CTC Concept In Bipartite Settlement

[Mohandas Rao]

CTC Concept In Bipartite Settlement 
“Cost to Company” (CTC) concept. 

That CTC concept is a piece of financial engineering whereby the compensation appears attractive on paper but when it comes to in-hand salary, it could be as much as 30 to 40 % less than what is promised. Broadly CTC consists of following components:

Salary including Basic Pay, DA, HRA and other Allowances.
Perquisites and Reimbursement given to employees. This includes incentives, reimbursement of conveyance, medical benefits, leave encashment etc. Contributions made by organizations to employee for Provident Fund, Gratuity, Medical Insurance, etc.

Determination of CTC is a professional method adopted by a corporate and employees are appointed with a fixed CTC so that there will be no hidden or variable cost of hiring an employee.

CTC is nothing but the cost that the company incurs to employ you and keep you employed. It includes your pay and anything else that the company may incur to keep you in employment. It’s important because a lot of components of your CTC may not translate into actual take-home cash every month.

We fear that employees may actually be worse off as Bank managements could push variable pay through the backdoor, thereby undermining the cardinal principle of labour rights – equal pay for equal work.

At present, a raise to Bank employees is given on gross salary, which primarily includes Basic Pay, Dearness Allowance, City Compensatory Allowance and House Rent Allowance (HRA) in some cases. Besides, there are various allowances for travel, newspapers, leased house rent (if HRA is not availed) and medical expenses, among others. 

But CTC concept encompasses, every paisa the Bank spends on an employee, from concessional rates of interest on loans to the employer's share in the provident fund, might be shown as part of CTC/salary.

Taking into account there is already significant difference in the perks of small and large-size Bank employees and if the wage rise is given on the CTC, it would widen the gap in pay packages. Needless to underscore here Salaries of State Bank of India employees are, for instance, higher than other PSB peers.

For e.g. in the Software Sector where the CTC salary concept is in vogue, it is ridiculous, as a sandwich given at the Software Company to the employee is considered as costing Rs.800/- and a cup of coffee as Rs.300/-. 

As a broad thumb rule, what you get in hand will be 70% of your CTC. So if your annual CTC is Rs.5 lakh, you can expect to get an annual take home of Rs.3.5 lakh or Rs.29,000/- per month.

CTC concept only will inflate Bank employee’s salary on papers. On 29th May, 2013 there was advertisement for recruitment in Navy, they have advertised that CTC for a Sub-Lieutenant would be approximately Rs.65,000/- per month (excluding the free medical facilities, LTC, canteen facilities, entitled rations, government accommodation, loans at subsidized rates. We would like to add here that Sub-Lieutenant is the lowest ranked in Navy and his Basic Pay is Rs15,600/- with grade pay of Rs.5,400/-.

(L.BALASUBRAMANIAN)
GENERAL SECRETARY
NATIONAL UNION OF BANK EMPLOYEES

[Mohan badi]

Thank you
Respected L.BALASUBRAMANIAN Sir,

for your kind explanation on CTC, what you say here is correct, that  it inflates on paper as big pay but take home will be 30-35 % less. Again IT  Sector is totally different than Banking sector, which IBA / MOF should not match / compare, as there is, in way, any similarity. Hope UFBU will not entertain all such thing and yield to this undesirable concept of this IBA, this is just to kill more time in our BPS move. After nationalization as one of our Member of this Blog said that all these years we have negotiated our Wage Pack with IBA only and why sudden we oppose IBA, his logic too is correct. But there is nothing wrong to IBA too to be incleded in the perview of  RTI Act, since it runs on Govt. Money totally, and all people / high ups are paid by Govt treasury / Banks' profit only. Sir I am seeing you first time on this blog. kindly be more participative in the interest of we all Retirees / pensioners, it is immaterial to all of us that from which Union you belong, presently working or one among us, but your write-up speak that you can do wonders like our Perumal Sir, C.N.Prasad Sir, Ravi Jain Sir, Sethi Sir and many more dignitaries of these blog who encourage us a lot to be always united and Our Strong Unity shall help one and all to achieve everything in future. One fear has been expressed by one member that once BPS and Wage Revision is over UFBU Members will forget all we Retirees / Pensioners, but it is not correct, what point is vital here is who will get more credit of having achieved all our demand and every Union will try to increase its membership for their future survival too. This is natural phenomena all over. My sincere request to all is that we must trust our all Union and its Comrades most respectfully and I am sure they will not leave any stone unturned in making all present employees and all retirees too happy with all our reasonable demand. Again one more thing Govt. / IBA must understand that all officers and award staffs have been appointed through various tests and interview process and they should not bifurcate here that one is more efficient and give him more incentive and other is not efficient and not to such employees. Here all are at par and equally equal, and hope on this issue our UFBU shall not bent at any point of time. Kindly remember the days of 1993 how we all union members got succeeded in getting pension sanctioned highly strategically. With warm Reagrds.

Prof.M.R.Badi. ( CRS-Pensioner, only our Union -UBIOEA-Members made me succeeded after18 years )

Bangalore.

pPensioners

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From: Mohandas Rao <mohand...@gmail.com>
To: "bankpe...@googlegroups.com" <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: ban...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, 11 June 2013 6:36 AM
Subject: bankpensioner CTC Concept In Bipartite Settlement

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[Veeraswami V]

I don't know why we waste our time and energy on all these silly matters, connected with serving employees. Some retired leaders still try to stick to serving employees/ officers associations, for their own reasons. What efforts they have taken to take up retirees problems, is not known.

