sadhyaa vandanam

[Dr. Yadu Moharir]

Respected scholars,

Lot of things have been discussed pertaining to "surya namaskaara" and health benefits during "sadhyaa vandanam"

Can someone elaborate on why such tradition (sandhyaa vandanam) was introduced as a ritual in the first place by our ancestors ? (no need to repeat the health benefits already discussed).

Thanks in advance

Dr Yadu

[sadasivamurty rani]

I can take the opportunity of explaining a Kind of Smarta Sandhayavandana prevalent in Andhra Pradesh particularly in our family tradition of Apasthmabha Sutra of Krishna Yajurveda Sakha. 

The following are the usual components of it:

1. 24 Keshava Namas

2. Bhutocchatana Mantra

3. Sankalpa

4. Pranayama

5. Marjanam

6. Aghamarshana Mantras: 

       a. Pratas sandhya and Madhyahna Sandhya : Praying to the Sun to make free 

           the meditating person free from all the sins committed during the previous                      night and till the Noon

               

       b. Sayam Sandhya Praying to the Agni to make free the meditating person from  

            all the sins committed during the day.

7. 24 Keshava Namas

8. Marjanam

9. Salutations to the Sun considering him as the Parabrahma and 

      Tarpanam Nava grahas and the Goddesses Savitri, Gayatri and Sarsvati

10. 7. 24 Keshava Namas

11. Gayatrhi Avahanam to be seated in the heart of the worshiper  

12. Again Pranayama 

13. Karnanyasa, Anga Nyasa and Mudras

14. Gayatrhi Dhyana Sloka

15. Gayathri Manthra Japa

17. Gayathri Udvasana

 18. Suryopasthana 

19. Prayers to all the chosen Gods and Goddesses to bless with the purushartha siddhi

20. Keshava namas and Mangala Shlokas.

This is the usual sequence of Sandhya Vandana which we perform in our tradition. 

 Regards, 

Dr. Rani Sadasiva Murty

---

From: 'Dr. Yadu Moharir' via भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत् <bvpar...@googlegroups.com>
To: "bvpar...@googlegroups.com" <bvpar...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, 1 November 2015 10:34 PM
Subject: {भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत्} sadhyaa vandanam

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[Sivasenani Nori]

Sir

In the Arthasangraha, a prakaranagrantha of Mimamsa, the discussion of Sandhyavandanam occurs under the Adhikaravidhi:

कर्मजन्यफलस्वाम्यबोधको विधिरधिकारविधिः। कर्मजन्यफलस्वाम्यं कर्मजन्यफलभोक्तृत्वम्। स च "यजेत स्वर्गकामः" इत्यादिरूपः। स्वर्गमुद्दिश्य यागं विदधतानेन स्वर्गकामस्य यागजन्यफलभोक्तृत्वं प्रतिपाद्यते। . . . एवं "अहरहः सन्ध्यामुपासीत" इत्यादिना शुचिविहितकालजीविनः सन्ध्योपासनजन्यप्रत्यवायपरिहाररूपफलस्वाम्यं बोध्यते॥

तच्च फलस्वाम्यं तस्यैव योऽधिकारविशिष्टः। अधिकारश्च स एव यद्विधिवाक्येषु पुरुषविशेणत्वेन श्रूयते। यथा . . . नित्ये सन्ध्योपासनादौ शुचिविहितकालजीवित्वम्।

While it is clear that the Mimamsa position is that the fruit, and hence purpose, of Sandhyavandanam is pratyavaayaparihaara (more about this later), the quality prescribed for the Adhikaari, (the one who enjoys this fruit) - शुचिविहितकालजीवित्वम् - offers an important clue. Firstly, it imposes Saucam (bathing in the morning and evening) and then provides the anchor around which the daily life is woven: start early and come back home by sunset, sparing five or ten minutes at beginning and ending of the day to focus on the Pratyaksha-naarayaNa: the Sun (असावादित्यो ब्रह्म). 

The multiplier effect of discipline is difficult to over-emphasise. Many people wonder how Vedic scholars or even traditional scholars remember such a huge amount of corpus. Often it is attributed to superior intelligence - but discipline is under-rated. These scholars repeat every text segment at least a hundred times (ten aavrittis, each consisting of ten repititions) for one or two weeks and then recite it at least once a month (svaadhyaaya) for a period of forty years (at least that's what the theory is). Those who are not endowed with great Medhasakti also can retain huge amounts of text if this kind of discipline is followed. Even for those not interested in memorizing vast texts, this discipline is useful. For instance, let us say one wants to recite the entire Ramayanam. Often the start is bright but then the intent fizzles down. In many cases the task is not completed - especially when it is not publicly declared and there is nobody asking whether the task is completed or not. On the other hand, if one makes a small rule - say that one would recite at least one sarga (or more if possible) every day after Sandhyavandanam, the task gets completed. Thus vihitakaalajeevitvam, is one great benefit. It is like why there are set office hours. (To be sure, this should not be read as the Mimamsa position, for they would not admit an unseen benefit if a seen benefit is sufficient).

