Installing/Removing the paddlewheel speed sensor each time - Is that crazy?

[jwshukis]

I am taking delivery of a new B40 on Sunday. As part of my inspection
last week, I noticed what I thought was a big problem. Dealer says
it's nothing. I'm not going to decide who is right before talking to
you experts.

I noticed that under the floorboards in the forward cabin was a
through-hull fitted with a blanking plug and a speed/temp sensor just
laying there dry. Thinking that they forgot to install the sensor
before lauching the boat, I sent them an email. Here is their
response:

Jeff,
I received a note and a voice mail this morning that you were
concerned that the transducer was not installed yet.
As good practice we do not leave them installed as they will
accumulate a lot of growth while here at the dock.
During your delivery walk through we show you the proper
installation. We also during the walk through highly suggest that the
owner not leave the transducer installed all the time so as to not get
it fouled with growth. It's much easier to just install a clean one
every time you go sailing then it is to have to pull it each time and
clean critters and salad off of it.

I am incredulous. The thought of removing a plug to expose a roughtly
2" diameter hole in the bottom of my boat scares the heck out of me.
How many gallons of sea water are going to pour through while they
struggle to screw in the sensor?

Does anyone on the list know about this procedure? Is it a recommended
practice?

Thanks,

Jeff

[Tony Marchesani]

Jeff,
I don't think the dealer is doing anything unusual here.  The speed sensor will pick up growth over time and affect or prevent a reading.  Some of this will depend on how aggressive the growth is in your area at this time of year.  Personally I would have them show you how to put them in and leave it in to insure they do function.
On my B361 the speedo has a flapper valve in the hull penetration that limits the amount of seawater that comes in while changing the unit.  Of course the larger diameter hole is the depth transducer and it has no such water slowing device on it.  The trick is to have the other piece ready IMMEDIATELY to put in and do it fast.  You will have some water to mop up but if your quick it isn't too bad.
You'll have a good demonstration watching the dealer do it, make sure he does both so you see the full effect if there is no flapper on the transducer.

Tony 

[Herb DuBois]

The fouling problem with the speed transducer in my area is so bad that just
leaving it sitting for 4-5 days will make it inoperative. I don't even
bother to install it anymore. I just use the SOG from the GPS. Your dealer
is right, make sure they show you how to remove and install the plug and
sensor if you intend to use it. The rubber seal will keep most of the
water out of the boat.

Herb DuBois
36CC Split Decision

[Larry Cohan]

jwshukis wrote:
> I am incredulous. The thought of removing a plug to expose a roughtly
> 2" diameter hole in the bottom of my boat scares the heck out of me.
> How many gallons of sea water are going to pour through while they
> struggle to screw in the sensor?
>
> Does anyone on the list know about this procedure? Is it a recommended
> practice?
>

Jeff,

The dealer is correct. Leaving the wheel in all the time (at least in
salty/brackish water) will render the log useless within a few weeks.

Let them show you how easy it is to take it out when you return and put
it in before departing. You'll never believe how fast you can be. :-)
I probably get less than a pint of water in the bilge each time.

It is prudent to have one of those wooden tapered plugs really handy,
though just in case.

Larry

[bjgr...@verizon.net]

If you have never pulled a transducer before it can be a bit unnerving but the dealer is correct. I leave my speedo and depth in during the year and pull them when they are either not working or I think they should be cleaned. In the winter I keep the boat in the water and put the blanks in. Most of the newer thru hulls have a flap that closes as you pull the transducer out allowing you time to replace witht the plug. One of mine does and the other doesn't so when I pull the one without I get a lot of water shooting up until I plug it. Bit messy but.. Bruce (Breezy 361)

>From: jwshukis <jwsh...@yahoo.com>
>Date: 2007/10/03 Wed PM 07:47:13 CDT
>To: Beneteau Owners <Benetea...@googlegroups.com>
>Subject: {Beneteau Owners} Installing/Removing the paddlewheel speed sensor each time - Is that crazy?

