JSP: Record Deal?
chuck nevitt
Well PW you still haven't convinced me that the 15,OOOk
that the label will make vs the 2OOOk the artist will make is a fair
deal---yeah yeah, I know these are just guestimates--but I'm basing them
on figures of DBS SALES with artists who rarely play--much less tour. I
only have
3 small, regional distributors (TX,CA,and Belgium/Holland) and I have no
idea how JSP's distribution stacks up against DBS Records--but I'm
betting it's a helluva lot better... Do you really think that if JSP
wasn't making money that they would be putting out an average of 25
records a year--I don't--but you can/will think whatever you like.
BTW, Don O. is JSP'S contact in the states--so perhaps he could talk to
Mr. Stedman on your behalf---if you're as good as you say you are we
should be listening to you on the radio in no time...good luck with your
career in music--I'm sure you'll go far...................
regards, chuck n.
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P.W. Fenton
At 10:08 AM 2/28/98 -0800, chuck nevitt said...
. >Well PW you still haven't convinced me that the 15,OOOk
>that the label will make vs the 2OOOk the artist will make is a fair
>deal---yeah yeah, I know these are just guestimates--but I'm basing them
>on figures of DBS SALES with artists who rarely play--much less tour. I
>only have
>3 small, regional distributors (TX,CA,and Belgium/Holland) and I have no
>idea how JSP's distribution stacks up against DBS Records--but I'm
>betting it's a helluva lot better... Do you really think that if JSP
>wasn't making money that they would be putting out an average of 25
>records a year--I don't--but you can/will think whatever you like.
Not only do you not get it, but it appears you can't get it. I never
doubted or quarreled with your figures. I never once suggested that to you
that JSP wasn't making plenty of money, nor did I indicate that I believed
that.
All I did do was explain to you that un-proven artists have nothing of
value to deal with, so they quite naturally, and quite reasonably, come out
on the VERY short end of the stick.
Think of it this way. You walk up on a high stakes poker game and you
watch as thousands of dollars change hands with each round. You know that
your real good at poker and could be winning money from all the players,
but you haven't got enough money to buy into the game. In fact, you
haven't got a dime. So I say to you, I'll buy you into to the game, but
only under these terms. If you win I get my stake back and 80% of your
winnings. You keep 20%. If you lose, you walk away the same way you came
in, broke.
You say that's a rip off. I say that's the facts of life, and if you are
any good, you stand to make a pile of money without risking a cent.
That is how the record business works. What the unknown artist brings to
the game is completely intangible. Agree to the terms, and take your
chances at success, or walk away as broke as you came in the door. I don't
see what's so difficult to understand about that.
>BTW, Don O. is JSP'S contact in the states--so perhaps he could talk to
>Mr. Stedman on your behalf---if you're as good as you say you are we
>should be listening to you on the radio in no time...good luck with your
>career in music--I'm sure you'll go far...................
Whether or not I go anywhere isn't the issue. Whether or not I have any
talent isn't the issue. Your sarcastic good luck wish isn't even the
issue. The issue is whether you can learn from the obvious, and rise above
your naivety. I'm not feeling very confident that you can.
P.W. Fenton
Tampa, Florida
http://www.gate.net/~pwfenton
Bill Salmon
Hash Brown said:
<<I put out my own cd, and have netted about 4500 profit. It can be done, I
don't necessarily care if everyone knows who I am, I'm happy with it. HB>>
This interesting in light ofr Chuck Nevitt's math that had JSP making about $20,000 on a CD. And of course JSP would have paid some of that to the artist. Lessening the profit even more. Oh, and I would just hazard a guess here that JSP has some overhead that has to be paid for somehow, you know office etc.
And strangly enough, the man who HAS done business with JSP (KBR) says:
<<Well as far as I can tell, I will put out discs till I catch My Buddy,
John Lee Hooker, I figure I'm about 50 behind him..On any label, I
will do em. Easy Disc, Jsp, Tone King, Whatever... >>
So, If Kenny is happy, if JSP is happy, what are we discussing here? OUR outrage at a deal that both parties consider satisfactory? Strage...
Bill (Yeah, but I woulda....) Salmon
HASHBB
In a message dated 3/1/98 8:52:54 PM, net...@mycroft.mexia.com wrote:
>This interesting in light ofr Chuck Nevitt's math that had JSP making about
$20,000
>on a CD. And of course JSP would have paid some of that to the artist.