Now, coming to the question of Pratyavaaya, this is like non-payment of interest, or not repaying a debt. Rishis with great tapas achieved the eligibility to see the various mantras and then through the unbroken chain of teachers passed these onto us, out of great compassion. We are indebted to our teachers and Rishis and have to repay this debt by keeping that knowledge alive and failure to repay this debt is what may be considered as Pratyavaaya.

Regards

N. Siva Senani

--

[Nagaraj Paturi]

> Can someone elaborate on why such tradition (sandhyaa vandanam) was introduced as a ritual in the first place by our ancestors ?

 

1. What is called as Sandhyaavandanam is not in fact a single ritual. It is a combination of several different rituals. Hence the explanation of purpose or function or use of Sandhyaavandanam can be only in the form of the different rituals that make what is called as Sandhyaavandanam. 

 

2. One of the core /central rituals of this ritual-complex is Gaayatreejapa. The meaning of the Gaayatreemantra itself explains purpose or function or use of  Gaayatreejapa. The purpose or function is to pay attention to and get absorbed in the savitr =generator of dheeh = physical and beyond physical (mental, spiritual etc. ) faculties. The generator within and outside the being. Tuning back the system that tends to go out of tune of the generator from time to time.

 

3. The other components such as maarjana, if you see the mantras used become self-explanatory. The mantras describe, among other things, the cleansing of the waters by golden sun rays (hiraNyavarNaass'uchayaa yaas'cha paavakaah) and in turn cleansing of body and mind by the waters so cleaned. 

 

4. Arghya to Surya is an expression of giving back to the Sun who gives us (what? need not be detailed)

 

5. Similarly other components such as namaskaaras to directions etc. can be explained. 

 

6. Pratyavaaya is because of the karma being nitya. Nitya is natural. A natural tendency of the being is formalized through ritual. Pratyavaaya is the pain of deviating from the nitya, natural.   

 

  

 

 

--

Nagaraj Paturi

 

Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.

 

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies

 

FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,

 

(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )

 

 

 

[Nagaraj Paturi]

Correction:

1. What is called as Sandhyaavandanam is not in fact a single ritual. It is a combination of several different rituals. Hence the explanation of purpose or function or use of Sandhyaavandanam can be only in the form of explanation of purpose or function or use of the different rituals that make what is called as Sandhyaavandanam

[Dr. Yadu Moharir]

Dear Dr Murty

Your posts are always full of information, however, my question is not what is done &/or to be practiced by whom, but why was it introduced in the first place to be practiced as a ritual as an integral part of everyday (nitya upaasanaa).

I am looking for the grandeur picture of the purpose.

Any thoughts will be helpful.

Best rgds

Dr Yadu

---

From: 'sadasivamurty rani' via भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत् <bvpar...@googlegroups.com>
To: "bvpar...@googlegroups.com" <bvpar...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 1, 2015 11:06 AM
Subject: Re: {भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत्} sadhyaa vandanam

[Dr. Yadu Moharir]

Dear Prof. Paturi

Please see the highlighted comments below:

---

From: Nagaraj Paturi <nagara...@gmail.com>
To: bvpar...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Sunday, November 1, 2015 12:00 PM
Subject: Re: {भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत्} sadhyaa vandanam

Correction:

1. What is called as Sandhyaavandanam is not in fact a single ritual. It is a combination of several different rituals. Hence the explanation of purpose or function or use of Sandhyaavandanam can be only in the form of explanation of purpose or function or use of the different rituals that make what is called as Sandhyaavandanam

I am extremely familiar with the protocol described by Dr. Murty's. What I am trying to understand is why such a complex protocol was prescribed in the first place for it's global application.

2. One of the core /central rituals of this ritual-complex is Gaayatreejapa. The meaning of the Gaayatreemantra itself explains purpose or function or use of  Gaayatreejapa. The purpose or function is to pay attention to and get absorbed in the savitr =generator of dheeh = physical and beyond physical (mental, spiritual etc. ) faculties. The generator within and outside the being. Tuning back the system that tends to go out of tune of the generator from time to time.

This paragraph totally confusing for me, specifically, "savitr =generator of dheeh = physical and beyond physical (mental, spiritual etc. )"  AND "Tuning back the system that tends to go out of tune of the generator from time to time. ".

KINDLY ELABORATE

 

3. The other components such as maarjana, if you see the mantras used become self-explanatory. The mantras describe, among other things, the cleansing of the waters by golden sun rays (hiraNyavarNaass'uchayaa yaas'cha paavakaah) and in turn cleansing of body and mind by the waters so cleaned.

