Regarding yajnopavita kala and prayascitta

[Yasoda Jivan dasa]

Namaskar 

According to  Dharma  sastra and grihya sutras a brahmin can be initiated into upanayana between 3-16 year of his age. Furthermore, if one crosses the maximum age he is considered as vratya and should perform prayaschitta to get upanayana. 

Different literature give different prayas citta. As manu says to perform krchra, apastambha says to perform 2 months brahmacharya and so on. 

In the present age if one has crossed his 16 years than how can he be initiated into savitri? How do present Brahmins deal with this? Or what is the proper procedure prayas citta procedure. 

[Yasoda Jivan dasa]

Namaskar 

regarding to this question I want to ask one more thing. Commentators on Manu smriti and also in smriti muktaphalam it is mentioned that those who are vratyas can be purified by vratyastoma yajna. What is the procedure  of vratyastoma ritual?

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "भारतीयविद्वत्परिषत्" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bvparishat+...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/CA%2BxhfB%2BXFHt5GDhMc6HWm7JpQeO%3Dr%2BCU0FPe%3D7QwKn8pAZVSYg%40mail.gmail.com.

[venkat veeraraghavan]

Out of curiosity, if your background is Iskcon or related to it, I would suggest that you look for answers from your Gurus and your GBC. There are plenty of differences in first principles between Gaudiya and Smartha lineages and all the sources you ask about are of smartha origin.

[Yasoda Jivan dasa]

Namaskar 

Dear venkat veer raghavan ji,

I am asking in the view point of smarta principles. Although I am from kaushik leaniage, due to not following brahmanical rituals, I asked about prayascitta. Because  such family members are known as vratya according to Manu smriti.Furthermore regarding iskcon, there is a process which is popularly known as second initiation, which is the combination of upanayan and pancaratrik process.

Kindly provide present smarta view point on this.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/04c4f12b-23c7-43d1-bb71-1ba4c155e546n%40googlegroups.com.

[Mahamaho. Subrahmanyam Korada]

नमो विद्वद्भ्यः

Vid Yasoda JIvan Dasa --

1.as vratya and should perform prayaschitta to get upanayana. .....those who are vratyas can be purified by vratyastoma yajna. What is the procedure  of vratyastoma ritual? 

व्रातेन जीवति पा 5-2-21 खः - व्रातेन  शरीरायासेन  जीवति - व्रातीनः  = व्याधादिः । स इव ’शाखादिभ्यो यः’ पा 5-3-103 व्रात्यः । 

व्रतं प्रायश्चित्तम् अर्हति ’दण्डादिभ्यो यः’ पा 5-1-66 व्रात्यः ।  व्रातस्तोमम् / व्रात्यस्तोमम्  वा अर्हतीति  व्रात्यः ।

सोमयागस्य  सप्त संस्थाः । अग्निष्टोमः आद्या संस्था । अनन्तरं भवेत् (?) ।

व्रात्यः संस्कारहीनः स्यात् - अमरः (2 - 53) .

एतदेव व्रतं कुर्युः उपपातकिनो द्विजाः ।

अवकीर्णिवर्ज्यं शुद्ध्यर्थं चान्द्रायणमथापि वा ॥ मनु 11-117

So one may go for चान्द्रायणव्रतम् also . 

In HOD (History of Dharmasastra) Vidvan Kane  summarized different views on this matter (HOD II - I -- pp 59-60 , 96 ,376 , 378 .

Gagabhatta (16 AD ) got  पट्टाभिषेक (coronation) performed for Chatrapati Sivaji , after उपनयनम्  and he was supported by a couple स्मृतिs .

Sivaji was between 46-50 and had had two children .

I personally feel better follow what is prescribed by वेद --

कूश्माण्डैर्जुहुयात् यो’पूत इव मन्येत ( a person who thinks to be impure should perform कूश्माण्डहोम -- कूष्माण्डहोम) -- 11 , स्वाध्यायब्राह्मणम् , तैत्तिरीयारण्यकम् ।

I have not seen this in any स्मृति (may be I am missing) but it is green in my mind - 60 years ago my father Vid Subrahmanyam , a घनपाठी  and

वैयाकरण was supervising कूष्माण्डहोम ।

I rather think this is easier than चान्द्रायणव्रतम् , कृच्छ्रम् etc.

I also heard my father clarifying a धर्मसन्देह  -- the अन्त्यकर्म of a person (died in an accident) who crossed 16 but not उपनीत , has to be performed  on a par with one who is उपनीत ।

2.In the present age if one has crossed his 16 years than how can he be initiated into savitri? How do present Brahmins deal with this? Or what is the proper  prayascitta procedure. 

Today there are two kinds of people --

the first group of people are performing the उपनयनम् just before विवाह , i e without following the नियम like उत्तरायणम् - माघादिपञ्चकम् etc .

the second group , especially from  South , are getting the boys उपनीताः at the age of 6 - 15 (roughly) and encouraging them to learn वेद । This is there in

India and US .

धन्यो’स्मि

Dr.Korada Subrahmanyam
Adju.Professor , Dept of Heritage Science and Technology, IIT, Hyderabad

299 Doyen , Serilingampally, Hyderabad 500 019
Ph:09866110741

https://sites.google.com/view/koradeeyam/home

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/CA%2BxhfBKRPfsDvxOvFLKtaJxraTYr0kRWe%3D2R-1EG%3DbC7VEdfzQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[Yasoda Jivan dasa]

नमस्काराः 

विद्वद्वर करोडा सुब्रमण्यचरणाः ! 

धन्योस्मि ! भवद्भिर्कुष्माण्ड इत्याख्य  होमविषये यदुक्तं , तत्र का विधिरिति विषये कोपि ग्रन्थः समुपलभ्यते वा ?  

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bvparishat/CAKj2ELT6p2x34%2BufMW87BYwX1Yu2pFg1AK2hYybAUA%3DWN0KxxQ%40mail.gmail.com.