Host in August with an event?

[Brian]

Hi all... I know this is a ways away, but I'd like to offer to host in
August, if its open. I was thinking of suggesting some sort of event
with it. Either a brew day or a style competition. Any thoughts?

For the brew day, we could just rally equipment and brew together.
Seems logistically a little difficult, but can be done - look up AHA
Big Brew Day. This year's Big Brew Day is May 7th, wish I could host
for that but I'll have my in-laws visiting then.

For the style comp - we could just pick a style and everyone brew
something, and if it's August we're shooting for, then we've got
plenty of time for most beers. This isn't really to see which is
best, it's just for fun and ends up being a great conversational piece
(both before and at the event) to see how everyone reached a similar
goal, i.e. what ingredients people used, what procedures they went
through, and more beer geekery that most of us love to talk about.

Anyways, just a thought. I'm down with just getting together and
sampling everyone's goodies too, I enjoy the social part of hanging
with everyone the most.

Brian

[Matt Welz]

I think this is a great idea!

Being summertime and all there are a lot of styles that could really
work if we wanted to do the style thing: hefeweizen, wit, blondes, fruit
beer, etc...

I've seen group brews also work out nicely with a group goal (i.e.
everyone brewing towards a mega batch) and without a group goal (i.e.
everyone brings their stuff, we brew simulataneously and randomly, spend
the day together, eat, whatever).

I'm happily up for either event, in long-winded conclusion.

Matt

[Mark Weber]

Keep it broad and maybe just say wheat beer?  That way if you're not into a particular style you don't feel excluded, but at least there's a common enough theme...

Group brew is also a great idea, and a really nice way to spend the day outside with friends and beer.

[Amy Quenneville]

I'm in for both!  Wheat beers sound good, we can definitely get a lot of variety if we want by playing around with different yeast.

[B. Eckert]

Mark, one argument against that is that you may not want to do it, but may end up liking it.  Maybe, just maybe. 

I'm open to just about any style though.

On Thu, Apr 28, 2011 at 12:53 PM, Mark Weber <mrw...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Matt Welz]

Playing devil's advocate (i.e. my schtick) I think there are benefits from all of us doing our own interpretation of a particular single style.

In particular, I'd argue that it's much harder to learn from each other if I do an american raspberry wheat beer with Wyeast 1056 and you do an imperial belgian wit, say.  Those are two completely different beers [hops, actually different base malts to an extent, yeast, and additives would all be different] with not much of a common starting point.  Not saying it wouldn't be fun to try different beers but it would be way less educational in my view, IF education is a goal in addition to mere enjoyment.

My experience with the Green Mountain Masher's American Rye beer challenge was really interesting/informative.  At first,  I thought the style was too dull for words.  I put together a recipe anyway and was pleasantly surprised to see:

a) the effect of rye against a neutral malt background in conjunction with my hop selection
b) the pretty big variety of flavors people get by tweaking the % of rye, hops, yeast, etc... all against a common background.

As a result, I understand rye MUCH better and how different hops and yeast interact with it.  Every beer there was different [just compare mine and Brian's].

I am not wedded to any particular idea and a BREW Wheat beer festival would be a lot of fun.  I'd probably brew several for it, in fact.  Just wanted to point out we might learn more and be surprised by the differences if we all had a more common starting point.  Oh yeah, and I just like to be difficult!

Cheers,

Matt

[Amy Quenneville]

Another interesting learning experience would be to use the same base malts and hops and everyone can use a different yeast.  I'm down with whatever but I would prefer an educational goal.  I've never brewed an all grain wheat so even just brewing one would be educational for me!  If we just pick one style for us all to brew it would be really cool to see what everyone comes up with and how much the different grain bills and hops affect the beer. 

[Mark Weber]

My initial thought was "but what if you're stuck with 5 gallons of a beer that you're not excited about?" but it sounds like a great excuse to try doing smaller batches, and I'd love to try a 2-gallon all-grain batch.

Who wants to pick the style?

[Matt Welz]

Yeah, that's a fair point -- I had the same worry with the Rye beer.  That is a risk inherit to any style we'd pick. Nothing ventured, nothing gained?

For what it's worth, I do brew a lot of small batches (3 gallon) in addition to 5 gallon batches and they seem to work out pretty well.  This could also be a good opportunity for a split batch -- use different yeasts or dry hops or something in two mini-batches. 

