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Apr 17, 2012, 2:34:49 AM4/17/12
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Take With a Grain of Salt, a review of: Prophecies & Promises
Everyone is entitled to their opinion when it comes to Book of Mormon geography, as long as you are honest in your research. This is something I did not find in Meldrums works. First of all, the Neal A. Maxwell Institute, which is run by Church owned BYU (has several members of the 12 Apostles, and First Presidency on the board of Trustees), funded with Tithing money, published a review of some of the work done by one of the authors (Rodney Meldrum), and finds that it is inaccurate at best. This is sad because we shouldn't have to be wary of fellow LDS members writings.
You can read the review on the Neal A. Maxwell site, or do a search for Often in Error, Seldom in Doubt: Rod Meldrum and Book of Mormon DNA by Dr. Gregory L. Smith FARMS Review: Volume - 22, Issue - 1, Pages: 17-161
There are modern Prophets and Apostles who have said many interesting things in dedicatory prayers for Temples in Central America. Temple dedicatory prayers are given under inspiration and are explained in the Church publication "Encyclopedia of Mormonism", as a prayer that is
"offered under apostolic authority. Historically these prayers encompass the whole sweep of the modern dispensation, invoking divine blessings on all mankind, living and dead. They have often been prophetic of world events (see D&C 109). Encyclopedia of Mormonism, p 1455
Gordon B. Hinckleys dedicatory prayer at the Guatemala City, Guatemala temple, he stated, "Thou Kind and Gracious Father, our hearts swell with gratitude for Thy remembrance of the sons and daughters of Lehi... We thank Thee O God, for lifting the scales of darkness which for generations clouded the vision of the descendants of Lehi"
In his March 6, 1999 dedicatory prayer given at the Colonia Juaréz Chihuahua Temple, Hinckley he said, "Bless Thy Saints that they may continue to live here without molestation. May they live in peace and security. May they be prospered as they cultivate their farms and pursue their vocations. May the sons and daughters of father Lehi grow in strength and in fulfillment of the ancient promises made concerning them."
In August 1999, Hinckley made a similar statement as he was in Guayaquil, Ecuador to dedicate another new LDS temple. "It has been a very interesting thing to see the descendants of father Lehi in the congregation that have gathered in the temple...So very many of these people have the blood of Lehi in their veins, and it is just an intriguing thing to see their tremendous response and their tremendous interest" (Salt Lake Tribune 11/30/2000).
While there are Temple dedicatory prayers which place Lamanites in South America, Polynesian Islands and a few in the Southern US (such as the Snowflake Arizona Temple which is far outside where Meldrums book claims to be BOM lands), it should be noted that not one inspired Temple dedicatory prayer in the Great Lakes region say anything about BOM lands, Lamanites in those areas, or anything else that would hint that they were in Book of Mormon areas. The only inspired prayers are outside of this Great Lakes geography theory.
You can read the review on the Neal A. Maxwell site, or do a search for Often in Error, Seldom in Doubt: Rod Meldrum and Book of Mormon DNA by Dr. Gregory L. Smith FARMS Review: Volume - 22, Issue - 1, Pages: 17-161
There are modern Prophets and Apostles who have said many interesting things in dedicatory prayers for Temples in Central America. Temple dedicatory prayers are given under inspiration and are explained in the Church publication "Encyclopedia of Mormonism", as a prayer that is
"offered under apostolic authority. Historically these prayers encompass the whole sweep of the modern dispensation, invoking divine blessings on all mankind, living and dead. They have often been prophetic of world events (see D&C 109). Encyclopedia of Mormonism, p 1455
Gordon B. Hinckleys dedicatory prayer at the Guatemala City, Guatemala temple, he stated, "Thou Kind and Gracious Father, our hearts swell with gratitude for Thy remembrance of the sons and daughters of Lehi... We thank Thee O God, for lifting the scales of darkness which for generations clouded the vision of the descendants of Lehi"
In his March 6, 1999 dedicatory prayer given at the Colonia Juaréz Chihuahua Temple, Hinckley he said, "Bless Thy Saints that they may continue to live here without molestation. May they live in peace and security. May they be prospered as they cultivate their farms and pursue their vocations. May the sons and daughters of father Lehi grow in strength and in fulfillment of the ancient promises made concerning them."