We can just discuss about retired employees problems, leaving other matters

Veeraswami V

Sent from my iPad 

[Mohandas Rao]

Dear Sri Veeraswami,

The pay structure of serving employees/officers directly affects their basic pension when they retire. The CTC of some of the fringe benefits like reimbursement of conveyance, news paper, lunch allowance etc. do not appear as any allowance in their pension. Further, if updating of pension took place, it will affect already retired people also. Hence I do not find that discussions on CTC or on the 10th BP are the silly things. 

K. MOHANDAS RAO, SBM-VR 2001

Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/bankpensioner.

[Manikanddan Kv]

I am afraid the IBA & other ,management pundits may find some method to include pension also in CTC.

Regards

Manikanddan

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[ravi jain]

Sir,

I am surprosed to read" why we waste our time and energy on all these silly matters, connected with serving employees".

Then don't make a hue and cry when serving employees are not wasting their time and energy on all these silly matters, connected with RETIRED employees.

Be Happy.

Ravi Jain (PSB)

On 14 June 2013 15:08, Veeraswami V <veera...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/bankpensioner.

[PM]

Dear Sri.Manikandan,

                                      It is true that,apart from Basic Salary, all fixed allowances,retirement benefits (PF. Superannuation & Gratuity and any other cash reimbursements are part of CTC.,Dearness Allowance (DA) is paid to the Bank employees to counter the increase in inflation as and when the Average Consumer Price Index is increased(At present Half Yearly). There is no such component in CTC offered by private organisations!

                                      As Sri.Mohandas Raoji  rightly pointed out Basic pay of employees  has much relevance in arriving basic pension of  retirees.This is the background under which the retirees look forward for a reasonable wage revision for Bank employees under ongoing BPS negotiations, which will be certainly beneficial to them also.

                                      Please also understand that in reality at present retirees/retirees associations have no access  to BP negotiating process and only through employees unions our demands and issues are placed before IBA.If the kind gesture of employees unions cannot be appreciated in right perspective at least we should not blame the unions. 

                                    AIBRF is the apex body of bank wise retirees organisations and it should be the endeavor of every individual retirees  to strengthen their bank wise retirees associations so that retirees voice is also listened by IBA,which will pave way for inclusion of AIBRF also in joint talks with IBA to resolve our issues.

                                       

         

                                        r

[Rajiv Bakshi]

Mr Ravi Jain,
You mean the RETIRED EMPLOYEES are
UNTOUCHABLE ?????

Rajiv Bakshi
Senior Manager ( Retd )
Punjab & Sind Bank


Rajiv Bakshi

Sent from RediffmailNG for iPhone

Get your own FREE website and domain with business email solutions, click here

[ravi jain]

Dear Rajiv Bakshi,

Please go thru my message again and again till you understand its meaning, after that write this word of UNTOUCHABLE. Also go thru all mails connected with this matter in whose reply i have written these few words.

Be Happy,

Ravi Jain (PSB)

On 16 June 2013 16:43, Rajiv Bakshi <rajivb...@rediffmail.com> wrote:

Mr Ravi Jain,
You mean the RETIRED EMPLOYEES are
UNTOUCHABLE ?????

Rajiv Bakshi
Senior Manager ( Retd )
Punjab & Sind Bank


Rajiv Bakshi

Sent from RediffmailNG for iPhone

From: "ravi jain"ravij...@gmail.com
Sent:Sun, 16 Jun 2013 12:45:29 +0530
To: bankpensioner bankpe...@googlegroups.com

[sureshbhat M]

 don't know why we waste our time and energy on all these silly matters, connected with serving employees. Some retired leaders still try to stick to serving employees/ officers associations, for their own reasons. What efforts they have taken to take up retirees problems, is not known.

We can just discuss about retired employees problems, leaving other matters

Veeraswami V

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Veeraswami Sir                           17/06/2013

      I am surprising your recent mails which are biased against the working employees and their Unions. 

 You are well aware that to get our pension, the survival and success of our esteemed Banks is very much important.

 The success of our esteemed Institution depends exclusivity  in the hands of our  working junior brother n  .

 With out their contribution we can not earn our pension.

 Even now, if IBA or Govt is listening to our voice to a smallest extent it is in the fear of working employees as their struck work will be the only tool to make the Govt to hear us.

      We are discussing our problems in this forum not just for time pass. We have some dedicated friends who grasp the important ideas and opinions spelled in  this forum and try to influence the leaders like AIBRF and UFBU for better settlement of our problems. They also make use of ideas in fighting our cases in Courts.

    Sir, if working class and Unions are not taking care of us-   Make them to hear us by convincing the facts- If you ignore them, they are happy to ignore us- as we are in need of them and not wise versa. 

      If you wish to discuss only retirees problems (with out linking to working class and their unions)- tell me whom it is to be conveyed for settlement? 

With regards

Suresh Bhat M

Canara Bank SVRS

[sankaran srinivasan]

DEMYSTIFYING CTC

HERE ARE LIES, DAMNED LIES AND CTC’S

NUBE   circular 03 / 2013   dated : 11-06-2013 rightly explained  what is Cost to the Company, net salary and gross salary which are some of the key components that form part of any individual’s salary structure.a transparent effort by a negotiating union    Cost to the company is the figure what companies generally like or prefer to quote when they offer salary packages to potential job aspirants.   The cost to the company figures can be quite misleading for new job aspirants while seasoned or experienced individuals usually are quite obviously aware of the differences after a couple of bitter experiences.    At the end of it, the amount the person actually gets in hand can turn out to be significantly lower than what he/she would have originally imagined.