One thing, I think Brian suggested while chatting, is maybe a Facebook vote?  Maybe, we could somehow narrow it down to a few warm weather, "summery", styles and then put it to the people?

Matt

[ev...@evanrutledgeborden.dreamhosters.com]

Just to put in my two cents (even though I haven't made a meeting). A friend and I just brewed the exact same same beer with only two variables. The grain bill, mashing temps/times and hop additions were the same, but we each used different yeast. The other variable is that we used sap instead of water and the sap came from two different places, so it had varying sugar content.

However the results of this experiment have been very interesting. The beers are still young but the difference is striking and really exhibits how much of an impact yeast has on flavor.

He used wyeast american ale and I used wyeast irish ale. As you can expect his is a lot cleaner with a hint of citrus from the yeast. Mine is much dirtier, rounder and displaying some diacetyl.

All in all I think the closer your parameters are the more interesting your findings will be. Picking one style may exclude some people who don't like that style, but it will garner better results and make for a better learning experience.

[Mark Weber]

I see your two cents and raise you another two...

If we're going for a particular style, my vote goes for saison as 1) it's *the* best summer beer and 2) it's the most forgiving for those who don't have temperature control in the midst of summer. 

There are two yeast strains commonly used but the grain bill is pretty straight-forward.

[B. Eckert]

I'd be down with it. 

For anyone that cares to take a gander, here are the "official" style guidelines for Saison:

Category 16 - Belgian and French Ales
Subcategory C - Saison

Aroma: High fruitiness with low to moderate hop aroma and moderate to no herb, spice and alcohol aroma. Fruity esters dominate the aroma and are often reminiscent of citrus fruits such as oranges or lemons. A low to medium-high spicy or floral hop aroma is usually present. A moderate spice aroma (from actual spice additions and/or yeast-derived phenols) complements the other aromatics. When phenolics are present they tend to be peppery rather than clove-like. A low to moderate sourness or acidity may be present, but should not overwhelm other characteristics. Spice, hop and sour aromatics typically increase with the strength of the beer. Alcohols are soft, spicy and low in intensity, and should not be hot or solventy. The malt character is light. No diacetyl.

Appearance: Often a distinctive pale orange but may be golden or amber in color. There is no correlation between strength and color. Long-lasting, dense, rocky white to ivory head resulting in characteristic “Belgian lace” on the glass as it fades. Clarity is poor to good though haze is not unexpected in this type of unfiltered farmhouse beer. Effervescent.

Flavor: Combination of fruity and spicy flavors supported by a soft malt character, a low to moderate alcohol presence and tart sourness. Extremely high attenuation gives a characteristic dry finish. The fruitiness is frequently citrusy (orange- or lemon-like). The addition of one of more spices serve to add complexity, but shouldn’t dominate in the balance. Low peppery yeast-derived phenols may be present instead of or in addition to spice additions; phenols tend to be lower than in many other Belgian beers, and complement the bitterness. Hop flavor is low to moderate, and is generally spicy or earthy in character. Hop bitterness may be moderate to high, but should not overwhelm fruity esters, spices, and malt. Malt character is light but provides a sufficient background for the other flavors. A low to moderate tart sourness may be present, but should not overwhelm other flavors. Spices, hop bitterness and flavor, and sourness commonly increase with the strength of the beer while sweetness decreases. No hot alcohol or solventy character. High carbonation, moderately sulfate water, and high attenuation give a very dry finish with a long, bitter, sometimes spicy aftertaste. The perceived bitterness is often higher than the IBU level would suggest. No diacetyl.

Mouthfeel: Light to medium body. Alcohol level can be medium to medium-high, though the warming character is low to medium. No hot alcohol or solventy character. Very high carbonation with an effervescent quality. There is enough prickly acidity on the tongue to balance the very dry finish. A low to moderate tart character may be present but should be refreshing and not to the point of puckering.

Overall Impression: A refreshing, medium to strong fruity/spicy ale with a distinctive yellow-orange color, highly carbonated, well hopped, and dry with a quenching acidity.

