3270 Emulator Software
Lizette Koehler
emulators. There is a lot but no specific to my requirements.
So here goes.
What are - say - the top 5 emulators everyone uses out there.
I have in my list so far
Hummingbird
Bluezone
HOD (Host on Demand - IBM) - an I am not sure what other software is
required to run this (Websphere or other?)
!Extra
Pcomm
Rumba
However, I was wondering if there were others.
My requirements are support (well supported), cost, encryption and usage
across a wide platform (z/OS, Linux, Windows, etc.). And it has to be
deployed via Citrix.
I am not sure what anyone else is using out there for this type of software.
I love Vista3270 but I am not sure that my company will even look at it.
Is there a preference out there or is it just a random acquisition - kinda
like I like the pink one?
Or does someone have an evaluation analysis write up on this type of
software that they would be willing to share?
I am not usually in the front in the RFP but this time I am and it would
help me to know what to look for when selecting a 3270 emulator.
Thanks
Lizette
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Lizette Koehler
emulators. There is a lot but no specific to my requirements.
So here goes.
What are – say - the top 5 emulators everyone uses out there.
I have in my list so far
Hummingbird
Bluezone
HOD (Host on Demand – IBM) – an I am not sure what other software is
required to run this (Websphere or other?)
!Extra
Pcomm
Rumba
However, I was wondering if there were others.
My requirements are support (well supported), cost, encryption and usage
across a wide platform (z/OS, Linux, Windows, etc…). And it has to be
deployed via Citrix.
I am not sure what anyone else is using out there for this type of
software. I love Vista3270 but I am not sure that my company will even look
at it.
Is there a preference out there or is it just a random acquisition – kinda
Eric
R.S.
> I just went through the archives looking for generic information on 3270
> emulators. There is a lot but no specific to my requirements.
>
>
> So here goes.
>
>
>
> What are - say - the top 5 emulators everyone uses out there.
>
>
>
> I have in my list so far
My list:
1. PCOMM
2. Nexus - very fast, very small, very little resources consuming.
3. x3270 - free
4. nothing
5. nothing
--
Radoslaw Skorupka
Lodz, Poland
--
BRE Bank SA
ul. Senatorska 18
00-950 Warszawa
www.brebank.pl
S d Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy
XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru S dowego,
nr rejestru przedsi biorców KRS 0000025237
NIP: 526-021-50-88
Wed ug stanu na dzie 01.01.2009 r. kapita zak adowy BRE Banku SA (w ca o ci wp acony) wynosi 118.763.528 z otych. W zwi zku z realizacj warunkowego podwy szenia kapita u zak adowego, na podstawie uchwa y XXI WZ z dnia 16 marca 2008r., oraz uchwa y XVI NWZ z dnia 27 pa dziernika 2008r., mo e ulec podwy szeniu do kwoty 123.763.528 z . Akcje w podwy szonym kapitale zak adowym BRE Banku SA b d w ca o ci op acone.
Martinez, Frank J
Frank J. Martinez
Technical Support Supervisor
IT System z
Tel.: 305-284-3919
Cell: 305-987-8281
Fax : 305-284-3872
e-Mail: FJM...@miami.edu
Peter Nuttall
You might want to check if any of your apps are using EHLLAPI (Screen
scraping) or HLLAPI , so you can make sure the new emulator software
supports that (I suspect most do, but you never know .... ).
Extra is in use here, deployed over citrix ....
Kind regards,
Peter
"Lizette Koehler" <star...@MINDSPRING.COM>
Sent by: "IBM Mainframe Discussion List" <IBM-...@bama.ua.edu>
24/08/2010 12:42 PM
Please respond to
"IBM Mainframe Discussion List" <IBM-...@bama.ua.edu>
Subject
3270 Emulator Software
So here goes.
Hummingbird
Bluezone
!Extra
Pcomm
Rumba
Thanks
Lizette
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Michael Saraco
my favorite is TN3270 Plus by http://www.sdisw.com/. It is cheap works
great and with Citrix I have never seen it deployed with Citrix. I
connect using Citrix to 2 different clients then use TN3270 for my
emulation.
Another emulator is Passport.
Michael Saraco
Systems Consultant
303-838-3374 x115
Cell 507-525-0530
From: Lizette Koehler <star...@MINDSPRING.COM>
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Date: 08/24/2010 05:56 AM
Subject: 3270 Emulator Software
Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-...@bama.ua.edu>
Itschak Mugzach
types. Not all of the emulators supports all types of certificates,
especially ARMs.
ITschak
Thompson, Steve
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Lizette Koehler
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 5:56 AM
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Subject: 3270 Emulator Software
<SNIPPAGE>
However, I was wondering if there were others.
My requirements are support (well supported), cost, encryption and usage
across a wide platform (z/OS, Linux, Windows, etc...). And it has to be
deployed via Citrix.
I am not sure what anyone else is using out there for this type of
software. I love Vista3270 but I am not sure that my company will even look
at it.
<SNIPPAGE>
I personally use QWS3270 Plus. There is also a secure version (does SSL as I recall). I have run it on Linux using Wine (not the secure, as I don't have that variant).
It is well supported, and as far as I am concerned, the price is good (QWS3270 Plus is less than US$30 single seat the last time I priced it).
I am not a Citrix user, so I have no idea about how QWS will interface with it (we have Citrix here, I am just fortunate to only need a "normal" VPN).
The biggest kicker that I have come across in evaluating 3270 software:
Scripting language and how it is supported. If you already have a system written using one language, will it easily port to another 3270 emulation system?
The next one, which is much more important to me is, can I map my keyboard (whether it is a keyboard or a laptop keyboard wannabe) to behave as much as possible to a real 3270 keyboard, including all the programmable keys (PF and PA)? Since I am a touch typist, this is a critical thing to me. Don't make me use a mouse to get PF3 or PA2 or some such.
Regards,
Steve Thompson
George.William
Hmmm.
Tom Brennan's Vista!
http://www.tombrennansoftware.com/
-----Original Message-----
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Lizette Koehler
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 3:56 AM
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Subject: 3270 Emulator Software
I just went through the archives looking for generic information on 3270
emulators. There is a lot but no specific to my requirements.
So here goes.
What are - say - the top 5 emulators everyone uses out there.
I have in my list so far
Hummingbird
Bluezone
HOD (Host on Demand - IBM) - an I am not sure what other software is
required to run this (Websphere or other?)
!Extra
Pcomm
Rumba
However, I was wondering if there were others.
My requirements are support (well supported), cost, encryption and usage
across a wide platform (z/OS, Linux, Windows, etc...). And it has to be
deployed via Citrix.
I am not sure what anyone else is using out there for this type of
software. I love Vista3270 but I am not sure that my company will even look
at it.
Is there a preference out there or is it just a random acquisition - kinda
like I like the pink one?
Or does someone have an evaluation analysis write up on this type of
software that they would be willing to share?
I am not usually in the front in the RFP but this time I am and it would
help me to know what to look for when selecting a 3270 emulator.
Thanks
Lizette
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Ward, Mike S
have a pretty good tn3270 client. We use OpenText Host Explorer. It used
to be HummingBird.
-----Original Message-----
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-...@bama.ua.edu] On
Behalf Of Lizette Koehler
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 5:43 AM
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Subject: 3270 Emulator Software
So here goes.
Hummingbird
Bluezone
!Extra
Pcomm
Rumba
Thanks
Lizette
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Grinsell, Don
We just went through a TN3270 RFP and chose Bluezone as a replacement for Attachmate. We deploy via traditional thick client, thin client, served desktop and Citrix. If you want more information on our selection criteria, contact me offline and I'll send you the technical requirements section of the RFP.
