Best possible view on Ramayana and Mahabharata dating

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Ravi Kumar

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Jul 6, 2018, 7:39:17 AM7/6/18
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Hari Om

There is a lot of confusion and variation regarding the scientific dating of the Ramayana and Mahabharata. The dates arrived at by researchers often vary widely wrt one another.

We all are aware, no doubt, that in the absence of archaeological data any dating is majorly an exercise in conjecture, but internal evidence and tradition also cannot be disregarded.

With this in mind, could the learned members here direct us to the best possible dates of the Ramayana and the Mahabharata? 

Thank you
RK

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 8, 2018, 10:51:40 AM7/8/18
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Nagaraj Paturi
 
Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.


BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra

BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies
 
FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,
 
(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )
 
 
 

Dr.C.S.R. Prabhu

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Jul 8, 2018, 12:00:47 PM7/8/18
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In contrast with Link 2,the standard time period is 3102 BC for Mahabharata war.It is supposed to be based in internal astronomical evidence.Howeverr Nilesh Oak maintains much earlier date of  around 6000BC for Mahabharata war.

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Ravi Kumar

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Jul 9, 2018, 1:02:14 AM7/9/18
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Thank you Sri Paturi. Could you give some guidance on the astronomical dating of the Ramayana too, if it is not inconvenient?

rgds/RK 


On Sunday, 8 July 2018 20:21:40 UTC+5:30, Nagaraj Paturi wrote:
On Fri, Jul 6, 2018 at 4:09 PM, Ravi Kumar <pranayam...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hari Om

There is a lot of confusion and variation regarding the scientific dating of the Ramayana and Mahabharata. The dates arrived at by researchers often vary widely wrt one another.

We all are aware, no doubt, that in the absence of archaeological data any dating is majorly an exercise in conjecture, but internal evidence and tradition also cannot be disregarded.

With this in mind, could the learned members here direct us to the best possible dates of the Ramayana and the Mahabharata? 

Thank you
RK

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Ravi Kumar

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Jul 9, 2018, 1:02:14 AM7/9/18
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Sri CSR Prabhu, if not inconvenient, could you give us any link/reference to the studies you mention pls.

The date arrived at by the study under discussion is 1504 BC after cross-referencing of internal astronomical data in the text. How do the dates 6000 BC and 3102 BC compare with the date 1504 BC in terms of internal textual consistency? Would appreciate your views.

rgds/RK

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 10, 2018, 1:56:26 AM7/10/18
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>  Could you give some guidance on the astronomical dating of the Ramayana too, if it is not inconvenient?


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Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 10, 2018, 1:59:29 AM7/10/18
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Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 23, 2018, 11:37:06 PM7/23/18
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Nilesh-ji shared the following videos on another list:

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 24, 2018, 3:04:01 PM7/24/18
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Sri  Jijith Nadumuri Ravi -ji posted on another list as follows:

It is long time i thought of writing down my experience creating the online portal Ancientvoice 8 years ago. Finally i could write it down as part of a talk and paper submission done for the recently concluded International Conference in Bangalore organized by Dr SR Rao foundation focusing on the growth of Indic culture from pre historic to medieval era.

Thanks Nitin ji for publishing in IndiaFacts.

Article:

Website:

Abstract:
AncientVoice is an online portal containing 23,000 plus wikified pages on Mahābhārata, Rāmāyana, Ṛgveda, Yajurveda (both Kṛṣna and Sukla recensions), Sāmaveda, Atharvaveda and Vishnu Purāna. Currently in English, but the Samskṛt version is being developed. It uses a Wikipedia style format, with millions of hyperlinks forming a network of nouns, making the cross-referencing very easy. One may start out with the noun Ayodhya in the Mahābhārata to be lead to every other references to Ayodhya in the Mahābhārata, in the 18 Parvās and 2000 plus chapters. The search can be extended to Rāmāyana, to find the references of Ayodhya in each of the 7 Kāndās and 600 plus chapters or into the Vedas or Purānas, leading to comparative analysis. It also aids in studying noun to noun relationship, such as starting with noun Arjuna leading to nouns of his wives or children. It has a database of nouns categorized into place-names (villages, cities, towns, kingdoms etc), names of kings, women, heroes, ascetics, Samskṛt non-translatables like Akṣauhini, Anīkini, Vyūha, Ṛta, Dharma, Manas, Chitta etc. The portal also hosts lineage trees of dynasties, analysis of the Yuga system, Kālachakra. It contains many art works and illustrations depicting heroes and heroines of Mahābhārata.