 This can be somewhat acceptable and has been scientifically proven.  Yes, UV rays do kill all kinds of microbes (pathogens as well as healthy bio-burden), for this to be the promary objective of "arjhya" does not make sense because the exposure "the residence time" necessary for such thing in practice is not sufficient for an effective "marjana" as suggested. 

 

4. Arghya to Surya is an expression of giving back to the Sun who gives us (what? need not be detailed)

As per my comment for the #3 this "marjana" as a real effective purification of the water (river or a lake) cannot be correct.  If a water stored in a copper or silver pot (overnight for at least 10-12 hr) can possibly work due to the bacterastatic properties of these metals.

5. Similarly other components such as namaskaaras to directions etc. can be explained. 

 

I will accept this at face value.

6. Pratyavaaya is because of the karma being nitya. Nitya is natural. A natural tendency of the being is formalized through ritual. Pratyavaaya is the pain of deviating from the nitya, natural.   

 

  Can you please explain and help me understand how does on equate "nitya = natural" ?

Any specifically prescribed karma, cannot be a natural because it is to be practiced and to be perfected by the saadhaka.  Example:  How can be classify "padmaasana" or any other yoga posture as NATURAL cannot make sense, (indeed some of them are based on animal's natural posture, but certainly not natural to human beings) 

Thanks

Best Rgds

Dr Yadu

[sadasivamurty rani]

Dear Dr. Yadu Moharir Ji!

Namaste. Suprabhatam.

Thanks for your compliment or comment that my posts are always full of information. 

Yes.  There was an intention in giving the sequential details of Sandhyavandna. Before I proceed to explain why I have given the sequential details I would like to concentrating on one or two points of your initial lines of this thread.

(The highlighted lines are from your mail)

Point No.1 

Lot of things have been discussed pertaining to "surya namaskaara" and health benefits during "sadhyaa vandanam"

"Surya Namaskara" associated with health benefits is not a part of Sandhya Vandana.  I have given some details of it in my separate post on Surya Namaskara. Those details can be seen there. 

Can someone elaborate on why such tradition (sandhyaa vandanam) was introduced as a ritual in the first place by our ancestors ? (no need to repeat the health benefits already discussed).

This part of your mail is to be answered:

With an initial ideal that the sequence of the process is self explanatory I have just given the sequence without any Benefit-Taglines.

The other Scholars Dr. Siva Senani Ji and Dr. Nagaraj Paturi Ji  have already initiated into the subject regarding its various benefits.

I lay down certain causes for placing this by our ancestors in the first of daily rituals to be performed by us. 

1. Sandhya Vandana is the Purifier of Antahkaranas ..   Manas, Buddhi, Ahankara and Chitta. 

   Every day we clean our surroundings.  We clean the vessels used on the previous day while taking food. We clean our clothes. We clean our body with Snana.  This is the physical cleaning process. 

But where is the occasion to clean the Anthahkaranas?

That occasion is Sandhaya Vandana. 

Why should we clean them? is the very next question -

Ape to Super Ape.. Super Ape to Divine  ... is the ideal way of Human living.

To make our lives Divine we invite the Gods and Goddesses to dwell in us making our heart the Best of the Elevated Seats available with us. 

As we cannot adjust with the impure surroundings the Divine beings also cannot stay in our impure Anthakaranas.

So for this purpose the Marjana Mantras, Mantra Achamanam and Aghamarshana Mantras are prescribed:

Particularly the Mantrachamana is a wonderful process of making us sin free if we understand and practice it. It surely sets us free from all Sins. 

ऒम्. .. सूर्यश्च मा मन्युश्च मन्युपतयश्च मन्यु कृतेभ्य:। पापेभ्यो रक्षन्ताम्। यद्रार्त्रिया पापमकार्षम्। मनसा वाचा हस्ताभ्याम्। पद्भ्यामुदरेण शिश्ना। रात्रिस्तदवलुम्पतु। यत्किञ्च दुरितं मयि। इदमहं मा ममृतयोनौ। सूर्ये ज्योतिषि जुहोमि स्वाहा।

This Mantrachamana is an essential part of all the three Sandhyas. So if having understood this if we perform - by mind, by speech and by all physical limbs we stop doing any kind of sins. 

"A SIN FREE HEART is the BEST SEAT FOR THE DIVINITY".

2. Sandhya Vandana is to Drive away all the Asuri set of qualities from us

The components of this Process are 1. Papa Purusha Vimochanam, (Drupadaadiva Munchatu...etc), 2. Arghyapradana with Gayatri Mantra to drive away all the Asuri set of qualities from us  3. Atma Pradakshina  and 4. Tarpanam. This process is of different lengths according to the respective traditions. 

