madhav seva vs. manav seva

[Vrajabasi das]

Please write your comments, arguments, points about

what do you think about this phrase "manava seva is madhav seva" or
"madhav seva is manav seva"

[saurabh bhatia]

Hare Krishna

Madhav Seva is the topmost service.
Because people who are doing manav seva are just catering to the bodily needs.
That gives only patch up ( or temporary) solutions
but our real identity is soul (not this material body).

We will only be happy and satisfied when we will engage ourselves in madhav seva
and "madhav seva is manav seva"
when we water the root of the plant, then we dont have to water the leaves separately.

Madhav (Lord Krishna) himself says in Bhagvad Gita-
Preaching (madhav seva) about the Lord is the top most philanthropist activity.

[rohit saluja]

Manav seva is just human sentiment and responsibility which one being think for other. Its like helping others.

No where God comes in picture.

 

 

Madhav seva is actually best manav seva.As when we water the roots all the brances are satisfied.Similarly when we serve Lord all the manav and even animals,plants etc. are satisfied.

 

On the other hands manav seva in terms of material benifits like food etc cannot be considered as Madhav seva because Lord doesnot comes in picture anywhere.

 

Jesus 1st said to Love Lord and then Love others .

 

Madhav seva means to tell others about Madhav,talk about Madhav,Love Madhav,Chant His names and glories,serve His Devotees exclusively. Which does not comes in so called Manav Seva.

 

Madhav seva means to give pleasure to Madhav.

So called Manav seva is done just to give pleasure to self - the ego.

 

Even those who dont believe in God, feel to do Manav seva. But the result sometimes is opposite.

Like if one opens an orphanages for Old people without home. Some people start throwing their old parents out of home as they know that now there is an orphanage nearby.

 

Sometimes during earthquakes the vegetarian food is supplied to people, but people refuse to have it as they like non veg diet. So much food may get wasted that time.

 

Conclusion :- Madhav seva is best seva for all including manavs. But so called Manav seva is not at all Madhav seva but just a responsibility which a human being feel for other. Even animals sometime remain in groups to help each other.

 

YS

rohit

[ravi.y kiran]

Service to  Krsna is service to mankind:

The Srimad  Bhagavatam emphasizes this  point with numerous example .One of them is  the eg. Of Pritu Maharaj.Pritu maha raj was a great devotee of Lord Krsna ,he set the perfect example  as the king of the world.He encouraged his subjects to  engage in bhakti yoga, as a result the whole world was happy and prosperous under his leadership.Service to Krsna is our natural occupation.So if everyone dovetails his activities with a motivation to please Guru and Krsna , all the human beings have a common goal /interest. As a result people cooperate among themselves and lead  a blissful life without envy , lust etc.

Another classic  eg. is of the watering the root.When one waters the root,the different parts of the tree receive water   automatically. One need not individually water the leaves, branches  etc.Similiarly when one serves Krsna  by default he is serving the humanity.Devotees  distribute the Krsna ‘s mercy to others  so as to please Krsna. Coincidentally  this  is the greatest service one can render to any other  human being.

On the other hand when one tries to serve others without bringing Krsna into the picture , the attempt will end up useless or counter productive.For example , many scientists have invented many equipments to avoid spreading of AIDS, thinking it to be a  great service .But people are using these to further exploit  each other, as a result they will be forced to face many problems in this life and many more lives to come.

Therefore the conclusion is  Service to Krsna is by default service to mankind and one cannot  

“serve“ others  without pleasing Krsna.

[vikas chauhan]

Hare Krishna pr.

Here is what i felt after reading the phrases. Please correct me wherever I am wrong.

 

Both of the phrases are correct. But a deeper comparison can easily reveal the better out of two.

" Manava seva is Madhava seva" - 1) Since Krishna resides inside the heart of every manava as Paramatma

and we all have same father (Krishna), we are obliged to serve the mankind and help the needy in particular.

2) Philanthropism is great (soul got this element of compassion from super soul) but we have to be very careful

 about whom we are serving. If one serves the manava fully engrossed in doing sinful activities then one becomes

 suited to share the reactions.      