Lessening
>the profit even more. Oh, and I would just hazard a guess here that JSP has
some
>overhead that has to be paid for somehow, you know office etc.
In defense of no one, for the record, this 4500$ profit reflects total sales
of less than 1000 units, with very little distribution which I procured on my
own, much less than Mr. Nevitt's totals, which I believe to be pretty
realistic. HB
chuck nevitt
Correct me if I'm wrong on this Mr. Stedman--but I've been
lead to believe that 25OO$ is usually the amount (front
money--to be recouped out of artist royalties) given to
JSP artist to record that all-important debut album. This
album should (IMO) be done as well as possible--because
quite often this is gonna be the record that people judge
the new kid on the block by. If there are shortcomings due
to a limited budget I don't think the critics or fans are
gonna blame anyone but the artist...and I guarantee they
will think twice about buying the next record by this
artist regardless of what labels he has/hasn't moved onto.
And think how frustrating it is to know that you're not
gonna have enough budget to pay your sidemen on the
session anything close to union wages for working on your
record--not to mention band mates who have probably put in
many extra hours in your garage rehearsing for the big
recording.
You probably realize that the amount of upfront money is
not going to allow you to hire a producer--so you'll have
to fill those shoes, too. The producer is gonna be asked
several important questions at the start (and thru out) of
the session by the engineer that can make big differences
in the way the record sounds (and cost) in the end...so be
ready for those! The engineer is gonna ask what kind of
format do you want to use (analog or digital) then he'll
ask what how many tracks you want to use (2, 8, 16, 24,
48, etc), do you want to use Dolby A, B, C, SR, etc),
where would you like the drummer--in the booth or out.
Then he will probably ask do you want to go direct to the
box (and don't you dare) with the bass and or/guitar--or
do you want to use the amp in combination (better) with
the direct--or just use the amps alone. How about the
vocals--do you want to record those live with the band--do
you want to do 'em in or out of the booth...and then at
this point your engineer will probably be able to tell
that you don't have a clue (actually he'll know that
before this point) and suggest that you might want to hire
him to be your producer too...oops, not enough budget for
that. Ok, Mr Producer, what kinds of mikes do you want to
use on the vocals, drums (close or overhead), guitar amps,
piano, organ, horns, etc (they all call for different
applications), do you think you're gonna want to do much
overdubbing--if so, the engineer needs to know upfront so
he can isolate certain things to keep bleed-in down...but
I'll answer this one for you--you are not gonna have the
budget to do much, if any, overdubbing...oh yeah, do we
want to run this tape @ 15ips or 3Oips...ok, time to set
up the equipment and get EQ's!
Now the next surprise is gonna be how long it takes to get
everything sounding just right...and since you couldn't
afford a producer you're going to get to tell the engineer
when YOU think it's right (with all kind of help from the
band--which will really slow things down!)...omygod, look
at the clock, you've been in there 4 hours and you are
FINALLY ready to record. OK, you start recording when you
realise every single person is so nervous that a GROOVE is
going to be hard to fall into--much less getting something
you can live with (and have critics tear apart) for the
rest of your life (which at this point you wonder if you
will live thru this session). Well, 3 hrs. and 6 smokin'
breaks later the engineer says he's got to tear things
down for the next session...my God, eight hours latter and
you mean to say you MIGHT have on track that's a keeper
--and those sidemen that you hired to come in and play are
asleep on the couch and "sorry, we got a gig tomorrow
nite, make that check out to my ex-wife will ya" are the
next words you here--great--well, so much for the horns
and keyboards...oh man, you just realized that this EQ and
set-up procedure is going to take another two hours off of
tomorrows precious recording time...well, maybe you will
come in tomorrow and lay down the remaining 11 tracks, and
fix those mistakes, let the lead guitat player try those
solo's one more time, and the vocalist is gonna need to
polish up some of thise horrible drop-outs because he kept
movin' off mike...no problem, you'll have at least 6 hours
to get all that done after setting up...GOOD LUCK!!
OK, mix down day, and a whole new set of questions, and
take yor time, because after all--this is your baby, your
dream , your nightmare. I'm not going over all the nuances
of a mixing session---but I will give you some darn good
advice: un-invite the band to help in the mixing session--
because they won't be of any! Just you and the engineer
need to be involved in this most critical part of the
recording--cause you are gonna drive him nuts all by your
self asking him repeatedly if there isn't some way to fix
this & that in the mix...ok, so you ran overtime, you
still finished up in 3O hours...lets figure up how much
you're gonna pocket off the top--since this is probably
the last money you'll ever see from the label!
