरणे --

अहस्सर्वैकदेशसंख्यातपुण्याच्च रात्रेः (पा 5-4-87) -- रात्रिशब्दात् अच् समासान्तः । अहर्ग्रहणं द्वन्द्वार्थम् (वा) - अहश्च रात्रिश्च अहोरात्रः \

होरा -- ज्योतिश्शास्त्रम् -- बृहज्जातकम् ( वराहमिहिराचार्यः ) ,1-3 --

होरेत्यहोरात्रविकल्पमेके वाञ्छन्ति  पूर्वापरवर्णलोपात् ।

कर्मार्जितं पूर्वभवे सदादि यत्तस्य पक्तिं समभिव्यनक्ति ॥ ( पक्तिः -- ’ स्त्रियां क्तिन् ’3-3-94 , भावे - पाक इत्यर्थः -- पूर्वकर्मफलं जातकचक्रसजयेन ज्ञायते इत्यर्थः ) ।

(अ)होरा(त्रः) -- एके मुख्यान्यकेवलाः- अमरः । मुख्याः , अर्थात् मिहिराचार्यस्य इदमिष्टम् । पृषोदरादित्वात् साधुः ।

वाक्यपदीयम् , वाक्यकाण्डः , 38 --

उपादायापि ये हेयाः तानुपायान् प्रचक्षते ।

उपयानां च नियमः नावश्यमवतिष्ठते ।

महाभाष्यम् - तव्यत्तव्यानीयरः (पा 3-1-96) --

वास्तव्यः - कृदन्तः तद्धितान्तो वा । कैयटेन अयं श्लोकः उद्धृतः ।

उद्योते नागेशः -- उपादयापि ये हेया इति। उपायशब्दव्युत्पत्तिः । पृषोदरादित्वात् साधुः । --- उपा(दाय हे)यः -- उपायः । 

We take a boat to cross a river and after crossing we leave the boat behind -- boat is an उपाय । व्याकरणप्रक्रिया  is also like that -- we offer some प्रक्रिया - 

it may differ from from वैयाकरण  to वैयाकरण । शब्द is नित्य ।

होरा स्त्रीलिङ्गशब्दः ( होता इत्यपि स्त्रीलिङ्गशब्दः) --

झल्लरी चर्चरी पारी होरा लट्वा च सिध्मला -- अमरः , लिङ्गादिसङ्ग्रहवर्गः ,स्त्रीलिङ्गशेषः ।

होरा तु लग्ने राश्यर्धे रेखाशास्रभिदोरपि -- मेदिनीकोशः ।

होलति , हुल्यते वा -- हुल हिंसासंवरणयोः - भ्वादिः । पचाद्यच् घ‘ज् वा ।

राशीनामुदयो लग्नम् - इति ज्योतिश्शस्त्रम् ।

धन्यो’स्मि

Dr.Korada Subrahmanyam
Professor of Sanskrit (Retd)

299 Doyen , Serilingampally, Hyderabad 500 019
Ph:09866110741

Skype Id: Subrahmanyam Korada

Blog: Koradeeyam.blogspot.in 

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[Raja Roy]

Dhanyavada Prof. Korada. From the verse by Varahamihira, hora will be the same as one day and night. Still, not clear how it came to denote an hour.

Raja

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[Subrahmanyam Korada]

नमो विद्वद्भ्यः

होरा ---

Still, not clear how it came to denote an hour

                                                                        --- Vid Raja Roy

It is a sorry state of affairs when you cannot argue with शास्त्रप्रामाण्यम् , especially with today's certain जाति of so called scholars , who are not trained in

पदवाक्यप्रमाणशास्त्रs (व्याकरणम् , पूर्वमीमांसा , न्यायवैशॆषिके ) but go on writing something that comes to their mind .

You (=x) cannot argue with people who do not know the derivation of a शब्द - its अर्थ and ज्ञानम् ।  

They take any  शब्द and assign any अर्थ without quoting any प्रमाणम् from the above शास्त्रs or कोश  -- the term 'आत्मा ' denotes a particular God - why not another 

God ? What is the विनिगमकम् ( एकपक्षसाधकयुक्ति) ।

 At times they change the text in a way that is suitable to their concept or सिद्धान्त ।  Such a tradition started long ago.

वाद can be there between equals not otherwise . 

More वैतण्डिकाः than वादिनः ।

 It is a waste of time .