 

Eg:1

Ravi, a fresh software graduate, joined a top notch IT Company. For his first job, he was extremely happy with the total CTC of Rs 6,00,000. On the basis of this CTC, Ravi made lavish plans with his first month’s salary. Expensive gifts for family, a swanky new bike and the latest mobile phone. But with the first salary, he realized some of his plans had to wait. His take home salary was nowhere close to his estimation of his salary. He approached his HR, who then explained the breakup of his CTC, which he had just glanced over at the time of joining.

 

The Cost to Company refers to the total expenditure a company would have to incur to employ you. It includes monetary and non-monetary benefits, such as monthly pay, training costs, accommodation, telephone, medical reimbursements or other expenses, borne by the company to keep you employed. The total CTC as need not be the actual salary in hand at the end of the month. It is simply a sum of various components put together.

Eg 2

 

  Let’s take a live example to understand this better.   Arjun Malhotra recently got selected as an Assistant Manager in one of the leading Mumbai-based BPOs.   It was his first job and he was offered an annual CTC package of Rs. 501624/-   ‘ Wow that sounds cool’ he thought.   He immediately did some rough calculations and estimated that his monthly salary would turn out to be Rs. 41,802/-.    His happiness didn’t last long when he was provided the offer letter and then it dawned on him what a cost to the company or CTC package meant.

Basically a CTC package includes all of the cost factors (well almost) that a company spends on an individual.  This primarily includes Employer’s contribution of provident funds, Gratuity, Mediclaim Insurance, Food Coupons, Loyalty bonus, and performance linked bonuses to name a few.   When companies include all these factors naturally the salary has to look bloated.

From an employee’s perspective the inclusion of the aforementioned factors doesn’t reflect directly in his net salary or his take home salary.    Net salary or take home salary basically means what you get in hand post the standard deductions such as PF, gratuity, and professional tax if applicable, etc.   The other major factor that impacts your net salary other than the standard deductions is the income tax.

Now that we have explained you what a CTC and net salary means, let us try and explain you the meaning of “gross salary.”  Gross salary is basically the salary that is quoted on your pay slip.   Gross salary doesn’t include the additional components that form part of your CTC.

Now lets go back to Arjun’s example.   Below is an extract from Arjun’s offer letter.

Gross and CTC Salary Breakup

Components	Amount Per Month	Components	Amount Per Month
Basic	13200	Employer's PF	1797
HRA	7260	Gratuity	635
Transportation	800	Fixed Bonus	5500
Education	200	Mediclaim	250
Meal Coupons	1100	Canteen	620
LTA	990
Medical	1250
CCA	8200
Total Gross	33000	Total CTC	41802
		Annual CTC	5010624

Showing 1 to 10 of 10 entries

The above table has been divided into two segments.  The components on the left are the ones that are accounted for in his gross salary while the components on the right are the CTC components which don’t directly reflect in his take home pay.  Most of these components such as performance bonus, gratuity, employer’s contribution of PF and canteen facilities do not get accounted for in his monthly take home but benefits he can derive in the long run.    So if we all want to know what Arjun’s actual salary is – well it turns out to be just Rs. 33,000/- (Gross salary) which is approximately Rs. 8000/- less than his CTC.  Once again there are also some additional components included in Arjun’s gross salary such as LTA that would be paid out to him at the end of the year or the food coupons (Sodhexo meal passes) paid monthly but in the form of coupons.  This again differs or varies from company to company.  Most companies offer Sodhexo’s as a tax saving gesture where the employees get to save a certain amount annually on income tax as the deducted amount is not taken into consideration for calculating income tax.

Other than what you get to see in Arjun’s offer letter, different companies have a variety of components that are  considered under CTC.  For instance most leading banks provide home loans to their employees on a heavily discounted rate of interest.   The entire benefit the employees gain from the discounted rate is added to their CTC package which hugely inflates their overall package.

Eg:3

Himadri Shekhar Bhattacharjee, a bank officer   in his thought provoking, informative   study in his site  ‘musing of life has  adumbrated this spurious , perverse concept succinctly  that it could be inflated by as much as 73%, if not more. See, how it can inflate the pay package of bank employees, irrespective of the actual money at hand, as can be seen below: 