Regards,
Don
--
Donald Grinsell
State of Montana
406-444-2983
dgri...@mt.gov
"I would like to see every single soldier on every single side, just take off your helmet, unbuckle your kit, lay down your rifle, and set down at the side of some shady lane, and say, nope, I aint a gonna kill nobody. Plenty of rich folks wants to fight. Give them the guns."
-- Woody Guthrie
-----Original Message-----
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Lizette Koehler
Sent: Tuesday, 24 August 2010 04:43
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Subject: 3270 Emulator Software
Eric Spencer
http://www.tombrennansoftware.com/
Very small footprint, fast, supports SSL, has reasonable font selection, FTP, Macros (record/playback) The best $30 I've spent in a long time. And you have your choice of colors (really) even pink. And fantastic support, I've never had a "problem" but Tom has responded to a couple of questions.
I seem to recall a thread where someone on the list said they got it running under Linux/WINE but I have not had any luck here.
2. Tom Brennan's Vista!
http://www.tombrennansoftware.com/
see above.
3. Tom Brennan's Vista!
http://www.tombrennansoftware.com/
see above.
4. Tom Brennan's Vista!
http://www.tombrennansoftware.com/
see above
5. x3270 if you're on Linux (free)
Eric Spencer
Neon Enterprise Software LLC.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-...@bama.ua.edu] On
> Behalf Of Lizette Koehler
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 5:56 AM
> To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
> Subject: 3270 Emulator Software
>
> I just went through the archives looking for generic information on 3270
> emulators. There is a lot but no specific to my requirements.
>
> So here goes.
>
> What are - say - the top 5 emulators everyone uses out there.
>
> I have in my list so far
>
> Hummingbird
> Bluezone
> HOD (Host on Demand - IBM) - an I am not sure what other software is
> required to run this (Websphere or other?)
> !Extra
> Pcomm
> Rumba
>
>
> However, I was wondering if there were others.
>
> My requirements are support (well supported), cost, encryption and usage
> across a wide platform (z/OS, Linux, Windows, etc.). And it has to be
> deployed via Citrix.
>
> I am not sure what anyone else is using out there for this type of
> software. I love Vista3270 but I am not sure that my company will even
> look
> at it.
>
> Is there a preference out there or is it just a random acquisition -
Shmuel Metz , Seymour J.
at 06:42 AM, Lizette Koehler <star...@MINDSPRING.COM> said:
>There is a lot but no specific to my requirements.
Are you looking for a 3270 simulator or for a TN3270 client? If the
latter, have you looked at x3270.
What features do you need, e.g., APA, PSS, explixcit partitions,
dynamic screen sizes, non-standard screen sizes?
>I have in my list so far
What about Vista?
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
ISO position; see <http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html>
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)
zMan
this another vote for a good, solid piece of software.
I've seen and used dozens of tn3270 clients. Most are pretty well the
same, though you'll learn to hate specific features in some of them. I
would thus STRONGLY recommend trialing several, and trying the tasks
you need, such as macros, upload/download (some of them make the
dialogs infernally confusing -- make sure you try it with specified
formats such as F 80, which some make VERY hard to specify), SSL, etc.
That might sound obvious, but given how similar they all are, it's
easy to shrug and say "Yep, looks like a 3270 to me" and move on too
quickly.
One anti-recommendation: Extra! has sucked pretty badly IMHO for a
very long time. Buggy and flaky. Haven't been forced to use it lately,
but I spent a week at a customer site and found pretty quickly that
typing over about 30wpm caused it to GPF. Boy, did that make for a
looong week...
At least we've stopped seeing new tn3270 products showing up at SHARE
-- for a while there, every drug-addled CEO seemed to think it was a
new market, and every SHARE there would be two or three new ones, most
of which were never seen again.
--
zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it"
Dave Salt
> One anti-recommendation: Extra! has sucked pretty badly IMHO for a
> very long time. Buggy and flaky.
I have to agree. Last year I worked at a customer's site for 2 months, and was forced to use Extra! The first thing I did after installing SimpList was to try to configure Extra so I could "Surf the mainframe" (i.e. select the many hundreds of SimpList point-and-shoot fields by clicking them with a mouse). But the only way I could get Extra to select point-and-shoot fields was to single left click (to position the cursor) and then single right click (to select). The left-click/right-click combination is far less intuitive than the double left click I'm used to. It was so frustrating I actually gave up and went back to using the keyboard!!! (GASP)
What I like about Vista3270 is that it supports point-and-shoot with a mouse right out of the box. Other emulators (e.g. PCOM) don't support it out of the box, but if each user takes the time to look through their emulator settings they can at least configure it that way. The next step below that is emulators where the closest you can get to point-and-shoot support is something very unintuitive (e.g. the left-click/right-click combo supported by Extra). Finally, right at the bottom of the pack are emulators that don't support point-and-shoot at all. I won't name names because it's been many years since I used such an emulator and perhaps they've fixed that deficiency by now.
One of the things I'd strongly recommend reviewing when evaluating emulators is their ability to allow users to select point-and-shoot fields with a mouse.
Dave Salt
SimpList(tm) - try it; you'll get it!
http://www.mackinney.com/products/program-development/simplist.html
Rick Fochtman
It's quite good and, in my experience, very reliable.
Rick
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lizette Koehler wrote:
>.
George.William
We have EXTRA! and I too am not as pleased with it as a few others.
However, at least with Extra! Xtreme 9 you can change the mouse's left
double click to select and ENTER. HOWEVER, it is NOT in the "mouse map"
settings but in the Global Preferences. Go figure.
-----Original Message-----
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-...@bama.ua.edu] On
Behalf Of Dave Salt
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 10:24 AM
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Subject: Re: 3270 Emulator Software
http://www.mackinney.com/products/program-development/simplist.html
______________________________________________________________________
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Gates, Guy
We use NEXUS currently, and used Reflections in the past.
Thanks...Guy M. Gates Jr.
TTI Z/OS Systems Programmer II
Field, Alan C.
-----Original Message-----
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Lizette Koehler
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 05:56
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Subject: 3270 Emulator Software
I just went through the archives looking for generic information on 3270
emulators. There is a lot but no specific to my requirements.
So here goes.
What are - say - the top 5 emulators everyone uses out there.
I have in my list so far
Hummingbird
Bluezone
HOD (Host on Demand - IBM) - an I am not sure what other software is
required to run this (Websphere or other?)
!Extra
Pcomm
Rumba
However, I was wondering if there were others.
My requirements are support (well supported), cost, encryption and usage
across a wide platform (z/OS, Linux, Windows, etc...). And it has to be
deployed via Citrix.
I am not sure what anyone else is using out there for this type of
software. I love Vista3270 but I am not sure that my company will even look
at it.
Is there a preference out there or is it just a random acquisition - kinda
Michael Knigge
> You really should look at VISTA, from TomBrennanSoftware.com
> It's quite good and, in my experience, very reliable.
Yeah, it is! And the Font that comes with Vista is just GREAT! It is so
great that I use it with SPF/SE (a SPF-like Editor for Windows) and not
just for Vista tn3270...
And just one thing to note: Tom Brennan gives excellent Support. As we
started using it and I also started writing macros for Vista tn3270 I
came accross afeature that I was missing: I needed to get the
EBCDIC-Value of a character on the screen....
I've sent a mail to Tom, asked for that feature and voila, just a few
days later I've got a new version... Try this with IBM (PCOMM) or other
"big players"....
