Auto Pilot with Gyro

[davidcf...@rogers.com]

Has anybody changed their Raymarine course computer from a non gyro to one of the newer models such as a S1G or a X10 ( with gyro ) . If so is there a marked improvement in the performance?

Fletch

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[Edward English]

Fletch,

We installed the X30 (same as X10 but sized for the boat) on our 40 and it has been great. I am a real fan of this new pilot and used the earlier version with gyro on our previous boat in heavy winds and seas for protracted offshore sailing. Our current pilot has handled heavy seas with 25-30 knot winds and steered the boat without an issue, including downwind with quartering seas and winds, which I believe is the most stressing for the pilot. I also have the remote handheld controller so that I can be anywhere on the boat and adjust it (which we need to do to avoid logs here in the NW).  I also have the rudder sensor installed.  One thing I do not do is to use the autopilot controller capability with our C90 Wide. I am not happy with the way it drives the system. We did use the NMEA output capability to connect out Fluxgate compass to the C90Wide.

Ed

OBS

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[Ben Campbell]

I have the same question. I've got an S1 non-gyro, and find it really hard to get it tuned right for our gusty inland lake winds. I've considered adding the external rate gyro, or just replacing the whole thing with an X10. Does anyone know if that is plug compatible with the peripherals from my S1?

[Ben Campbell]

Er, I guess I meant the X-5, not X-10. And it looks like there's an even newer wheelpilot corepack.

[David Mackintosh]

I am sure i posted to this topic weeks ago i also  have a smart heading system for sale :-)

regards

David

[davidcf...@rogers.com]

David. Do not want to sound dumb, is the smart heading system different to the course computer? Is it an add on or a stand alone unit?

Fletch

Sent from my BlackBerry device on the Rogers Wireless Network

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From: David Mackintosh <sv.highl...@gmail.com>

Sender: benetea...@googlegroups.com

Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2012 08:28:54 +0000

To: <benetea...@googlegroups.com>

ReplyTo: benetea...@googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: {Beneteau Owners} Auto Pilot with Gyro

[David Mackintosh]

yes it is an add on to give  stabilised course holding MOSTLY for use in giving a better Radar picture  BUT all it really is is the G option adding a Gyro to any Raymarine non gyro course

i wrote this a number of weeks ago

David Mackintosh sv.highl...@gmail.com	17/08/2011
to beneteau-owners

First have you thought about the GyroPlus upgrade?  Then i would have just considered one of the 'older' corepacks -  get the G version with the inbuilt gyro the S1G/S2/GS3G  (dependent on boat size/displacement) from probably Ebay

woo hoo  a new one http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Raymarine-S2G-Autopilot-Corepack-New-Box-/120740734893?pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item1c1cb567ad

We upgraded from a 100/200/300 model to an S3G and are about to fit twin actuators.  As ATM we have the rotary drive via another chain to the wheel shaft and want to add the linear drive direct to the rudder stock/quadrant with a selector switch so we have a system that does not use the steering mechanism (cables and chains etc) in the heavy weather.

Issues of course for us are finding a good solid mounting spot for the non moving end and getting a 14" actuating centre on the rudder stock.  The Std Bennie fit on all the 461's i have looked at - is naughtily directly onto the Stb Aft cabin bulkhead without any significant additional stiffening - then fixing the other end at around a 10" centre which is about as much as you can get if you fix the output to the quadrant itself.  IT should of course be at a 14" centre to give the autopilot a lot more power (Torque on the rudder post).

