Re: {भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत्} Rajesh Rao: A Rosetta Stone for the Indus script: Bharatkalyan97 (Updates, J une 30, 2011)

[gira...@juno.com]

July 4, 2011

 

Etymology of Sanskrit shabda "Meena" !

 

Dear Dr G.N.Jha,

 

Thanks for telling us about lecture of Rajesh Rao. Indus script is not easy subject.

 

By the way, what is the etymology of the shabda "Meena"  ( fish) assuming that it is Sanskrit word? Thanks. N.R.Joshi.

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Girish Nath Jha" <gir...@mail.jnu.ac.in>
To: <kumuda...@gmail.com>,<bvpar...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: <bsi...@umassd.edu>
Subject: Re: {भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत्} Rajesh Rao: A Rosetta Stone for the Indus script: Bharatkalyan97 (Updates, June 30, 2011)
Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2011 04:58:13 +0530

The presentation by Mr Rao is good entertainment.

He should understand that the excercise he has undertaken is a serious
one - probably much more than solving a crossword puzzle. And therefore
he may consider obtaining latest data and research in the area to get a
comprehensive understanding of the issues involved. In this context, I
would like to recommend a recent publication titled "Origin of Indian
Civilization" (DK Printword 2010) edited by Bal Ram Singh.

I am wondering what made Mr Rao cite Parpola whose expertise on Indian
languages is questionable when he traces the word 'meen' to Tamil. I am
sure all in this group would agree that 'meen' has a Sanskrit origin. I
think it is high time intrepretation of India is done little more
sensibly than what it has been done so far.



Dr. Girish Nath Jha
Associate Professor, Computational Linguistics
Special Center for Sanskrit Studies,
J.N.U., New Delhi - 110067
http://www.jnu.ac.in/faculty/gnjha   
http://sanskrit.jnu.ac.in  
ph.26741308 (o)

Mukesh and Priti Chatter Distinguished Professor of History of Science,
University of Massachusetts Dartmouth, USA
http://www.umassd.edu/indic/faculty.cfm
>>> kumuda rao 07/02/11 12:26 PM >>>
of course the speech is quite amazing and worth watching. Everyone must
watch it

Kumuda

2011/6/30 S. Kalyanaraman

>
> - Rajesh Rao: A Rosetta Stone for the Indus script |...
>
> Rajesh Rao is fascinated by "the mother of all crossword puzzles": How
to
> decipher the 4000 year old Indus script. At TED 2011 he tells how he
is
> enlisting modern computational techniques to read the Indus language,
the
> key piece to understanding this ancient civilization.
>
> kalyan
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> अथ चेत्त्वमिमं धर्म्यं संग्रामं न करिष्यसि।
> ततः स्वधर्मं कीर्तिं च हित्वा पापमवाप्स्यसि।।
> तस्मादुत्तिष्ठ कौन्तेय युद्धाय कृतनिश्चयः।
> निराशीर्निर्ममो भूत्वा युध्यस्व विगतज्वरः।। (भ.गी.)
>

--
अथ चेत्त्वमिमं धर्म्यं संग्रामं न करिष्यसि।
ततः स्वधर्मं कीर्तिं च हित्वा पापमवाप्स्यसि।।
तस्मादुत्तिष्ठ कौन्तेय युद्धाय कृनिश्चयः।
निराशीर्निर्ममो भूत्वा युध्यस्व विगतज्वरः।। (भ.गी.)

--
अथ चेत्त्वमिमं धर्म्यं संग्रामं न करिष्यसि।
ततः स्वधर्मं कीर्तिं च हित्वा पापमवाप्स्यसि।।
तस्मादुत्तिष्ठ कौन्तेय युद्धाय कृतनिश्चयः।
निराशीर्निर्ममो भूत्वा युध्यस्व विगतज्वरः।। (भ.गी.)

____________________________________________________________
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[narayanan er]

Respected scholars,
The term मीनः is in masculine gender from the root मीञ् हिंसायाम् with a suffix नक् supported by the Unadi rule 3.3 फेनमीनौ, and the derivation will be मीयते हिंस्यते इति मीनः।  Amarasimha gives a lexical support to this as मत्स्यः (1-10-17). Why it is in masculine gender ? The Panini Linganushasana says : नोपधः, the syllable न् as the penultimate one to the अ ending like इनः, फेनः etc.

The term also used to represent the last Rashi starting from Mesha ( अन्त्यभम् ). It says : मेषादिद्वादशराश्यन्तर्गतान्तिमराशिः। It includes the the last one (or three??) fourth of Purvabhaadrapadaa, Uttarabhaadrapadaa and Revati. Two female fish are appearing to represent the fundamental goddess of this Rashi. I doubt that is it the one fourth of Purvabhaadrapadaa or three fourth of Purvabhaadrapadaa??. I hope the astronomers will pardon me if my learning is wrong.