Comments: Varying strength examples exist (table beers of about 5% strength, typical export beers of about 6.5%, and stronger versions of 8%+). Strong versions (6.5%-9.5%) and darker versions (copper to dark brown/black) should be entered as Belgian Specialty Ales (16E). Sweetness decreases and spice, hop and sour character increases with strength. Herb and spice additions often reflect the indigenous varieties available at the brewery. High carbonation and extreme attenuation (85-95%) helps bring out the many flavors and to increase the perception of a dry finish. All of these beers share somewhat higher levels of acidity than other Belgian styles while the optional sour flavor is often a variable house character of a particular brewery.

History: A seasonal summer style produced in Wallonia, the French-speaking part of Belgium. Originally brewed at the end of the cool season to last through the warmer months before refrigeration was common. It had to be sturdy enough to last for months but not too strong to be quenching and refreshing in the summer. It is now brewed year-round in tiny, artisanal breweries whose buildings reflect their origins as farmhouses.

Ingredients: Pilsner malt dominates the grist though a portion of Vienna and/or Munich malt contributes color and complexity. Sometimes contains other grains such as wheat and spelt. Adjuncts such as sugar and honey can also serve to add complexity and thin the body. Hop bitterness and flavor may be more noticeable than in many other Belgian styles. A saison is sometimes dry-hopped. Noble hops, Styrian or East Kent Goldings are commonly used. A wide variety of herbs and spices are often used to add complexity and uniqueness in the stronger versions, but should always meld well with the yeast and hop character. Varying degrees of acidity and/or sourness can be created by the use of gypsum, acidulated malt, a sour mash or Lactobacillus. Hard water, common to most of Wallonia, can accentuate the bitterness and dry finish.

Vital Statistics:	OG: 1.048 – 1.065
IBUs: 20 – 35	FG: 1.002 – 1.012
SRM: 5 – 14	ABV: 5 – 7%

Commercial Examples: Saison Dupont Vieille Provision; Fantôme Saison D’Erezée - Printemps; Saison de Pipaix; Saison Regal; Saison Voisin; Lefebvre Saison 1900; Ellezelloise Saison 2000; Saison Silly; Southampton Saison; New Belgium Saison; Pizza Port SPF 45; Lost Abbey Red Barn Ale; Ommegang Hennepin

[Chris Duncan]

Melissa and Mark,
Can you share or email me the recipe for the Imperial Porter you
shared at the April meeting? - Good stuff
Thanks!
-Chris

On Apr 29, 2:02 pm, "B. Eckert" <yoeck...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I'd be down with it.
>
> For anyone that cares to take a gander, here are the "official" style
> guidelines for Saison:
>

> *Category 16 - Belgian and French Ales
> Subcategory C - Saison*
>
> *Aroma:* High fruitiness with low to moderate hop aroma and moderate to no

> herb, spice and alcohol aroma. Fruity esters dominate the aroma and are
> often reminiscent of citrus fruits such as oranges or lemons. A low to
> medium-high spicy or floral hop aroma is usually present. A moderate spice
> aroma (from actual spice additions and/or yeast-derived phenols) complements
> the other aromatics. When phenolics are present they tend to be peppery
> rather than clove-like. A low to moderate sourness or acidity may be
> present, but should not overwhelm other characteristics. Spice, hop and sour
> aromatics typically increase with the strength of the beer. Alcohols are
> soft, spicy and low in intensity, and should not be hot or solventy. The
> malt character is light. No diacetyl.
>

> *Appearance:* Often a distinctive pale orange but may be golden or amber in

> color. There is no correlation between strength and color. Long-lasting,
> dense, rocky white to ivory head resulting in characteristic “Belgian lace”
> on the glass as it fades. Clarity is poor to good though haze is not
> unexpected in this type of unfiltered farmhouse beer. Effervescent.
>