The S3G upgrade was easy peasy and made a significant difference to autopilot performance in heavy air reaching - in fact it is quite clever 'at times' and bears away in the gusts and comes up in the lulls maximising boat speed.


 and this

Hi folks after posting about selling your boat here...i realised i have a  Raymarine Smart Heading System that i should sell

As new never been used was bought to upgrade the Autohelm type 300 course computer but then i got a new S3G control head as i was told the 300 head was faulty - when in fact it was loose magnets in the autohelm drive motor that were causing the autopilot to stop working 'at times'

Still in the slightly battered box and open to sensible offers

Stand Alone Gyro head plus Compass cables and fixings

http://www.raymarine.co.uk/view/?id=282

http://www.raymarine.com/ProductDetail.aspx?SITE=1&SECTION=2&PAGE=389&PRODUCT=699

http://www.raymarine.com/GetFile.aspx?fileId=784&categoryId=3

Provides stabilized heading data to Raymarine multifunction displays equipped with radar.  The Smart Heading Sensor delivers the same gyro stabilized heading information provided by our gyro equipped SmartPilot autopilots.

Features:

• Provides fast, stable and accurate heading data over NMEA 0183
• Significantly improves stability of radar/chart overlay
  
• Significantly improves performance of MARPA. Improves target acquisition, retention and calculation of target tracking data, especially when conditions deteriorate.
  
• Easy to install, and set up
• Easy to calibrate using soft keys and menu on the multifunction display
• Easy compass alignment to COG

It will also convert any old style Raymarine non gyro autopilot control head to a gyro version

any interest?

kindest regards

David

[davidcf...@rogers.com]

What would it take to own this little add on?

Fletch

Sent from my BlackBerry device on the Rogers Wireless Network

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From: David Mackintosh <sv.highl...@gmail.com>

Sender: benetea...@googlegroups.com

Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2012 12:30:45 +0000

[David Mackintosh]

well i am open to sensible offers I can of course wrap it in Christmas paper and send it as a gift so you wont be hit with any taxes or import duties :-)

i had/have it advertised on here http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=320717

at £400.00 but that has resulted in only a few enquiries so far no one putting the money down and running away with it :-(

tis about $600/800 online  this being the case £300 $450 plus shipping to you?

Thoughts?

kindest regards

David

[davidcf...@rogers.com]

I have to get my 100 looked at, not dead sure if it is my problem. Probably 200+ and then 450 for you, I am getting close to a new X10 which can be bought for 1k -/+

Sent from my BlackBerry device on the Rogers Wireless Network

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From: David Mackintosh <sv.highl...@gmail.com>

Sender: benetea...@googlegroups.com

Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2012 12:42:58 +0000

[David Mackintosh]

sorry i did not understand that reply

For sure if my OLD BUT GOOD core pack is still on the boat i would sell that to you for a few hundred dollars  I am not sure if it still on Highland Fling as we did have a big clear out at one of the SXM boat  flea markets.

regards

David

[Ben Campbell]

Yep, I knew this had come up before. I just couldn't remember if it was this list or somewhere else.

[jwshukis]

My 2007 Beneteau came with a Raymarine S3 autopilot and a massive L&S hydraulic ram - a very nice hardware setup. Performance was good, but it tended to wander when sailing downwind, especially with higher winds and confused waves - and we get plenty of those.

 

Instead of spending $3K replacing the S3 computer with an S3G, I purchased a Raymarine GyroPlus kit from eBay for about $135. The instructions were a bit confusing since they focused on earlier generation Ray gear, but in the end the installation was very easy - just a few wires. The control head now says that it's a gyro-based autopilot and performance is noticably improved - actually the performance is darn near perfect.

 

It may also be possible to rip the gyro out of the GyroPlus and install it directly in the S3, which is probably how the S3G is actually built. And if $1xx is too much, here is an article that says with a bit of soldering you can use a $10 hobby gyro instead:

http://portanna.org/tip/153-gyro-raymarine     If you do want to buy a cheap gyro, try hobbyking.com.

[David Mackintosh]

We will be on Highland Fling on the 21st hope to get the mast in on the 22nd and get into the water on the 23rd.  Then we can get into the Lagoon in St Martin and hopefully get a good WiFi connection.  By the weekend we wil have Highland Fling  in a comfortable and liveable state so IF we have got WiFi i can send a message re the core pack we have available for sale. From Memory my old but good core pack is a Raymarine  T300

https://flir.box.com/s/nwf2s5ha9xrltggghogu/1/402138883/3273075077/1

regards

David

On 1 November 2012 14:53, <davidcf...@rogers.com> wrote:

David, do you know what model your core pack is? I would be interested if it a Raymarine and works with the heading sensor?