CTC of a JMG- 1

Bank Officer : CTC of a bank officer

·                                  

INFLATION OF SALARY PACKAGE BY APPLYING CTC CONCEPT OF CALCULATION
.	BASIC PAY	Rs14500 pm*12	174000
.	DEARNESS ALLO...@36.75%, as on Aprill 2010	Rs5328.75 pm*12	63945
.	HOUSE RENT ALLOWANCE@6.5% AT OTHER PLACES	Rs942.50 pm*12	11310
.	SPECIAL AREA ALLOWANCE@Rs400	Rs400 pm*12	4800
.	CITY COMPENSATORY ALLOWANCE,@4% OF BP MAX. Rs540 pm.	Rs540 pm*12	6480
.	PF CONTRIBUTION BY EMPLOYER @10% of BP(though There shall be no Provident Fund to officers joining the services of Banks on or after 01.04.2010. They shall be covered by a Defined Contributory Pension Scheme).	Rs1450 pm*12	1450
.	RENT FREE ACCOMODATION (minus recover @1.20% of starting BP, ie.Rs174 pm		17400
.	Furniture Facility(less, recovery @.25% of starting BP ie Rs36.25 pm from Rs80000, as admissible in PNB,for example).	For an assumed asset life of 10 years,(80000-(36.25*120))	75650
.	FIXED PERSONAL PAY at minimum.	Rs858 pm*12	10296
.	PROFESSIONAL QUALIFICATION PAY FOR CAIIB@ Rs410 pm, 2 years after reaching top of the scale.	Rs410 pm*12	4920
.	PROFESSIONAL QUALIFICATION PAY FOR CAIIB@ Rs1030 pm. 2 years after reaching top of the scale.	Rs1030 pm*12	1030
.	HALTING ALLOWANCE, w.e.f. 01.05.2010 Grade / Scales of Officers Major 'A' Class Cities (Rs.) Area I(Rs.) Other Places (Rs.) Officers in Scale - IV & above 1000 800 700 Officers in Scale - I / II / III 800 700 600		12360
.	MID ACADEMIC YEAR TR. ALL. w.e.f 01.05.2010 Rs.700/- p.m.		700
.	MEDICAL AID (@Rs5100 pm,as prevalent in PNB, for ex.).		5100
.	PETROLL REIMBURSEMENT@30 litres in a month in area III places.	@Rs73 per litres for 12 months	26280
.	NEWSPAPER EXPENSES REIMBURSEMENT(@ Rs150pm. at PNB, for ex.)	@Rs150 for 12 months	1800
.	MOBILE BILL REIMBURSEMENT(@Rs1200pm, at pnb, for ex)	@Rs1200 pm for 12 months	14400
.	ENTERTAINMENT EXPENSES(@Rs4800 pa, as paid by pnb, for ex.)		4800
.	CANTEEN FACILITY(@Rs50 per employee, in mid sized branches, as paid by PNB, for ex.)	@Rs50 for 12 months	600
.	KEROSENE/FUEL CHARGES FOR CANTEEN (on actual basis).	At an assumed consumption of one LPG cylinder pm for an office with 5 staff.	1032
.	LIBRARY FACILITIES(@Rs625 pa.as paid by PNB,for ex.)/	At an assumed staff strength of 5	125
.	CLOSING ALL.FOR 2 CLOSINGS IN A YEAR@Rs250,per closing, as paid in PNB		500
.	BRIEF CASE COST REIMBURSEMENT(@Rs150, as paid by PNB,for ex.).	Not included as contingent upon it happening.	150
.	CHILDREN'S SCHOLARSHIP SCHEME.		4000
.	EX-GRATIA		100000
.	SILVER JUBILEE/ MILE STONE AWARDS		4000
.	MEMENTO TO RETIRING EMPLOYEES.		5000
.	GRATUITY
.	Compensation on Transfer Officers in Scale - IV & above` Rs.12,000/- Officers in Scale - I, II & III Rs.9,000/-		9000
.	LEAVE FARE CONCESSION, w.e.f 01.05.2010 An officer in JMG Scale - I is entitled to travel on duty by 1st Class or AC 2-Tier Sleeper by train. He may, however, travel by air (economy class) if so permitted by the Competent Authority having regard to the exigencies of business or public interest.
.	DEPUTATION OUTSIDE BA...@7.75% of pay max.Rs2300 pm
.	DEPUTATION INSIDE BANK@4% of pay, max.Rs1200 pm
.	HILL AND FULE ALLOWANCE, w.e.f 01.11.2007 Places with an altitude of 1000 meters & above but less than 1500 metres & Mercara Town 2% of pay subject to a maximum of Rs.550/- p.m.Places with an altitude of 1500 meters & above but less than 3000 metres 2.50% of pay subject to a maximum of Rs.680/- p.m.Places with an altitude of 3000 meters & above 5% of pay subject to a maximum of Rs.1,570/- p.m.	Not taken into calculation as not admissible to all.
.	CTC Per Year		438978
.	CTC Per Month,as on 01-04-2010		36,581.50
.	ACTUAL STARTING SALARY OF A JMG SC-I, AS ON 01-04-2010 PM		21171.25
.	SALARY PACKAGE INFLATED BY CTC CONCEPT:	73%	15410.25
.	CTC FOR PERSONS MAY BE ADJUSTED FOR CC ALL AND NON CC ALL. RECEIPENTS.

SOURCE : http://mitalismusings.blogspot.in/2013/04/bank-employees-do-not-deserve-any-pay.html

 

‘CTC’ emerged as a new and novel way to window dress salary packages to project them more than what one gets in his/her hand. Beware, the CTC concept is being toyed with, by FINMIN and IBA, to create a feeling that, bank employees are already getting more than what they deserve, so, there is no need for any further hike.But, it defies logic, why, government employees are kept untouched from this seemingly novel concept and pay commission structured pay and facilities are continued for them inspite of the stark disparity between pay of government employees and bank employees.Even State govt employees get more than what we get.

Let the Finance Ministry lead from the front and show it to the Nation how the CTC structure be implemented by moving all the MPs, MLAs, Ministers, PM, President etc etc as well as the Govt Employees to the CTC Model first. Lets not forget Charity begins at home first. So please preach what you Practice

S.Srinivasan

Above all we have to increase our awareness and learning

[M A Prasad]

The companies give full details before acceptance of CTC and if some one misunderstands, it is his fault.  Regards

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M A Prasad
Mob: +91 75985 12516

Res: F12, Sri Karpagavruksham Apartments

        Subramaniapuram Road, Seshadripuram

        Srirangam, Trichy 620006

[Rama Subramanian]

I agree with Mr. M.A. Prasad. The concept of CTC may be new for the old guard like us but not for the gen next.  CTC concept is in vogue in most MNCs and even Indian companies for the last 10 years or more and the youngsters of today are fully aware of what it is.

By the way, generally training costs are not included in CTC but other perks and allowances mentioned in the detailed note above.

I do not find anything wrong with employers adopting CTC concept.  It is more refined and inclusive than gross emoluments concept prevalent earlier.

