Request for Stability and Less Frequent Software Updates

[Peter Gilbert]

As a former IT professional, I am alarmed to see the frequent software updates to the Brennan B2.

Software releases should, I believe, be bundled together and a full, exhaustive set of regression tests undertaken to ensure the stability of the system before they go into production. I recognise there may be instances when an emergency fix might be required, but having seen the variety of issues that crop up in this forum, it seems highly risky to keep pushing out software updates every few weeks. It is also annnoying as a user because you can never be sure whether a release will work satisfactorily. 

A good example of where an issue lies is the reported 'spontaneous' switching from HDD to SD. This is nuts. This sort of issue was probably introduced unwittingly. A robust and exhaustive set of use cases that are rigorously executed should have highlighted this, and the user group would be a much happier bunch of bunnies as a result.  The number of issues raised in the forum would decline and the Brennan crew would not be distracted by a constant stream of queries.

They could also focus on sorting out the website so that everything is bang up to date and properly spelt etc; it gives a very poor impression when basic grammatical mistakes (e.g. misuse of "it's" and "its") are found all over the place!! For example, the pdf user guide for Playlists is out of date and should be updated or taken down.

Regards

Peter

[Daniel Taylor]

While I can appreciate Peter's point of view, I will limit my two cents worth to this:  I wish more attention was paid to fixing reported bugs before coming out with new features.  Case in point: we now have a new equaliser, yet there continue to be reports of various problems with the WebUI.

[Tony Johnston]

And my two pence worth! So many posts seem to be requesting and expecting more and more additions to the B2. For a simple soul like me I preferred the (KISS) Keep It Simple Stupid principle. Adding more and more innovations seems to be counter productive.

[Blayne]

Spot On  Peter. The B2 is a tinkerers delight that borders on fraud. As soon as I purchased my BR2 I knew I had gotten screwed. As soon as it operated as it should Brennan would upgrade the OS and all hell would break loose. Every purchaser added to the list of desired features and Brennan would accommodate. I think the only goal was to make the BR2 be everything for everybody. I am scared to death of doing another upgrade. I would be thrilled if Brennan would issue one last debugged upgrade to fulfill the bogus promises of the early advertisements. Dump a lot of the bells and whistles, give us a stable website and a stable GUI. Blayne Olsen

[Edwyn Corteen]

Hi Blayne

Fraud? I don't think so, you are not forced, ever, to update the software, so If you are happy with the B2 you can leave it as is until an update you do want is released.

"bogus promises of the early advertisements." What are these? The B2 has always done exactly what I wanted, and was advertised, ever since it was first released.

Ever since then the software has continuously been improved and added to, without costing us a penny! Can you name any other HiFi device that is continuously updated with over the air updates?

[Blayne]

Hi Edwyn,

Any update I would do now will give me potential problems with an Equalizer I don't need or want , disappearing playlists, switching from HDD to to SD, playlists that won't play. So my question to you and to Brennan is "When will I see an update that announces that all these problems will not present themselves and that there will be no danger of introducing any new problems".  I'm not holding my breath. 

cheers, Blayne

[Graham Trent]

Only had my B2 for a month but I love having new features added to the system which is only a music player for the home! It reminds me of my Topfield PVR which also had loads of software that could be loaded.

[MRB]

I sympathize with requests for stability -- but I prefer the rapid addition of new features. The NAS and DLNA capabilites are huge and I appreciate the rapid pace of innovation.

-Mark

[Iain Horbury]

I bought a B2 just over a year ago hoping it would enhance the enjoyment I had from listening to the music on my JB7 ....... and it has done just that.

I have always regarded Martin as an enthusiastic music lover who is constantly striving to give us improvements to our listening enjoyment by introducing new features and refining a fairly unique product. The recent (free) Equalizer, for instance, has greatly improved the sound of my many remastered versions of vinyl recordings which have always sounded lifeless.