Bye,
Michael
--
Yours sincerely
Michael Knigge
Development
S.E.T. Software GmbH
Lister Straße 15
30163 Hannover
GERMANY
Tel. +49 511/3 97 80-23
Fax +49 511/3 97 80-65
michael...@set-software.de
Commercial Registry: HRB52778 Local Court Hannover
Chief Executive Officer: Till Dammermann, Dr. Bernd Huber
Linda Mooney
I have used Tom Brennan's Vista TN3270 and I like it very much.
Some of our customer base uses Mocha TN3270 from MochaSoft, I have not used it, but they seem to like it pretty well.
HTH,
Linda Mooney
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lizette Koehler" <star...@MINDSPRING.COM>
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 3:42:36 AM
Subject: 3270 Emulator Software
I just went through the archives looking for generic information on 3270
emulators. There is a lot but no specific to my requirements.
So here goes.
What are - say - the top 5 emulators everyone uses out there.
I have in my list so far
Hummingbird
Bluezone
HOD (Host on Demand - IBM) - an I am not sure what other software is
required to run this (Websphere or other?)
!Extra
Pcomm
Rumba
However, I was wondering if there were others.
My requirements are support (well supported), cost, encryption and usage
across a wide platform (z/OS, Linux, Windows, etc.). And it has to be
deployed via Citrix.
I am not sure what anyone else is using out there for this type of software.
I love Vista3270 but I am not sure that my company will even look at it.
Is there a preference out there or is it just a random acquisition - kinda
like I like the pink one?
Or does someone have an evaluation analysis write up on this type of
software that they would be willing to share?
I am not usually in the front in the RFP but this time I am and it would
help me to know what to look for when selecting a 3270 emulator.
Thanks
Lizette
Ivan Warren
>
> What are – say - the top 5 emulators everyone uses out there.
>
> I have in my list so far
>
- A real 3279 Mod 3 (If I had one) - Not really an emulator is it ?
But the best experience ever !
- SDI's TN3270 Plus
- x3270
- c3270
..
Ed Finnell
In a message dated 8/24/2010 5:43:55 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
iv...@VMFACILITY.FR writes:
A real 3279 Mod 3 (If I had one) - Not really an emulator is it ?
But the best experience ever !
>>
The 3192's with the VGA ports were outstanding.
Then GRAFTEK with PCI card was great, but pricey.
Tried most of the rest, liked Hummingbird the best for TN3270.
Thought for a while some of the WEB3270 products would take off, but
guess it changes too fast.
Graeme Gibson
Shmuel Metz , Seymour J.
at 06:58 PM, Ed Finnell <Efinn...@AOL.COM> said:
>A real 3279 Mod 3 (If I had one) - Not really an emulator is it ?
>But the best experience ever !
ObForeverAmber Bah! 3290. While ISPF only supported 4 explicit
partitions, that was still enough to make it head and shoulders above
anything else unless I really needed color.
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
ISO position; see <http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html>
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
McKown, John
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List
> Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 8:24 AM
> To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
> Subject: Re: 3270 Emulator Software
>
> at 06:58 PM, Ed Finnell <Efinn...@AOL.COM> said:
>
> >A real 3279 Mod 3 (If I had one) - Not really an emulator is it ?
> >But the best experience ever !
>
> ObForeverAmber Bah! 3290. While ISPF only supported 4 explicit
> partitions, that was still enough to make it head and shoulders above
> anything else unless I really needed color.
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
An how come no emulator supports 3290 style partitions? Or does one? I'd love to 4-way split my ISPF screen! And have two side-by-side edits going for comparison.
--
John McKown
Systems Engineer IV
IT
Administrative Services Group
HealthMarkets(r)
9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone * (817)-691-6183 cell
john....@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com
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Chase, John
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of McKown, John
>
> [ snip ]
>
> An how come no emulator supports 3290 style partitions? Or does one?
I'd love to 4-way split my ISPF
> screen! And have two side-by-side edits going for comparison.
Bluezone "claims" to, but I haven't figured out how to exploit it yet.
-jc-
Wendell Lovewell
nimble enough to swap in-and-out using Windows hotkeys, but it is still
pretty full-featured.
One thing I'd like to see in it is support of non-standard screen sizes.
Kulin Remailer
> love to 4-way split my ISPF screen! And have two side-by-side edits going
> for comparison.
That's what wide screens and multiple sessions are for.
Shmuel Metz , Seymour J.
on 08/25/2010
at 08:27 AM, "McKown, John" <John....@HEALTHMARKETS.COM> said:
>An how come no emulator supports 3290 style partitions?
I thought some did.
>Or does one?
Blue zone.
>I'd love to 4-way split my ISPF screen! And have two side-by-side
>edits going for comparison.
Or two 80-column splits and one 160 column split for viewing listings.
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
ISO position; see <http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html>
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Howard Brazee
Metz , Seymour J.) wrote:
>>An how come no emulator supports 3290 style partitions?
>
>I thought some did.
>
>>Or does one?
>
>Blue zone.
With my computer monitor, I find 3270-model 5 to be enough, but sure
enough it does offer 3290. I don't think I'll try it.
Mike Schwab
<shmuel+...@patriot.net> wrote:
>
> Or two 80-column splits and one 160 column split for viewing listings.
RJE editor that would do an 80 column edit screen and a 133 column
prinout screen in the same window. Think it would work with real
hardware? After all, a mainframe IP is a mainframe IP.
--
Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA
Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all?
Ed Finnell
In a message dated 8/25/2010 2:14:51 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
howard...@CUSYS.EDU writes:
With my computer monitor, I find 3270-model 5 to be enough, but sure
enough it does offer 3290. I don't think I'll try it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ed Finnell
With my computer monitor, I find 3270-model 5 to be enough, but sure
enough it does offer 3290. I don't think I'll try it.
>>
For many moons ISPF has had VSPLIT, but unless your emulator supports
wide screens it's painful to navigate.
Steve Comstock
>
> In a message dated 8/25/2010 2:14:51 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
> howard...@CUSYS.EDU writes:
>
> With my computer monitor, I find 3270-model 5 to be enough, but sure
> enough it does offer 3290. I don't think I'll try it.
>
>
>
> For many moons ISPF has had VSPLIT, but unless your emulator supports
> wide screens it's painful to navigate.
>
You mean SPLITV.
--
Kind regards,
-Steve Comstock
The Trainer's Friend, Inc.
303-393-8716
http://www.trainersfriend.com
* To get a good Return on your Investment, first make an investment!
+ Training your people is an excellent investment
Kirk Wolf
See: http://x3270.bgp.nu/
<http://x3270.bgp.nu/>I'm sure that *some* of the commercial emulators are
better, but I believe that *most* are not. Disclaimer: I have never used
Vista.
x3270/c3270 is solid, lightweight, and more than adequate for me. It
includes support for SSL/TLS and dynamic logmode/screen sizes (I typically
use 133x60). You can also customize the keys, colors, etc, although the
documentation is a bit cryptic.
It is almost certainly the best emulator for the price, and if there is a
feature that is missing, you can jump right in and help add it :-)
Kirk Wolf
Dovetailed Technologies
http://dovetail.com
PS> For the nostalgic, the x3270 project also maintains a IBM 026 Keypunch
emulator:
http://x3270.bgp.nu/x026.html
This could be just what you are looking for if your shop is trying to cut
back on ISPF usage in order to save money :-)
Ed Finnell
In a message dated 8/25/2010 4:30:28 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
st...@TRAINERSFRIEND.COM writes:
You mean SPLITV.
>>
Yep, too many packages ago.
Shmuel Metz , Seymour J.