> *Flavor:* Combination of fruity and spicy flavors supported by a soft malt

> character, a low to moderate alcohol presence and tart sourness. Extremely
> high attenuation gives a characteristic dry finish. The fruitiness is
> frequently citrusy (orange- or lemon-like). The addition of one of more
> spices serve to add complexity, but shouldn’t dominate in the balance. Low
> peppery yeast-derived phenols may be present instead of or in addition to
> spice additions; phenols tend to be lower than in many other Belgian beers,
> and complement the bitterness. Hop flavor is low to moderate, and is
> generally spicy or earthy in character. Hop bitterness may be moderate to
> high, but should not overwhelm fruity esters, spices, and malt. Malt
> character is light but provides a sufficient background for the other
> flavors. A low to moderate tart sourness may be present, but should not
> overwhelm other flavors. Spices, hop bitterness and flavor, and sourness
> commonly increase with the strength of the beer while sweetness decreases.
> No hot alcohol or solventy character. High carbonation, moderately sulfate
> water, and high attenuation give a very dry finish with a long, bitter,
> sometimes spicy aftertaste. The perceived bitterness is often higher than
> the IBU level would suggest. No diacetyl.
>

> *Mouthfeel:* Light to medium body. Alcohol level can be medium to

> medium-high, though the warming character is low to medium. No hot alcohol
> or solventy character. Very high carbonation with an effervescent quality.
> There is enough prickly acidity on the tongue to balance the very dry
> finish. A low to moderate tart character may be present but should be
> refreshing and not to the point of puckering.
>

> *Overall Impression:* A refreshing, medium to strong fruity/spicy ale with a

> distinctive yellow-orange color, highly carbonated, well hopped, and dry
> with a quenching acidity.
>

> *Comments:* Varying strength examples exist (table beers of about 5%

> strength, typical export beers of about 6.5%, and stronger versions of 8%+).
> Strong versions (6.5%-9.5%) and darker versions (copper to dark brown/black)
> should be entered as Belgian Specialty Ales (16E). Sweetness decreases and
> spice, hop and sour character increases with strength. Herb and spice
> additions often reflect the indigenous varieties available at the brewery.
> High carbonation and extreme attenuation (85-95%) helps bring out the many
> flavors and to increase the perception of a dry finish. All of these beers
> share somewhat higher levels of acidity than other Belgian styles while the
> optional sour flavor is often a variable house character of a particular
> brewery.
>

> *History:* A seasonal summer style produced in Wallonia, the French-speaking

> part of Belgium. Originally brewed at the end of the cool season to last
> through the warmer months before refrigeration was common. It had to be
> sturdy enough to last for months but not too strong to be quenching and
> refreshing in the summer. It is now brewed year-round in tiny, artisanal
> breweries whose buildings reflect their origins as farmhouses.
>

> *Ingredients:* Pilsner malt dominates the grist though a portion of Vienna

> and/or Munich malt contributes color and complexity. Sometimes contains
> other grains such as wheat and spelt. Adjuncts such as sugar and honey can
> also serve to add complexity and thin the body. Hop bitterness and flavor
> may be more noticeable than in many other Belgian styles. A saison is
> sometimes dry-hopped. Noble hops, Styrian or East Kent Goldings are commonly
> used. A wide variety of herbs and spices are often used to add complexity
> and uniqueness in the stronger versions, but should always meld well with
> the yeast and hop character. Varying degrees of acidity and/or sourness can
> be created by the use of gypsum, acidulated malt, a sour mash or
> Lactobacillus. Hard water, common to most of Wallonia, can accentuate the
> bitterness and dry finish.

>   *Vital Statistics*:  OG: 1.048 – 1.065   IBUs: 20 – 35  FG: 1.002 –

> 1.012  SRM: 5 – 14 ABV: 5 – 7%
>

> *Commercial Examples:* Saison Dupont Vieille Provision; Fantôme Saison

> D’Erezée - Printemps; Saison de Pipaix; Saison Regal; Saison Voisin;
> Lefebvre Saison 1900; Ellezelloise Saison 2000; Saison Silly; Southampton
> Saison; New Belgium Saison; Pizza Port SPF 45; Lost Abbey Red Barn Ale;
> Ommegang Hennepin
>

[nathan shappy]

I really like the idea of going with the same base ingredients and altering only one or two variables. It seems like it would be a great way to see (and of course, taste) the differences the variables make. I have yet to try and copy any of the brews I've done before, let alone play with a couple of the ingredients. It would also be fun to choose a style and see what crazy ideas people come up with. once we get a date picked I'll see about taking that day off for the fun.

Nate

---

Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2011 10:24:23 -0400
Subject: Re: [BurlingtonBREW] Host in August with an event?
From: ev...@evanrutledgeborden.dreamhosters.com
To: burling...@googlegroups.com