I have बृहज्जातकम् (of वराहमिहिराचार्य) before me - there are two commentaries - the Sanskrit one by भट्टोत्पल and the Hindi one by केदारदत्त जोशी ।

भट्टोत्पल is a good scholar in व्याकरणम् (महाभाष्यम्) etc.

होरेत्यहोरात्रविकल्पमेके वाञ्छन्ति  पूर्वापरवर्णलोपात् । बृह. 3 -- अ ( होरा ) त्रः । -- I quoted Panini earlier .

भट्टो.व्याख्या --

किमर्थं पुनः अहोरात्रशब्दात् होराशब्दो व्युत्पाद्यते इति । अत्रोच्यते । मेषादयो द्वादश लग्नराशयः अहोरात्रान्तर्भूताः लग्नस्य च कालवशात् ज्ञानं लग्नवशात् शुभाशुभज्ञानम् । अतः अहोरात्राश्रयत्वात्

तत एव होराशब्दो व्युत्पाद्यते । एतदेव आचार्यस्य अभिप्रेतम् । यतः परमतम् अप्रतिषिद्धम् अनुमतमिति (this is there in उत्तरतन्त्रम् of सुश्रुतसंहिता) । 

तथा च सारावळ्याम् - 

आद्यन्तवर्णलोपात् होरास्माकं भवत्यहोरात्रात् । 

तत्प्रतिषिद्धः सर्वो ग्रहभगणश्चिन्त्यते यस्मात् ।

केदारदत्त जोशी while endorsing भट्टोत्पल’s commentary adds his own too --

...मेषादिक १२ राशियों में प्रत्येक राशि को आधी = अर्ध सीमा का नाम होरा कह जाने से एक राशि में २ होरा होने से १२ राशियों में  १२ x २ =२४ होरा सिद्ध होती हैं । ’ राशेरर्धं होरा ’ ज्यौतिष फलित में प्रसिद्ध है ।

...आधुनिक निर्मित यन्त्र , या घण्टा मिनिट सेकण्ड सूचक घटी यन्त्र का १ घण्टा का मान होरा या अवर=hour कहा गया है ।

The above statement of केदारदत्त जोशी cannot be taken as प्रमाणम् for obvious reasons -- no शास्त्रम् , no निघण्टु  is quoted .

People follow blindly --

गतानुगतिको लोकः न लोकः पारमार्थिकः ।

गङ्गासैकतलिङ्गेन नष्टं ताम्रभाजनम् ॥   

   

--- परमार्थः प्रयोजनम् अस्य पारमार्थिकः -- ठञ्  ’ प्रयोजनम् ’  पा सू  5-1-108 , ’ ठस्येकः ’ पा  7-3-50 , ' किति च ’ पा 7-2-118 आदिवृद्धिः ,’ ञ्नित्यादिर्नित्यम् ’ पा 6-1-191 आद्युदात्तस्वरः ।

Bonus Info --

वराहमिहिराचार्य  declares that the वैयाकरणाः , नैयायिकाः , मीमांसकाः ,वेदान्तिनः etc  failed in their endeavor in mastering  ज्योतिषम् / होरातन्त्रम् and this बृहज्जातकम् is meant for them  ( we do not come across any serious discussion related to ज्योतिषम् in the works on the above शास्त्रs ) --

भूयोभिः पटुबुद्धिभिः पटुधियां होराफलज्ञप्तये

शब्दन्ययसमन्वितेषु  बहुशः शास्त्रेषु दृष्टेष्वपि ।

होरातन्त्रमहार्णवप्रतरणे भग्नोद्यमानामिदं

स्वल्पं वृत्तविचित्रमर्थबहुळं शास्त्रप्लवं प्रारभे ॥ बृह. 3  (ज्ञप्तिः ज्ञानम् इति प्रौढमनोरमा )

I do not know whether any पौराणिक raked up the question - why सीता was in लंका and answered - the answer is provided by वाल्मीकी  ।

Panini earmarked fifty or so सूत्रs for ज्योतिषम् । He clearly says - people are running to ज्यौतिषिकs /  सिद्धान्तिs  with horoscopes .

ज्योतिषं नेत्रमुच्यते( वेदपुरुषस्य इति शेषः ) - इति शिक्षा । ’ ज्योतिषामयनं चक्षुः ’ - पाणिनीयशिक्षा ।

I have studied hundreds of जातकचक्रs / जन्मकुण्डलीs between 1974 and 1994 .Study involves offering predictions .