3. Sandhayavandana is the Intellectual Invigorating and Stimulating Process:

This Process includes:1.  Gayatri Avaahana, 2. Gayatri Japasankalpa, 3. Karanyasa, 4. Anga nyasa 5. Dhyana Shloka and 6. Japavidhi. 

This is the most essential part of Sandhyavandana through which the Savitr Devata graces us to unite our Intellect with the Path of  Dharma and other Purusharthas to lead a pious, ideal and virtuous life. 

यो देवस्सविताऽस्माकं धियो धर्मादिगोचरा:।

प्रेरयेत् तस्य यद्भर्गस्तद्वरेण्यमुपास्महे ॥

4. Sandhya Vandana is to Express our ever Indebtedness to the Gods, Rshis and Manes (Pitr Devatas) for giving us this rarest birth among Human beings:

After the Gayatri Japavidhi the process of Suryopasthanam is prescribed: This consists of 1. Expressing our Devotion to The Sun, 2. Dig-Devata Namaskara 3. Rshi-Pitr Namaskara with Gotra Pravaras. This process is to express our Gratitude to the Gods, Rshis and Pitr Devatas for providing us to have a this rarest opportunity to be born as Human beings. 

5. Sandhayavandanam is to offer our Devotion to All the Gods and Goddesses of our respective Family Traditions:

This is the closing Part of Sandhyavandana to offer Namaskarams to all the Gods and Goddesses of our respective Family Traditions. Here all our expectations such as Fulfillment of Purusharthas, Klesha Nasa, Sukha Jivana, Sampadvriddhi, Vamsha Vriddhi, Vidyavrddhi etc.  from those gods are enlisted and finally the Sandhyavandana closes with Mangalasasanam. 

6. Ultimately Sandhayavandana is to attain Sakala Srauta - Smartha Karmacharana Yogyataa Praapti: 

This is the consolidation of all the above five purposes:

When our Antahkaranas are purified the Godsis seated in our hearts. 

They bestow upon us the awakened, stimulated and invigorated intellect.

With such intellect if we express our Gratitude to all the Deities they bless us to be spiritually strong enough  to perform any and every other kind of Srauta Karmas and Smartha Karmas for attaining different worldly benefits. 

There can be many other supplementary benefits and also other scientific reasons which are being explained by the rest of the scholars of this forum.

 I hope this mail of mine may satisfy at least a part of your question of this thread.

Regards,

Dr. Rani Sadasiva Murty

From: 'Dr. Yadu Moharir' via भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत् <bvpar...@googlegroups.com>
To: "bvpar...@googlegroups.com" <bvpar...@googlegroups.com>

Sent: Monday, 2 November 2015 3:06 AM

[Nagaraj Paturi]

Dear Dr Moharir,

 

1.

This paragraph totally confusing for me, specifically, "savitr =generator of dheeh = physical and beyond physical (mental, spiritual etc. )"  AND "Tuning back the system that tends to go out of tune of the generator from time to time. ".

Kindly Elaborate

Savitr is taken in the sense of Prasavitr by authorities such as SaayaNa too. 

Prasav = to give birth to , is well known. 

I used the word 'generate' in that sense. That is how savitaa =generator

For dheeh, I wrote "dheeh = physical and beyond physical (mental, spiritual etc. ) faculties"  ; you missed to copy the word faculties. 

SaayaNa takes the word dhiyah in the sense of karmaaNi = activities. karmaaNi are s'aarIraka karmaaNi, maanasika karmaaNi etc. 

In the verse, योदेव स्सवितास्माकं also, dhiyah is elaborated as dhiyo dharmaadigocharaah ; even SaayaNa takes the meaning dharmaadiroopaah. dharma (property)  here is s'arIradharma, manOdharma etc. Combining all this, we get the meaning physical activities (biological processes) mental activities etc. or physical properties, mental properties etc. for dheeh. 

What is dheemahi ? If Savitr is realized to be an entity inside the meditating person, then the dhyaana on that entity can be realized to be getting tuned to that inner entity. Why do we need to periodically do the dhyaana? The very need to periodical tuning shows that the person gets out of tune( from this inner eternal 'vibration' called Savitr) from time to time. 

Similar is the case of PraaNaayaama. Why peridical praaNaayaama? Only because the right breathing pattern set in by praaNaayaama gets disturbed by the day to day activities. Incidentally, praaNaayaama is part of Sandhyavandanam in general and gaayatreejapa in particular. 

2. maarjana is self-explanatory. 

3. Nitya karma is a karma which is not naimittika i.e. a karma done with a purpose. It is not nitya because it is prescribed to be done. It is the other way round. It is prescribed to be done because the prescribing rishi through his tapas discovered that it is nitya. Most of the vidhis of dharmashastra are formalizations of the ideal natural activities of a person sensitive to and attuned to ritam, the natural rhythm of rhythm of rhythms. 