I think that UFBU, instead of dragging the negotiations by resisting the introduction of CTC concept, should be spending time to identify the components of CTC which IBA may come out with, work out what and how much they should be in the interest of the employees and officers and propose their own CTC to IBA and take the latter by surprise at the earliest point in time in the course of the ensuing negotiations.

I will not discuss about variable pay since it may only generate controversy, but other elements of CTC should be carefully and smartly worked out by unions.

In fact, this may be a blessing in disguise for employees and officers of certain banks where certain facilities / perks are not presently available, if the CTC is made uniform across the banking sector, after considering the best practices prevailing in each bank.

Wishing all the best to the banking fraternity.

Ramasubramanian

Ex Bank of Baroda

Hyderabad

[M A Prasad]

absolutely right..

[perumal maruthu]

Dear Sir,

You have not spelt out your thoughts on the Pensioners' demands (100%DA/Updation/Hospitalization etc) if Unions are to accept the panacea of CTC!

It is unfortunate that those who support CTC in Banks do not say anything on Pensioners' fate....they simply think that 'somehow Unions will do something for the Pensioners'. If their bargaining power is weakened by CTC, what is in store for the suffering Pensioners?

M.Perumal

absolutely right..

HimadriShekhar Bhattacharjee, a bank officer   in histhought provoking, informative   study in his site  ‘musing of life has  adumbrated this spurious , perverse concept succinctly  that it could be inflated by as much as 73%, if not more. See, how it can inflate the pay package of bank employees, irrespective of the actual money at hand, as can be seen below: 

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to mailto:bankpensioner%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com.

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Res: F12, Sri Karpagavruksham Apartments

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        Srirangam, Trichy 620006

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Res: F12, Sri Karpagavruksham Apartments

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        Srirangam, Trichy 620006

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[Gopalakrishnan Ramachandran]

After reading the mails in support and against the CTC, I feel that this concept cannot be implemented in banks, where the salary structure is common. CTC is a concept where the companies alter the pay and variables to suit the qualification of the employee and in banks, we are bound by a scale of pay which is common to all. May be, in specialized fields, this can be implemented. As the issue involves a lot of discussion, which is time consuming, the concerned parties should postpone the decision to next bipartite(if it happens!) and proceed with finalising improvement in the present structure. I think the proposal is only for delaying talks and driving the employees to desperation. Having said so, the pensioners like us, do not have a say in the matter, as the same concerns only the serving employees. For us, updation is the immediate issue and the IBA can do well in deciding on updation immediately and can prolong dwelling on the CTC concept after that.  

G.Ramachandran

CB SVRS 

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[M A Prasad]

Dear PM Sir,

I fully endorse your views - having worked in private sector bank, nationalised bank and also IT private section I  am only trying to clarify CTC as a concept.  CTC per se is not bad however that does not mean that things associated with CTC are good - like any new thing getting introduced it will have its own drawback - that is why I am suggesting that instead of fighting (one hand let the unions fight against CTC) but in parrallel they should also work on how we can use CTC concept to the benefit of common man in Bank (do not confuse with Aad Aadmi of politics).  

CTC and pensioners are not related to each other and as  pensioner I can only wait and watch (and of course share our experience with them and that is all what we can do at the moment).

Regards pensioner's plight we have to have three pronged attack - educate the public about the sufferings in press as much as possible (ii) bring political pressure wherever possible (iii) take legal steps to include our federation into negotiations or some think like this.  It is a long drawn process - Also keep negotiating bodies and the current employees fully aware of today's employees are tomorrow's pensioner - make the benefit we are claiming is actually their benefit that may help - Regarding anamolies, it my considered opinion where difference exists between management and pensioners, it can be settled only between court of law- this I have expressed several times earlier in this forum as well.

Thanks and regards,

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[real banker]

And to add to what Mr Perumal says :

   - All must remember that one day they are also going to retire.

? Regards

Sudershan Pal
REAL BANKER

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[Prasad C N]

Dear friends,

It would be death knell to trade unions, if CTC is agreed.  Please see the situation in ING Vysya.  

 

Thanks, a Million.

With regards,
Prasad C N

---

From: Rama Subramanian <vrs...@gmail.com>
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 27 June 2013 11:06 AM
Subject: Re: bankpensioner Re: CTC Concept In Bipartite Settlement

[JSOMA SHEKARA]

CTC and Pension Scheme/DA system based on Consumer Price Index cannot co exist together. If employees are ready to forego pension scheme  and opt back for PF and accept DA as decided by management CTC can be introduced in Banks.

[M A Prasad]

1.Though it is not right - all organizations are moving towards contributory pension scheme - similar to NPS in Government itself.

2. While negotiating, known drawbacks in CTC can be eliminated 

Regards

[rajkumarnegi]

If CTC concept is for the Banks then ,the Pensioners must be given
full salary as pension . The Pensioners are not entitled to other
facilities and after the retirement ,all of a sudden the perks are
withdrawn and the officer/pensioner who was enjoying the benefits of
the perks,face much difficulty with the 50% or 40% pension .,then he
/she realises that he/she is retired, and that effects on the health
of the pensioners.,So please give 100% pension to the pensioners.to
maintain their position in the market.