>
>I am taking delivery of a new B40 on Sunday. As part of my inspection
>last week, I noticed what I thought was a big problem. Dealer says
>it's nothing. I'm not going to decide who is right before talking to
>you experts.
>
>I noticed that under the floorboards in the forward cabin was a
>through-hull fitted with a blanking plug and a speed/temp sensor just
>laying there dry. Thinking that they forgot to install the sensor
>before lauching the boat, I sent them an email. Here is their
>response:
>
>Jeff,
>I received a note and a voice mail this morning that you were
>concerned that the transducer was not installed yet.
>As good practice we do not leave them installed as they will
>accumulate a lot of growth while here at the dock.
>During your delivery walk through we show you the proper
>installation. We also during the walk through highly suggest that the
>owner not leave the transducer installed all the time so as to not get
>it fouled with growth. It's much easier to just install a clean one
>every time you go sailing then it is to have to pull it each time and
>clean critters and salad off of it.
>
>

>I am incredulous. The thought of removing a plug to expose a roughtly
>2" diameter hole in the bottom of my boat scares the heck out of me.
>How many gallons of sea water are going to pour through while they
>struggle to screw in the sensor?
>
>Does anyone on the list know about this procedure? Is it a recommended
>practice?
>

>Thanks,
>
>Jeff
>
>
>

[mos...@aol.com]

Jeff -

true it is, as odd as it may seem.  You can leave the paddlewheel in place, but it does get clogged w/ growth.  There are paddlewheel transducers but they are expensive and who knows how they might get clogged.

Our approach is to leave the plug in place and rely on the gps speed data output. 

Mark Moskovitz
Alkenjibarii 473

-----Original Message-----
From: jwshukis <jwsh...@yahoo.com>
To: Beneteau Owners <Benetea...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Wed, 3 Oct 2007 8:47 pm
Subject: {Beneteau Owners} Installing/Removing the paddlewheel speed sensor each time - Is that crazy?

---

Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail!

[Matt Reidy]

Jeff,

I've resorted to removing my speed sensor every time I leave my boat because
I haven't found a reliable way to keep the growth from fowling it.

I think you'll find many people do this routinely. Once you get the hang of
it only about a cup of water may come in.

-Matt

-----Original Message-----
From: Benetea...@googlegroups.com
[mailto:Benetea...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of jwshukis
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2007 8:47 PM
To: Beneteau Owners

Subject: {Beneteau Owners} Installing/Removing the paddlewheel speed sensor
each time - Is that crazy?

[Ken Mahren]

Many units have a "flapper" in the threw hole that blocks a lot of water
coming in during the switchover. You need to practice it a few times to get
it done fast. I would agree with the installer that sitting at dock for
weeks may very well clog it up. They actually sound quite professional, and
knowledgeable.

Ken

-----Original Message-----
From: Benetea...@googlegroups.com
[mailto:Benetea...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of jwshukis
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2007 8:47 PM
To: Beneteau Owners
Subject: {Beneteau Owners} Installing/Removing the paddlewheel speed sensor
each time - Is that crazy?

[Patrick Brehm]

Not a big deal! If you have your hand ready, as soon as you pull the
transducer(s), slide your open palm over the receptacle to check the water
inflow, you may get a cup or two. There is really no pressure to speak of.
With your other hand, align the plug with where it should fit, slide off
your hand as you place the plug in place, you may get another cup or two. I
would be surprised if you get anymore than a quart of water. Some will spray
around as you place the plug, no big deal, just have some towels around and
an old tshirt on. I do it three times a year to check and clean. Since we
use the boat occasionally in Pac NW winter months, I don't pull the
transducers out anymore, as it makes no difference.

Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: Benetea...@googlegroups.com
[mailto:Benetea...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Larry Cohan
Sent: October 03, 2007 6:14 PM
To: Benetea...@googlegroups.com
Subject: {Beneteau Owners} Re: Installing/Removing the paddlewheel speed
sensor each time - Is that crazy?

[Scott]

It's not much of a problem changing the blanking plug and the paddle wheel - just make sure you don't lose the O ring

Ken Mahren <kma...@gmavt.net> wrote:

---

Got a little couch potato?
Check out fun summer activities for kids.

[RICK-DAMICO]

I did it once and the flapper valve prevented a lot of water from spilling into the bilge, but I thought I'm never doing that again!

 

I have a diver clean the haul once a month in the summer and once every 4 or 5 weeks in the winter, and he usually cleans the paddle wheel. 

 

After not sailing for 3 weeks or a month, the speed usually kicks in after a few minutes doing 5 knots leaving the marina.