When are you heading done?

David

Sent from my BlackBerry device on the Rogers Wireless Network

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From: David Mackintosh <sv.highl...@gmail.com>

Sender: benetea...@googlegroups.com

Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2012 13:37:17 +0000

[David Mackintosh]

he he i have three of them in my R/C Concorde model the one controlling pitch is in HH Mode and rotated/tilted  by a servo so i can set up high alpha approach and landing just like the real plane.

 these guys haven't got that bit sorted yet

but enjoy never-the-less.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qNVvRXnWCk

regards

David.

[davidcf...@rogers.com]

David, do you know what model your core pack is? I would be interested if it a Raymarine and works with the heading sensor?

When are you heading done?

David

Sent from my BlackBerry device on the Rogers Wireless Network

---

From: David Mackintosh <sv.highl...@gmail.com>

Sender: benetea...@googlegroups.com

Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2012 13:37:17 +0000

[davidcf...@rogers.com]

Cool, is that one yours ?

Sent from my BlackBerry device on the Rogers Wireless Network

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From: David Mackintosh <sv.highl...@gmail.com>

Sender: benetea...@googlegroups.com

Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2012 15:33:24 +0000

To: <benetea...@googlegroups.com>

ReplyTo: benetea...@googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: {Beneteau Owners} Re: Auto Pilot with Gyro

[David Mackintosh]

NOPE i have not done a vid of mine  as yet - that one is for sale around $20K the kit is $6550 just for the moulds alone  http://www.vogelsang-aeroscale.com/braeuerconcorde.html

 Did you notice TWO GUYS were flying that baby i wonder if they have SOP's and who was the PIC and NFP OR were they both flying the plane

Hmmmmmmmmmmm  i wanna go left no i wanna go right..........a bit like a 473 with twin wheels one for the Captain one for the Admiral,

Here is another powered by ONLY two real turbo jets just like the real Concorde  except they were not FOUR Rolls Royce SMCEMA 593 tiurbo jets with reheat.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cs9x9_jtwO8

That first one is powered by two Schubeler EDF's http://www.schuebeler-jets.de/en/

here it is just after build

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fniIDR65H64

Truly you have never lived until you have peed at Mach Two and seen the sun rise in the west as you flew out of NY on the evening flight sadly I never managed to join the very very exclusive 60K M2 club :( of course all of that is in the past now.

Concorde was a dream to fly even though it was highly automated and it threw the rule book out the window on approach  Unlike other planes you controlled rate of descent  with the stick and speed with the throttles.  You were on the back side of the drag curve with a Delta (Ogival Ogee) wing on approach and landing

Ground effect was huge with Concorde close to lading it arrested the rate of descent at around 85 to 90%  Because it had a delta wing, there is a pronounced flare required to counteract the nose-down pitch experienced as the ground effect grabed the back end of the wing and tried to rotate the Concorde nose down You' dont flare to reduce the descent rate like in a small plane  or any other airliner.  On landing one the main gear was on the ground you' just pulled lots of back stick'  to keep the nose from smacking into the runway experiencing loads it was never designed to take you then let it gently kiss the runway  . Flying a Boeing jet you flare only slightly; - you more or less drive them right onto the runway. 

With Concorde you needed to maintain 10 to 11.5 degrees of pitch. At 12.5 degrees, the tail bumper would hit the runway  and at 8 degrees, you would get a massive descent rate.

Concorde was VERY VERY finicky about attitude at the final portion of the descent. BUT then it had all the automation to make this something that was easily handled day in day out by of course the cream of BA and AF pilots. :-)

TRULY I will never understand why mankind took its first backward step in evolution  and aeronautics in grounding every last one of them. 

OWELL

regards

David