Rajkumarnegi

>>>> *From:* M A Prasad <pras...@gmail.com>
>>>> *To:* bankpe...@googlegroups.com
>>>> *Sent:* Friday, 28 June 2013 6:27 AM
>>>> *Subject:* Re: bankpensioner Re: CTC Concept In Bipartite Settlement
>>>> **
>>>> absolutely right..
>>>> ****
>>>> On 27 June 2013 11:06, Rama Subramanian <vrs...@gmail.com> wrote:**

>>>> ****

>>>> On Wed, Jun 26, 2013 at 5:18 PM, M A Prasad <pras...@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:

>>>> **

>>>>
>>>> The companies give full details before acceptance of CTC and if some
>>>> one
>>>> misunderstands, it is his fault. Regards

>>>> ****

>>>> On 26 June 2013 16:21, sankaran srinivasan <ambuj...@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:

>>>> **
>>>>
>>>> *DEMYSTIFYING CTC *
>>>> *HERE ARE LIES, DAMNED LIES AND CTC’S *
>>>> NUBE circular 03 / 2013 dated : 11-06-2013* *rightly explained

>>>> what is Cost to the Company, net salary and gross salary which are some
>>>> of
>>>> the key components that form part of any individual’s salary
>>>> structure.a
>>>> transparent effort by a negotiating union Cost to the company is the
>>>> figure what companies generally like or prefer to quote when they offer
>>>> salary packages to potential job aspirants. The cost to the company
>>>> figures can be quite misleading for new job aspirants while seasoned or
>>>> experienced individuals usually are quite obviously aware of the
>>>> differences after a couple of bitter experiences. At the end of it,
>>>> the
>>>> amount the person actually gets in hand can turn out to be
>>>> significantly

>>>> lower than what he/she would have originally imagined.****
>>>> ** **
>>>> Eg:1****
>>>> **Ravi**, a fresh software graduate, joined a top notch IT Company. For

>>>> his first job, he was extremely happy with the total CTC of Rs 6,00,000.
>>>> On

>>>> the basis of this CTC, **Ravi** made lavish plans with his first

>>>> month’s salary. Expensive gifts for family, a swanky new bike and the
>>>> latest mobile phone. But with the first salary, he realized some of his
>>>> plans had to wait. His take home salary was nowhere close to his
>>>> estimation
>>>> of his salary. He approached his HR, who then explained the breakup of
>>>> his

>>>> CTC, which he had just glanced over at the time of joining.****
>>>> ****

>>>> The Cost to Company refers to the total expenditure a company would
>>>> have
>>>> to incur to employ you. It includes monetary and non-monetary benefits,
>>>> such as monthly pay, training costs, accommodation, telephone, medical
>>>> reimbursements or other expenses, borne by the company to keep you
>>>> employed. The total CTC as need not be the actual salary in hand at the
>>>> end
>>>> of the month. It is simply a sum of various components put

>>>> together.****
>>>> Eg 2 ****
>>>> ** **

>>>> Let’s take a live example to understand this better. Arjun Malhotra
>>>> recently got selected as an Assistant Manager in one of the leading
>>>> Mumbai-based BPOs. It was his first job and he was offered an annual
>>>> CTC
>>>> package of Rs. 501624/- ‘ Wow that sounds cool’ he thought. He
>>>> immediately did some rough calculations and estimated that his monthly
>>>> salary would turn out to be Rs. 41,802/-. His happiness didn’t last
>>>> long
>>>> when he was provided the offer letter and then it dawned on him what a
>>>> cost

>>>> to the company or CTC package meant.****

>>>> Basically a CTC package includes all of the cost factors (well almost)
>>>> that a company spends on an individual. This primarily includes
>>>> Employer’s
>>>> contribution of provident funds, Gratuity, Mediclaim Insurance, Food
>>>> Coupons, Loyalty bonus, and performance linked bonuses to name a few.
>>>> When companies include all these factors naturally the salary has to
>>>> look

>>>> bloated.****

>>>> From an employee’s perspective the inclusion of the aforementioned
>>>> factors doesn’t reflect directly in his net salary or his take home
>>>> salary. Net salary or take home salary basically means what you get
>>>> in
>>>> hand post the standard deductions such as PF, gratuity, and
>>>> professional
>>>> tax if applicable, etc. The other major factor that impacts your net

>>>> salary other than the standard deductions is the income tax.****

>>>> Now that we have explained you what a CTC and net salary means, let us
>>>> try and explain you the meaning of “gross salary.” Gross salary is
>>>> basically the salary that is quoted on your pay slip. Gross salary
>>>> doesn’t include the additional components that form part of your

>>>> CTC.***
>>>> *

>>>> Now lets go back to Arjun’s example. Below is an extract from Arjun’s

>>>> offer letter.****
>>>> *Gross and CTC Salary Breakup*****
>>>> *Components*
>>>> *Amount Per Month*
>>>> *Components*
>>>> *Amount Per Month*
>>>> Basic****
>>>> 13200****
>>>> Employer's PF****
>>>> 1797****
>>>> HRA****
>>>> 7260****
>>>> Gratuity****
>>>> 635****
>>>> Transportation****
>>>> 800****
>>>> Fixed Bonus****
>>>> 5500****
>>>> Education****
>>>> 200****
>>>> Mediclaim****
>>>> 250****
>>>> Meal Coupons****
>>>> 1100****
>>>> Canteen****
>>>> 620****
>>>> LTA****
>>>> 990****
>>>> ** **
>>>> ** **
>>>> Medical****
>>>> 1250****
>>>> ** **
>>>> ** **
>>>> CCA****
>>>> 8200****
>>>> ** **
>>>> ** **
>>>> Total Gross****
>>>> 33000****
>>>> Total CTC****
>>>> 41802****
>>>> ** **
>>>> ** **
>>>> Annual CTC****
>>>> 5010624****
>>>> *Showing 1 to 10 of 10 entries*

>>>> tax.****

>>>> Other than what you get to see in Arjun’s offer letter, different
>>>> companies have a variety of components that are considered under CTC.
>>>> For
>>>> instance most leading banks provide home loans to their employees on a
>>>> heavily discounted rate of interest. The entire benefit the employees
>>>> gain from the discounted rate is added to their CTC package which
>>>> hugely