In August 1999, Hinckley made a similar statement as he was in Guayaquil, Ecuador to dedicate another new LDS temple. "It has been a very interesting thing to see the descendants of father Lehi in the congregation that have gathered in the temple...So very many of these people have the blood of Lehi in their veins, and it is just an intriguing thing to see their tremendous response and their tremendous interest" (Salt Lake Tribune 11/30/2000).
While there are Temple dedicatory prayers which place Lamanites in South America, Polynesian Islands and a few in the Southern US (such as the Snowflake Arizona Temple which is far outside where Meldrums book claims to be BOM lands), it should be noted that not one inspired Temple dedicatory prayer in the Great Lakes region say anything about BOM lands, Lamanites in those areas, or anything else that would hint that they were in Book of Mormon areas. The only inspired prayers are outside of this Great Lakes geography theory.
President Joseph Fielding Smith says there are "millions" of Lamanites in Mexico-
"The history of this American continent also gives evidence that the Lamanites have risen up in their anger and vexed the Gentiles. This warfare may not be over. It has been the fault of people in the United States to think that this prophetic saying has reference to the Indians in the United States, but we must remember that there are millions of the 'remnant' in Mexico, Central and South America" (Church History and Modern Revelation 2:127).
The Prophet Spencer W. Kimball said there are Lamanites all over the Western Hemisphere-
"I rejoice that it has been my privilege to carry the gospel to the Lamanites from the Pacific Ocean to the Atlantic, from the reaches of Canada to southern Chile, and in the islands from Hawaii to New Zealand." - Spencer W. Kimball, "Our Paths Have Met Again", Ensign, Dec. 1975
He makes several assumptions that are not correct, one of which is that Joseph Smith *only* taught a Great Lakes setting for The Book of Mormon. This is clearly not correct. Either the author did not really research the issue, or decided to ignore other quotes by Joseph Smith, as well as many other Prophets and Apostles in Joseph Smiths day forward. Neither option puts the research of the author in a positive light. Also, Joseph Smith published many things in the Times and Seasons and elsewhere, which placed The Book of Mormon in Central America, what is now Southern US, Western United States, Florida, Kentucky, and more. He also allowed members of the twelve apostles to declare Book of Mormon cities in Mesoamerica, repeatedly. Rodney Meldrum attempts to claim that Joseph Smith said no such thing, but the evidence says otherwise.
After Joseph Smith received the book Incidents of Travel in Central America, Chiapas, and Yucatan, which extensively goes over the Mayan ruins, history, archaeology, etc.. from John Bernhisel, Joseph Smith wrote him a thank you letter stating that this book on Mesoamerica:
"corresponds with & supports the testimony of the Book of Mormon; I have read the volumes with the greatest interest & pleasure & must say that of all histories that have been written pertaining to the antiquities of this country it is the most correct luminous & comprihensive.-..." Joseph Smith, The Personal Writings of Joseph Smith, compiled and edited by Dean C. Jessee (Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1984), 501 - 502.
"Stephens and Catherwood's researches in Central America abundantly testify of this thing. The stupendous ruins, the elegant sculpture, and the magnificence of the ruins of Guatamala, and other cities, corroborate this statement, and show that a great and mighty people-men of great minds, clear intellect, bright genius, and comprehensive designs inhabited this continent. Their ruins speak of their greatness; the Book of Mormen [Mormon} unfolds their history." Joseph Smith (editor)," American Antiquities," Times and Seasons 3/18 (15 July 1842): 860
"The history of this American continent also gives evidence that the Lamanites have risen up in their anger and vexed the Gentiles. This warfare may not be over. It has been the fault of people in the United States to think that this prophetic saying has reference to the Indians in the United States, but we must remember that there are millions of the 'remnant' in Mexico, Central and South America" (Church History and Modern Revelation 2:127).
