B2 unresponsive

[Steve Povey]

I bought my B2 in October 2017. It becomes unresponsive after being unused for a day or two. The display shows the date but it will not respond to any button, or remote. So, I unplug it, turn back on and then reset the SETTINGS.
I have tried reseating the Micro card but it has no effect. I find this very tiresome and time consuming.
The micro card has the following info on it :-
Micro SD
HC
Class 10
8Gb

Can anyone help solve this problem please ? After nearly 2 years, I am losing patience with the B2.
Steve Povey

[Daniel Taylor]

Does it continue to be unresponsive no matter what you do?  Or does it start working at some point and then after a couple days unused, it then goes unresponsive again?  I'm trying to determine if it's a software or hardware problem.

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

Are you saying your B2 will not come out of Standby if left for a couple of days?

What software version are you running?

I power my B2 on and off every time I use it (usually daily) without a problem - I do usually do the Saving routine before powering off if the B2 isn't already in Standby.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

It seems to go into unresponsive standby randomly, usually after a day or two. It doesn’t become responsive if left. If left alone for a weekend, or a couple of weeks, it still stays unresponsive.
I update the software every few months. It is currently using software updated April 26 2019.
Steve Povey

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

There was a post from some time ago with a similar problem and it appeared to be caused by the WiFi/Internet. If this drops out repeatedly the B2 froze whilst trying to re-establish a connection. So as an experiment remove the WiFi dongle (power off first) and see if the B2 freezes if left for a couple of days.

If OK check your WiFi signal level - Settings > Maintenance > WiFi Strength - it needs to be at least -60dBm (-50dBm being better and -70dBm being worse) and should not fluctuate wildly for a reliable connection.

Alternatively power off the B2 when you are not using it.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

Thanks for your comments.
The wifi signal is 50 dB. I have removed dongle and will leave for a while.
The last suggestion, of powering off each night is not what I want. I have a playlist set up for waking up music. I also set the Random on. If I power off, then I will have to reset Random on and Playlist on each morning, which is a tedious operation.
Steve Povey

[Steve Povey]

To PMB
I started up the B2 today after a week untouched and without the wifi dongle. Started OK. Does this mean the dongle is redundant ?

Steve Povey

[Mark Fishman]

> I started up the B2 today after a week untouched and without the wifi dongle. Started OK. Does this mean the dongle is redundant ?

Only if you don't want to connect to wifi.

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

Have you got the B2 connected to your LAN with an Ethernet cable?

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

No. The B2 is 5m upstairs connected to the internet by wifi. A wi-fi range extender (tp-link re200) is used in the room.

Steve Povey

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

There have been reports of issues when using WiFi extenders. Will the B2 connect to the main hub or is the signal too weak?

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

I would need to run a wire 5m upstairs to the B2. What kind of wire is used, what are the connectors and is there a limit on the length of wire used ?

Steve Povey

[Edwyn Corteen]

This extender has an Ethernet port in it, all you would need is a short Ethernet cable connected between the B2 and the extender, see this page for the Ethernet section https://www.brennan.co.uk/itemcontent.php/content/Techy

If you don't have one ask one of your techy friends or get one at PC World etc.

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

Evidently the spec for CAT5 cabling is 100m (approx 300ft) but this is for ideal conditions (no interference, etc), so I would have thought 5m is no problem.

I've fitted a short male-female Ethernet extension to my B2 to allow me to easily disconnect it from the network - I move my B2 around quite a bit during testing...

Once plugged in you may find you have to reboot the router to get the B2 connected. The display will then show 'Ethernet 192.168.1.216' for example.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

Thanks Paul
I have a JB7 downstairs. Maybe, I will swap them around.
Steve Povey

[Steve Povey]

I fitted a 10m ethernet cable between the B2 and extender recently. The B2 got on to the internet fine. But last week it froze again and I had to reboot and change the settings again. Then it froze again this morning ! I am disturbed that the problem persists. The software was updated in August.

[Dennis Lefebvre]

I think you established in early July that the B2 does not lockup when there is no internet connection. When it freezes is the time shown on the front panel, allowing you to know when it occurred? If it's about the same time each day it might be something your ISP does (over night)?  How is the WiFi Extender connected to the router?

[Steve Povey]

There is no time display when it freezes. The extender is connected to the router via the mains.

[Daniel Taylor]

Can you remove your extender from the situation and connect the B2 directly to the router with a cable - even if only temporarily, for troubleshooting.

[Steve Povey]

Not easily. The router is downstairs and the B2 is upstairs (and not above the router). Also, I am loath to buy another cable.
Thanks for your interest.
Steve Povey

[Dennis Lefebvre]

Is there any wireless segment in the connection? 