Support from Martin, Paul and the Forum have helped (and continue to do so) when I struggle to understand aspects of the B2 which are beyond my technical knowledge. I imagine there are

few companies who are as consumer oriented as Brennan and this particular customer is more than satisfied.

Iain

[Tony Johnston]

I converted to from the JB7 to the B2, 2TB version a few years ago [external sd card version] and wouldn't be without it. With something like 3,000 CDs/LPs and still adding, it's an amazing bit of kit and in use many hours per day. I don't consider myself a technophob, nor a computer whizkid, but a lot of the changes and requests for changes leave me bemused. The B2 is powered by a Raspberry Pi, I don't know what version is in my B2. I just wonder what the limits are with this type of processor and whether our demands are potentially trying to push it too far. Hopefully someone one with the IT expertise can tell me.

[RaymondO]

I have to agree that I like the updates - in almost every case it brings additional usefulness and if I compare the feature-Set when I bought it, and what it is like now 2+ years down the line, all this has cost me £0 extra. You are not forced to update - indeed some like to skip them until any bugs are trapped and reported in the forum as being a non issue. I’m not going to complain about a service that brings extra functionality that I don’t have to pay for!

The more I use it, The more I enjoy it - and the support on here is higher than most groups I belong to. Expecting NOT to be a beta tester is a choice only the b2 owner can make, and if the HDD/Sd switch of the March update did anything - it perhaps helped some realise that having a backup to the single HDD might just be a good idea!

[RobF]

I also like the updates and that PMB tries to respond as much as he does. I am sure that can get a little tiresome. How many websites or companies actually respond? Not many. Nothing is perfect and I initially had a few “what’s going on” questions. However I think it’s a great product to that fills a niche. I just sold some/half of my used cds now that I have put them all on the Brennan. I have connected it to speakers via Bluetooth, wires and amp. I have done a full backup. No issues. I also have another server that contains my and all my family’s music but I like the Brennan for its conversion function, portability and keeping my music separate.

[Peter Gilbert]

Interesting to see the reaction.

To be clear, I don't have any issue with innovation and adding functionality.  It just needs to be done in a controlled and rigorous manner, and not at break neck speed whch seems to be the case at the moment.  I should not have to worry about the impact when I take a software update. The new functionality should work as intended and existing functionality should not be compromised. That can only be achieved by rigorous analysis, diligent software development, and comprehensive testing.

Someone mentioned that we are not forced to take updates.  However, I have no idea what bugs are lurking in the software version I have currently installed. I then have a decision to take.  Do I risk an update and perhaps inherit some other issues, or do I stick with the version I have and risk being caught out later when one of the bugs surfaces? I should not be put in this position.  I paid a lot of money for the B2, and it should work as expected every time I use it.

 

[Tony Johnston]

Peter Gilbert. Off topic I know, but I wish the banks with much greater resources would do what you propose.😊

[fk00...@gmail.com]

Peter makes a valid point -- providers of consumer products have some level of obligation to their customers to ensure updates are stable and do not cause unintended additional issues. All that takes is better in-house Quality Control prior to the update release. All tech companies follow some form of this testing model with varying degrees of success.

Peter is merely suggesting B2 owners would benefit if the company more rigorously tested its updates prior to release. That is not an unreasonable expectation from the consumer perspective... not every B2 purchaser expects they also purchased an ongoing role as a guinea pig beta tester...

[Dick Cooper]

As another former programmer I think paying customers deserve updates that have been rigorously tested. Perhaps a set of volunteer beta testers could be found who would be willing to download updates from a beta site and help Martin with the testing.

[keith gardner]

64G SD Card, 2½ years old, Operated only via front panel and remote control.

While I can agree (or sympathise) with most views posted here, the KISS approach appears to have been lost. There is no separation from basic operational improvements and bug fixes, and the 'enhancements' that many do not need (or want). Perhaps a two stream approach would help.

