An OSA TN3270 question

Tobias, Sid

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Mar 14, 2010, 8:37:08 AM3/14/10

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Currently we use a Cisco TN3270 CIP card in a router which has an ESCON connector.
It has been working great for 6 years and we will continue to use it at our main site.
We are currently building a D/R site and would like to have an alternative to the CISCO solution.
Mainly because CISCO does not sell them or support them anymore. I have read that the reason that CISCO doesnt make them anymore is that IBM offers the OSA that is as reliable and as fast as the CIP Card solution.

My question is, has anyone used the OSA to support 2000 TN3270 sessions? If so how does it interface to CICS (VTAM or TCP). If anyone has done this i would appreciate seeing the OSA parameters and or the VTAM parameters for this.

Thank you

Sid Tobias
Health Management Associates, Inc.
Computer Operations Manager
239 598 4669 x 3462

Rich Smrcina

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Mar 14, 2010, 8:43:47 AM3/14/10

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I don't know about supporting 2000 sessions and I don't have the OSA
definitions handy. To the operating system (VM, VSE or z/OS) the
terminal session looks like a non-SNA terminal session.

There is a good reference on the OSA ICC on the redbooks site:

OSA-Express Integrated Console Controller Implementation Guide
SG24-6364-01

--
Rich Smrcina
Phone: 414-491-6001
http://www.linkedin.com/in/richsmrcina

Catch the WAVV! http://www.wavv.org
WAVV 2010 - Apr 9-13, 2010 Covington, KY

Wakser, David

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Mar 14, 2010, 8:58:56 AM3/14/10

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Sid:

You could set it up either way; by using a different port (and by specifying the application desired in the DEFINE TELNETD statements for that port), you could send TCP/IP users directly into CICS, or any other VTAM application. You could also set up a TCP/IP menu from which they can choose their sessions. To the system, the in-coming connection is plain old non-SNA. Except for the TCP/IP definition for the device, there is no difference between a CISCO or OSA connection to the system.

For the large number of connections, you need to ensure that you have supplied plenty of partition GETVIS for your TELNET connections in the TCP/IP partition. On one of our systems, we have defined that partition as 50M – but you may need to adjust that. Otherwise, there should be no surprises.

David Wakser

Confidentiality Note: This e-mail, including any attachment to it, may contain material that is confidential, proprietary, privileged and/or "Protected Health Information," within the meaning of the regulations under the Health Insurance Portability & Accountability Act as amended. If it is not clear that you are the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you have received this transmittal in error, and any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail, including any attachment to it, is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately return it to the sender and delete it from your system. Thank you.

Rbo...@aol.com

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Mar 14, 2010, 9:08:31 AM3/14/10

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Sid,

OSA-ICC only supports about 255 sessions. I forget the exact number but it's no where near 2000. In my case I setup 27 sessions (3 sessions for 9 LPAR's). One of the 3 sessions, per LPAR, is a CONSOLE and the other 2 are VTAM LU's, per LPAR. The VTAM LU's look exactly like normal VTAM LU's. Here's an example of one:

L1GO401O LOCAL CUADDR=401,                                             X
               TERM=3277,                                              X
               FEATUR2=(EDATS,MODEL2),                                 X
               MODETAB=ISTINCLM,                                       X
               USSTAB=VTMUSST3,                                        X
               DLOGMOD=D4B32XX3

The IOCP definitions are as follows:

CHPID PCHID=121,PATH=(73),TYPE=OSC,SHARED OSA-ICC

CNTLUNIT CUNUMBR=731,PATH=(73),UNIT=OSC OSA-ICC

IODEVICE ADDRESS=(400,32),CUNUMBR=(731),UNIT=3270,MODEL=X

Connectivity over and above the above is done through TCP/IP for ALL other sessions.

The remainder of the setup is done using the HMC. It's pretty simple to setup. You define a server and then the sessions, where you specify that each sessions is to be a CONSOLE or TERMINAL. Here's an example of the output that's produced when downloading the each sessions parameters (it illustrates the server, one console and one terminal):

// This file has been generated from the binary file D:\POKCODE\IQZC0121.HUL

<OSC_SERVER>
HOST_IP= 10.254.38.21
DEFAULT_GATEWAY= 10.254.38.1
SUBNET_MASK= 255.255.255.0
PORT= 3270
ETHERNET_FRAME= DIX
MTU= 1492
NAME= CDCz890
</OSC_SERVER>

<CONFIG_SESSION>
<SESSION1>
CSS= 00 IID= 01 DEVICE= 0400
GROUP= "KEV1OP"
CONSOLE_TYPE= 2 RESPONSE= ON
READ_TIMEOUT= 10
DEFER_HOST_DISCONNECT= 0
</SESSION1>