Regards 

harindranath

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Jul 24, 2018, 11:49:25 PM7/24/18
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Since we are on the subject of dating Ramayana and Mahabharata, I am interested to know the opinion of the 
members of this group on a book published almost a century ago from Kerala.

Title: The Permanent History of Bharata Varsha
Author: K. Narayana Aiyer
In two parts
self-published by the author in 1918. The author was the Superintendent of the School of Arts of the Maharaja of Travancore. Note the apparent contradiction in the title, which was intentional.
Available at Google books.
The first part and a portion of the second part were reprinted  by Cosmo Publications in 2001 in two volumes with (India) added in the title which totally contradicts the views expressed in the book. The author's name and "permanent"  were also misspelled. Cosmo Publications also failed to give the earlier publication history of the book.

The missing portion of the book was available at ASI site as a scanned pdf. 

The author's views are in conflict  with almost  all of modern scholarship.
Nevertheless I find the book extremely useful.


Best
Harindranath

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 25, 2018, 12:16:06 AM7/25/18
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There were similar books of the early 20th century.

Sri Kota Venkatachalam was one such author from Andhra Pradesh known all over India:


Pandit Kota Venkatachalam Pakayaji (1885-1959) known as a great Historian of yester years with his titles as ‘Bharata Charitra Bhaskara and vimarsakagresara’ is infact a versatile personality with diverse characteristics rarely seen in a single person. He was knowledgeable in Astrology, Astronomy and Geography. In order to appreciate the indepth study and research Sri Kota Venkatachalam has done with his thorough knowledge in the above subjects, one has to patiently go through his works like ‘Jamboo Dweepamu’, ‘Aryula Dhruva Nivasa Khandanamu’, ‘Brahmanda Srishti Viganamu’ etc., (Telugu) where in he profusely quotes our ancient Sastras, Rishis and Scholars right up to Bhaskaracharya.

His important historical publications include the following –
1. Ancient Hindu history Part I, 2. Ancient Hindu history Part II, 3. Chronology of Nepal History, reconstructed, 4. Chronology of Kashmir History reconstructed, 5. The plot in Indian Chronology 6. The Age of Budha, Milinda and Amtiyoka and Yuga Purana, 7. Indian Eras, 8. Historicity of Vikramaditya and Salivahana, 9. Age of  War (Printed after his Sidhi) and many other books in Telugu. He took Sanyasa and ascended Abhinava Virupaksha Peetham on 8-7-1957.

Pandit Kota Venkatachalam has infact got printed clearly 

a) Imperial Royal dynasties of Bharat after Mahabharat war ie. From 36 years before Kali or 3138 B.C. to 4295 Kali or 1193 A.D. (Vide Annexure – I attached to this article)

b)  Statement showing the contemporaneity of Kings with their reigning periods in 3 of the States of Bharat namely 1. Magadha. 2. Nepal, 3. Kashmir (Vide Annexure II enclosed)

c) . He finally records with satisfaction the important dates in the history of Bharat which he has proved sufficiently. (Vide Annexure-III).  

In his An appeal to the Young Indologists, Pandit Kota Venkatachalam states the following.

The history of India, particularly of the ancient period, as it is found in the Text books of schools and colleges and in the writings of research scholars of Indology, enquires through revision. European scholars, who attempted to construct our history, seriously erred in chronology.

1. The false assumption that the Aryans came from outside India and the wrong identification of Chandra-Gupta-Maurya of 1534 B.C. with another Chandra-Gupta, the contemporary of Alexander’s time (326 B.C.) led to several errors in chronology and other aspects of our history

2. The Puranas which are a storehouse of historical information were discredited as mere fiction. Several facts from the Puranas that do credit to our history and culture are entirely omitted in the historical writings of Europeans and their Indian followers.

 3. Some Indologists went to the length of interpolating in and otherwise tampering with the writings of ancient foreign visitors of India and with the Buddhist literature.

4. Many ancient inscriptions like the Kumbhalghar Inscription (V. S. 1517) were destroyed

5. The genuine Inscription of Janamejaya (Ind. Ant. Pp.333, 334) dated Kali 89 or 3012 B.C. has been rejected as being spurious. Several other important ancient inscriptions between 3138 B.C. and 300 B.C. were destroyed.

6. Some coins and Inscriptions have been misread, misinterpreted, misapplied and misrepresented and some are forged so as to be used for supporting the modern theories.

7. The Aihole inscription and others that establish correctly the date of the War (3138 B.C.) have been neglected.

8. Some important dates which are supposed to be Anchor Sheets of Ancient Indian chronology have been arbitrarily determined, with no regard for or reference to ancient literature.



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