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[Damodara Dasa]

|| Hare Krishna ||

Respected Subrahmanyam ji,

Thank you for these nice references. I got to learn some important things.

However, I was unable to understand one thing from this reply
--did you mean here that the word "Hora" doesn't actually denote 1
hour in traditional terminology but it has been done so nowadays? Or
misunderstood your point.

Or, if it did denote 1 hour (2.5 ghatikas) in traditional times then
you must be having some reference to this measurement of hora in
traditional Sanskrit texts.

Thank you,
Hari Guru Vaisnava das,
damodara das

On 6/16/22, Subrahmanyam Korada <kora...@gmail.com> wrote:
> नमो विद्वद्भ्यः
>

> होरा ---
> Still, not clear how it came to denote an hour
> ---
> Vid Raja Roy
>
> It is a sorry state of affairs when you cannot argue with
> शास्त्रप्रामाण्यम् , especially with today's certain जाति of so called
> scholars , who are not trained in

> *पदवाक्यप्रमाणशास्त्रs (व्याकरणम् , पूर्वमीमांसा , न्यायवैशॆषिके ) *but go

> on writing something that comes to their mind .
> You (=x) cannot argue with people who do not know the derivation of a शब्द
> - its अर्थ and ज्ञानम् ।
> They take any शब्द and assign any अर्थ without quoting any प्रमाणम् from
> the above शास्त्रs or कोश -- the term 'आत्मा ' denotes a particular God -
> why not another
> God ? What is the विनिगमकम् ( एकपक्षसाधकयुक्ति) ।
> At times they change the text in a way that is suitable to their concept
> or सिद्धान्त । Such a tradition started long ago.
> वाद can be there between equals not otherwise .
> More वैतण्डिकाः than वादिनः ।
> It is a waste of time .
>

> I have *बृहज्जातकम् (of वराहमिहिराचार्य)* before me - there are two

> commentaries - the Sanskrit one by भट्टोत्पल and the Hindi one by केदारदत्त
> जोशी ।
>

> भट्टोत्पल is a good scholar in *व्याकरणम् (महाभाष्यम्)* etc.
>
> होरेत्यहोरात्रविकल्पमेके वाञ्छन्ति पूर्वापरवर्णलोपात् । *बृह. 3 -- अ (
> होरा ) त्रः* । -- I quoted Panini earlier .
>
> *भट्टो.व्याख्या* --

> किमर्थं पुनः अहोरात्रशब्दात् होराशब्दो व्युत्पाद्यते इति । अत्रोच्यते ।
> मेषादयो द्वादश लग्नराशयः अहोरात्रान्तर्भूताः लग्नस्य च कालवशात् ज्ञानं
> लग्नवशात् शुभाशुभज्ञानम् । अतः अहोरात्राश्रयत्वात्
> तत एव होराशब्दो व्युत्पाद्यते । एतदेव आचार्यस्य अभिप्रेतम् । यतः परमतम्

> अप्रतिषिद्धम् अनुमतमिति (this is there in *उत्तरतन्त्रम् of सुश्रुतसंहिता*)
> ।
> तथा च *सारावळ्याम्* -

> आद्यन्तवर्णलोपात् होरास्माकं भवत्यहोरात्रात् ।
> तत्प्रतिषिद्धः सर्वो ग्रहभगणश्चिन्त्यते यस्मात् ।
>

> *केदारदत्त जोशी* while endorsing भट्टोत्पल’s commentary adds his own too --

>
> ...मेषादिक १२ राशियों में प्रत्येक राशि को आधी = अर्ध सीमा का नाम होरा कह
> जाने से एक राशि में २ होरा होने से १२ राशियों में १२ x २ =२४ होरा सिद्ध
> होती हैं । ’ राशेरर्धं होरा ’ ज्यौतिष फलित में प्रसिद्ध है ।

> ...*आधुनिक निर्मित यन्त्र , या घण्टा मिनिट सेकण्ड सूचक घटी यन्त्र का १
> घण्टा का मान होरा या अवर=hour कहा गया है* ।
>
> *The above statement of केदारदत्त जोशी cannot be taken as प्रमाणम् for
> obvious reasons -- no शास्त्रम् , no निघण्टु is quoted .*

