855 vs. 870

[Steve Dickens]

I would be interested to hear from anyone who has used the 870 message for
an acknowledgement from a purchase order, instead of the 855. We have a
business unit in our company, who is stating that a best practice study
has reccommended the 870 over the 855. I am not sure that in a normal
(simple) supply chain scenario where a customer places an order, and a
supplier responds with an order status, that anything more than the 855
will provide any additional value. And...the 870 is certainly a more
complex message to work with, given its heirarchical design.
I am also interested to know the history (breifly) of the development of
the 870. Was it developed with a specific usage in mind, for a particular
industry, etc.?

[Carl Galgano]

Steve:
The 870 is usually sent if the seller (ie vendor) in the relationship
changes something in the order, like the ship date, if the order can't be
shipped on time. It usually includes some sort of reason code to let the
buyer know why the order is being changed. The 855 is a PO ackknowledgement
is is used to acknowledge an 850.
The exchange usually looks like this:

Purchaser Vendor
850====================>
<=======================855
<=======================870
860====================>
<=======================865

I'm not saying the is the ONLY correct way or for that matter the ONLY way
its being done. However I've been doing this a long time and this is the
most prevelant way of exchanging order info. I would say that it is
incorrect to send an 870 as a response to an 850, rather send the 855 and
only send an 870 if you change the order.

Good luck.
Carl

Carl Galgano
EDI Consulting Services, Inc.
http://cgalgano.home.mindspring.com
mailto://cgal...@ediconsulting.com
(770) 422-2995

[Fernando Ribeiro]

> Jouhshen,
>
> >What is the equivalent of 870 and 865 in EDIFACT?
> >
> >Regards,
> >Jouhshen
>
> Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe ORDRSP
> is the equivalent of 870, 855 and 865 messages.
> If you use 855 and 865 to indicate receipt and syntatic
> acceptance ONLY of the PO or PO change, you can use the
> CONTRL message.
>
> From the UN/EDIFACT D96A ORDRSP definitions:
>
> >1.3 Principles
> >
> > - A seller may respond for one or more goods items or
> > services.
> >
> > - The response may be for a Purchase order or a Purchase
> > order change request:
> [my comment: response to 850 and 860]
> > - an acknowledgment of receipt and understanding of data,
> [my comment: 855/865's role]
> > - confirmation of acceptance,
> [my comment: 855/865's role]
> > - a proposal of amendment,
> [my comment: 870's role]
> > - a notification of non-acceptance for all or part of the
> > message.
> [my comment: 855/865's role]
> > - A purchase order response may refer to goods items or
> > services related to one or more delivery schedules, call-
> > offs, etc.
> >
> > - A purchase order response for cross-border transactions
> > may contain additional information for customs and/or
> > statistical purposes.
> >
> > - A purchase order response may contain details for
> > transport and destination as well as delivery patterns.
> >
> > - A buyer's purchase order may be responded to by one or
> > more response messages, according to business practice.
>
> Fernando Ribeiro
> SIBS - Sociedade Interbancária de Serviços
> frib...@sibs.mailcom.pt +351 1 7918838 GMT+0

[JouhS...@pg.slr.com]

Carl,

What is the equivalent of 870 and 865 in EDIFACT?

Regards,
Jouhshen

[William J. Kammerer]

I'm a packrat when it comes to EDI flow diagrams: there's an especially
nice one which illustrates Fernando Ribeiro's points on the uses of the
EDIFACT ORDRSP at Compaq's Supplier EDI pages at
http://www.compaq.com/corporate/edi/sup-flow.html. Texas Instruments
also has the EIDX "Order Business Models" which illustrates many of the
same points at http://www.ti.com/sc/docs/scedi/ordmodel.pdf; their
X12-EDIFACT chart is at
http://www.ti.com/sc/docs/scedi/techpaks/sctecpak.htm.

Kudos to Compaq and Texas Instruments for generously making their
diagrams and EDI ICs and MIGs available!

For these and other examples of MIGs and flow diagrams, check out
FORESIGHT Corporation's Resources Web-Page. You will see dozens of links
to sites containing viewable Implementation Guidelines or Specifications
(ICs or MIGs). Just go to http://www.foresight-edi.com/ and select
"Resources." From there, you'll be able to look at the list of ICs
arranged by Company within Industry Group.

William J. Kammerer
FORESIGHT Corp.
6543E Commerce Pkwy.
Dublin, OH USA 43017-3221
(614) 791-1600 (voice)
(614) 791-1609 (fax)
e-mail: wkam...@foresight-edi.com
Visit FORESIGHT Corp., the world's leading supplier of EDI productivity
tools, at http://www.foresight-edi.com/