 

Rick D'Amico
"Airtime"
B-323
San Diego/Phoenix

[Jack Ives]

Hi Jeff,

As a matter of course, I remove that transducer every time I leave the boat
and reinstall it before sailing off. This prevents all the little nasties
from making a home in the impeller.

Your Dealer has given sound advice.

Jack Ives

SO43
Grace

-----Original Message-----
From: Benetea...@googlegroups.com
[mailto:Benetea...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of jwshukis
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2007 8:47 PM
To: Beneteau Owners
Subject: {Beneteau Owners} Installing/Removing the paddlewheel speed sensor
each time - Is that crazy?

[Howell Cooper]

Jeff,
In certain areas, the critters grow enough in one or two weeks to stop the
paddle wheel completely. It is such a problem in the Texas area, that I
don't even install mine unless we plan to be at sea extensively. I use the
GPS speed over ground function most of the time. The 2 inch hole issue is
not a big deal. A beach towel will catch most, if not all the water as you
pop the plug and install the paddle wheel. With a little practice, you may
not have more than a gallon to deal with. Some through hulls, depending on
the manufacturer, may even have a small, flexible flap that tremendously
restricts the flow even if you are slow to get the paddle wheel in the
fitting. Get your crew in the cockpit and just do it a time or two and it
will be not big thing. Heck, if you miss the fitting you always have the old
palm plug that works until you get the alignment slot right. It is a rite
of passage- that first time you extract that plug to install your paddle
wheel. Neptune will giggle.

Howell Cooper
Why Knot
Port Aransas, Texas

[Daryl Davies]

HI Jeff,

The transducer is a matter of preference. But if you leave it in the
water and don't sail much, you will have to pull it to clean anyway
if you want to get a speed reading. When you pull it you will get
maybe a pint of water maybe less -- most of the newer thru hulls
actually have a flap or hinged fitting that closes as you pull the
transducer. I have even done this procedure while underway -- and
then a bit more water comes in as there is more pressure on the
hull. Even in the old days before they had the transducer flaps, you
would only get a bit more water in. Don't worry your boat won't
sink. One bit of advice, make sure that the plug or blank transducer
plug is attached by a wire or something to keep it close.

On a related matter -- many cruisers -- and racers for off shore
races will have a wood plug that is attached to every thru hull just
in case you ever have a thru hull hose break, or an thur hull let go
-- not the time to be looking for the wood plugs.

Congrats on your new boat.

Daryl
Quiver Ben 46

[pegasu...@aol.com]

Yes recommended procedure

Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: jwshukis <jwsh...@yahoo.com>
To: Beneteau Owners <Benetea...@googlegroups.com>

Sent: Wed, 3 Oct 2007 7:47 pm
Subject: {Beneteau Owners} Installing/Removing the paddlewheel speed sensor each time - Is that crazy?

[Noble, Milner E.]

It's not a problem.  As others reported, you get a healthy pint +/- and that's about it.  The first time I did it I was nervous, but when the transducer is inserted, the water stops or all but stops flowing.  Screwing down the ring completes the job.

--Milner 

---

From: Benetea...@googlegroups.com [mailto:Benetea...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of pegasu...@aol.com
Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2007 9:31 AM
To: Benetea...@googlegroups.com
Subject: {Beneteau Owners} Re: Installing/Removing the paddlewheel speed sensor each time - Is that crazy?

[Daryl Davies]

You didn't mention where you are? Who is your broker.

Daryl

At 05:47 PM 10/3/2007, you wrote:

[jwshukis]

Replying to myself to thank at least 16 people for their answers:

The consensus opinion seems to be that it's not at all a bad idea to
remove the speed sensor from time to time or often and that a flapper
dramatically limits the amount of water that pours in. I'll have the
dealer do it the first time and will then make a habit of pulling the
sensor every week or two (I'm in SF and I hear that the salad grows
fairly slowly here). I may also - as some have advised - try just
using the GPS SOG instead of the sensor.

Jeff

[hugeal]

I have a B393, bought new in April 2006 in SF Bay. Only a few weeks
ago noticed the speed indicator had stopped working. Followed
procedures as others have indictated -- cleaned the paddlewheel
thoroughly, but a week later it stopped again. So that time, I cleaned
the wheel, but also pushed on the rubber flap and a whole lot more
crap came up. Got about a quart of water & mopped with a towel. Since
then, the speed indicator works fine.