08/25/2010
at 02:25 PM, Mike Schwab <mike.a...@GMAIL.COM> said:
>On one of the Hercules yahoo groups a few years ago, someone wrote
>an RJE editor that would do an 80 column edit screen and a 133
>column prinout screen in the same window.
Do you mean an MVS application that defined two explicit partitions on
a 3270 (real or simulated)?
>Think it would work with real hardware?
If the anwer to my question is yes, then it should work just fine.
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
ISO position; see <http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html>
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Shmuel Metz , Seymour J.
at 04:15 PM, Ed Finnell <Efinn...@AOL.COM> said:
>For many moons ISPF has had VSPLIT, but unless your emulator
>supports wide screens it's painful to navigate.
SPLITV is only available for sessions with explicit partition support.
A 3278-5 did not have explicit partitions, not did later 3270 models
with 3278-5 form factors.
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
ISO position; see <http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html>
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike Schwab
<shmuel+...@patriot.net> wrote:
> In <AANLkTimngDk3URvNznGbsm5=uetr3PmzrqEmfKD=t+...@mail.gmail.com>, on
> 08/25/2010
> at 02:25 PM, Mike Schwab <mike.a...@GMAIL.COM> said:
>
>>On one of the Hercules yahoo groups a few years ago, someone wrote
>>an RJE editor that would do an 80 column edit screen and a 133
>>column prinout screen in the same window.
>
> Do you mean an MVS application that defined two explicit partitions on
> a 3270 (real or simulated)?
>
software). Emulated a BSC 2703 RJE device. Looks like it requires
BSC.
>>Think it would work with real hardware?
>
> If the anwer to my question is yes, then it should work just fine.
I am guessing only if the 2703 device is still around and can be
genned. Guessing it would require a UCB address too, so pretty
unlikely / extremely limited number.
--
Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA
Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Anonymous
>
> <http://x3270.bgp.nu/>I'm sure that *some* of the commercial emulators are
> better, but I believe that *most* are not. Disclaimer: I have never used
> Vista.
>
> x3270/c3270 is solid, lightweight, and more than adequate for me. It
> includes support for SSL/TLS and dynamic logmode/screen sizes (I typically
> use 133x60). You can also customize the keys, colors, etc, although the
> documentation is a bit cryptic.
I have used Vista, Attachmate Extra, IRMA, PC/COM, Rumba (a true
abomination) and x3270. I have probably used others but not extensively
enough to remember them now.
x3270 is far and away the best of the lot- where and how I use it. How much
I like it may have something to do with the fact that I use it from Linux
and UNIX which automatically reduce aggravation thousands fold from
Windows, but x3270 is excellent. If you can use it on your platform, give
it a try. I will say I used the Windows version of x3270 and I didn't like
it as much as Vista on Windows. Vista's file transfer is buggy, other than
that it's seems to work mostly ok.
Shmuel Metz , Seymour J.
08/26/2010
at 09:26 AM, Mike Schwab <mike.a...@GMAIL.COM> said:
>No, this was a windows program named RJE80 (not the Dec Eclipse
>software). Emulated a BSC 2703 RJE device.
ITYM 2780; the 2703 was a controller.
>I am guessing only if the 2703 device is still around and can be
>genned.
That wouldn't let you port the editor, only talk to the 2780
simulator.
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
ISO position; see <http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html>
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Edward Jaffe
> At least we've stopped seeing new tn3270 products showing up at SHARE
> -- for a while there, every drug-addled CEO seemed to think it was a
> new market, and every SHARE there would be two or three new ones, most
> of which were never seen again.
>
Agreed. The products being demonstrated at Boston's STE were far more
interesting that the "stuff" ISVs were peddling just a few years ago.
There's some serious looking stuff out there these days...
--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
310-338-0400 x318
edj...@phoenixsoftware.com
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/
Edward Jaffe
> An how come no emulator supports 3290 style partitions? Or does one? I'd love to 4-way split my ISPF screen! And have two side-by-side edits going for comparison.
>
I used a 3290 for two years. I kept wanting to like it. But, it was slow
and incredibly restrictive when compared to today's emulators.
I currently configure my emulator sessions with 90x80 default (primary)
size and 90x142 alternate size. I can put two 90x80 displays side by
side or any number of sessions with any combination of custom sizes I
choose -- all with extended data stream, full color, presentation
symbols, graphics escape characters, structured fields, code page
support, mouse support, etc.
It helps to have a decent monitor to view all of this data. I use a DELL
UltraSharp U2410 24" Widescreen Monitor
http://www.dell.com/us/en/dfo/peripherals/monitor-dell-u2410/pd.aspx?refid=monitor-dell-u2410
(Actually, at home I have two monitors and a dual-display video card so
I run a very wide Windows desktop. My office is starting to look like
hackers live there. Maybe they do. :-\ )
--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
310-338-0400 x318
edj...@phoenixsoftware.com
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Edward Jaffe
> I currently configure my emulator sessions with 90x80 default
> (primary) size and 90x142 alternate size. I can put two 90x80 displays
> side by side or any number of sessions with any combination of custom
> sizes I choose -- all with extended data stream, full color,
> presentation symbols, graphics escape characters, structured fields,
> code page support, mouse support, etc.
It's late. Of course, I meant "program symbols" not "presentation
symbols". Also, I neglected to mention vector graphics. :-[
Ed Finnell
In a message dated 8/28/2010 3:33:00 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
edj...@PHOENIXSOFTWARE.COM writes:
It helps to have a decent monitor to view all of this data. I use a DELL
UltraSharp U2410 24" Widescreen Monitor
http://www.dell.com/us/en/dfo/peripherals/monitor-dell-u2410/pd.aspx?refid=m
onitor-dell-u2410
(Actually, at home I have two monitors and a dual-display video card so
I run a very wide Windows desktop. My office is starting to look like
hackers live there. Maybe they do. :-\ )
>>
Don't be such a piker....
_http://sewelldirect.com/samsung-zenview-8-multi-screen-display-lcd-monitors
.asp?source=froogle&utm_source=Froogle&utm_medium=cse&cvsfa=1306&cvsfe=2&cvs
fhu=53572d36343933_
(http://sewelldirect.com/samsung-zenview-8-multi-screen-display-lcd-monitors.asp?source=froogle&utm_source=Froogle&utm_medium=cse&cv
sfa=1306&cvsfe=2&cvsfhu=53572d36343933)
or tiny'd
http://tinyurl.com/3xybhe8
Edward Jaffe
> Don't be such a piker....
>
>
Now you're talking! 8-)
--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
310-338-0400 x318
edj...@phoenixsoftware.com
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Shane
Shane ...
On Sat, 2010-08-28 at 16:52 -0700, Edward Jaffe wrote:
> Ed Finnell wrote:
> > Don't be such a piker....
> >
> > http://tinyurl.com/3xybhe8
> >
>
> Now you're talking! 8-)
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ed Finnell
In a message dated 8/28/2010 6:52:58 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
edj...@PHOENIXSOFTWARE.COM writes:
Now you're talking! 8-)
>>
I'd have to hire a hacker just to tell me which was the active screen!
David Cole
show details 6:19 AM (25 minutes ago)
Quoting from " http://tinyurl.com/3xybhe8":
>"Each individual Samsung LCD has a 19-inch diameter screen"
Uh ... Diagonal?