>
> People follow blindly --
>
> गतानुगतिको लोकः न लोकः पारमार्थिकः ।
> गङ्गासैकतलिङ्गेन नष्टं ताम्रभाजनम् ॥
>

> --- परमार्थः प्रयोजनम् अस्य पारमार्थिकः -- *ठञ् ’ प्रयोजनम् ’ पा सू

> 5-1-108 , ’ ठस्येकः ’ पा 7-3-50 , ' किति च ’ पा 7-2-118 आदिवृद्धिः ,’

> ञ्नित्यादिर्नित्यम् ’ पा 6-1-191 आद्युदात्तस्वरः* ।
>
> Bonus Info --
>
> *वराहमिहिराचार्य * declares that the *वैयाकरणाः , नैयायिकाः , मीमांसकाः
> ,वेदान्तिनः etc* failed in their endeavor in mastering *ज्योतिषम् /
> होरातन्त्रम्* and this बृहज्जातकम् is meant for them ( we do not come

> across any serious discussion related to ज्योतिषम् in the works on the
> above शास्त्रs ) --
>
> भूयोभिः पटुबुद्धिभिः पटुधियां होराफलज्ञप्तये
> शब्दन्ययसमन्वितेषु बहुशः शास्त्रेषु दृष्टेष्वपि ।
> होरातन्त्रमहार्णवप्रतरणे भग्नोद्यमानामिदं
> स्वल्पं वृत्तविचित्रमर्थबहुळं शास्त्रप्लवं प्रारभे ॥ बृह. 3 (ज्ञप्तिः

> ज्ञानम् इति *प्रौढमनोरमा* )
>
> I do not know whether any पौराणिक raked up the question - *why सीता was in
> लंका* and answered - the answer is provided by वाल्मीकी ।

>
> Panini earmarked fifty or so सूत्रs for ज्योतिषम् । He clearly says -
> people are running to ज्यौतिषिकs / सिद्धान्तिs with horoscopes .
>

> ज्योतिषं नेत्रमुच्यते( *वेदपुरुषस्य इति शेषः* ) - इति *शिक्षा* । ’
> ज्योतिषामयनं चक्षुः ’ - *पाणिनीयशिक्षा* ।

>
> I have studied hundreds of जातकचक्रs / जन्मकुण्डलीs between 1974 and 1994
> .Study involves offering predictions .
>
> धन्यो’स्मि
>
> Dr.Korada Subrahmanyam
> Professor of Sanskrit (Retd)
> 299 Doyen , Serilingampally, Hyderabad 500 019
> Ph:09866110741

> *Skype Id: Subrahmanyam Korada*
> *Blog: Koradeeyam.blogspot.in <http://Koradeeyam.blogspot.in> *

>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 8, 2022 at 6:38 PM Raja Roy <rajarammo...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Dhanyavada Prof. Korada. From the verse by Varahamihira, hora will be the
>> same as one day and night. Still, not clear how it came to denote an
>> hour.
>> Raja
>>
>> On Mon, Jun 6, 2022 at 7:56 AM Subrahmanyam Korada <kora...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> नमो विद्वद्भ्यः
>>>
>>> होरा -- अहोरात्रम् --- विद् राजा राय् -- श्रीकान्त जमदग्निः
>>>

>>> *वेदे ( कृष्णयजुर्वेदः - काठकाः - संज्ञानम् - 39 )* --

>>>
>>> यो ह वा अहोरात्राणां नामधेयानि वेद । नाहोरात्रेष्वार्तिमार्छति ।
>>> संज्ञानं विज्ञानं दर्शा दृष्टेति । एतावनुवाकौ पूर्वपक्षस्याहोरात्राणां
>>> नामधेयानि । प्रस्तुतं विष्टुतग्ं सुता सुन्वतीति ।
>>> एतावनुवाकावपरपक्षस्याहोरात्राणां नामधेयानि । नाहोरात्रेष्वार्तिमार्छति ।
>>> य
>>> एवं वेद ।
>>>

>>> *व्याकरणे* --

>>>
>>> अहस्सर्वैकदेशसंख्यातपुण्याच्च रात्रेः (पा 5-4-87) -- रात्रिशब्दात् अच्
>>> समासान्तः । अहर्ग्रहणं द्वन्द्वार्थम् (वा) - अहश्च रात्रिश्च अहोरात्रः \
>>>