3) The kind of service : Generally people think of serving in sense of providing food, monetary help, addressing  social cause etc. But all these are confined to bodily level and that too vanishes due to Lord's energy in the form of time. But serving mankind by assisting them to be closer to God and understanding the soul,its true nature and ultimate goal of human life can actually make some difference.This can itself solve the material problems as well.   

"Madhava seva is manva seva" - Since Krishna is the source of everything, if someone tries to serve Him, everybody in this material manifestation, including manav, are benefited. This can be illustrated by following examples:

1) Chanting of the Holy name benefits not only the chanter but also all the living entities present in the vicinity. 

2) Yajna or sacrifices (performed in order to satisfy Lord Vishnu ) satisfies the demigods, who under the direction of Lord, provide rains required for food. Mother earth also mercifully provides grains, fruits, gems, precious stones and elements required by mankind.

3) Serving madhava by acting according to his rules (given in scriptures) elevates manav and imbibes virtues that will in turn solve almost all problems created by manav himself.

 Madhava in itself includes the devotees. The perfection lies in serving devotees since it pleases Lord . Devotees are free of all kind of contamination and are one with the wish of supreme Lord. Devotees not only aim at serving Lord but are always very compassionate to conditioned souls, and thus in this particular situation the manava seva and madhava seva becomes one but perpetually manva seva surpasses the madhava seva.

Haribol

grateful

vikas

[rohit saluja]

Mature reply Vikas Pr. Hari hari :)

[rohit saluja]

Nice to hear from you Ravi Kiran Pr. I liked Prithu Maharaj example.

Prabhupad also wanted that top Politians should become Krishna Conscious so that whole Society gets benifit.

 

Remain in touch.

 

YS

rohit

 

[pratham arora]

Hare Krishna

The devotees have explained the topic really well. They have very nicely established the difference between madhav seva and so called manav seva.Saurabh prabhu nice explained the temporary nature of manav seva as compared to  eternal effects of madhav seva.Rohit prabhu brought out the subtle point point that while doing manav seva we are doing our False ego seva.The Prthu maharaj example by Ravikiran prabhu explains the whole matter.Vikas prabhu took the discussion to a very subtle level,and with the help of examples clearly explained when manav seva becomes madhav seva.I didnt get the last line though,i think he will be kind enough to explain it.

I would just like add an example that I heard in a lecture.It was during the the time of the tsunami, that knocked sri lanka.Different philantropist organisations have set up their camps there.besides them them there was a camp set up by Iskcon devotees. As expected they were distributed huge amount of krishna prasad and doing kirtan everywhere they went.To the surprize of everyone the Iskcon camp attracted maximum no. of people.The reason behind this wasn't they were distributing oppulent food items or anything very costly.The reason simply was that were catering the needs of the soul i.e. taking the holy names rather than serving their material needs.The example iterates that when one involves in madhav seva,manav seva is already taken into account.

lastly I would like to steal a point from Vrajabasi Prabhu's blog.

"Once one person challenged the founder acarya of ISKCON - A.C Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, you are talking so much about God and spirituality, is it not luxury to talk all these things when people are not having food to eat? Srila Prabhupada challenged him back by saying we are ready to keep in our temple as many people as you want to bring and we will provide them food, clothing and shelter provided they agree to chant sixteen rounds of Hare Krsna maha mantra every day and follow four regulative principles namely no meat eating, no intoxication, no gambling and no illicit sex. He kept quiet never to turn back. People are so attached to sinful life that at any cost they don't want to leave it. And that is the root cause of their sufferings. By connecting all our activities to God, we become purified and can truly become happy."

Regards

Pratham Arora

[rohit saluja]

Hare Krishna Pr

Thanks for sharing such nice examples.

 

Jai Prabhupad :)

Prabhupad showed clearly what is the real problem why people suffer. The attachment to commit sins.. Hari Hari

 

[rohit saluja]

If rich people give up this mentality of enjoying sinful life, then nobody will die out of hunger atleast.

