Re: Native Instruments Session Guitarist Free Download
Leocricia Flinchum
If you look just above your last post you'll see a screenshot of the pattern maker. That's the tool they give you to create or modify patterns. I personally haven't played with it that much but it seems fairly thorough.
@jimchik you have to have the melody instruments for that. The pattern based ones don't allow for that. However there really is more to these instruments than meets the eye and there are things you can do as work arounds.
@Uwe303 Yes absolutely, it is a limitation not to have an option to have the "stop immediatley" feature for when you do want that. I spent some more time with the guitars. Don't know what you guys have, but just for clarity, I have 4 of them in K13 UCE. . Strummed Accoustic, Strummed Accoustic2, Picked Accoustic and Electric Sunburst delux.
Strummed Accoustic is the only one you can choose to stop instantly via that panel of options. The best the others can do 1/8th. Note: that is when Picked Accoustic and ESBde are using their pattern modes. Of course the melody mode doesn't apply here. If you use the keyswitch to stop immediately its limited in that you are stuck with it sounding the last note you pressed for your chord sequence.
I went and tried to replicate what you said about the auto chords allowing you to stop immediately. I wasn't able to achieve this on those other 3 instruments at all. If I set strummed Accoustic to stop at 1/8 then activated auto chords it didn't stop immediately. There is a case to be made as I think you already said, it depends when actual notes are playing so I made sure I chose a preset that was reasonably busy when I did a key off.
As you've mentioned, its one of my favourite tricks to shorten the phrases AND double them - especially great for variation on an otherwise slow song for incidentals and I do this a lot. I think this one method goes a long way to improve the realism.
What I'd like to see improved is 1/ a finer stop time (1/16th) as well as stop immediately, and 2/ some of the patterns wont play below a certain tempo. I find that pretty limiting. Theres a bit of inconsistency too if I double the project tempo and 1/2 the speed in the pattern. In one case I was able to achieve a lower tempo by just leaaving the pattern tempo at 1.1 and slow the project tempo right down.
I forgot to mention theres one little glitch that happens from time to time. When I stop the transport, depending when I do that, a guitar pattern can just keep playing infinitely until I start the transport again! lol, I use it as an opportunity to freewheel and play other stuff with it. Sometimes I actually find it quite inspiring as weird as that may sound.
No problem, we are here in the forum for that purpose, even if it takes longer sometimes. And yes the power button enables auto chords, so you only have to press one white key and the black keys somehow change the notes/Chords.
I have some multiple problems with NI session guitars paterns. I am using electric vintage patern mode for this example, but the proble is on all my NI Session guitars I am using Ableton Live DAW and Launchkey MIDI contollers.
Problem # 1; when I stop the recording and start up again from the very beginning, the patterns start playing where I stopped the playback and not from the first session guitar pattern in the clip. So I reset my DAW to start up from the beginning of the 8 bar clip, and it does, but the session guitar patterns starts up from the key switch that was playinng when I stopped playback.
Problem # 2; When I add a second MIDI clip into the same track to start a chorus part or bridge part and record a differnt set of patterns, the original verse patterns I had already recorded (see problem # 1) All those MIDI clips play the patterns I recorded into the new clips.
"If you do change patterns over the course of the song you have to remember there's only one pattern in use at a time. If you have a pattern set later in the track and then reposition the playback to a section that's earlier, you'll still have the same pattern set from the previous section. Again the fix for this is to apply the pattern note across the entire span of where that pattern will be played" @DunedinDragon
So I'm using 63 Airplay B with the Sunburst Guitar. Chord changes are either halfway or 3/4 of the way through the pattern. I was getting VERY inconsistent playback. Copy paste the same 4 bars 4 times and get different notes in different bars.
I use a lot of the different session guitarist libraries and I've never had a problem other than initially getting used to the triggering time which is pretty much the same as you would have in switching between chords on an actual guitar. The other thing is how to position the articulation or pattern change MIDI notes so it affects the appropriate chord/pattern at the right time. It's not hard, it just needs to be precise. It's easiest to start a chord slightly ahead of the measure and put the change note on the measure so the change note affects the right chord. If you do change patterns over the course of the song you have to remember there's only one pattern in use at a time. If you have a pattern set later in the track and then reposition the playback to a section that's earlier, you'll still have the same pattern set from the previous section. Again the fix for this is to apply the pattern note across the entire span of where that pattern will be played.
Since most of the MIDI loops that drive the patterns are a full measure long (unless you go to the edit page and change the start/stop/loop points in the pattern), they will stop within the stop parameter that you set in the release time (1/8, 1/4, et al). But if you play the pattern for, say, 3 eighth notes with an 8th note release, it can be expected that the pattern will likely actually play for a half note (pattern dependent, obviously).
As for the patterns not starting on time, I've never had any issues (Win10/Nuendo) as long as they're quantized. I will sometimes advance the entire MIDI track offset by a few ticks to get it just a touch ahead of the beat tho.
Ive found getting the triggering right to be somewhat finnicky. I get the best results by making sure everything is slightly ahead of the beat. This is whats recommended in the documentation. IIRC they advise against quantizing but I find its better to Q then shift everything ahead a little, especially the keyswitches. Maybe its just me but I think in some cases at least, if you dont Q chords, some notes can get cut off and other weird anomolies. As a K13 UCE owner, Ive seen only the Strummed Accoustic will let you set it to stop instantly when you stop playing. I wished they all had that feature.
those instruments are really tricky, for example if you set it to stop instantly it only stops if the gap between notes is greater than one 1/8th note, otherwise it keeps playing the phrase in background and the notes are working like gates. Normal notes you can set on time, just the phrase triggers you can place a bit ahead. But i think those instruments are designed that way, as phrase players. But if you use auto chord it works the way you want if i understand you correctly.
@Uwe303 dont know if you were replying to me but yes they are tricky to get right (the phrases). Takes a bit of practise to get used to - especially (additionally) doing the keyswitches when you are used to playing a keyboard like a piano. (ie playing in the key of C but you want to move between a Db keyswitch and say, Eb)
But as you say, the instant stop thing depends, though Id never thought about it long enough to realize about the gating effect. I haven't experimented with auto chord at all. Where I can I set things to play "as played". I do find with the K13 UCE theres some good options to mix these guitars with melodic and pattern based, like playing them together (simultaneously) as long as you set up the right patterns in the right slots to compliment each other.
The chord feature is right above the box with the phrases, left side. It's strange that ,if that is enabled, the phrase stops right after releasing note and next chord plays the phrase from start but without it needs the gap of a 1/8th note to stop (if set to stop instantly) and then the next trigger let's it start from beginning. And if you play something please look at the bar under the phrase, then you can see where in the phrase you are, they are mostly 2 bars long, if tempo is set to 1:1. For me it made things more obvious.
@jimchik I can get results consistent enough to be useable as I work on my projects but I concur, I wouldn't like to be using these instruments live. Im In Logic and though I've seen a bit of funky behaviour, its not often enough for me to call it a bug, but as Uwe said these instruments are tricky to get right. Of course I wouldn't rule out buginess but in my case I've put it down more to just needing to work with these instruments to get the hang of how they work. For sure, the actual quality of these instruments is really nice, but playing them efficiently is another matter.
@Uwe303 so I did go and play around with those auto chords, but cant remember if they stopped instantly or not. I was quite intrigued by how the other notes in the octave were used. In any case theres always those other key switches which do a hard stop /upward single strum or downward single strum - etc - those will stop a pattern in its tracks.
I also don't think it's a bug i guess the session instruments are really made to use the phrases as a whole. But a request for stopping playback immediately if set so would make sense and would make the instruments more versatile.
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