This response was triggered after updating (web upgrade) to 11.march.19 software version. My B2 is now effectively 'bricked', refuses to play music while recognising, albums/artists/tracks present on lower rolling display and on 'info page'. This is not what I expect after 2½ years. On the last two occasions I hit this snag I had to do a music reload. This type of bug should have been eliminated long ago.

[w.a.f...@btinternet.com]

I'm with Peter Gilbert here. I feel there are far too many versions being released and these cannot have been properly tested. I would like to see far fewer general releases, but these well tested stable releases, along with better documentation. By all means produce beta releases for those who are happy to be involved in the testing, but for those of us who want a simple life, the fewer new features/bugs the better.

[Tony Hetherington]

Agreed... stable, well tested updates only. Martin should consider the majority of his customers who just want a device to work as advertised with minimum complications. This forum seems to have a lot of more technically minded people who encourage Martin to push changes too quickly, to the detriment of stability in performance.

[RaymondO]

For those that have no interest in updates (as I was with my J7 Over 3 years) nobody forced me to update and it worked as advertised. At the end of the day, it is still a computer and updating is within the gift of the owner. Considering to do so is OPTIONAL the consumer has a choice. Many things can happen that will result in a product being ‘bricked’ almost none of them due to the manufacturers error but a user mistake or power fluctuations at the ‘wrong’ time.

I find it hypocritical for those to complain about b2 updates when it is most likely their very own computer is doing exactly the same thing (and not asking them either). For those that have the ability and enjoyment of using the b2 to the full, why should an excellent product be held back just because some ‘cannot handle’ some updates should something go wrong? This forum is the place to seek help and is highly regarded - I wouldn’t expect this to change.

I would hate for Martin to feel his efforts are unappreciated and flounce off to abandon the b2 whilst resolving to make the b3 (or whatever) a non-upgradesble Box users can only the firmware that shipped on the day of manufacturing. We cannot have it both ways.

[Tony Johnston]

Agreed Tony Hetherington. My B2 is now my primary music listening device and I'm really pleased with it having upgraded from the JB7 a few years ago.
The only thing that I would find really helpful at this stage is making more of the "knob twirling" actions available on the UI. It's too easy to twist and press the wrong menu item then have to start again.

[Tony Hetherington]

Raymond O.... I am not against the B2 being updated, just that it seems to be happening too frequently to allow for full testing for bugs/undesirable effect. I appreciate Martin's efforts and indeed my B2 is quite different from the one I bought three years ago.. I just update infrequently due to having to wait for bugs to surface.

I am very happy with my B2 and like many others it is my only source of listening to music. My CD's have long been consigned to boxes in the loft 

I also have my laptop and smartphone set to 'ask before updating' so am not hypercritical

[RaymondO]

Ah but Tony..... The default state for most kit is automatic! The b2 will never update unless the user actually chooses to do so! 🤠

[KAT]

Hello I agree with Peter. Please remember that many of us purchased this because of the ergonomics: a cd juke box, plus a few extras, all controlled by your phone or lap top, or, by the knobs on the front. Please do continue improving the software, but perhaps just have 2 fully, well tested, upgrades a year, or maybe even just one a year. For those who like tinkering, or have the time, give them the option to upgrade more frequently. Please just make it clear when an upgrade is stable.

Thank you.

[Jasper Warwick]

I have to say that one of things I love about the B2 is how quickly the user interface is developing and the changes over the last 18 months have genuinely transformed how I listen to my music. The new mobile user interface (when it is finished) will be great, I do think there is a strong argument for having a stable release when it is complete that the majority of users can use and a beta release that feature hungry users (like me) can continue to upgrade for the latest developments. 

[Nick Hickson]

I'd like to see a change to the 'Maintenance' menu' where currently there are far too many options there and especially the ability to easily delete the contents of one's HDD.

I would like to see Maintenance '1' say and then things where damage can be done consigned to, say, 'Maintenance 2' where those almost destructive, irreversible options could be hidden away.

[PMB]

Hi All,

Thanks for the suggestions.