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

It would be useful to know how the B2 behaves when plugged into the main router rather than the extender. We have had reports of problems using mains wired extenders before so it would be good to remove it from the system, as a test.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

No

[Steve Povey]

I do not have a cable long enough to go from router to B2. They are in different rooms, on different levels about 50 m apart.

[Daniel Taylor]

Earlier in this thread (July 10), you mentioned the posibility of swapping your downstairs JB7 with the upstairs B2.  It's just temporary for a test.  If the problem turns out to be your extender, then you'll be better able to decide what to do.  If the problem remains, even with the extender out of the picture, then that will point you in a different direction.

[Steve Povey]

The JB7 downstairs is located 27 feet away from the router and I do not have a spare cable.

Further suggestions appreciated.

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

How about moving the B2 as close as you can to the router and connect using WiFi - it would be good to get the extender our of the system to prove/disprove it's causing the issue. Make sure the B2 is connected to the main router, not the extender....

I power my B2 on and off nearly every day, as part of my support role and have never had a problem doing this. I usually press and hold the Play/Stop button until 'Saving' has been displayed briefly and the clock is shown again before removing power (at the mains socket). If the B2 is already in Standby I just power off.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

Another thought - try selecting WiFi Watchdog from the Advanced menu.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

I have “forced on” hifi watchdog. What does it do?

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

Has it improved the connection?

There's only the description on the Menu page to go by - WiFi Watchdog.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Edwyn Corteen]

Hi Steve

Watchdog monitors the WiFi status and, as soon as a dropout is detected, it reconnects

[Steve Povey]

Unfortunately no. My B2 froze this morning (Tuesday 10 Sept), so I had to reboot it and reset the settings.

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

The RE200 has an Ethernet port and if I'm reading the description correctly you should be able to connect the B2 to that port.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

It is already connected to the ethernet port and it still becomes unresponsive in time. So now I have disconnected the ethernet port and also switched off the TP-link device, which saddens me that I have bought the TP-link and the ethernet cable without benefit. But this setup takes me right back to the start. So I expect it will eventually become unresponsive again. I have become pessimistic that this problem will ever be solved.

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

I'm sure this is a WiFi related issue and we can sort it one way or another.

So without the Ethernet cable and TP Link, is the B2 connected to WiFi (your main router) or can it not see your router? You may have to Reset WiFi, to clear the settings and run Setup WiFi again.

Another thing to try, to prove whether it's WiFi causing the issue, is to run the B2 without the WiFi dongle as a test.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Dennis Lefebvre]

On Friday, September 13, 2019 at 4:12:43 AM UTC-4, PMB wrote:

Another thing to try, to prove whether it's WiFi causing the issue, is to run the B2 without the WiFi dongle as a test.

I think Steve has already done this, scroll back to 5 July.  

[PMB]

Thanks Dennis.

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

Just reread the thread and if you have the B2 connected to the TP LInk with an Ethernet cable you don't need the WiFi dongle.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

I have tried the following combinations :-
1) B2 without dongle or Tp- link
2) B2 with dongle only
3) B2 with tp- link and dongle
4) B2 with tp- link and Ethernet cable

The B2 becomes unresponsive after a while in every case. Any suggestions ..?

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

Email us with your address and request a replacement SD Card - it may be a software issue.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

Returned from my overseas trip yesterday. So today I installed the micro card you sent me, thanks, connected  to the ethernet, set up the B2 and now all I can do is wait to see if the problem recurs.

Cheers, Steve.

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

That's great, thanks for letting us know.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

Monday 11 November 2019

Sad news. My B2 was unresponsive this morming. The remote has a new battery, so not that.

Steve Povey

[Edwyn Corteen]

Hi Steve

Do you leave your B2 on all the time? If so try switching WiFi Watchdog on, found in settings/maintenance/advanced.

[Steve Povey]

OK, I’ve set it on. Nothing seems to have happened. What should happen ?

Cheers,

Steve

[Edwyn Corteen]

hi steve

you will see nothing different but hopefully the B2 will not go unresponsive!

[Steve Povey]

Thanks Edwyn.

Looked at the menu page on the B2 website. No wiser !

Cheers, Steve.

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

Some owners have found that the B2 can freeze when left on all of the time and the cause appears to be when the WiFi signal is lost repeatedly. WiFi watchdog monitors the connection and forces a reconnection.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Clan]

I used to leave my B2 on all the time for weeks , no problem , however i do not now as the Oled display is going to fade and by the time i need one you won't be selling spares , Perhaps I will  have buy one from you now as they are listed .  This has happened to my JB7 to some extent ,  but the display is not available and the charge for repair is  far too high .