The Prophet Spencer W. Kimball said there are Lamanites all over the Western Hemisphere-
"I rejoice that it has been my privilege to carry the gospel to the Lamanites from the Pacific Ocean to the Atlantic, from the reaches of Canada to southern Chile, and in the islands from Hawaii to New Zealand." - Spencer W. Kimball, "Our Paths Have Met Again", Ensign, Dec. 1975
He makes several assumptions that are not correct, one of which is that Joseph Smith *only* taught a Great Lakes setting for The Book of Mormon. This is clearly not correct. Either the author did not really research the issue, or decided to ignore other quotes by Joseph Smith, as well as many other Prophets and Apostles in Joseph Smiths day forward. Neither option puts the research of the author in a positive light. Also, Joseph Smith published many things in the Times and Seasons and elsewhere, which placed The Book of Mormon in Central America, what is now Southern US, Western United States, Florida, Kentucky, and more. He also allowed members of the twelve apostles to declare Book of Mormon cities in Mesoamerica, repeatedly. Rodney Meldrum attempts to claim that Joseph Smith said no such thing, but the evidence says otherwise.
After Joseph Smith received the book Incidents of Travel in Central America, Chiapas, and Yucatan, which extensively goes over the Mayan ruins, history, archaeology, etc.. from John Bernhisel, Joseph Smith wrote him a thank you letter stating that this book on Mesoamerica:
"corresponds with & supports the testimony of the Book of Mormon; I have read the volumes with the greatest interest & pleasure & must say that of all histories that have been written pertaining to the antiquities of this country it is the most correct luminous & comprihensive.-..." Joseph Smith, The Personal Writings of Joseph Smith, compiled and edited by Dean C. Jessee (Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1984), 501 - 502.
"Stephens and Catherwood's researches in Central America abundantly testify of this thing. The stupendous ruins, the elegant sculpture, and the magnificence of the ruins of Guatamala, and other cities, corroborate this statement, and show that a great and mighty people-men of great minds, clear intellect, bright genius, and comprehensive designs inhabited this continent. Their ruins speak of their greatness; the Book of Mormen [Mormon} unfolds their history." Joseph Smith (editor)," American Antiquities," Times and Seasons 3/18 (15 July 1842): 860
Joseph Smith was the Editor of the Times and Seasons, and it states on several issues where it is claimed that The Book of Mormon happened in Mesoamerica, that "The Times and Seasons, is Edited by Joseph Smith. Printed and published about the first and fifteenth of every month, on the corner of Water and Bain Streets Nauvoo, Hancock County, Illinois, by Joseph Smith."
There are MANY other examples of Joseph Smith teaching a Mesoamerican model for The Book of Mormon, but this should suffice.
Meldrum also claims that DNA proves his theory, yet there is no geneticist who backs up what he claims. I have produced a video on DNA and The Book of Mormon called "The Book of Mormon and New World DNA", and interviewed and spoke with many LDS geneticists. I spoke to them specifically about the X Haplogroup that Meldrum is using as evidence, and they all cautioned me against using it as evidence. So, I left it out of the video (which, I did for free, and get absolutely no royalties from. I did it to answer questions of those whose testimonies were shaken, and have not received one penny for my work. Meldrum has sold tens of thousands of DVD's for 25 dollars each. He has something to lose). You can click on the first link for more information on the fallacy of X Haplogroup as evidence for the BOM argument. Perhaps the mistake comes because Meldrum is not a scientist, and has no training whatsoever in genetics. He is a salesman by trade. Actual geneticists have urged him to back away from this argument because of it's flaws, but those pleas fell on deaf ears. He has ignored what doctors in this field say about his argument. These same LDS geneticists do not subscribe to any geography for The Book of Mormon. They do not care whether it took place in North America, South America, or Cuba. But, do recognize when someone, who is gaining popularity, is obviously wrong in their conclusion. They have nothing to gain or lose by explaining the fallacies of Meldrums argument, but would like to see accurate information published. They are not members of FAIR, and only present the facts.
Claims about the "Michigan relics" as evidence for The Book of Mormon have been used by Meldrum as well. But starting with Elder James E. Talmage (author of Jesus the Christ, Articles of Faith, and more) they have been shown to be forgeries. Recently, they were re-evaluated, and again, shown to be forgeries. So why are these forgeries used as evidence for The Book of Mormon? I would much rather learn about truthful evidences in behalf of The Book of Mormon than something that sounds good, but is fraudulent. This has been brought up to the author, but ignored. He now claims to have distanced himself from them, but I have personally seen them on display at his fireside, his website still sells books advocating the Michigan relics, he has pictures of them in one of his videos on the Hopewell, and you view them on your BOM geography tours with Meldrum as evidence for The Book of Mormon.