[madhav phatak]

ओम नमो,
साधु निरुपितम्।

[Nagaraj Paturi]

Now, let me bring some science into the discussion on Savitr as an inner generating/driving entity inside the living organism:

 

1. Did Wohler's synthesis disprove that organisms can produce organic compounds by themselves? In fact, he could only prove that what is being synthesized in a laboratory using a huge elaborate process is getting generated inside the organism. Who is playing the role of the scientist that synthesizes the compound, inside the body of the living organism?

 

2. What is the source inside the body of the living organism from where its self-healing process starts ?

 

3. Newton's laws of motion do not apply to a living body. No 'external force' is required for the body to move from rest to motion or back or to change the direction of motion. What is the source inside the body of the living organism for the processes that help the living body to move from rest to motion or back or to change its direction of motion all by itself.

 

Many other such questions when pondered over, help understand that there is an inner  generating/driving entity inside the living organism. The beautiful Vedic word for it is Savitr.    

[Subrahmanyam Korada]

नमो विद्वद्भ्यः

Can someone elaborate on why such tradition (sandhyaa vandanam) was introduced as a ritual in the first place by our ancestors ?

                                   ---  Vidvan Dr Yadu Moharir

First of all  one has to understand the  संस्कृति of  भरतखण्ड , that is aptly called सनातनधर्म ( सनातनः = नित्यः - not disturbed by काल -- भूत - भविष्यत् - वर्तमानकालाः)।

The सनातनधर्म stands  firmly on four pillars called - धर्म , अर्थ , काम and मोक्ष --

ऊर्ध्वबाहुः विरौम्येष न हि कश्चित् शृणोति माम् ।

धर्मात् अर्थश्च कामश्च स धर्मः किं न सेव्यते ? -- व्यासः - भारतम् - स्वर्गारोहणपर्व , 5-62

So धर्म is the basis of  the  संस्कृति and such a धर्म  is prescribed by श्रुति ( वेद ) and स्मृति ।

’ वेदो’खिलो धर्ममूलम् " - गौतमस्मृतिः/ मनुस्मृतिः ।

There are three kinds of दोषाः - मनोदोषाः , कायदोषाः , वाग्दोषाः ।

मनस् is considered as more important than काय (शरीरम्) ।

So , while getting up  from  bed one , after completing  the minimum  needs of शौचम् , should pray to सविता , who is  ब्रह्मन्  itself  .

There are mainly three kinds of कर्मs - नित्यकर्माणि , नैमित्तिककर्माणि , काम्यकर्माणि ।

नित्य-नैमित्तिककर्माणि  are mandatory even for a संन्यासी ।

One who gives up काम्यकर्माणि is a संन्यासी ।

सन्ध्यावन्दनम् is a नित्यकर्म - one should perform regularly .

In fact, all  the कर्मs are meant for  चित्तशुद्धि (cleansing the mind ) and to generate विविदिषा ( वेत्तुम् इच्छा - a desire to know the ब्रह्मन्) . There will be , no doubt , other benefits .

पापनाश is also said to be a benefit of  सन्ध्यावन्दनम् - पापनाश means पापबुद्धिनाश as अवश्यम् अनुभोक्तव्यम् कृतं कर्म शुभाशुभम् / नाभुक्तं क्षीयते कर्म जन्मकोटिशतैरपि ।

So the sons of this soil , called कर्मभूमि , have to follow the directions  of वेद , that is  अपौरुषेय ।

धन्यो’स्मि

Dr.Korada Subrahmanyam
Professor of Sanskrit, CALTS,
University of Hyderabad,
Ph:09866110741(M),91-40-23010741(R),040-23133660(O)

Skype Id: Subrahmanyam Korada

Blog: Koradeeyam.blogspot.in 

[Ajit Gargeshwari]

Thank you Prof Korada for the explanation . You have used the word सनातनधर्म. Sorry for a bit of side tracking but when was the word सनातनधर्म coined where is the oldest reference to the word or is it a modern concept is this word found in the Vedas the pillar of सनातनधर्म?

Regards
Ajit Gargeshwari
न जायते म्रियते वा कदाचिन्नायं भूत्वा भविता वा न भूयः।
अजो नित्यः शाश्वतोऽयं पुराणो न हन्यते हन्यमाने शरीरे।।2.20।।

[Dr. Yadu Moharir]

Dear  Prof Paturi

The inner energy has been well documented in science (Thermodynamics)

http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/chemistry/5-12-organic-chemistry-i-spring-2003/lecture-handouts/07.pdf

The Arrhenius Law: Activation Energies

				The Arrhenius Law: Activation Energies All molecules possess a certain minimum amount of energy. The energy can be in the form of kinetic energy or potential energy.
				View on chemwiki.ucdavis.edu	Preview by Yahoo

The real message is that one can never create Energy, it just changes form.  Whether it is in the form of a Potential, Kinetic. Chemical, Electrical and ......

