Dasas and Dasyus in Rigveda
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Lokesh Johri
Aug 20, 2019, 5:25:58 PM8/20/19
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Is it a general consensus among the scholars that "Dasas" and "Dasyus" were two separate sets of people against whom "aryans" raged war - as in Rigveda. (Reference - Ram Sharan Sharma)?
Ramakrishnan
Aug 22, 2019, 10:41:45 AM8/22/19
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Namaste,
In my understanding Dasyu & Dāsa in the Rgveda represent a broadly similar set of peoples/tribes (since they are sometimes referred to in the Rgveda within the same mantra by both names) so it may be sensible to treat them both as similar peoples, but the fact that they have separate names probably means that they had some distinction between them (i.e. they might have been similar but not identical). Also these Dāsas & Dasyus in early Vedic texts are usually people who are powerful and in cultural conflict not only with the Vedic society but also the word is used to refer to opponents of Indra (such as three headed serpent monster Vrtra) whom he defeats (note the close parallel in Iranic serpent demon azi dahaka . Namuci and śambara are also called dāsas in Vedic texts, and śambara is the enemy of divodāsa. In later texts, these dāsas are also called asuras.
In my understanding Dasyu & Dāsa in the Rgveda represent a broadly similar set of peoples/tribes (since they are sometimes referred to in the Rgveda within the same mantra by both names) so it may be sensible to treat them both as similar peoples, but the fact that they have separate names probably means that they had some distinction between them (i.e. they might have been similar but not identical). Also these Dāsas & Dasyus in early Vedic texts are usually people who are powerful and in cultural conflict not only with the Vedic society but also the word is used to refer to opponents of Indra (such as three headed serpent monster Vrtra) whom he defeats (note the close parallel in Iranic serpent demon azi dahaka . Namuci and śambara are also called dāsas in Vedic texts, and śambara is the enemy of divodāsa. In later texts, these dāsas are also called asuras.
Taking the evidence from the Iranian side, both dāsas and dasyus are mentioned in Zoroastrian texts (as dahae and dahyu) - and in parallel with classical Sanskrit texts, the early Iranian texts classify these tribes as opposed to themselves culturally, but in later Iranian texts, they are listed with other Iranian texts who had embraced Zoroastrianism (asura worship). Still the Iranian texts portray them as robbers and people of low respectability. For more information on the Iranic connections, refer to https://www.livius.org/articles/people/dahae/ & http://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/dahyu-
There is another category of beings who are dāsas i.e. they are common servants within Vedic society (not necessarily opposed to that society) and are not shown to be from a different cultural background. For example divodāsa ("servant of the devas") is a Vedic name that immediately comes to mind having this meaning (of common servant).
Some scholars (usually western) try to mischievously translate the word dāsa (for servant) as slave. I do not think there is much evidence to support that idea as slavery implies the following factors:
1. Ownership of human beings by other human beings
2. Some form of bonded labour and physical imprisonment (and/or restricted movement)
3. Trading in human beings (slave trade) and applying prices and/or barter values on them
I do not believe there is any evidence to indicate that these factors existed either in Vedic India or later on to indicate the existence of Slaves, slavery as a cultural practice or slave trading as an economic reality in ancient India, so we may safely (on the weight of substantial evidence) say dāsas (servants) were not equated with slaves either in India or in Iran.
Ramakrishnan
Is it a general consensus among the scholars that "Dasas" and "Dasyus" were two separate sets of people against whom "aryans" raged war - as in Rigveda. (Reference - Ram Sharan Sharma)?
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Lokesh Johri
Aug 22, 2019, 2:46:30 PM8/22/19
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Namaste,
That is interesting.
However, if the conflict described in Rig Veda was happening in the Indian subcontinent, why does it have an echo in a Persian sacred text i.e. in Avesta?
Regards,
Lokesh
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Ramakrishnan
Aug 23, 2019, 6:29:41 AM8/23/19
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Namaste,
When we speak of the Rgveda, we are talking of a bigger region to the north-west of India with which the Vedic people were interacting (not merely the Indus/Punjab valley which was the home of the early Vedic civilization).
There were civilizational links with Iran (who were also following Vedic deities until the start of Zoroastrianism around 800-700 BCE or thereabouts).
The uttara-mādras (Medes), Uttara-kurus (dominion of Kūruš i.e. "Cyrus") & Kambojas & Parama-Kambojas (Domain of Kambūǰiya i.e. "Cambyses") are all peoples that are frequently mentioned in Vedic texts as following closely related cultures, and even some Vedic Rishis (and acharyas) are reputed to have lived among them - for example Kauhala, Salamkayana, Upamanyu, Madragara Shaungayani, Kamboja Aupamanyava, Sati Austraksi etc are some of the names from the Vamsha Brahmana as being based in the Kamboja/uttara-Madra janapadas.
The further we go back into the past, the more Iranians were similar to Indo-Aryans culturally. So there is no surprise that both Vedic texts and Iranic texts mention the Dasas & Dasyus even though they were living on the north-western borderlands or even further north-west outside India's current borders. The Indian janapadas were counted under the term madhyadesa
However Zoroastrian texts were not originally composed in Iran proper, but in and around Afghanistan (where Zoroaster was born) - so the dasas and dasyus of the Rgveda may have been geographically close to both the Indic and Iranic groups.
When we speak of the Rgveda, we are talking of a bigger region to the north-west of India with which the Vedic people were interacting (not merely the Indus/Punjab valley which was the home of the early Vedic civilization).
There were civilizational links with Iran (who were also following Vedic deities until the start of Zoroastrianism around 800-700 BCE or thereabouts).
The uttara-mādras (Medes), Uttara-kurus (dominion of Kūruš i.e. "Cyrus") & Kambojas & Parama-Kambojas (Domain of Kambūǰiya i.e. "Cambyses") are all peoples that are frequently mentioned in Vedic texts as following closely related cultures, and even some Vedic Rishis (and acharyas) are reputed to have lived among them - for example Kauhala, Salamkayana, Upamanyu, Madragara Shaungayani, Kamboja Aupamanyava, Sati Austraksi etc are some of the names from the Vamsha Brahmana as being based in the Kamboja/uttara-Madra janapadas.
The further we go back into the past, the more Iranians were similar to Indo-Aryans culturally. So there is no surprise that both Vedic texts and Iranic texts mention the Dasas & Dasyus even though they were living on the north-western borderlands or even further north-west outside India's current borders. The Indian janapadas were counted under the term madhyadesa
However Zoroastrian texts were not originally composed in Iran proper, but in and around Afghanistan (where Zoroaster was born) - so the dasas and dasyus of the Rgveda may have been geographically close to both the Indic and Iranic groups.
Regards,
Ramakrishnan
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Kalicharan Tuvij
Aug 23, 2019, 12:30:59 PM8/23/19
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Namaste.
Below is a reading based on my personal research:
dasyu = those not within (i.e. "below") Arya fold.
dAsa = dasyu incorporated (of own accord/ vanquished) into Arya fold (1st generation).
dAsa is a sub-branch of shudra and mostly implied low-profile, humble, livelihoods. paricharya connotation for shudra directly comes from dAsa class within shudra-s.
Only shudra varNa had the capacity to lift dasyu-s upto Arya fold : no other varNa could do it. Devata involved : parjanya.
Children of dAsa-s had bright prospects further embedding into Arya fold, though we do find some evidence of struggle recorded in Upanishad-texts.
Comparisons with Avesta etc is not fruitful as their connection with Veda is not relational rather heirarchical (tree). Infact it is the very "othering" movement (of conjuring things/people as absolute evil) that led to Zoroastrianism and subsequently other monotheisms.
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