On Sat, Aug 28, 2010 at 7:52 PM, Edward Jaffe
<edj...@phoenixsoftware.com>wrote:
zMan
--
zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it"
Ed Finnell
In a message dated 8/29/2010 9:02:07 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
zedgar...@GMAIL.COM writes:
No, it's retro, like the 50s: remember those round TVs? :-)
>>
Dumont and Zenith were big. Sky King, Cpt Preston, Buster Brown, and Ruff
and Ready. Evening news was 'Walter Concrete' as my sister used to say.
Somewhere along the way I got a chemistry set and an AT&T science kit and my
lifelong adventure began...
Rick Fochtman
>> At least we've stopped seeing new tn3270 products showing up at SHARE
>> -- for a while there, every drug-addled CEO seemed to think it was a
>> new market, and every SHARE there would be two or three new ones, most
>> of which were never seen again.
>>
>
> Agreed. The products being demonstrated at Boston's STE were far more
> interesting that the "stuff" ISVs were peddling just a few years ago.
> There's some serious looking stuff out there these days...
-------------------------------<unsnip>----------------------------------
How many people are still "in the business" that even remember how a
"true" 3270 even worked?? :-)
Rick
Rick Fochtman
Roy Rogers, with Dale, Trigger, Buttermilk and a Jeep named "Nelly
Belle". :-)
Rick
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Ted MacNEIL
Belle". :-)
My favourite was still ZORRO with the late Guy Williams, who also played John Robinson (the father) in that 1960's laugher "Lost in Space".
Danger! Danger! Will Robinson!
-
I'm a SuperHero with neither powers, nor motivation!
Kimota!
Ed Gould
---------SNIP--------------
-------------------------------<unsnip>----------------------------------
How many people are still "in the business" that even remember how a "true" 3270 even worked?? :-)
Rick
-
Rick:
I will go you one better. We had a product that allowed switch of applications so you could have 20-30 concurrent sessions. No biggy its available from several vendors.
This goes back almost twenty years but we were forced to replace our 3270's with pc's no asking just do it.The first day went average no biggies but then I started to need a function that as it turned out could only be done with real 3270's. I started to go out to the data center so I could get my job done and the idiot VP was upset because I wasn't at my desk. I was producing work (but not goofing off) and he got all bent out of shape because I wasn't at my desk. He demanded to know why and I showed him the function that did not work on his PC 3270 emulator (do *NOT* remember the name but IIRC it was Novelle based). He told me I had to work at my desk and I said OK if you do not want the volume of work I was producing as it really cut into productivity. He said yes you will sit at your desk. So then when it was time to project estimates for projects I increased the man hours by 50 percent. I told him it would be cheaper to give me back the 3270 I had.
Ed Finnell
In a message dated 8/29/2010 4:29:25 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
rfoc...@YNC.NET writes:
with Dale, Trigger, Buttermilk and a Jeep named "Nelly
Belle". :-)
>>
Yeah, Tom Mix, Johnny Mack Brown, Gene Autry guess they were Saturday
Matinee along with Howdy Dowdy but didn't watch much of that. Too much to do...
Jim Mulder
06:48:23 AM:
> >"Each individual Samsung LCD has a 19-inch diameter screen"
>
> Uh ... Diagonal?
A Farnsworth from Warehouse 13?
Jim Mulder z/OS System Test IBM Corp. Poughkeepsie, NY
Ed Finnell
In a message dated 8/29/2010 5:31:41 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
d10...@US.IBM.COM writes:
A Farnsworth from Warehouse 13?
>>
Well, one more and I'm letting this thing go. As we were exploring
graphics way back then I was pleasantly surprised to find TI support. The old ones
with the orange screens. Don't know if this was NASA,FAA, DOE, or DOD
requirement it was just there in several places on several machines.
Thompson, Steve
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-...@bama.ua.edu] On
Behalf Of Rick Fochtman
Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 4:25 PM
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Subject: Re: 3270 Emulator Software
<SNIIPAGE>
How many people are still "in the business" that even remember how a
"true" 3270 even worked?? :-)
I do. Up until ACS and I parted ways (where I was the last of the
OBS/ACS WYLBUR developers) I still had a 3270 Mod5 and a 3270 Mod2 to
verify that what was happening with the 3270 Emulators was correct. And
I had access to a 3279-2 8 color monitor. That was when I came to find
that QWS3270 was excellent (I won't even mention the emulator ACS was
using at the time). If I found a difference, I had the fix from them in
2-3 days tops.
I also remember, very fuzzily, GAM and the 40x12 version of the 3270.
Later,
Steve Thompson
Gerhard Postpischil
> How many people are still "in the business" that even remember
> how a "true" 3270 even worked?? :-)
Upstairs I have a 3174-1L, a 3174-63R, a 3179, two 3180s, and a
3290. All power up and are configured, and someday I may hook
the "remote" to Hercules; the local is on the P/390.
But Tom Brennan's Vista is more convenient to use <g>
Gerhard Postpischil
Bradford, VT
R.S.
> How many people are still "in the business" that even remember how a
> "true" 3270 even worked?? :-)
Some people still use real 3270s. I do, but only for consoles and local
(non-SNA) terminals. However I do my regular work on emulator since day 0.
BTW: such console has some advantages: no operating system means no
system management, no patches, no antivirus protection, no bloatware, no
"company policy rules", no licenses, no Windows domain, no DHCP, etc. I
simply do its work, nothing more. Very convenient, especially for
unattended devices.
--
Radoslaw Skorupka
Lodz, Poland
--
BRE Bank SA
ul. Senatorska 18
00-950 Warszawa
www.brebank.pl
S d Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy
XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru S dowego,
nr rejestru przedsi biorców KRS 0000025237
NIP: 526-021-50-88
Wed ug stanu na dzie 01.01.2009 r. kapita zak adowy BRE Banku SA (w ca o ci wp acony) wynosi 118.763.528 z otych. W zwi zku z realizacj warunkowego podwy szenia kapita u zak adowego, na podstawie uchwa y XXI WZ z dnia 16 marca 2008r., oraz uchwa y XVI NWZ z dnia 27 pa dziernika 2008r., mo e ulec podwy szeniu do kwoty 123.763.528 z . Akcje w podwy szonym kapitale zak adowym BRE Banku SA b d w ca o ci op acone.
Chase, John
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Ed Finnell
>
> In a message dated 8/29/2010 9:02:07 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
> zedgar...@GMAIL.COM writes:
>
> No, it's retro, like the 50s: remember those round TVs? :-)
>
> >>
> Dumont and Zenith were big. Sky King, Cpt Preston, Buster Brown, and
Ruff
> and Ready. Evening news was 'Walter Concrete' as my sister used to
say.
"Walter Crankcase, Tom Brokejaw and Peter Lemming" were the "big three"
news anchors. Then "Dan Blather" took over when "Walter Crankcase"
retired.
-jc-
Shmuel Metz , Seymour J.
<1242406483-1283118254-cardhu_decombob...@bda026.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>,
on 08/29/2010
at 09:44 PM, Ted MacNEIL <eama...@YAHOO.CA> said:
>My favourite was still ZORRO with the late Guy Williams, who also
>played John Robinson (the father) in that 1960's laugher "Lost in
>Space".
Rocky and Bullwinkle, unless they're after the cutoff date.
For the 1950's, Watch Mr. Wizard.
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
ISO position; see <http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html>
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
zMan
> Some people still use real 3270s. I do, but only for consoles and local
> (non-SNA) terminals. However I do my regular work on emulator since day 0.
> BTW: such console has some advantages: no operating system means no system
> management, no patches, no antivirus protection, no bloatware, no "company
> policy rules", no licenses, no Windows domain, no DHCP, etc. I simply do its
> work, nothing more. Very convenient, especially for unattended devices.