Living things have a beautiful bio-chemical systems that behave and perform their function often known as "Red-Ox" (Reduction - Oxidation) pathways. (excellent example - Uniquenone / Ubiquenol)

From my understanding, I would claffify Savitar as the (hv) the energy of activation required to effect the specific transformation.

Yes, Vedic sages recognized it and termed as "savitar" but it is the Science that is utilizing it for all advancements.  Just gloating on yesteryear's does not help anyone.

Therefore, the concept of viniyoga was introduced by our ancestors, however, the viniyoga somehow got  trapped in the academic rituals, of Brahmins, without understanding and applying it to their lives or the society they lived in.

adnyebhyo granthinaH shreShThaa granthibhyo dhaariNo varaaH |

dhaaribhyo dnyaaninaH shreShThaa dnyaanibhyo vyavasaayinaH || manusmR^iti 12\.103 ||

 

Meaning - One who learns a little is better than the one who have not learned at all.  One who memorizes are better than who have learned a little (at least they are faithful to the original works).  One who knows the meanings are better than the ones who just memorize.   The ones who use that knowledge are the superior ones.

In my opinion,  All knowledge is useless if it is not understood, utilized, and not accessible at the time of need. (By the way this statement is conclusion of my book, GaNesha 360 - The Science of Smart Living)

With kind regards,

Dr Yadu

---

From: Nagaraj Paturi <nagara...@gmail.com>
To: bvpar...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, November 3, 2015 8:45 PM

[Dr. Yadu Moharir]

Thanks you Prof Korada, for the elaboration.

Could you also explain the meaning of term "sanaatana"

From my understanding, I interpret as "nitya nutana"  meaning constantly evolving (changing).

Thanks you in advance

Best Rgds

Dr Yadu

---

From: Subrahmanyam Korada <kora...@gmail.com>
To: "bvpar...@googlegroups.com" <bvpar...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 4, 2015 6:50 AM

Subject: Re: {भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत्} sadhyaa vandanam

[Nagaraj Paturi]

>From my understanding, I would claffify Savitar as the (hv) the energy of activation required to effect the specific transformation.

>Yes, Vedic sages recognized it and termed as "savitar" but it is the Science that is utilizing it for all advancements.  Just gloating on yesteryear's does not help anyone.

 

------- Dear Dr Moharir,

 

I did not intend to pitch the Vedas against science, I did not claim any superiority of the Vedas over science.

 

Gloating or not gloating over yesteryears or the present years was not part of any of my posts; in fact any such expression was beyond the scope of the thread's original question or my posts in answer to that question.

 

Yes, as a general point of observation, I find no reason to disagree with your statement "All knowledge is useless if it is not understood, utilized, and not accessible at the time of need"

 

Coming back to the original question, the function of Sandhyavandanam is a subjective, inward looking , process of the organism focussing on its Savitr (inner energy being one of the things close to it) and getting absorbed in the feel of its Savitr. Viniyoga of such a process of focussing, getting absorbed etc. can be studied using the tools of the scientific field (psychology, neurology etc.) relevant to such a process.  

--
निराशीर्निर्ममो भूत्वा युध्यस्व विगतज्वरः।। (भ.गी.)
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[Bijoy Misra]

Dear Dr Moharir,

While your question is valid, I urge you to try out to experiment.  Please don't take anything accepted

but feel that energy.  I won't go into more details but would recommend you to get into the modern

literature of neuro-science to understand intentionality.  It is a new term coming from psychology.

Once you study, many of your questions might resolve through the modern findings.  More you

would learn by practicing!

Best regards,

Bijoy Misra

Boston.

[Nagaraj Paturi]

In my starting post in this thread, I described Savitr as the one within and outside the being.

 

Now, let me elaborate the 'outside the being' aspect of Savitr:

 

In its 'outside the being' aspect, Savitr is the life-generating and life-activity-inspiring aspect of the Sun.

 

In fact, this aspect of the Vedic concept Savitr/Savitaa is so well established that the word Savitr/Savitaa is used as a synonym for the Sanskrit words referring to the Sun.

 

Belief in the role of the Sun as a fertilizer, , is so widespread that many fertility worshipping rituals and cultures are centred  around the Sun in different parts of the world.

 

Role of the Sun in many nutrition and other health aspects of organisms is well recognized in modern science too.

 

Role of the Sun in photosynthesis which helps the bottom of the food chain is also now part of common knowledge.

 

In brief, centrality given to the Sun in the Vedas and the Vedic lore is now well supported by the understandings in modern science too.