>>> *होरा -- ज्योतिश्शास्त्रम् -- बृहज्जातकम् ( वराहमिहिराचार्यः ) ,1-3* --

>>>
>>> होरेत्यहोरात्रविकल्पमेके वाञ्छन्ति पूर्वापरवर्णलोपात् ।

>>> कर्मार्जितं पूर्वभवे सदादि यत्तस्य पक्तिं समभिव्यनक्ति ॥ ( पक्तिः -- *’
>>> स्त्रियां क्तिन् ’*3-3-94 , भावे - पाक इत्यर्थः -- पूर्वकर्मफलं

>>> जातकचक्रसजयेन ज्ञायते इत्यर्थः ) ।
>>>

>>> *(अ)होरा(त्रः)* -- एके मुख्यान्यकेवलाः- *अमरः* । मुख्याः , अर्थात्

>>> मिहिराचार्यस्य इदमिष्टम् । पृषोदरादित्वात् साधुः ।
>>>

>>> *वाक्यपदीयम् , वाक्यकाण्डः , 38* --

>>>
>>> उपादायापि ये हेयाः तानुपायान् प्रचक्षते ।
>>> उपयानां च नियमः नावश्यमवतिष्ठते ।
>>>

>>> *महाभाष्यम् - तव्यत्तव्यानीयरः (पा 3-1-96)* --
>>> वास्तव्यः - कृदन्तः तद्धितान्तो वा ।* कैयटेन *अयं श्लोकः उद्धृतः ।
>>> *उद्योते नागेशः* -- उपादयापि ये हेया इति। उपायशब्दव्युत्पत्तिः ।
>>> पृषोदरादित्वात् साधुः । --- *उपा(दाय हे)यः -- उपायः* ।

>>> We take a boat to cross a river and after crossing we leave the boat
>>> behind -- boat is an उपाय । व्याकरणप्रक्रिया is also like that -- we
>>> offer
>>> some प्रक्रिया -
>>> it may differ from from वैयाकरण to वैयाकरण । शब्द is नित्य ।
>>>

>>> *होरा स्त्रीलिङ्गशब्दः ( होता इत्यपि स्त्रीलिङ्गशब्दः)* --
>>>
>>> झल्लरी चर्चरी पारी होरा लट्वा च सिध्मला -- *अमरः , लिङ्गादिसङ्ग्रहवर्गः
>>> ,स्त्रीलिङ्गशेषः* ।
>>>
>>> होरा तु लग्ने राश्यर्धे रेखाशास्रभिदोरपि -- *मेदिनीकोशः* ।

>>>
>>> होलति , हुल्यते वा -- हुल हिंसासंवरणयोः - भ्वादिः । पचाद्यच् घ‘ज् वा ।
>>>

>>> राशीनामुदयो लग्नम् - इति *ज्योतिश्शस्त्रम्* ।

>>>
>>> धन्यो’स्मि
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Dr.Korada Subrahmanyam
>>> Professor of Sanskrit (Retd)
>>> 299 Doyen , Serilingampally, Hyderabad 500 019
>>> Ph:09866110741

>>> *Skype Id: Subrahmanyam Korada*
>>> *Blog: Koradeeyam.blogspot.in <http://Koradeeyam.blogspot.in> *

>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, May 17, 2022 at 4:49 PM 'Shrikant Jamadagni' via
>>> भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत् <bvpar...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>>>

>>>> Sanskrit *horaa* is not from *ahoratra*
>>>>
>>>> Apte, Vachaspatyam etc give derivation as *hu + ran*

>>>>
>>>> Besides it has other meanings than hour.
>>>>
>>>> होरा [Printed book page 1177-a

>>>> <https://www.sanskrit-lexicon.uni-koeln.de/scans/csl-apidev/servepdf.php?dict=AP90&page=1177-a>
>>>> ]
>>>> होरा [हु-रन्]
>>>> *1* The rising of a zodiacal sign.
>>>> *2* Part of the duration of a sign.
>>>> *3* An hour.
>>>> *4* A mark, line.