...and if a tornado hits the building, you can hide under it and be
protected, since they're built like tanks!
--
zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it"
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Shmuel Metz , Seymour J.
<45D79EACEFBA9B428E3D...@IWDUBCORMSG007.sci.local>,
on 08/29/2010
at 11:05 PM, "Thompson, Steve" <Steve_T...@STERCOMM.COM> said:
>I do. Up until ACS and I parted ways (where I was the last of the
>OBS/ACS WYLBUR developers)
Would you consider writing up a brief history of who forked from whom
when for ACS and OBS and including it in
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WYLBUR>?
This request also applies to anyone involved with other flavors of
Wylbur; the article needs a family tree and chronology.
Thanks.
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
ISO position; see <http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html>
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Anne & Lynn Wheeler
> Some people still use real 3270s. I do, but only for consoles and
> local (non-SNA) terminals. However I do my regular work on emulator
> since day 0.
i kept a real 3277 for a long time because the human factors were so
much better than 3274/3278. we actually had an argument with kingston
about design point of 3274/3278 ... and they eventually came back and
said it was never targeted for online, interactive work ... it was
purely targeted at data-entry use (i.e. keypunch).
part of the problem was that they moved quite a bit of electronics out
of the terminal head and back into the 3274 (reduced manufacturing
costs). with the electronics in the 3277 there were some number of
"human factors" hacks that could be done to improve operation.
it was possible to do a little soldering inside the 3277 keyboard to
adjust the "repeat delay" and the "repeat rate".
the 327x was half-duplex and had nasty habit of locking the keyboard if
hitting key at same time a write happened to go to the screen (really
terrible interactive characteristics). There was a very small fifo box
that was built; unplug the keyboard from inside the 3277 head, plug the
fifo box into the head and plug the keyboard into the fifo box. the fifo
box would queue pending keystrokes when the screen was being written
... to avoid the keyboard locking problem.
the 3272/3277 (ANR) was also much faster than 3274/3278 (DCA) ... there
was a joke that TSO was so non-interactive and so slow ... that TSO
users had no idea that the 3274/3278 hardware combination was enormously
slower than 3272/3277 (becayse so much terminal head electronics for the
3278 had been moved back into the 3274 ... there was an enormous
increase in the DCA controller/terminal head chatter ... that was
responsible for much of the significant slow down).
old benchmarks comparing 3272/3277 & 3274/3278
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001m.html#19 3270 protocol
later with simulated PC ... those that were ANR/3277 simulation had much
faster download/upload transfers than the DCA/3278 simulation (again
because there was so much more controller/terminal head chatter required
by DCA over the coax).
prior to PCs and simulated 3270s ... vm provide simulated virtual 3270s
over the internal network (late 70s, eventually released as product) and
there was an internal developed HLLAPI for simulated keystrokes, logic
and screen scraping called PARASITE/STORY. old posts with PARASITE/STORY
description and sample STORYs:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001k.html#35 Newbie TOPS-10 7.03 question
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2001k.html#36 Newbie TOPS-10 7.03 question
above includes STORY for automatically logging onto RETAIN for
retrieving bug & fix descriptions.
other recent poss mentioning PARASITE/STORY
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2008g.html#22 Was CMS multi-tasking?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2009k.html#0 Timeline: The evolution of online communities
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2009l.html#43 SNA: conflicting opinions
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2009q.html#4 Arpanet
for other topic drift ... circa 1980, STL was bursting at the seams and
they decided to move 300 people from the IMS group to an offsite
building (approx. ten miles away) and let them remote back into the
computers at the datacenter.
They tried SNA remote 3270 support, but the IMS group found the
operation extremely dismal (compared to the local 3270 vm370 support
that they were used to inside STL ... even tho they were
3274/3278). Eventually it was decided to deploy NSC HYPERChannel
"channel extenders" with local 3274/3278 ("channel attached") terminals
at the remote site. For the fun of it, I wrote the software driver for
the HYPERChannel box ... basically scanned the channel program
... created a simplified version which was download (over HYPERChannel
network) to HYPERChannel A51x remote device adatper (aka channel
emulator box at the remote building).
There was no noticable difference in terminal response at the remote
building. However, there was an interesting side-effect at the STL
datacenter ... with overall system thruput improving 10-15%. Turns out
with the mainframes (168, 3033), installations were use to spreading the
3274 controllers over the same channels with disk controllers. The
problem turned out that the 3274s were also extremely slow on the
channel side (besides being slow on the terminal head side) ... with
very high channel busy ... even for the simplest of operations. The
HYPERChannel boxes that directly attached to (real) mainframe channels
were significantly more efficient than the 3274s ... for the identical
operations (the enormous 3274 channel busy time had been moved to the
simulated channel HYPERChannel A51x boxes at the remote site) ... which
resulted in significantly reduced contention with disk operations and
the overall 10-15% increased thruput. misc. old posts mentioning
various things ... including HYPERChannel work
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subnetwork.html#hsdt
for other IMS drift ... old reference that when Jim left for Tandem
... he was palming off some number of things for me ... including
database consulting with the IMS group ... and talking to customers
about relational databases:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2007.html#email801006
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2007.html#email801016
in this post
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2007.html#1
following post in the same thread ... comment about rewriting IOS for
disk engineering so it would never fail (related to them attempting to
use MVS and finding it had a 15min MTBF in their environment)
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2007.html#2
above includes this old email
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2007.html#email801015
about initial MVS regression tests with injected 3380 errors, MVS
required re-IPL in all the casess (and in 2/3rds of the cases, no
indication what the problem was).
--
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
Rick Fochtman
-----Original Message-----
>>From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Ed Finnell
>>
>>In a message dated 8/29/2010 9:02:07 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
>>zedgar...@GMAIL.COM writes:
>>
>>No, it's retro, like the 50s: remember those round TVs? :-)
>>
>>
>>
>>Dumont and Zenith were big. Sky King, Cpt Preston, Buster Brown, and
>>
>>
>Ruff
>
>
>>and Ready. Evening news was 'Walter Concrete' as my sister used to
>>
>>
>say.
>
>"Walter Crankcase, Tom Brokejaw and Peter Lemming" were the "big three"
>news anchors. Then "Dan Blather" took over when "Walter Crankcase"
>retired.
>
> -jc-
>
------------------------------------<snip>----------------------------------
Don't forget Chet Huntley & David Brinkley :-)
Rick
deputybubba
Take a look at Tom Brennan as others have stated.
Free 30 day trial and a one time fee, great product.
Bruce
Linda Mooney
I have a local 3270 in my cube, along with a PC with emulation and dual monitors. I used to have a real 3279 s3g. It was wonderful, but I couldn't remote to it like I can the PC. I like not having to drive in when I 'get the call' off-hours. :-)
Linda
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick Fochtman" <rfoc...@YNC.NET>
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 2:29:02 PM
Subject: Re: 3270 Emulator Software
You forgot "Rin, Tin, Tin" and "Hoppalong Cassidy" :-) Not to mention
Roy Rogers, with Dale, Trigger, Buttermilk and a Jeep named "Nelly
Belle". :-)
Rick
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Ed Finnell wrote:
>
>In a message dated 8/29/2010 9:02:07 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
>zedgar...@GMAIL.COM writes:
>
>No, it's retro, like the 50s: remember those round TVs? :-)
>
>
>
>
>Dumont and Zenith were big. Sky King, Cpt Preston, Buster Brown, and Ruff
>and Ready. Evening news was 'Walter Concrete' as my sister used to say.
>Somewhere along the way I got a chemistry set and an AT&T science kit and my
>lifelong adventure began...