Overall, I know geneticists, archaeologists, and scholars who have no opinion on Book of Mormon geography, who have attempted to explain to Meldrum why the information he uses is not accurate, but they have been ignored. To me, this is the cherry on top of bad scholarship that give LDS a bad name. I hope to see future work by this author cleaned up, and presented with an honest look on these subjects.
There are MANY other examples of Joseph Smith teaching a Mesoamerican model for The Book of Mormon, but this should suffice.
Meldrum also claims that DNA proves his theory, yet there is no geneticist who backs up what he claims. I have produced a video on DNA and The Book of Mormon called "The Book of Mormon and New World DNA", and interviewed and spoke with many LDS geneticists. I spoke to them specifically about the X Haplogroup that Meldrum is using as evidence, and they all cautioned me against using it as evidence. So, I left it out of the video (which, I did for free, and get absolutely no royalties from. I did it to answer questions of those whose testimonies were shaken, and have not received one penny for my work. Meldrum has sold tens of thousands of DVD's for 25 dollars each. He has something to lose). You can click on the first link for more information on the fallacy of X Haplogroup as evidence for the BOM argument. Perhaps the mistake comes because Meldrum is not a scientist, and has no training whatsoever in genetics. He is a salesman by trade. Actual geneticists have urged him to back away from this argument because of it's flaws, but those pleas fell on deaf ears. He has ignored what doctors in this field say about his argument. These same LDS geneticists do not subscribe to any geography for The Book of Mormon. They do not care whether it took place in North America, South America, or Cuba. But, do recognize when someone, who is gaining popularity, is obviously wrong in their conclusion. They have nothing to gain or lose by explaining the fallacies of Meldrums argument, but would like to see accurate information published. They are not members of FAIR, and only present the facts.
Claims about the "Michigan relics" as evidence for The Book of Mormon have been used by Meldrum as well. But starting with Elder James E. Talmage (author of Jesus the Christ, Articles of Faith, and more) they have been shown to be forgeries. Recently, they were re-evaluated, and again, shown to be forgeries. So why are these forgeries used as evidence for The Book of Mormon? I would much rather learn about truthful evidences in behalf of The Book of Mormon than something that sounds good, but is fraudulent. This has been brought up to the author, but ignored. He now claims to have distanced himself from them, but I have personally seen them on display at his fireside, his website still sells books advocating the Michigan relics, he has pictures of them in one of his videos on the Hopewell, and you view them on your BOM geography tours with Meldrum as evidence for The Book of Mormon.
Overall, I know geneticists, archaeologists, and scholars who have no opinion on Book of Mormon geography, who have attempted to explain to Meldrum why the information he uses is not accurate, but they have been ignored. To me, this is the cherry on top of bad scholarship that give LDS a bad name. I hope to see future work by this author cleaned up, and presented with an honest look on these subjects.
Most every other point he makes is flawed. As I said before, it is sad that LDS scholars have to correct their own, but you can read more about it in another review by faithful Latter-day Saints, on the FAIR website, or do a search for "Reviews of DNA Evidence for Book of Mormon Geography"
Douglas K. Christensen says:This review is from: Prophecies and Promises - The Book of Mormon and the United States of America (Perfect Paperback) A comprehensive review is not possible in such a short space. The website of Book of Mormon Archaeological Forum (www.bmaf.org) contains a corpus of articles by many authors which address virtually every controversial issue from Meldrum and associates.
L. Norman Poulsen says:"Everyone is entitled to their opinion when it comes to Book of Mormon geography, as long as you are honest in your research. This is something I did not find in Meldrums works. First of all, the Neal A. Maxwell Institute, which is run by Church owned BYU (has several members of the 12 Apostles, and First Presidency on the board of Trustees), funded with Tithing money, published a review of some of the work done by one of the authors (Rodney Meldrum), and finds that it is inaccurate at best. This is sad because we shouldn't have to be wary of fellow LDS members writings." Nonsense!! - Implying that the Church Apostles agree with Neal Maxwell / Formerly Farms reviews is pure drama - not truth.
"Also, Joseph Smith published many things in the Times and Seasons and elsewhere, which placed The Book of Mormon in Central America, what is now Southern US, Western United States, Florida, Kentucky, and more. He also allowed members of the twelve apostles to declare Book of Mormon cities in Mesoamerica, repeatedly. Rodney Meldrum attempts to claim that Joseph Smith said no such thing, but the evidence says otherwise."