<SESSION2>
CSS= 00 IID= 01 DEVICE= 0401
GROUP= "KEV1LO1"
CONSOLE_TYPE= 1 RESPONSE= OFF
READ_TIMEOUT= 60
DEFER_HOST_DISCONNECT= 60
</SESSION2>

In a message dated 3/14/2010 8:43:37 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, ri...@velocitysoftware.com writes:

On 03/14/2010 07:34 AM, Tobias, Sid wrote:
>

> Currently we use a Cisco TN3270 CIP card in a router which has an
> ESCON connector.
> It has been working great for 6 years and we will continue to use it
> at our main site.
> We are currently building a D/R site and would like to have an
> alternative to the CISCO solution.
> Mainly because CISCO does not sell them or support them anymore. I
> have read that the reason that CISCO doesnt make them anymore is that
> IBM offers the OSA that is as reliable and as fast as the CIP Card
> solution.
>
> My question is, has anyone used the OSA to support 2000 TN3270
> sessions? If so how does it interface to CICS (VTAM or TCP). If
> anyone has done this i would appreciate seeing the OSA parameters and
> or the VTAM parameters for this.
>
>
> Thank you
>
>
> Sid Tobias
> Health Management Associates, Inc.
> Computer Operations Manager
> 239 598 4669 x 3462
>
>
>
>

Kevin Corkery

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Mar 14, 2010, 9:16:40 AM3/14/10

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The OSA-ICC supports a maximum of 120 TN3270 session per port. They can be pooled on the port but not across ports. This is the local 3270 console support only. I have 2 ports, on different cards, designated for OSA-ICC with 240 terminal sessions available. For a small shop this is more than enough.

From: owner...@Lehigh.EDU [mailto:owner...@Lehigh.EDU] On Behalf Of Rbo...@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 9:08 AM
To: VSE Discussion List
Subject: Re: An OSA TN3270 question

Wakser, David

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Mar 14, 2010, 9:20:58 AM3/14/10

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Bob:

Perhaps I misunderstood, but I didn’t think he was talking about ICC using the HMC. I assumed he was merely speaking about an OSA card connected to the VSE system.

David Wakser

From: owner...@Lehigh.EDU [mailto:owner...@Lehigh.EDU] On Behalf Of Rbo...@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 9:08 AM
To: VSE Discussion List
Subject: Re: An OSA TN3270 question

Sid,

OSA-ICC only supports about 255 sessions. I forget the exact number but it's no where near 2000. In my case I setup 27 sessions (3 sessions for 9 LPAR's). One of the 3 sessions, per LPAR, is a CONSOLE and the other 2 are VTAM LU's, per LPAR. The VTAM LU's look exactly like normal VTAM LU's. Here's an example of one:

Confidentiality Note: This e-mail, including any attachment to it, may contain material that is confidential, proprietary, privileged and/or "Protected Health Information," within the meaning of the regulations under the Health Insurance Portability & Accountability Act as amended. If it is not clear that you are the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you have received this transmittal in error, and any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail, including any attachment to it, is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately return it to the sender and delete it from your system. Thank you.

Rbo...@aol.com

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Mar 14, 2010, 9:23:04 AM3/14/10

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David,

Maybe "I" was the one that misunderstood. Oh well, it looks like he got answers for both.

Chris Mason

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Mar 14, 2010, 1:04:27 PM3/14/10

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Sid

> Mainly because CISCO does not sell them or support them anymore, I have read that the reason that CISCO doesn't

make them anymore is that IBM offers the OSA that is as reliable and as fast as the CIP Card solution.

Perhaps you can let us know *where* you read that. It's "apples and oranges".

I believe that the CIP "solution" is to provide a general-purpose TN3270 function - perhaps among other capabilities. That would mean comparing the "CIP" with "OSA" was not comparing "like with like".

The flavour of "OSA" generally abbreviated to the OSA-ICC[1] running as CHPID type OSC is oriented to providing support for a hardware console which, because it presents the appearance of a local pre/non-SNA channel-attached 3270 display, can also be used incidentally as a 3270 display in an SNA network by means of "protocol conversion" logic in the VTAM running in the LPAR to which the "channel" is defined. This is *not* a general-purpose TN3270 server as the limits on the number of TN3270E TCP connections - illogically and inappropriately sometimes described as "sessions" - mentioned by Bob Botsis and Kevin Corkery indicates.

The more general purpose flavours of OSA, typically running in QDIO mode as CHPID type OSD, behave as LAN, typically Ethernet, adapters and can support TN3270 or TN3270E connections only when *additionally* supported by a TN3270(E) server function running as an application to the IP-support software on the operating system, in the case of this list, VSE.[2]

> My question is, has anyone used the OSA to support 2000 TN3270 sessions?