>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Shrikant Jamadagni
>>>> Bengaluru
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tuesday, 17 May, 2022, 04:35:45 pm IST, Raja Roy <
>>>> rajarammo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dear learned scholars,
>>>> I have seen it mentioned in many books and articles that hora is
>>>> derived
>>>> from Ahoratra. But how do the first and last letters get dropped?
>>>> Besides,
>>>> ahoratra is one day and night, while hora is an hour. Some articles
>>>> mention
>>>> that Varahamihira has said so. Does anyone have an exact reference for
>>>> that? I would like to hear from Sanskrit experts whether such a
>>>> derivation
>>>> is feasible.
>>>> Best regards,
>>>> Raja
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
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>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/CAJSSQ5tU6aj-AgQy4XyrF0UXeWqeOJ7PhVNFDYPSqw%3DWTAZv%3Dg%40mail.gmail.com

>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/CAJSSQ5tU6aj-AgQy4XyrF0UXeWqeOJ7PhVNFDYPSqw%3DWTAZv%3Dg%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>>>> .

>>>>
>>>> --
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>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
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>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit

>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/698902043.1301776.1652786352787%40mail.yahoo.com
>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/698902043.1301776.1652786352787%40mail.yahoo.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>>>> .

>>>>
>>> --
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>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
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>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/CAKj2ELR_qUmKabNT49QXWjzMo7zXkrC7i%2BNW7mHJePFWGDz%3DbQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>>> .

>>>
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/CAJSSQ5s60tno8eQt6a98jLm%2BRtpaW6OaL%2B9B_Rh2LHZwBsQPtw%40mail.gmail.com
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/CAJSSQ5s60tno8eQt6a98jLm%2BRtpaW6OaL%2B9B_Rh2LHZwBsQPtw%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>> .

>>
>
> --
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>

[BVK Sastry (G-S-Pop)]

Namaste

 

1.  Prof. Korada has rightly pointed to a significant issue in ‘Samskruth to Hindi’ – Concept-Trans-mapping Error’ flowing down to ‘ English translation’  and ‘Anglicized Astrology’  practice.

< The above statement of केदारदत्त जोशी cannot be taken as प्रमाणम् for obvious reasons -- no शास्त्रम् , no निघण्टु  is quoted .  >

 

2. To understand the Technicality of ‘ Hora’ in practice, one may explore the link below. This is from practitioner of traditional vedanga jyotisha as well as ‘software designer’:

 

Parasara's Hora Chart Decoded | FREE Modern Astrology Lessons (indianastrologysoftware.com) –

https://blog.indianastrologysoftware.com/parasaras-hora-chart-decoded/

 

The link invokes ‘Parashara’ : suryendvorvisame rasu same tadviparltakam I pitarascandrahoresa devah suryasya klrtitah I raserardham bhaveddhora tascaturvimsatih smrtah I mesadi tasarh horanam parivrttidvayam bhavet I

Meaning, Lords of Horas are the Sun and the Moon in odd signs and the reverse holds good in even signs. The deities corresponding to the lunar and solar Horas are pitris (ancestral manes) and the gods. Half of a sign is a Hora. There are 24 of those remembered. Starting from Aries, two cycles of Zodiac occur with those 24 Horas.  

 

3. Regards Many times, quoting a 'traditional text and view' is not enough to satisfy the person making the query.

Read more on what ' Hour' in Western /European/ UK astrology means.   [  https://www.lunarium.co.uk/articles/planetary-hours/ ] .  https://llewellyn.com/journal/article/2868

At the first glance, the planetary hours are similar to the ordinary hours which all of us are used to. A planetary day consists of 24 planetary hours, and an ordinary day consists of 24 hours. But here similarity ends.

A planetary day begins at the moment of sunrise in the given place, while ordinary day begins at midnight. Since the moment of sunrise is generally different for different places, every place on the Earth has its own planetary day, while ordinary day is the same for all the places in the same time zone.

When centuries ago Gregorian calendar was adopted in many countries of Europe, special care was taken to ensure that the sequence of the days of the week, and the sequence of their planetary rulers, remained unaltered. So it can be said that this sequence comes to us from time immemorial. This sequence of the planetary rulers of the days of the week follows the beams of the seven-point star, or heptagram, also known as the Star of the Magi:  The sequence is well known to traditional astrologers: arka-shukro-budhah -soumyo-mando -jivo-dharasutrah'.

Ordinary hours always have the same continuity (60 minutes), while the length of planetary hours varies around the year, and a day hour is usually not equal to a night hour (these are equal to each other, as also to ordinary hour, only twice a year — at the Vernal Equinox, around the 21st of March, and at the Autumnal Equinox, around the 22nd of September). Planetary hours depend on the date and the location. Let the date be the 28th of June and the location — Glasgow, UK. Figures will be different for other places and dates.