 

Gaayatree japa, which is one of the core rituals of Sandhyaavandanam, in its aspect as a meditation on the life-generating and life-activity-inspiring aspect of the Sun is well supported by contemporary understanding.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Subrahmanyam Korada]

नमो विद्वद्भ्यः

You have used the word सनातनधर्म. Sorry for a bit of side tracking but when was the word सनातनधर्म coined where is the oldest reference to the word or is it a modern concept is this word found in the Vedas the pillar of सनातनधर्म?

                            

                                                                                             ---- Vidvan Ajit Gargeswari

सनातनधर्मः - the term is  पुरातनः , not  अधुनातनः --

पाणिनीयम्  --

सना - इति अव्ययम् स्वरादिगणे पाणिनिना पठितम् - स्वरादिनिपातमव्ययम् (1-1-36)

सना इत्यव्ययात् - ’  सायंचिरंप्राह्णेप्रगे’व्ययेभ्यःट्युट्युलौ तुट् च ’ ( पा सू 4-3-23) इति  कालवाचकात् अव्ययात् भव इत्यर्थे शैषिकौ ट्युट्युलौ प्रत्ययौ ( अनादेशनन्तरम् ) तुट् च -- 

सना भवः = सनातनः ।

शाश्वतस्तु ध्रुवो नित्यसदातनसनातनाः - विशेष्यनिघ्नेषु अमरः ।

My mental search into four Vedas and Upanisats  failed me . 

सत्यं ब्रूयात् प्रियं ब्रूयात्  न ब्रूयात् सत्यमप्रियम् ।

प्रियं च नानृतं ब्रूयात् एष धर्मः सनातनः ॥   मनुस्मृतिः , 4-138

सत्यं दमस्तपश्शौचं सन्तोषो ह्रीः क्षमार्जवम् ।

ज्ञानं शमो दया ध्यानम् एष धर्मः सनातनः॥  महाभारतम्

अराजकेषु राज्येषु धर्मो न व्यवतिष्ठते ।

परस्परं च खादन्ति सर्वधाधिगराजकम् ॥

अदासः क्रियते दासः ह्रियन्ते चाबलाः स्त्रियः।

राजा चेन्न भवेल्लोके पृथिव्यां दण्डधारकः।।

धर्माय राजा भवति न कर्मकरणाय तु ।

राजा चरति चेद्धर्मं देवत्वायैव कल्पते ॥

चातुर्वर्ण्यं च धर्माश्च रक्षितव्याः समीक्षिताः।

धर्मसंकररक्षा च राज्ञां धर्मस्सनातनः॥       महाभारतम्

पातकं वा सदोषं वा कर्तव्यं रक्षता सदा ।

राज्यभारनियुक्तानाम् एष धर्मः सनातनः ॥  रामायणम्

आतुरे नियमो नास्ति बाले वृद्धे तथैव च ।

सदाचाररते चैव  ह्येष धर्मः सनातनः ॥  मनुस्मृतिः ( ? )

गृहस्थो गोपयेद्दारान् विद्यामभ्यसयेत्सुतान् ।

पोषयेत् स्वजनान् बन्धून् एष धर्मः सनातनः ॥

धन्यो’स्मि

[sunil bhattacharjya]

Namaste,

Lord Krishna said as follows;

विधिना या भवेद्धिंसा सा त्वहिंसा प्रकीर्तिता ।

सत्यं ब्रुयात् प्रियं ब्रुयान्न ब्रुयात्सत्यमप्रियम् ।

प्रियं च नानृतं ब्रुयादेष धर्मः सनातनः ॥

Here sanatana dharma seems to mean eternal rule

Regards,

Sunil KB

[Ajit Gargeshwari]

​

"धर्मः सनातनः" This phrase in the quoted works means Dharma is eternal not we are the followers of "सनातनः धर्मः"

Regards
Ajit Gargeshwari
न जायते म्रियते वा कदाचिन्नायं भूत्वा भविता वा न भूयः।
अजो नित्यः शाश्वतोऽयं पुराणो न हन्यते हन्यमाने शरीरे।।2.20।।

[Nagaraj Paturi]

​"धर्मः सनातनः" This phrase in the quoted works means Dharma is eternal.

 

not we are the followers of "सनातनः धर्मः

 

Are we followers of some other Dharma than that is described here as ​"धर्मः सनातनः" ?

 

 

[Ajit Gargeshwari]

Dharma is universal not restricted to practice or rituals of a group or community. Its applicability is for all mankind Arjuna was just an excuse. Any way that's not within the scope of this thread. I made this mark in to highlight one may not find the word 'Sanatana Dharma' what it normally denotes now in the Vedas or early texts. Sandhya Vandana need not be linked to Santana Dharma what it denotes now.