 

Regards,
Narayanan

---

From: "gira...@juno.com" <gira...@juno.com>
To: bvpar...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Mon, 4 July, 2011 10:52:47 PM
Subject: Re: {भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत्} Etymology of Sanskrit shabda "Meena" !

[navaratna rajaramnavaratna]

 

   Excellent! So much for Parpola's Dravidian thesis. I may mention it at the panel discussion on Aryan-dravidian issue at the Origins conference.

 

N.S. rajaram

2011/7/5 narayanan er <drerna...@yahoo.com>

[narayanan er]

Respected Scholars,
I would like to confirm on my previous posting with a doubt on the Mina Rashi, as is it the one fourth of Purvabhaadrapadaa but not the three fourth of it.
Secondly, the Purvabhaadrapadaa and the Uttarabhaadrapadaa will create a square in the sky, as they appear to be, called the bed/cot of Ravana, having a widened head side to locate his ten heads, and the western part is the Purvabhaadrapadaa and eastern is the other. This is the Bhaadrapadaa square. Sirrah and Aljenib makes the wider side of square on the west make the Purvabhaadrapadaa. Scheat and Markab on the east make the Uttarabhaadrapadaa.

 

Regards,
Narayanan

---

From: navaratna rajaramnavaratna <rajaramn...@gmail.com>
To: bvpar...@googlegroups.com; Girish Nath Jha <giri...@gmail.com>; bharatiyaexperts <bharatiyae...@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tue, 5 July, 2011 3:15:34 PM

[subrahmanyam korada]

namo vidvadbhya.h

MIna.h - Lin'gam

GangAyAm mInaghos.au sta.h -- Nagesa in Manjusa and in some Nyayagranthas (Laks.an.A ) .

Jyotis.am --

27 Naks.atras (Abhijit is not to be countedd here ) - each four legs - 27x4 = 108 PAdas

12 RAs'is - each RAs'i having 9 PAdas -- as'vinibharan.ikr.ttikApAdam mes.a.h etc. 12 x 9 = 108 PAdas

pUrvAbhAdrApAda.h uttarAbhAdrA revatyantam mIna.h  --- PUrvAbhAdrA 4 th PAda   +  UttarAbhAdra 4 PAdas + RevatI 4 PAdas - MIna.h

VyAkaran.am

'Lingam as'is.yam lokAs'rayatvAt  lingasya' - Linga is not to be prescribed by Panini as it depends upon the usage  by S'is.t.aloka .

Then  what about 'LingAnus'Asanam of Panini , 'ghan~ajabantA.h ' ( pumsi) etc. ?

 That is just 'diksUcanA' , not exhaustive . That'swhy NAmalingAnus'Asanam is required .

Under 'tyadAdIni ca' (Pan 1-1-74) Patanjali 's usage -- sambandham anuvartis.yate ( also in 6 th adhyAya) .

Sam + bandh + ghan~ = sambandha.h . How Napumsaka ?

Here is Kaiyata --  dvitIyAntam etat . sambandham anurotsyate  na hAsyati ityartha.h ( o hAk = tyAge) .athavA sambadhyate iti sambandham , karman.i ghan~ , napumsake'pi bAdhakAbhAvAt bhavati .

Nagesa's Udyota -- napumsake'pi iti , ghan~japA.h pumsi iti bhAvaghan~vis.ayakam , kvAcitkam vA iti bhAva.h .

Linga is widelydiscussed under 'sarUpAn.Am ekas'es.a ekavibhaktau " (Panini1-2-64

dhanyo'smi

Prof.Korada Subrahmanyam
Professor of Sanskrit,
CALTS,
University of Hyderabad 500046
Ph:09866110741(R),91-40-23010741,040-23133660(O)

[rniyengar]

Dear Dr.Narayanan,

Some time back we discussed Nakshatra names when you explained the
older names of P & U.Bhadrapadas. These were known as Proshthapada.
You gave valuable information:

प्रोष्ठपद the Sabdakalpadruma gives the following
details:
प्रोष्ठपदः। पुं०। (प्रोष्ठी गौस्तस्येव पादौ यस्य सः।
''सुप्रातसुश्वमुदिवेति।''
५। ४। १२०। इति अच् प्रत्ययेन साधुः। प्रोष्ठपदी
नक्षत्रविशेषस्तद्युक्ता
पौर्णमासी यत्र मासे। अण्। पक्षे न वृद्धिः।) भाद्रमासः। इत्यमरः॥
(नक्षत्रविशेषः।
यथा। महाभारते। ६। ३। १४। ''शुक्रः प्रोष्ठपदे पूर्बे समारुह्य
विरोचते॥'' यथा
च मार्कण्डेये। ३३। १५। ''अजाविकं प्रोष्ठपदे
विन्देद्धावांस्तथोत्तरे॥''
गोतुल्यपदयुक्ते। त्रि। इति व्याकरणम्॥)

NOw you have posted new interesting information that the four
Bhadrapada square is 'RavaNa's cot'
Please provide the reference for this also.