Not True!! - First hand validated reports that Joseph placed Book of Mormon lands in Mesoamerica are non-existant - Second hand reports that aren't validated are out there but not numerous. To say they are numerous without evidence is strains your credibility.
You've totally ignored evidence from the Book of Mormon itself covered in the book. Surely God knows where Book of Mormon lands and the Lamanites are and those places are referenced in the Book of Mormon and the Doctrine & Covenants. Certainly not everything offered up by Meldrum rings true but neither does the data from those espousing Mesoamerica as the lands of the Book of Mormon. You quote Joseph Fielding Smith who clearly states there is no Hill Cumorah in Mesoamerica in Doctrines of Salvation Volume 3, Pages 232-243. Deseret Book is buried in Book of Mormon geography books that place the "Original Hill Cumorah" in various places in Mesoamerica. We don't know for certain where all of the Book of Mormon events took place but there are some things we do know. 1) The only Hill Cumorah is in upstate New York near Palmyra. 2) The Jaredites and Nephites lived in the same land where the New Jerusalem will be established (Jackson County Missouri) Ether 13:1-10, 3 Nephi 20:21-22. Joseph places Manti in Missouri, the plains of the Nephites on the route between Kirtland and Missouri, and the remains of Zelph a Lamanite warrior convert fighting the final battles in North America and his commander Onandagus was know from the Rocky Mountains to the eastern sea. Not Mesoamerica !!!!!!! See Doctrines of Salvation cited above.
. . . Michighan relics have been thouroughly evaluated and found to be fraudulent. Really? Meldrum's point is that no scientific study can be cited which includes data and rationale for concluding they're fraudulent. Meldrum doesn't even claim they're all legitimate - just that the evaluation was cursory at best and that fraudulent items were designed based on real artifacts that had been found making it difficult to distinguish between them. You give LDS Scholars too much credence. They are looking for physical evidence while sometimes discounting or ignoring scriptural and church leadership's evidence i.e. Doctrines of Salvation quoted above.
Please cite "Word Print Studies" tying Joseph Smith to "Times & Seasons" Articles mentioned by Meldrum.
Scholars spend a lot of energy discounting that which doesn't fit their Mesoamerica outlook and very little time digging deeper, identifying and following leads that don't square with that outlook. This is a common trait of scholars both in and out of the church. It takes a great body of evidence to get the scientific and scholarly communities to consider another viewpoint. It's inherently easier to throw stones at a proposal than it is to investigate things that may support the proposal. We as Mormons have been fighting that for years -i.e. horses and elephants in Book of Mormon lands. You are very blind if you think everything coming out of the Neal Maxwell Institute squares with and is approved by the 12 Apostles and 1st Presidency. Write them yourself and see and stop condemning Meldrum and calling him dishonest and others who accept many of Meldrum's findings based on their own studies.
"Also, Joseph Smith published many things in the Times and Seasons and elsewhere, which placed The Book of Mormon in Central America, what is now Southern US, Western United States, Florida, Kentucky, and more. He also allowed members of the twelve apostles to declare Book of Mormon cities in Mesoamerica, repeatedly. Rodney Meldrum attempts to claim that Joseph Smith said no such thing, but the evidence says otherwise."
Not True!! - First hand validated reports that Joseph placed Book of Mormon lands in Mesoamerica are non-existant - Second hand reports that aren't validated are out there but not numerous. To say they are numerous without evidence is strains your credibility.
You've totally ignored evidence from the Book of Mormon itself covered in the book. Surely God knows where Book of Mormon lands and the Lamanites are and those places are referenced in the Book of Mormon and the Doctrine & Covenants. Certainly not everything offered up by Meldrum rings true but neither does the data from those espousing Mesoamerica as the lands of the Book of Mormon. You quote Joseph Fielding Smith who clearly states there is no Hill Cumorah in Mesoamerica in Doctrines of Salvation Volume 3, Pages 232-243. Deseret Book is buried in Book of Mormon geography books that place the "Original Hill Cumorah" in various places in Mesoamerica. We don't know for certain where all of the Book of Mormon events took place but there are some things we do know. 1) The only Hill Cumorah is in upstate New York near Palmyra. 2) The Jaredites and Nephites lived in the same land where the New Jerusalem will be established (Jackson County Missouri) Ether 13:1-10, 3 Nephi 20:21-22. Joseph places Manti in Missouri, the plains of the Nephites on the route between Kirtland and Missouri, and the remains of Zelph a Lamanite warrior convert fighting the final battles in North America and his commander Onandagus was know from the Rocky Mountains to the eastern sea. Not Mesoamerica !!!!!!! See Doctrines of Salvation cited above.