I expect that using an OSA as a LAN adapter where the TN3270(E) server support runs as an operating system application can extraordinarily easily support 2,000 TCP connections and concatenated SNA sessions.

> If so how does it interface to CICS (VTAM or TCP).

If you pass through a TN3270 server - as you do with the CIP - then the TN3270 server creates the appearance of a 3270 display. It can either pretend to be a pre/non-SNA channel-attached 3270 display or it can pretend to be the secondary half-session in an SNA LU-LU session using 3270 data streams following either LU type 0 or LU type 2 protocols.

If you expect not to change what the client workstations do and how they are defined, then you are stuck with TN3270 or TN3270E clients and a TN3270(E) server will be required as the partner in the TN3270(E) TCP connection.

If you pass through a TN3270(E) server, the interface to CICS will almost certainly be over the VTAM API using CICS's VTAM/SNA support.

Total and complete honesty prompts me to say that, if you use a TN3270(E) server which supports pre/non-SNA channel-attached 3270 display devices, at one time and just possibly still today, CICS could support you more directly though BTAM - although I'm not sure of the position of BTAM support in the various z operating systems these days.

That *may* be the answer to the "interface to CICS with TCP". If not, please post again.

-

Quoting David Wakser

> ... there is no difference between a CISCO or OSA connection to the system.

I checked on a web site for "TN3270 CISCO CIP"[3] and found that the "dynamic definition of dependent LUs", DDDLUS, function was supported. This implies that the CIP emulates an SSCP-dependent PU entity and associated SSCP-dependent LU entities - the dynamic appearance of which is what the DDDLUS function is all about - which are defined within VTAM using a PU statement and, if not relying entirely on the DDDLUS function, following LU statements.[4]

If using an OSA-ICC, the LU entity definitions within VTAM are LOCAL statements. If using an OSA as a LAN adapter together with a TN3270(E) server application, the LU entity definitions within VTAM are APPL statements - or VSE has clever ways of dealing with these matters which are foreign to me!

So, unless David can flesh out what he means by "no difference" you shouldn't expect to be using the same VTAM definitions with one of the two "OSA" "solutions" as with your "CIP" "solution".

-

Quoting Bob Botsis (RBOTSIS)

> The VTAM LU's look exactly like normal VTAM LU's.

***Only*** if your "normal" VTAM LU is supported by the "protocol conversion" logic within VTAM for pre/non-SNA channel-attached 3270 devices which are represented to VTAM sing LOCAL statements rather than real LU statements or perhaps APPL statements.

Anyhow we can that Bob for his samples.

I *think* the code identified as CONSOLE_TYPE refers to the last time I got extensively involved in a discussion in this list where I suggested scepticism over what the good people responsible for the OSA-ICC said about how this code should be defined. It may be useful to read over that thread[5] - if you decide to use the OSA-ICC - which appears unlikely.

-

Chris Mason

[1] OSA-Express Integrated Console Controller - as indicated by Rich Smrcina.

[2] I'd better say I haven't been a VSE specialist since 1969 - when it was known as DOS! I'm here to pick up VTAM and SNA topics - and maybe IP topics as long as they don't involve the actual IP-based software running with VSE.

[3] http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/hw/modules/ps2643/products_data_sheet09186a0080091ef3.html

[4] If relying wholly or partially on the DDDLUS function, there will be some *model* LU statements defined.

[4] http://groups.google.com/group/bit.listserv.vse-l/browse_thread/thread/95932a911f9a2f5d/e63674c2bb857134

----- Original Message -----

From: Tobias, Sid

To: VSE Discussion List

Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 1:34 PM

Subject: An OSA TN3270 question

Wakser, David

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Mar 14, 2010, 1:15:06 PM3/14/10

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Chris and Sid:

We had, in the past, one client where we used a CIP device, because we were having problems with their SNA connections on an OSA-2, and IBM was unable to diagnose the problem. Therefore, we migrated them to a CIP, which allowed both traditional SNA connections along with TCP/IP connections. However, I was not involved with the hardware or VTAM side of the implementation, and the client has since migrated to a different platform, so I cannot access the VTAM settings used. However, from a TCP/IP and TN3270 side (which I set up and supported), there was no difference between the CIP and standard (not OSA-ICC) OSA-2.