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Mitch Russo]

I am very satisfied with my purchase. The B2 does everything I thought it should except pay attention to genre tags, which is my only request of substance. I applaud the Brennan crew for continuing to stay interested and excited about the product to want to add more features and make the system better and better. As a former software company owner, who happens to have sold the company to a Brittish concern (Sage) I assure you I understand the process. Yes, updates should be tested so they don't break what's already working. Personally, I stay one release behind to be sure it's been vetted thoroughly before I go forward with the next download. This has worked well over the years as my favorite software goes through the usual update/upgrade process. 

Finally, I want to emphasize that I don't see any cause to label the B2 as a fraud to any stretch of the imagination. I realize that others have had several, numerous problems. Interestingly, having been an owner for the last couple of months, and a forum visitor almost daily, most people who are reporting problems are experiencing similar issues. I have seen efforts to address those through software i.e. the WiFi problem, the SD/HD switching problem and others that have come up. I applaud the continuous development and I look forward to further enhancements as the system evolves. 

There is no other $500 box that does anything like this as well as the B2 does, as far as I know. I for one am grateful to have rediscovered so much of my own music and enjoyed the process immensely. Please don't stop, but it's ok to slow down a bit and do a wee bit more testing before a release.

Suggestion: Consider doing a beta release to those brave souls with hearty backups and want to help test new versions. Then, after beta is complete, label it is as "stable" and the rest of us can then go forward and download. 

Thanks,

Mitch

[Jasper Warwick]

@Mitch, Could not have said it better myself.

[Mil]

I am all for new innovations and additions to the software, but system stability and reliability surely should come first. Fixing bugs affecting the B2's functionality (I have to reboot and reset mine -at least- 5-7 times a week, which seems utterly ridiculous) is far more important than snazzy new features that add extra layers of complexity (and potentially new bugs) to an already shaky and unreliable UI. 

For example, if you delete anything from the B2 whilst it's playing music, as soon as the track finishes the first disc you ripped to the B2 starts playing and everything goes haywire and out of order. This is fixable by running a Scan Disk, but such a dramatic intervention really, really shouldn't be necessary after asking the B2 to accomplish such a trivial task.

Ultimately, I find it hard to understand why the B2 is so buggy and unreliable - ultimately, we're just talking about running a network-compatible digital music player on a Raspberry Pi! How can this be so difficult to get right?

(Right just now I'm listening to a new album by Will Burns & Hannah Peel, and out of nowhere "Drowning Witch" by Frank Zappa has just started. Random is NOT on because I just made sure it was OFF five minutes ago, so WTF is going on?)

[Mil]

I also find it grimly amusing how inaccessible the Reboot function is, given the number of times I have to use it...

[Tony Johnston]

Reading all of these comments I must be one of the few owners who doesn't suffer from a buggy B2. With 3000 CDs/LPs currently loaded everything seems to play as it should in spite of the regular updates. It's in use every day and even my playlists work as I want them to.

[Mil]

I will admit that the playlists seem much more reliable recently - a definite plus :)

[Mil]

Also, in the interests of fairness, I feel compelled to mention that I genuinely love my B2 - its plus points more than outweigh the negatives. I guess I can't stop thinking about how it could be even better... 

[PMB]

Hi Mil,

When you say you have to reboot your B2 5-7 times a week, what are the symptoms requiring the reboot (apart from the delete issue you have already mentioned)?

Paul

Brennan Support.

[Mil]

Hi Paul,

Sorry for the delay in my reply - I've been on holiday. Apart from when deleting tracks (which I now avoid doing when the B2 is playing, and always perform a Scan Disk afterwards), the machine stops playing songs sequentially or starts playing songs at random with no obvious input on my part or changes to the B2. It is extremely frustrating. 

[PMB]

Hi Mil,

So the B2 plays OK but sometimes starts playing in Random order rather than sequential - is that right? Do you press the NEXT button to start play - as this selects Random play mode?

Paul

Brennan Support.