Regards
Ajit Gargeshwari
न जायते म्रियते वा कदाचिन्नायं भूत्वा भविता वा न भूयः।
अजो नित्यः शाश्वतोऽयं पुराणो न हन्यते हन्यमाने शरीरे।।2.20।।

[Nagaraj Paturi]

 

1. The root of the problem is in the use of the word 'dharma' in Hindi and other contemporary north Indian languages as a translation for the English word 'religion'. The word 'sanaatana dharma' if used with this sense of the word 'dharma', then translates into 'eternal religion'. Since the connotation of the English word does not allow it to be eternal, the word sanaatana dharma appears to have a problem.

 

2. The word 'sanaatana dharma' has been used as a problem-free alternative for the problematic word 'Hinduism' in modern discourse. Since this usage appears in modern discourses only, the word itself appears to be neologism which  it is not.

 

3. After the reformation movements such as Arya Samaj, the word 'Sanaatani' came to mean things like 'superstitious of the Hindus' 'opposed to rational understanding of Hinduism' etc.

 

4. The word 'sanaatana dharma' has been used to articulate the distinction of Hinduism as against book-based , prophet-based religions.

 

All these modern usages create an impression that the word is a modern coinage whereas the modern usages of the word are only modern and not the word itself. 

 

2015-11-06 12:10 GMT+05:30 Nagaraj Paturi <nagara...@gmail.com>:

[Hnbhat B.R.]

All the quoted verses quote "this is the eternal Dharma" and does not define any particular Dharma in common ad सनातनधर्म as already pointed out by Prof. Korada. And not defining a common धर्म as सनातनधर्म or  nor defining the nature of धर्म as I can understand the quoted verses including the recent ones posted by Sunil Bhattacharya.

That is why Prof. Korada stated he could not trace the origin of the word popular as सनातनधर्म.

Thus the question turns out do we follow all the धर्म called as एष धर्मः सनातनः or any of the eternal धर्म defined in any of quoted verses?

It is declared

  "वेदो’खिलो धर्ममूलम् " - गौतमस्मृतिः/ मनुस्मृतिः ।

महाभारत has this quotion

तर्कोऽप्रतिष्ठः श्रुतयो विभिन्नाः नासौ ऋषिर्यस्य मतं न भिन्नम् | 
धर्मस्य तत्त्वं निहितं गुहायां महाजनो येन गतः स पन्थः || 

quoted as the words of Dharmaraja in reply to the questions of Yaksha. I could not right now give the reference to Mahabharata.

Again,   Mahabharata Book 12 शान्तिपर्व
Chapter 37 says

अदत्तस्यानुपादानं दानमध्ययनं तपः |
अहिंसा सत्यमक्रोधः क्षमेज्या धर्मलक्षणम् ||७||

य एव धर्मः सोऽधर्मोऽदेशेऽकाले प्रतिष्ठितः |
आदानमनृतं हिंसा धर्मो व्यावस्थिकः स्मृतः ||८||

[Dr. P. Ramanujan]

सनातनशब्दविषये अभिधेयजिज्ञासायां -

कठोपनिषदि -

नाचिकेतमुपाख्यानं मृत्युप्रोक्तं सनातनम् ।

गुह्यं ब्रह्म सनातनम् ।

एषोsश्वत्थस्सनातनः । तदेव शुक्रं तद्ब्रह्म तदेवामृतमुच्यते ।

 

भगवद्गीतासु -

कुलधर्माः सनातनाः ।

अचलोऽयं सनातनः ।

यान्ति ब्रह्म सनातनम्

बीजं मां सर्वभूतानां विद्धि पार्थ सनातनम् ।

भावोऽन्योऽव्यक्तोऽव्यक्तात्सनातनः ।

त्वमव्ययः शाश्वतधर्मगोप्ता सनातनस्त्वं पुरुषो मतो मे ।।

ममैवांशो जीवलोके जीवभूतः सनातनः ।

 

इत्यादिषु यद्यपि कुत्रचित् पुराणत्वं युज्येत, तथापि ब्रह्म, ईश्वर, जीवादिविषये

नित्यत्वमेव सर्वैर्दार्शनिकैः निर्णीतत्वात्, समानन्यायेन धर्मस्य विशेषणत्वेऽपि

तथाभावे न कापि क्षतिः । प्रत्युत इष्टञ्चेदं महर्षीणां गीताचार्यस्य च ॥

 

रामानुजः

--

निराशीर्निर्ममो भूत्वा युध्यस्व विगतज्वरः।। (भ.गी.)
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तैत्तिरीयब्राह्मणे उपहोमेषु (2.5.5.3)

सनातनं विततँ षण्मयूखम् । इति मन्त्रपादव्याख्याने सायणीये

सनातनम् - अनादिकालसिद्धम् इत्युक्तमस्ति ।

अहोरात्रविषयकं संवत्सरविषयकं च प्रकरणम् ।

 

रामानुजः

[Dr.S.R.Leela(MLC)]

Krute cha Pratikartavyam esha dharmah sanatanah---valmiki ramayanam, sundarakanda

Leela s r

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