. . . Michighan relics have been thouroughly evaluated and found to be fraudulent. Really? Meldrum's point is that no scientific study can be cited which includes data and rationale for concluding they're fraudulent. Meldrum doesn't even claim they're all legitimate - just that the evaluation was cursory at best and that fraudulent items were designed based on real artifacts that had been found making it difficult to distinguish between them. You give LDS Scholars too much credence. They are looking for physical evidence while sometimes discounting or ignoring scriptural and church leadership's evidence i.e. Doctrines of Salvation quoted above.
Please cite "Word Print Studies" tying Joseph Smith to "Times & Seasons" Articles mentioned by Meldrum.
Scholars spend a lot of energy discounting that which doesn't fit their Mesoamerica outlook and very little time digging deeper, identifying and following leads that don't square with that outlook. This is a common trait of scholars both in and out of the church. It takes a great body of evidence to get the scientific and scholarly communities to consider another viewpoint. It's inherently easier to throw stones at a proposal than it is to investigate things that may support the proposal. We as Mormons have been fighting that for years -i.e. horses and elephants in Book of Mormon lands. You are very blind if you think everything coming out of the Neal Maxwell Institute squares with and is approved by the 12 Apostles and 1st Presidency. Write them yourself and see and stop condemning Meldrum and calling him dishonest and others who accept many of Meldrum's findings based on their own studies.
Douglas K. Christensen says:The Meldrum organization recently produced a slick documentary called Lost Civilizations of North America designed to promote the Heartland theory with the endorsement of respected non-LDS scientists. The documentary purports to be an exploration of "the fascinating world of ancient North America, and why the artifacts and evidences of ancient civilizations have been lost and largely ignored." Consequently, archaeologists Kenneth Feder and Bradley T. Lepper, historian Terry A. Barnhart, and physical anthropologist Deborah A. Bolnick were contacted and asked to participate in the production of "an exploration of the fascinating world of ancient North America, and why the artifacts and evidences of ancient civilizations have been lost and largely ignored."
These scholars were so chagrined with what Meldrum and the producers did with their statements that several of them have initiated law suits and together they have written three articles about their experiences. I contacted Mr. Feder and assured him that Meldrum's organization is not representative of scholarly work being done by LDS scholars. He graciously responded that he had come to that understanding and was aware of some of the legitimate research being done by Church members.
Rather than trying to give lots of quotes in this short response, you can read them in their entirety at the BMAF website. Part one can be found at www.bmaf.org/node/489, part two at www.bmaf.org/node/node/490 and part three at www.bmaf.org/node/495. These articles are being picked up by multiple media sources and anti-Mormon bloggers such as the Skeptical Enquirer, the Ohio Historical Society, the All Empires History Community, Ex-Mormon Forum, Twitter, Regator Best Blogs, National Library of Australia, and newspaper, magazine, and journal articles with consequential highly negative impressions that unfortunately affect the reputation of the LDS Church.
These scholars were so chagrined with what Meldrum and the producers did with their statements that several of them have initiated law suits and together they have written three articles about their experiences. I contacted Mr. Feder and assured him that Meldrum's organization is not representative of scholarly work being done by LDS scholars. He graciously responded that he had come to that understanding and was aware of some of the legitimate research being done by Church members.
Rather than trying to give lots of quotes in this short response, you can read them in their entirety at the BMAF website. Part one can be found at www.bmaf.org/node/489, part two at www.bmaf.org/node/node/490 and part three at www.bmaf.org/node/495. These articles are being picked up by multiple media sources and anti-Mormon bloggers such as the Skeptical Enquirer, the Ohio Historical Society, the All Empires History Community, Ex-Mormon Forum, Twitter, Regator Best Blogs, National Library of Australia, and newspaper, magazine, and journal articles with consequential highly negative impressions that unfortunately affect the reputation of the LDS Church.
You can participate in this discussion by sending an email to bmaf...@gmail.com
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