In the contemporary astrology planetary days and hours were almost forgotten, and only in Horary Astrology and Elections they are still being used by some practitioners. But in the other Esoteric Arts like Magic and Alchemy, as also in Herbalism, to know the appropriate day and hour can be of crucial importance. Famous British astrologer and herbologist Nicholas Culpeper advised to collect herbs in the appropriate planetary hour, corresponding to the planetary ruler of the herb. This is because the energy of the ruling planet is stronger in its hour, so the healing properties of the collected herb will be stronger too.

Mark Stavish, the author of the wonderful book "The Path of Alchemy" writes that "planetary hours are a critical part of natural magic and alchemy" and throughout the book instructs the reader to do every operation in its appropriate day and hour, to be able to concentrate the subtle energy of the desired planet.

 

Likewise in all schools of Magic planetary hours and days are by all means taken into account when making talismans or performing a ritual. For example, a Sun talisman will be necessarily made on the day and hour of the Sun.

 

You can also use this ancient knowledge when planning something important in your life. The main rule is quite simple: the planet that rules the day and the hour promotes those activities which are in tune with its principle and can impede those activities which are of the opposite nature.

 

Regards

BVK Sastry

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[Subrahmanyam Korada]

नमो विद्वद्भ्यः

There is a correction in प्रक्रिया  of  'पारमर्थिक’ -- the आदिवृद्धि  is by तद्धितेष्वचामादेः पा 7-2-117 (not by किति च ) ।

Vid Damodara Dasa --

1.did you mean here that the word "Hora" doesn't actually denote 1

hour in traditional terminology but it has been done so nowadays? Or
misunderstood your point.

-- no , your understanding is right .

2.Or, if it did denote 1 hour (2.5 ghatikas) in traditional times then

you must be having some reference to this measurement of hora in
traditional Sanskrit texts.

-- the concept of 'hour' ( 60 minutes ) was / is not there in traditional Sanskrit texts . It is introduced by Westerners - and once 

people got accustomed to पाश्चात्यविद्द्या (संप्रदाय) they forgot घटिकाः - विघटिकाः etc . Only those who are in touch with ज्योतिषम्

do understand the ancient calculation .

 सिद्धान्तिs have to deal with both methods -- so in पञ्चाङ्गम् they give both -- घटिक-विघटिकाः and घण्टा-निमेषाः ।

In लग्नपत्रिका for विवाह / उपनयन  we give both -- recently a Sanskrit - lover from  US asked me to provide the Sanskrit version of 

an उपनयनलग्नपत्रिका ।

The scholar , who prepared the लग्नपत्रिका ,  mentioned  as - मुहूर्तः घटिकाः 7 विघटिकाः 37 -- this is not appropriate - it is actually

hours and minutes -- घटिका-विघटिकाः are noted in Sanskrit numerals  and  घण्टा-निमेषाः in Arabic numerals . 

Slowly people are forgetting our heritage  -- अनभ्यासे विषं शास्त्रम् ।

2.5 घटिकाः = 1 hour (per day 60 घटिकाः -- 24x2.5 -- 24 hours) .

2.5 विघटिकाः = 1 minute 

Hope explained at a satisfactory level - feel free .

धन्यो’स्मि

Dr.Korada Subrahmanyam
Professor of Sanskrit (Retd)

299 Doyen , Serilingampally, Hyderabad 500 019
Ph:09866110741

Skype Id: Subrahmanyam Korada

Blog: Koradeeyam.blogspot.in 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/CABr-jZDwe6dMF8CXgU7LYS89J%2BTNKg3XnAdAS%2Baf4apHH2E%3DbA%40mail.gmail.com.

[Subrahmanyam Korada]

नमो विद्वद्भ्यः

Namaste Sastrigaru

Good information - not known to the present generation .

Even in Ayurveda (Caraka and Susruta) it is clearly mentioned that the  herbs etc. grown up in certain season (ऋतु) only would contain the गुणs described .

The पदार्थs are put under two (or three) headings -- hot and cool , following the impact of  सूर्य and चन्द्र ।

Even today many common people think that a person with Sanskrit knowledge knows how to fix a मुहूर्त । 

As I have already discussed in 2010 - 2011 , the three systems , viz  ज्योतिषम् , आयुर्वेद  and  वेदान्त  are connected with each other . And they are useful for common people.

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