--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bitcoindev+...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/a186c724-eef7-4964-9aba-85ae9cce2249n%40googlegroups.com.
On Jul 15, 2025, at 2:26 PM, 'Donald Dienst' via Bitcoin Development Mailing List <bitco...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Dear Bitcoin developers,
--
Boris,
Thank you for taking the time to raise these thoughtful objections. They highlight important edge cases, particularly around long-term inheritance planning and time-locked contracts, that deserve further discussion.
The intent of this proposal is not to seize anyone’s Bitcoin but to create a rules-based mechanism for reintroducing truly abandoned coins—those locked away forever due to lost keys—back into the economy. If a private key is irrecoverably lost, the associated Bitcoin is effectively removed from circulation and, arguably, no longer owned. In such cases, the so-called "security tax" affects no active participant.
That said, your concerns are valid. One potential refinement would be to extend the inactivity window significantly—perhaps even to 100 years—to better accommodate multi-generational ownership and time-locked smart contracts. The core idea is that a sufficiently long timeframe, paired with clear expectations and wallet alerts, can strike a balance between preserving ownership rights and sustaining economic viability.
It's also possible that this proposal—or one like it—may only be realistically implemented as part of a broader hard fork in the distant future, potentially bundled with other critical changes such as post-quantum security upgrades. I hope that when that moment comes, a mechanism for reclaiming permanently lost coins is part of that discussion.
To those who object on purely ideological grounds, I would offer this reflection: if something can happen, it will happen—and it will continue to happen. People will keep losing keys. And one day, someone will lose the private key to the very last satoshi. Long before that point, Bitcoin may become functionally unusable—not because of inflation like fiat currencies, but due to irreversible deflation and economic ossification.
In that light, maintaining the myth that permanently lost coins should remain sacrosanct is not ideological purity—it’s advocating for a slow march toward irrelevance. To preserve Bitcoin’s utility as both a store of value and a medium of exchange, we must confront this eventuality with reasoned, transparent, and opt-in solutions.
Sincerely,
Donald D. Dienst
Hi Donald and everyone!
First of all, I want to thank you for the effort and work put into this proposal, wich addressses a complex and important topic. Howewer, to my understanding, the proposal clearly lacks solid foundations, and although it tries to anticipate some objections, the responses offered are either insufficient or even counterproductive.
1) The issue of miner incentives is overstated
The last bitcoin won’t be mined until the year 2140, which means we’re still more than 100 years away. Justifying such a structural change today based on a concern that lies completely outside our current technical, social, and economic horizon is an exaggeration. As rewards decrease, Bitcoin has already shown a natural tendency to substitute them with transaction fees, without this causing any systemic collapse.
2) Artificial scarcity is not a problem (it’s part of the design)
Bitcoin is divisible into 100 million satoshis per unit, which provides more than enough granularity to operate even if BTC reaches astronomical values. If 1 BTC were worth more than 1 million u$s, each satoshi would be worth over a cent. If necessary, an extension of decimals could be considered in the future (as is already done in Lightning with millisatoshis), without altering the fundamental rules.
The idea that “lost value must be recovered” to maintain liquidity completely ignores the fact that in a deflationary economy, the loss of units doesn’t necessarily reduce system functionality—it increases the value of the remaining units. In the words of Satoshi Nakamoto himself:
“Lost coins only make everyone else’s coins worth slightly more. Think of it as a donation to everyone.” (I clarify that i do not necessarily intended to be canonical)
3) The confiscation risk doesn't disappear just because it's framed as "reauthentication."
The argument that “if you can’t move your coins for 20 years, it’s indistinguishable from abandonment” is not only weak, but profoundly dangerous. What happens if coins are immobilized as part of an inheritance, a trust, or simply due to personal choice?
Peter Todd summed it up perfectly:
“If you want to argue for actually redistributing coins rather than just creating new ones out of thin air - for whatever reason - you need to justify why you want to risk confiscating coins that were not in fact lost.”
The fact that the current system can’t distinguish between lost and non-lost coins doesn’t justify defaulting to confiscation. In fact, that limitation is deliberate: Bitcoin is based on the presumption of individual sovereignty, not on a registry of “legitimate activity.” Why should I be required to spend or move my BTC if I don’t want to? The very idea of Bitcoin is that I have full freedom to decide what to do with my funds.
4) Bitcoin does not need to "reactivate" value to sustain its economy.
The assumption that a prolonged decrease in supply would destabilize the system has not been empirically demonstrated. Growing demand, combined with coin loss, creates deflationary pressure, yes—but that doesn’t prevent circulation or absolutely disincentivize spending. Bitcoin’s economy has already adapted to this over time without artificial intervention.
Sincerely,
Javier Mateos