>>>> inflates their overall package.****
>>>> *Eg:3 *
>>>> *Himadri****Shekhar Bhattacharjee, a bank officer in his****thought
>>>> provoking, informative * study in his site ‘musing of life has

>>>> adumbrated this spurious , perverse concept succinctly that it could
>>>> be
>>>> inflated by as much as 73%, if not more. See, how it can inflate the
>>>> pay
>>>> package of bank employees, irrespective of the actual money at hand, as
>>>> can

>>>> be seen below: ****
>>>> *CTC of a JMG- 1***
>>>> *Bank Officer : CTC of a bank officer*****
>>>> · ****

>>>> INFLATION OF SALARY PACKAGE BY APPLYING CTC CONCEPT OF

>>>> CALCULATION****
>>>> .****
>>>> BASIC PAY****
>>>> Rs14500 pm*12****
>>>> 174000****
>>>> .****
>>>> DEARNESS ALLO...@36.75%, as on Aprill 2010****
>>>> Rs5328.75 pm*12****
>>>> 63945****
>>>> .****
>>>> HOUSE RENT ALLOWANCE@6.5% AT OTHER PLACES****
>>>> Rs942.50 pm*12****
>>>> 11310****
>>>> .****
>>>> SPECIAL AREA ALLOWANCE@Rs400****
>>>> Rs400 pm*12****
>>>> 4800****
>>>> .****
>>>> CITY COMPENSATORY ALLOWANCE,@4% OF BP MAX. Rs540 pm.****
>>>> Rs540 pm*12****
>>>> 6480****
>>>> .****

>>>> PF CONTRIBUTION BY EMPLOYER @10% of BP(though There shall be no
>>>> Provident Fund to officers joining the services of Banks on or after
>>>> 01.04.2010. They shall be covered by a Defined Contributory Pension
>>>> Scheme).

>>>> ****
>>>> Rs1450 pm*12****
>>>> 1450****
>>>> .****

>>>> RENT FREE ACCOMODATION (minus recover @1.20% of starting BP, ie.Rs174

>>>> pm****
>>>> ****
>>>> 17400****
>>>> .****

>>>> Furniture Facility(less, recovery @.25% of starting BP ie Rs36.25 pm

>>>> from Rs80000, as admissible in PNB,for example).****
>>>> For an assumed asset life of 10 years,(80000-(36.25*120))****
>>>> 75650****
>>>> .****
>>>> FIXED PERSONAL PAY at minimum.****
>>>> Rs858 pm*12****
>>>> 10296****
>>>> .****

>>>> PROFESSIONAL QUALIFICATION PAY FOR CAIIB@ Rs410 pm, 2 years after

>>>> reaching top of the scale.****
>>>> Rs410 pm*12****
>>>> 4920****
>>>> .****

>>>> PROFESSIONAL QUALIFICATION PAY FOR CAIIB@ Rs1030 pm. 2 years after

>>>> reaching top of the scale.****
>>>> Rs1030 pm*12****
>>>> 1030****
>>>> .****

>>>> HALTING ALLOWANCE, w.e.f. 01.05.2010
>>>>
>>>> Grade / Scales of Officers Major 'A' Class Cities (Rs.) Area I(Rs.)
>>>> Other Places (Rs.)
>>>> Officers in Scale - IV & above 1000 800 700

>>>> Officers in Scale - I / II / III 800 700 600****
>>>> ****
>>>> 12360****
>>>> .****
>>>> MID ACADEMIC YEAR TR. ALL. w.e.f 01.05.2010 Rs.700/- p.m.****
>>>> ****
>>>> 700****
>>>> .****
>>>> MEDICAL AID (@Rs5100 pm,as prevalent in PNB, for ex.).****
>>>> ****
>>>> 5100****
>>>> .****
>>>> PETROLL REIMBURSEMENT@30 litres in a month in area III places.****
>>>> @Rs73 per litres for 12 months****
>>>> 26280****
>>>> .****
>>>> NEWSPAPER EXPENSES REIMBURSEMENT(@ Rs150pm. at PNB, for ex.)****
>>>> @Rs150 for 12 months****
>>>> 1800****
>>>> .****
>>>> MOBILE BILL REIMBURSEMENT(@Rs1200pm, at pnb, for ex)****
>>>> @Rs1200 pm for 12 months****
>>>> 14400****
>>>> .****
>>>> ENTERTAINMENT EXPENSES(@Rs4800 pa, as paid by pnb, for ex.)****
>>>> ****
>>>> 4800****
>>>> .****

>>>> CANTEEN FACILITY(@Rs50 per employee, in mid sized branches, as paid by

>>>> PNB, for ex.)****
>>>> @Rs50 for 12 months****
>>>> 600****
>>>> .****
>>>> KEROSENE/FUEL CHARGES FOR CANTEEN (on actual basis).****

>>>> At an assumed consumption of one LPG cylinder pm for an office with 5

>>>> staff.****
>>>> 1032****
>>>> .****
>>>> LIBRARY FACILITIES(@Rs625 pa.as paid by PNB,for ex.)/****
>>>> At an assumed staff strength of 5****
>>>> 125****
>>>> .****