Thanks

RN Iyengar

On Jul 5, 3:32 pm, narayanan er <drernaraya...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Respected Scholars,
> I would like to confirm on my previous posting with a doubt on the Mina Rashi,
> as is it the one fourth of Purvabhaadrapadaa but not the three fourth of it.
> Secondly, the Purvabhaadrapadaa and the Uttarabhaadrapadaa will create a square
> in the sky, as they appear to be, called the bed/cot of Ravana, having a widened
> head side to locate his ten heads, and the western part is the Purvabhaadrapadaa
> and eastern is the other. This is the Bhaadrapadaa square. Sirrah and Aljenib
> makes the wider side of square on the west make the Purvabhaadrapadaa. Scheat
> and Markab on the east make the Uttarabhaadrapadaa.
>
>  Regards,
> Narayanan
>
> ________________________________
> F

> Respected scholars,
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >The term मीनः is in masculine gender from the root मीञ् हिंसायाम् with a suffix
> >नक् supported by the Unadi rule 3.3 फेनमीनौ, and the derivation will be मीयते
> >हिंस्यते इति मीनः।  Amarasimha gives a lexical support to this as मत्स्यः
> >(1-10-17). Why it is in masculine gender ? The Panini Linganushasana says :
> >नोपधः, the syllable न् as the penultimate one to the अ ending like इनः, फेनः
> >etc.
>
> >The term also used to represent the last Rashi starting from Mesha ( अन्त्यभम्
> >). It says : मेषादिद्वादशराश्यन्तर्गतान्तिमराशिः। It includes the the last one
> >(or three??) fourth of Purvabhaadrapadaa, Uttarabhaadrapadaa and Revati. Two
> >female fish are appearing to represent the fundamental goddess of this Rashi. I
> >doubt that is it the one fourth of Purvabhaadrapadaa or three fourth of
> >Purvabhaadrapadaa??. I hope the astronomers will pardon me if my learning is
> >wrong.
>
> > Regards,
> >Narayanan
>
> ________________________________

>  From: "girav...@juno.com" <girav...@juno.com>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

[narayanan er]

Respected Professor Iyengar,
Ravana's cot is only an imaginary statement on the basis of the appearance of an imaginary square. Naturally when one who is having ten heads, and for him to lay upon if a cot is necessary, then the head part should normally be widened. I got this idea from a Malayalam blog of which I put a link if you like to look at the pictures of P & U Bhaadrapadaa as square :
http://bahirakasam.blogspot.com/2011/01/blog-post_09.html
The blog post discusses about pegasus, the flying horse according to the Greek Mythology. The post also claims that Ptolemy also included pegasus in his list of 48 constellations. The blog was posted on Sunday, 9th January, 2011. But the blog post does not give any reference to any Ravana cot story, rather than the mentioning that Indians call it as Ravana cot. It also claims that pegasus could be visible by 8pm every day in India. It says that Indians call Bhaadrapadaa square for the combination of P & U Bhaadrapadaa. The confirmation on the Mina Rashi's elements of constellation was on the basis of a conversation between Narada and Pulastya in the Vamana Purana. It reads :
धनिष्ठार्द्धं शतभिषा प्रोष्टपदांशकत्रयम्।  सौरं पद्मापरमिदं कुम्भो जङ्घे च विश्रुते॥
प्रोष्ठपदांशमेकन्तु उत्तरा रेवती तथा।  द्वितीयं जीवसदनं मीनन्तु चरणावुभौ॥........................
इति श्रीवामनपुराणे पुलस्त्यनारदसंवादे हरललितः पञ्चमोऽध्यायः॥ (These are quoted from the Sabdakalpadruma under the word राशिः)
It is clear from the picture in the blog link that one side of the cot like figure is widened. Please see the link :
http://bahirakasam.blogspot.com/2011/01/blog-post_09.html

 

Regards,
Narayanan

---

From: rniyengar <narayana...@gmail.com>
To: भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत् <bvpar...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thu, 7 July, 2011 4:19:38 PM

Subject: Re: {भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत्} Etymology of Sanskrit shabda "Meena" !