[Dennis Lefebvre]

You can set the OLED to turn itself off when not playing. Front panel > Settings > Maintenance > Screen Saver > 16 

[Daniel Taylor]

Clan,

There are display settings and standby settings that can be set to greatly reduce the wear on the display while the unit is idle.  But the better choice, IMO, is to turn it off when not in use.

[Clan]

The clock is a nice feature though , why couldn't it have been a vacuum florescent , I have an AKAI  Hi Fi clock timer for my Hi Fi with one,  it has been on constantly  since 1979 with no degradation . That's 40 years ! Where will our Brennans be in 2060 I wonder :-)

[Mark Fishman]

Your Akai clock was made with lead solder. Undoubtedly the B2 is made with reduced-lead or lead-free solder -- in the USA we have something called the Reduction of Hazardous Substances Act; you might see the lable RoHS-compliant on stuff -- and the solder will develop thermally induced cracks in 5 years (or if you're really lucky, 10).

Modern electronics breaks after 5-7 years in almost al cases, usually for that reason (or else any electrolytic capacitors swell, leak, and stop working).

Keep good backups. Refresh them (by copying and verifying) every 4-6 years. Anything that exists in only one place doesn't really exist. Yes, it's a real burden; ask your local librarian or museum curator what they do about digital media and the proprietary hardware/software needed to make sense of them.

In 100 years our descendants will look back at us and wonder why we deliberately created a new Dark Age.

[Clan]

It is the same with cars packed with circuit boards which heat up in the sun to at least 50C  in some places then cool to -10 C   day after day  .there are companies which repair boards  with cracked solder joints now .

Indeed , all this digital content stored on millions or  billions of hard discs all over the world it makes you wonder ,  at least photos on card  and  books and paintings  and  LP Vinyl records and even magnetic tape  with our music on last for  hundreds of years . 

When we die who is going to be bothered looking through our TB's of hard disc contents ...

[Daniel Taylor]

On Tuesday, November 12, 2019 at 3:18:04 PM UTC-5, Clan wrote:

When we die who is going to be bothered looking through our TB's of hard disc contents ...

Ha!  Who indeed.  I'm having enough trouble figuring out who to leave my LPs and CDs to.  How many of us cared much about the LPs our parents/grandparents left to us?

[Clan]

my father died recently and has several thousand Cd's and   also several thousand LP records going back to the 1950's   all classical ...     what do you do  indeed ...

[Mark Fishman]

A problem with mass-produced items like those is that almost no one wants them, once they're no longer "trendy". Still, there might be some rare (and thus worth selling) items among the older LPs. If you can find someone who deals in whole collections -- they will cherry-pick the valuable items afterward, so they insist on buying the whole collection.

Or you can just hold a very large yard sale.

I'm undoubtedly going to leave a similar problem for my widow (or creditors).

[Steve Povey]

Bad news. This morning my B2 was unresponsive.

I have set up a bedroom playlist for morning relaxation. I also set Random play on and Segue on. So when the B2 is unresponsive, the remote and buttons on B2 will not work. I have to Reset the B2 by unplugging and replugging, then set the B2 to play my playlist plus the Random and Segue. This is tiresome really and upsets my relaxation routine.

Cheers,

Steve Povey.

[Mark Fishman]

Have you tried removing any network connection (wired or wireless) entirely, to test whether the B2 becomes unresponsive when it isn't even trying to connect to the Internet? (I'm hoping that you can use the B2 as a "local" music source.)

[Dennis Lefebvre]

On Thursday, November 14, 2019 at 6:07:04 PM UTC-5, Mark Fishman wrote:

Have you tried removing any network connection (wired or wireless) entirely,

Scroll back to July 5. 

[Daniel Taylor]

I just scrolled back to July 5 and started reading suggestions and replies.  Not I'm afraid of getting caught in an infinite loop.  ;o)

[Mark Fishman]

That message seems to say that Steve left the unit turned off for a week, and then turned it on without wifi. Not the same as leaving it running without any Ethernet connection to see if it locks up after a couple of days.

Sorry if I am missing something essential here.

[Dennis Lefebvre]

On Thursday, November 14, 2019 at 8:29:10 PM UTC-5, Mark Fishman wrote:

That message seems to say that Steve left the unit turned off for a week,

The post from 28 June suggests otherwise, but I expect Steve will clarify.  

[Daniel Taylor]

Steve,

How long did you operate the B2 without WiFi?

Did it lockup at all during that period of time?

[PMB]

Hi Steve,

We would offer to take a look at your unit but if there is a fault it would probably be very difficult to find. You say the B2 works OK without WiFi or Ethernet connection so it's looking like it may be something to do with your broadband. Do you have problems with low connection speed and/or dropouts?

Please email me so we can discuss further.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Steve Povey]

I have tried the B2 with, and without wifi and also with an Ethernet connection.