(chuck math)
3O hours at
4O$ per hour is
_______________
12OO $ add these costs
6OO$ for your band members (a 1OO$ per man-per day)
2OO$ for those sidemen you didn't get to use
4OO$ for tapes (average for a session)
1OO$ tip for the engineer
5O$ for food, drinks, etc.
________________
255O $ and your label has given you (to be payed back)
25OO $...well ,congratulations, you at least have a
finished master in your hands....and you're only 255O$ IN
THE WHOLE, and it also cost you you're song publishing,
but hey, you know for a fact that you'll be able to make
much more money, now that the label is promoting you! The
kind of money that say a Kenny Neal might make at Poor
David's playing for the door on a recent Sat. nite was
gonna make (I think there was 3O people there...at 7$
dollars a head they made a whoppin' 21O$ minus rooms and
gas from who knows where), or the kinda money Monster Mike
Welch made last year when he and his band drove up to the
Bluecat from New Orleans and had there gig cancelled 3
hours before showtime because of "rain." Oh yeah, don't
forget how good you're gonna feel when the reviewers tear
you another one because they say the band sounded
unprepaired, the mix was terrible, and what were they
thinkin' when they OK'ed those vocals...well, you think,
you did the best you could with the limited budget you had
to work with...oh well.
I'm not going to tell you that things couldn't work out a
lot better than the above situaion I presented as a
possibility...but I wouldn't count on it too much..as a
matter of fact, I was being kind with the number of
problems that arise--so to not scare you off from the
whole process. But if your gonna have to pay the money
back out of your royalties anyhow, you might as well get
you enough to do it right...because if it's not worth
doing right--it's not worth doing!!
regards,
chuck nevitt (i done seen it with my own good eye)
Kenny Ray
Now Chuck, He's Hip to the Biz!!
except, We can be rollin in 1 1/2 hours Max and I work em (The Session
Players) Like the Great Santini.ie; like a drill Sargaent.
Hell I was a Sargaent , USAF 69-72. London England.Seems like another
lifetime..
I remember we did Fingers Taylor's LP/cd in 14 hours with Anson &
Myself on Guitar, Wes Starr, Pharoah, Eddie Stout on Bass. Jim
Sullivan, Great engineer, Summet Burnet Studio, Dallas '85
KBR the Rottweiler of the Guitar.
Kate Ernde
Kenny Ray wrote:
>
> Now Chuck, He's Hip to the Biz!!
> except, We can be rollin in 1 1/2 hours Max and I work em (The Session
> Players) Like the Great Santini.ie; like a drill Sargaent.
> Hell I was a Sargaent , USAF 69-72. London England.
Whoa! ...and if you want an incredible road manager, hire one who's
been in the British Army. I know from whence I speak - you and all
your equipment will be there on time and in place! (And this includes
pub breaks.)
HASHBB
In a message dated 3/3/98 5:47:36 PM, blu...@earthlink.net wrote:
>I remember we did Fingers Taylor's LP/cd in 14 hours with Anson &
>Myself on Guitar, Wes Starr, Pharoah, Eddie Stout on Bass. Jim
>Sullivan, Great engineer, Summet Burnet Studio, Dallas '85
Kenny, thats the mighty Bob Sullivan, who did the Lousiana hayride when Elvis
was on, also did the hit "Suzy Q". HB
chuck nevitt
That was Bob Sullivan at the board...he also did the ZuZu
Bollin lp and the Henry Qualls CD at Sumet for us...not to
mention the first two T-Birds records, as well as Anson's
first two releases. They were all done in studio A--which
is the big-room...they have also recently done some major
renovations to that room--like replacing the carpeted floor with a wood
floor--should make it even better! And Bob is still around...he lives in
OK but said he would drive down anytime for a blues-session!...c.n.
Kenny "Blue" Ray wrote:
<<Now Chuck, He's Hip to the Biz!!except, We can be rollin in 1 1/2
hours Max and I work em (The Session Players) Like the Great Santini.ie;
like a drill Sargaent. Hell I was a Sargaent , USAF 69-72. London
England.Seems like another lifetime..
I remember we did Fingers Taylor's LP/cd in 14 hours with Anson & Myself
on Guitar, Wes Starr, Pharoah, Eddie Stout on Bass. Jim Sullivan, Great
engineer, Summet Burnet Studio, Dallas '85>>
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