>
>
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>send email to list...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO
>Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
>.
Richards, Robert B.
How about the commercials?
Ovaltine, N-E-S-T-L-E-S, 20 Mule Team Borax, Brylcreem (A Little Dab'll Do Ya!), Ipana Toothpaste with Bucky Beaver (Brusha... Brusha... Brusha. Get the New Ipana - it's dandy for your teeth!), LSMFT, Show us your Lark.
George Carlin had a whole routine on commercial slogans. Hilarious!
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ron Hawkins
Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2010 10:17 PM
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Subject: Re: 3270 Emulator Software
What about Skippy, the bush kangaroo...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of
> Linda Mooney
> Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2010 12:17 PM
> To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Anne & Lynn Wheeler
> This thread just proves most of us are getting or already are... *old*! :-)
>
> How about the commercials?
>
> Ovaltine, N-E-S-T-L-E-S, 20 Mule Team Borax, Brylcreem (A Little
> Dab'll Do Ya!), Ipana Toothpaste with Bucky Beaver
> (Brusha... Brusha... Brusha. Get the New Ipana - it's dandy for your
> teeth!), LSMFT, Show us your Lark.
>
> George Carlin had a whole routine on commercial slogans. Hilarious!
I had done dynamic adaptive resource management while undergraduate in
the 60s ... and the company included it for cp67 distribution.
then in the early 70s, the cp67->vm370 morph had a lot of simplification
and most of it was dropped ... which was followed periodically by lots
of pressure from SHARE to have me re-release it for vm370.
then there was the FS period that totally consumed most of the
corporations attention ... and 370 hardware & software product pipelines
were allowed to dry up. when FS was finally killed, there was mad
rush to get products back into the 370 pipeline
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/submain.html#futuresys
I had converted a bunch of stuff from cp67 and vm370 and doing product
distribution for large number of internal datacenters (and making less
then complimentary comments about reality of the FS effort) ... some old
email
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/v.html#email731212
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/w.html#email750102
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/w.html#email750430
a combination of SHARE pressure and mad rush to get stuff back into
product pipeline was enough to overcome development group NIH ... I was
told to create the resource manager ... which was also selected to be
the guinea pig for starting to charge for kernel software (and i had to
spend lots of time with various parties working on policies for kernel
software charging) ... some past posts about starting to charge for
application software with the 23jun69 unbundling announcement (but
initially, kernel software was still free)
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/submain.html#unbundle
Somebody from corporate reviewed the resource manager specs and ask
where all the tuning parameters were (the favorite son operating system
in POK was doing a resource manager with an enormous number of manual
tuning parameters). The comment was all "modern" operating systems had
enormous numbers of manual tuning knobs for use by customer specialists
... and my resource manager couldn't be released w/o having some manual
tuning parameters. I tried to explain that a major point of dynamic
adptive resource manager ... was that the resource management did all
the "tuning" ... doing all the work dynamically adapting the system to
different configurations and workloads ... but it fell on deaf ears.
So I was forced to add some number of manual tuning modules and placed
them in a module call *SRM* ... and all the dynamic adaptive stuff went
into a module called *STP* (after TV commercial punch line for a product
associated with muscle cars of the 60s ... "The Racer's Edge").
I published the detailed description of the operations (including the
components in SRM), how they operated and also published the code (which
was also included as part of the standard source distribution &
maintenance; later I was told, the details were even taught in some
univ. courses). However, there was a joke related to the nature of
dynamic adaptive and feedback control operations ... given that the
"degrees of freedom" afforded the (*SRM*) manual tuning knobs were less
than the "degrees of freedom" allowed the dynamic adaptive mechanism,
over the same components (i.e. the dynamic adaptive nature could more
than compensate for any manual changes that might be made).
--
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Staller, Allan
<snip>
How about the commercials?
Ovaltine, N-E-S-T-L-E-S, 20 Mule Team Borax, Brylcreem (A Little Dab'll Do Ya!), Ipana Toothpaste with Bucky Beaver (Brusha... Brusha... Brusha. Get the New Ipana - it's dandy for your teeth!), LSMFT, Show us your Lark.
George Carlin had a whole routine on commercial slogans. Hilarious!
</snip>
McKown, John
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List
> Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2010 7:55 AM
> To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
> Subject: Re: Nostalgia (was 3270 Emulator Software)
>
> Forgot Burma Shave - Take it off! Take it all off! <G>
>
I proposed to Ida
Ida refused
I'da won my Ida
if I'da used:
Burma Shave.
--
John McKown
Systems Engineer IV
IT
Administrative Services Group
HealthMarkets(r)
9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone * (817)-691-6183 cell
john....@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com
Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM
Chase, John
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Staller, Allan
>
> Forgot Burma Shave - Take it off! Take it all off! <G>
>
> <snip>
> How about the commercials?
>
> Ovaltine, N-E-S-T-L-E-S, 20 Mule Team Borax, Brylcreem (A Little Dab'll Do Ya!), Ipana Toothpaste with
> Bucky Beaver (Brusha... Brusha... Brusha. Get the New Ipana - it's dandy for your teeth!), LSMFT, Show
> us your Lark.
>
> George Carlin had a whole routine on commercial slogans. Hilarious!
Lucille Ball and "Vita-meta-vegamin". :-)
-jc-
Staller, Allan
-----Original Message-----
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Staller, Allan
Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2010 7:55 AM
To: IBM-...@bama.ua.edu
Subject: Re: Nostalgia (was 3270 Emulator Software)
Dale Miller
I was hired by a contracting firm to work in the IMS support center at
the offsite facility referred to by Lynn. The staff at that time had
327x terminals. I was lucky enough to be part of a test program which
put a PC with 3270 emulation on my desk and that of an IBM regular in
the center. Worked well for me, until about a month later, I couldn't
boot my PC. After about 6 hours the support staff notified me (as I
recall this) that an IBM manager somewhere heard that an outside
contractor had access to a PC with emulation. He was afraid that I
could download IMS source code to a diskette and give it to a
competitor. Apparently, my PC had been disabled internally (by
changing the password). I was out of luck until they decided what to
do about it. When I came in the next morning, my diskette drive had a
key lock over the front, but I could then boot up my PC and do my job.
Under the 3-monkey philosophy, I decided to keep my mouth shut, but
the smartass in me wanted to point out that I had the authority to
create a tape on the machine where the source code resided, and mail
it to a customer. This facility was there to enable us to send
emergency fixes to customers. If I wanted to give the source code to a
competitor, that mechanism would have been an infinitely better way
than smuggling it out in 700k chunks.
The offsite facility was just a few blocks from the infamous
semiconductor facility (previously closed) which had contaminated the
soil and groundwater in the area.
While I was in the support center, they moved the IMS support center
back to STL, which was a very comfortable facility to work in (and a
relaxing 10-minute drive from my house, except when rains and
mudslides closed the road, and we had to drive in the back way through
the Almaden Research Center).
The downside issues of STL were the dangers of finding rattlesnakes
under your car, the huge gashes in the beautiful lawns made by wild
boars, and the high winds/eucalyptus tree situation. During one storm,
my car was dealt nasty front-end, windshield and roof damage by a
large eucalyptus branch, necessitating a tow-truck call and bumming a
ride home. Toward the end of my tour, management implemented a power-
control system which was supposed to turn off the lights in an office
if no one was in it. It was aggravating to have to throw my hands up
every few minutes to convince the sensors that I was indeed in the
room. In spite of those issues, it was a good place to work.
I did eventually leave to go back to my real calling - systems
programming.