Alan Kerr
Jabulani B393

> > Jeff- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[bmik...@idworld.net]

Where is this located on a F305? I did a quick look last weekend and
didn't find it.

Brian

[Uwe Mewes]

On our F305 I have to lift the two most forward floor boards in the main
cabin.

Uwe Mewes
F305
Heaven Can Wait

----- Original Message -----
From: <bmik...@idworld.net>
To: <Benetea...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2007 2:51 PM
Subject: {Beneteau Owners} Re: Installing/Removing the paddlewheel speed
sensor each time - Is that crazy?

>

[Bob]

The newer through hulls have a back flap that closes when you remove
the paddle. It will still get you wet. take a towel with you. It is a
good practice to take it out if you are laying the boat up for a week
or two. I never do that I wait till it gums up every third sail and
then clean it. There is a spray the you can buy at westmarine
specifically for paddle wheels. Hope you enjoy your new boat. I have
just taken delivery of my B49, truly a great boat. Minor problems with
the battens on the main sail. Happy sailing

Regards, Bob

[Guy]

It is not 2", more like 1"... it has a check valve so a little water will
get in... be sure to keep it lubed with vasoline (both trasnducer and
blank).

-------------------------------------------------
Captain Guy
s/v Island Time (Beneteau 352#277)
AICW 845.5
386-689-5088

----- Original Message -----
From: "jwshukis" <jwsh...@yahoo.com>
To: "Beneteau Owners" <Benetea...@googlegroups.com>

Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2007 8:47 PM

Subject: {Beneteau Owners} Installing/Removing the paddlewheel speed sensor
each time - Is that crazy?

>

[coastcruiser]

Jeff,

Your broker is correct. On my mooring at Morro Bay, CA, the sea life
takes over the paddlewheel in about a week. If you leave the blank
plug installed when the boat is at rest, you'll never have to clean
the paddlewheel. Just install the paddlewheel when you go sailing and
don't forget to remove it after.

To minimize splash when you quickly (but never fast enough) place your
palm over the tube, cut and discard the bottom six or eight inches
from a 5 gallon plastic bucket. Place the remaining top portion over
the tube and do the blank-to-paddlewheel switch within the bottomless
bucket. This keeps saltwater confined to the fiberglas bottom pan and
off the interior finishes of your cabin.

Good Sailing, Tom

[thudbranch]

I found that by soaking my wheel in a bleach solution for a few
minutes, I could extend the period before the paddle loaded up again.

On Oct 3, 6:32 pm, Scott <ipacke...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> It's not much of a problem changing the blanking plug and the paddle wheel - just make sure you don't lose the O ring
>

> ---------------------------------

> Got a little couch potato?

> Check out fun summer activities for kids.- Hide quoted text -

[Rick Donovan]

I have done the same thing when the paddle wheel got particularly dirty. I used about 30% bleach and hot water in a container to soak the unit over night. I had been concerned that it might be damaged somehow by this but it has not been a problem.

Rick Donovan

2002 Beneteau 473 #29

Turn the Page

Falmouth, Maine

richard....@verizon.net

[jkr...@aol.com]

List;
Someone a while ago talked about using Raritan joker valves in the Jabsco heads that are standard on the B's. They stated that they got longer life out of these. I am tired of changing the standard valves twice a year. Raritan makes two different joker valves (on their website). One that has a straight "lip" and one that has a "star" shape to its output side. Which one was used ? Does it make a difference?
I would hate to replace something that has the same problem. Whomever did the change I would appreciate hearing from you.
Ron
S/v Esprit
B331#227

[Guy]

I use a q-tip and some vasoline to coat the well above the addlewheel and
the bugs stay out.

Guy

----- Original Message -----
From: "thudbranch" <thudb...@hotmail.com>
To: "Beneteau Owners" <Benetea...@googlegroups.com>

[Larry & Maribeth]

Ron,

 

I used the straight 'lip' style.  Drops right in.  You will notice right off the Raritan is molded thicker than Jabsco's.

 

Two seasons on it so far and still working like new.

 

Larry J.

[jkr...@aol.com]

Larry;

Thanks very much.

Ron

-----Original Message-----
From: Larry & Maribeth <mbn...@cox.net>
To: Benetea...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 11:17 am
Subject: {Beneteau Owners} Re: joker valves