[rohit saluja]

I just want to relate this to ongoing instance.

Anil from 3rd year in our college died recently due to falling down from bike.

I may be wrong but if i relate this with previous instances where 2 of my batchmates and 3 of my seniors were drowned in the sea in last few years.

This is happening because students come to goa with propensity to enjoy.They indulge in sinful activities and they dont understand the purpose of Human life.

So they dont care much and are drowned or fall down from bikes with their desires to enjoy materially.

 

But by preaching Krishna Consciousness just from the begining in our college, we are atleast saving few boys who might be one of such case if they would not become Krishna Conscious.

And they would have wasted their precious human life just like that.

 

So try to preach to as much as we can. Even some may leave afterwards but they will always have the importance of Human life in background and hence they will never be ablet take to sinful life to much extent atleast.And even if they indulge, if Krishna's mercy is there, they may get reminder of Krishna at such time.

 

So again, Madhav seva includes Manav seva here.

 

On the other hand parents fear that why my child is becoming Krishna Conscious? But if they see this part that so many people are giving up their life in Goa due to reason of enjoying materially.. .which one is better option???

YS

rohit
 

[SWAPNIL NANKAR]

Haribol Rohit Pr!

Your answer in the above mail was really wonderful. I thoroughly enjoyed it.

During one of his lectures, Devamrita Swami (perhaps) was asked why
people are not happy although some of them do so much of (so called)
social service.

He gave the answer with a perfect analogy:
A person does not want to serve the root/origin (Krishna), i.e. he
doesn't want to supply food to the stomach. He thinks, "form so long I
have been trying to digest this Samosa with my right hand & for my
right hand; but unfortunately I am not able to succeed."

One day, a very noble thought comes to his mind, "I am doing
everything for the right hand. WHAT ABOUT THE LEFT HAND!!!!".

HA HA HA HA. There was laughter all over.

YS
Swapnil

[vikas chauhan]

Hare Krishna pr.

Pratham pr. asked me to explain what i meant by my last sentence. May be I wasnt able to present it clearly. What i meant  was that when we say "Madhava" ,in one sense, it includes the Lord, His holy name, His pastimes, Dhaams, etc. as well as his devotees. The devotees who still have material bodies are manava . So when we are serving the devotees (manava) , we are actually serving  Madhava. So in this case the manava seva and Madhava seva are one and the same.

Any one who wants to do Madhava seva can chant holy name, do deity worship, visit dhams, offer bhoga to lord, hear about his transcendental pastimes, etc.  But Lord gets very pleased (and may be even more pleased than doing all above) when someone humbly, selflessly serves the devotees (who are so dear to Him, completely dependant on Him and thus one with His wish). So from one point of view ,in this case manava(devotees) seva  surpasses Madhava seva.

plzz forgive if I am wrong and mercifully correct me.

Haribol

[rohit saluja]

little confusion.. Manava include everyone.. devotees as well as non Devotees...

So Manava cant be used for Devotees.

But on the other hand Devotees now a days are only Manav.

Others are sophisticated animals as they do only what animals do.

But again there are some exceptional human beings who worship Demigods or may be atheist.. but they dont eat meat or indulge in sex or intoxication or gambling.

So they can also be considered as Manavas. But not as Devotees.

 

I think everything is clear now. So no need to discuss more on this topic of using Manava for Devotees.

 

YS

rohit

 

[rohit saluja]

Service to Devotees does not surpass Madhav seva but it is the highest Madhav Seva :)

On 8/19/10, rohit saluja <rohits...@gmail.com> wrote:

[vikas chauhan]

Hare Krishna pr.

 thank you Rohit pr. for correcting me

Haribol

[rohit saluja]

Pr i know you wrote in right consciousness. So i never corrected you.

This is just for others.. so that they dont understand it the other way :)

 

Words sometimes may not represent what exactly one is trying to convey... but your Devotion did conveyed :)

miss you

[pratham arora]

Hare Krishna

Thank you Rohit pr and Vikas pr. for the nice clarification.

Regards

Pratham Arora