Dale Miller
dalel...@comcast.net
Anne & Lynn Wheeler
> Actually, this is a reflection on Lynn Wheeler's contribution of 8/30.
re:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2010m.html#80 3270 Emulator Software
in that period ... the executive responsible for IMS had left and joined
a large financial institution in the area ... and for some time was out
hiring IMS developers ... eventually having a larger IMS development
group than STL. Also, email reference (about Jim leaving for Tandem and
palming off database consulting with IMS group to me), makes mention of
foreign entities having IMS competitive product. In any case, STL
management was quite sensitive to issue of competitive IMS development
activity.
the IMS FE service group in Boulder area ... was faced with similar
situation ... being moved to bldg on the other side of the highway
... and similar HYPERChannel (channel extender) implementation was
deployed for them.
In the STL case, there was T3 digital radio (microwave), went to
repeater tower on the hill above STL, to dish on top of bldg. 12 (on
main plant site) and then to dish on roof of off-site bldg. where the
relocated IMS group were sent. After "85" was built (elevated section
cutting the corner of the main plant site), radar detectors were
triggered when autos drove thru the path of the signal (between tower on
the hill and roof of bldg. 12).
In the boulder case, they were moved to bldg across highway from where
the datacenter was located. Infrared T1 modems (sort of higher powered
version of consumer remote controls) were placed on the roofs of the two
bldgs to carry the HYPERChannel signal. There was some concern that
there would be "rain-fade" resulting in transmission interruption during
severe weather. However, during one of the worst storms ... white-out
snow storm when people couldn't get into work, the error monitoring
recorded a slight increase in bit-error rate.
However, there was early transmission interruption that would occur in
the middle of the afternoon. Turns out that as the sun crossed the sky,
it warmed different sides of the bldgs, which resulted in causing the
bldgs to slightly lean in different directions. This slight change in
bldg. angle was enough to throw-off the alignment of the infrared
modems. This resulted in having to position the infrared modem mounted
poles on the roof to make them less sensitive to the way the bldgs.
leaned as different sides were heated and cooled during the course of
the day.
The HYPERchannel vendor attempted to talk the corporation into letting
them release my software support. However, there was strong objection
from the group in POK that was hoping to eventually get ESCON released
(and they felt any improvement in HYPERchannel in the market, would
reduce the chance of ever making business case for shipping ESCON). As a
result, the HYPERchannel vendor had to reverse engineer my software
support and re-implement it from scratch (to ship to customers).
One of the things I had done in the support ... was if I got an
unrecoverable transmission error ... I would simulate a "channel check"
error in status back to the kernel software. This was copied in the
vendor implementation and would result in phone call from the 3090
product administrator several years later. Turns out that the industry
service that gathered EREP data and generated summary reports of error
statistics ... was showing 3090 "channel checks" being 3-4 times the
expected rate.
They tracked it down to HYPERchannel software support generating
"channel checks" in simulated ending status. After a little research, I
determined that IFCC (interface control checks) resulted in identical
same path through error recovery (as "channel checks) and talked the
HYPERchannel vendor into changing their software support to simulate
IFCC for unrecoverable transmission errors.
About the same time, there was a different problem inside the
corporation ... that seemed to affect STL more than many of the other
labs. I had stumbled across the ADVENTURE game at Tymshare (had been
ported from PDP10 at stanford to the TYMSHARE vm370/cms commercial
timesharing service) ... and managed to obtain a copy of the fortran
source ... and made a copy of the CMS executable on the internal
network. For a period, some number of locations seemed to have all
their computing resources going to employees doing nothing but playing
ADVENTURE (for people demonstrating that they succesfully acquired all
points and finished the game, I would send them a copy of the
source). STL management would eventually decree that employees would
have a 24hr grace period, but after that, any employee caught playing
ADVENTURE during standard work hours would be dealt with severely.
--
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
----------------------------------------------------------------------
bbreynolds
wrote:
> This thread just proves most of us are getting or already are... *old*! :-)
>
> How about the commercials?
>
> Ovaltine, N-E-S-T-L-E-S, 20 Mule Team Borax, Brylcreem (A Little Dab'll Do Ya!), Ipana Toothpaste with Bucky Beaver (Brusha... Brusha... Brusha. Get the New Ipana - it's dandy for your teeth!), LSMFT, Show us your Lark.
>
> George Carlin had a whole routine on commercial slogans. Hilarious!
Before Bucky Beaver shilled for Ipana, their spokespersons were
Foodini and Pinhead.
Bruce B. Reynolds, Trailing Edge Technologies, Warminster PA
bbreynolds
/SNIP
> Toward the end of my tour, management implemented a power-
> control system which was supposed to turn off the lights in an office
> if no one was in it. It was aggravating to have to throw my hands up
> every few minutes to convince the sensors that I was indeed in the
> room. In spite of those issues, it was a good place to work.
>
In one of my underemployment jobs, I worked the night crew at a big-
box
store, and did the electronics stocking and restocking. For security,
the
store had enclosed the electronics back room in square-mesh chicken
wire: equaled a very good Faraday cage, and no reception for the
Symbol
hand-held terminals: although the store had been opened for multiple
years,
and there were constant complaints about the reception in that area,
no
one among corporate headquarters nor the local installers knew what
was
going on. Got a separate transceiver inside the cage.
Anywho, they had also installed motion sensors on the lights in each
aisle:
lights would come on as you walked into the aisle, but the sensor only
faced out of the aisle. When it timed out, you had to walk out of the
aisle
and back in again to get the lights on. When this happened to me a
number
of times while I was on top of a ladder, and suddenly in the dark, I
suggested
that I would be making an OSHA complaint, and again it dawned on them
that the sensor had to work both ways: it was still possible for the
lights
to time out (some jobs, like inventory, did not require much motion),
but now
the handwave got the lights on. I wonder what portion of the back
room's crew
clock time was spent walking to the end of the aisle to the lights on.
Anne & Lynn Wheeler
... image of the 3270 logo screen at the offsite IMS location
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/vmhyper.jpg
it is from 1980 35mm slide presentation on the effort ... above was
3270 35mm slide that was scanned and cropped just to show the logo
screen.
another part of the 1980 35mm slide presentation
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/hyperlink.jpg
showing possible HYPERChannel (network) channel extender operation.
In the mid-80s, NCAR did a SAN/NAS like filesystem implementation using
MVS acting as tape<->disk file staging for (non-IBM) supercomputers with
HYPERChannel interconnect. Non-IBM systems would send MVS request for
some data ... MVS would make sure it was staged to disk, download
channel program into the memory of the appropriate HYPERChannel remote
device adapter and return a pointer (for that channel program) to the
requester. The requester then could directly execute the channel program
... flowing the data directly from disk to the requester (over the
HYPERChannel network) w/o requiring it to pass thru MVS (modulo any
tape/disk staging).
This became the requirement for "3rd party transfers" in the later
standardization effort for HiPPI (100mbyte/sec standards form of Cray
channel) with IPI-3 disks (i.e. not requiring transferred data to flow
thru the control point) ... and also showed up as requirement in FCS
standards meeting (i.e. what FICON is built on).
In the early 90s, gov. labs were encouraged to try and commercialize
technology they had developed. NCAR did a spin-off of their system as
"Mesa Archival" ... but implementation rewritten to not require MVS
(i.e. support done on other platforms). San Jose disk division invested
in "Mesa Archival" ... and we were asked to periodically audit and help
them whenever we could (they had offices at the bottom of the hill from
where NCAR is located) ... aka San Jose was looking at it as helping
them get into large non-IBM-mainframe disk farms.
--
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
----------------------------------------------------------------------