David Wakser

From: owner...@Lehigh.EDU [mailto:owner...@Lehigh.EDU] On Behalf Of Chris Mason
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 1:04 PM
To: VSE Discussion List
Subject: Re: An OSA TN3270 question

Sid

Confidentiality Note: This e-mail, including any attachment to it, may contain material that is confidential, proprietary, privileged and/or "Protected Health Information," within the meaning of the regulations under the Health Insurance Portability & Accountability Act as amended. If it is not clear that you are the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you have received this transmittal in error, and any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail, including any attachment to it, is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately return it to the sender and delete it from your system. Thank you.

Edward M Martin

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Mar 14, 2010, 7:45:23 PM3/14/10

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Hello Sid,

Question, do you have z/VM or are straight z/VSE?

We have z/VM and TCP/IP with a limit of 4096 on the z/VM side.

On the z/VSE direct connections we have about 1500 terminals and 900 printers with a 70 meg partition. We have a separate TCP/IP partition for all the email/ftp stuff.

Ed Martin

Aultman Health Foundation

330-363-5050

ext 35050

From: owner...@Lehigh.EDU [mailto:owner...@Lehigh.EDU] On Behalf Of Tobias, Sid

Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 8:35 AM
To: VSE Discussion List

Chris Mason

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Mar 15, 2010, 6:05:24 AM3/15/10

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David

This makes sense only by assuming your memory has been playing trick with you!

You are still trying to equate OSA features, even OSA-2 (not OSA-ICC), with CIP supporting TN3270. OSA features, OSA-ICC excepted, know nothing about TN3270. If the OSA appears to be supporting TN3270, either TCP traffic over IP flows back and forth through to an "inboard" TN3270(E) server application - or - SNA traffic flows back and forth through to an "outboard" implementation of TN3270(E) logic in some clever typically router-like machine.

If you take yourself to a "bookshelf" where the OSA feature manuals are to be found such as

http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/Shelves/IOA2BK81

and search for the character string "TN3270E", you will find a "hit" only in the manual for the OSA-ICC, "System z9 and eServer zSeries z890 and z990 Open Systems Adapter-Express Integrated Console Controller User's Guide". You will find a hit in neither "System z10, System z9 and eServer zSeries Open Systems Adapter-Express Customer's Guide and Reference" nor "eserver zSeries 900 Planning for the Open Systems Adapter-2 Feature", the two manuals which cover the OSA not used as an OSA-ICC and OSA-2 respectively.

I suspect - on somewhat flimsy evidence - that the VTAM definitions which you found appeared to be being used with both the OSA-2 and CIP related to, in the case of the OSA-2, the SNA connections to which you referred to workstations themselves using SNA support - and, in the case of CIP, possibly the same or CIP supporting TN3270. In all these cases, there would be a PU statement followed, unless the DDDLUS function were being used exclusively, by LU statements.

In the case of the "inboard" TN3270(E) application I cannot imagine it could be done in any way except one very similar to the way it is done with the z/OS Communications Server IP component which involves VTAM APPL statements representing the secondary LU in the session using the 3270 data stream.

In the case of the "outboard" TN3270(E) implementation, VTAM LU statements represent the secondary LU in the session using the 3270 data stream.

Just for completeness, in the case of "hardware" which simulates the "upstream" appearance of a pre/non-SNA channel-attached 3270 controller - originally the 3272 - such as the OSA-ICC, VTAM LOCAL statements represent the secondary LU in the session using the 3270 data stream - and imply the use of the VTAM protocol converter for non-SNA 3270 data stream flow.

Here are some web pages which helped me clarify what Sid's current VTAM definitions probably are:

TN3270 Server for CIP and CPA

http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/hw/modules/ps2643/products_data_sheet09186a0080091ef3.html

TN3270 Cisco SNA Direct PU Configuration and Verification

http://www.cisco.com/en/US/tech/tk331/tk339/technologies_tech_note09186a0080093da2.shtml

Configuring and Verifying TN3270 CSNA DLUR/DLUS

http://www.cisco.com/en/US/tech/tk331/tk339/technologies_tech_note09186a0080093db5.shtml

Chris Mason

Tobias, Sid

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Mar 15, 2010, 9:47:50 AM3/15/10

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Chris

No sense in guessing, these are the Vtam Definitions used for the CIP.

CISCOXCA VBUILD TYPE=XCA

CISXCA PORT ADAPNO=0,CUADDR=700,SAPADDR=04,MEDIUM=RING,TIMER=60

CISGRP GROUP ANSWER=ON, X

AUTOGEN=(100,L,P), X

CALL=INOUT, X

DIAL=YES, X

ISTATUS=ACTIVE

/+

CATALOG CISCOSWN.B R=YES

CISCOSWN VBUILD TYPE=SWNET,MAXGRP=10,MAXNO=256,MAXDLUR=256

XCAPU1 PU ADDR=01,VPACING=0, X

IDBLK=05D,IDNUM=00700, X