>>>> CLOSING ALL.FOR 2 CLOSINGS IN A YEAR@Rs250,per closing, as paid in

>>>> PNB*
>>>> ***
>>>> ****
>>>> 500****
>>>> .****
>>>> BRIEF CASE COST REIMBURSEMENT(@Rs150, as paid by PNB,for ex.).****
>>>> Not included as contingent upon it happening.****
>>>> 150****
>>>> .****
>>>> CHILDREN'S SCHOLARSHIP SCHEME.****
>>>> 4000****
>>>> .****
>>>> EX-GRATIA****
>>>> 100000****
>>>> .****
>>>> SILVER JUBILEE/ MILE STONE AWARDS****
>>>> 4000****
>>>> .****
>>>> MEMENTO TO RETIRING EMPLOYEES.****
>>>> 5000****
>>>> .****
>>>> GRATUITY****
>>>> ****
>>>> .****

>>>> Compensation on Transfer
>>>>
>>>> Officers in Scale - IV & above` Rs.12,000/-
>>>>

>>>> Officers in Scale - I, II & III Rs.9,000/-****
>>>> 9000****
>>>> .****

>>>> LEAVE FARE CONCESSION, w.e.f 01.05.2010
>>>>
>>>> An officer in JMG Scale - I is entitled to travel on duty by 1st Class
>>>> or AC 2-Tier Sleeper by train. He may, however, travel by air (economy
>>>> class) if so permitted by the Competent Authority having regard to the

>>>> exigencies of business or public interest.****
>>>> ****
>>>> .****
>>>> DEPUTATION OUTSIDE BA...@7.75% of pay max.Rs2300 pm****
>>>> ****
>>>> .****
>>>> DEPUTATION INSIDE BANK@4% of pay, max.Rs1200 pm****
>>>> ****
>>>> .****

>>>> HILL AND FULE ALLOWANCE, w.e.f 01.11.2007
>>>> Places with an altitude of 1000 meters & above but less than 1500
>>>> metres
>>>> & Mercara Town 2% of pay subject to a maximum of Rs.550/- p.m.Places
>>>> with
>>>> an altitude of 1500 meters & above but less than 3000 metres 2.50% of
>>>> pay
>>>> subject to a maximum of Rs.680/- p.m.Places with an altitude of 3000
>>>> meters

>>>> & above 5% of pay subject to a maximum of Rs.1,570/- p.m.****
>>>> Not taken into calculation as not admissible to all.****
>>>> ****
>>>> .****
>>>> CTC Per Year****
>>>> ****
>>>> 438978****
>>>> .****
>>>> CTC Per Month,as on 01-04-2010****
>>>> ****
>>>> 36,581.50****
>>>> .****
>>>> ACTUAL STARTING SALARY OF A JMG SC-I, AS ON 01-04-2010 PM****
>>>> ****
>>>> 21171.25****
>>>> .****
>>>> SALARY PACKAGE INFLATED BY CTC CONCEPT:****
>>>> 73%****
>>>> 15410.25****
>>>> .****

>>>> CTC FOR PERSONS MAY BE ADJUSTED FOR CC ALL AND NON CC ALL.

>>>> RECEIPENTS.*
>>>> ***
>>>> ****
>>>> ****
>>>> SOURCE :
>>>> http://mitalismusings.blogspot.in/2013/04/bank-employees-do-not-deserve-any-pay.html
>>>> ****
>>>> ** **
>>>> *‘CTC’ emerged as a new and novel way to window dress salary packages
>>>> to project them more than what one gets in his/her hand.* *Beware, the

>>>> CTC concept is being toyed with, by FINMIN and IBA, to create a feeling
>>>> that, bank employees are already getting more than what they deserve,
>>>> so,
>>>> there is no need for any further hike.But, it defies logic, why,
>>>> government
>>>> employees are kept untouched from this seemingly novel concept and pay
>>>> commission structured pay and facilities are continued for them inspite
>>>> of
>>>> the stark disparity between pay of government employees and bank
>>>> employees.

>>>> **Even State govt employees get more than what we get.*

>>>> Let the Finance Ministry lead from the front and show it to the Nation
>>>> how the CTC structure be implemented by moving all the MPs, MLAs,
>>>> Ministers, PM, President etc etc as well as the Govt Employees to the
>>>> CTC
>>>> Model first. Lets not forget Charity begins at home first. So please
>>>> preach

>>>> what you Practice****
>>>> S.Srinivasan ****
>>>> *Above all we have to increase our awareness and learning*
>>>> ** **

>>>>
>>>> On Tuesday, June 11, 2013 6:36:02 AM UTC+5:30, K.MOHANDAS RAO, SBM-VR
>>>> 2001 wrote:
>>>>

>>>> *CTC Concept In Bipartite Settlement **

>>>> “Cost to Company” (CTC) concept.
>>>>

>>>> *That CTC concept is a piece of financial engineering whereby the

>>>> mailto:bankpensioner%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com<bankpensioner%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com>
>>>> .

>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/bankpensioner.
>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>

>>>> **
>>>> --
>>>> M A Prasad**Mob: +91 75985 12516

>>>> Res: F12, Sri Karpagavruksham Apartments
>>>> Subramaniapuram Road, Seshadripuram
>>>> Srirangam, Trichy 620006
>>>> --
>>>> Visit our blog site http:://bankpensioner.blogspot.com
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>>>> .

>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/bankpensioner.
>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
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>>>>
>>>>

>>>> ****
>>>> **
>>>> -- **
>>>> M A Prasad**Mob: +91 75985 12516

>>>> Res: F12, Sri Karpagavruksham Apartments
>>>> Subramaniapuram Road, Seshadripuram
>>>> Srirangam, Trichy 620006

>>>> -- **Visit our blog site http:://bankpensioner.blogspot.com**--- **You

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[Daulat Munot]

Dear Comrades, C.T.C.concept is not a good concept..It will promote exploitation in working class. IT IS ANTI LABOUR CONCEPT AND CERTAINLY WIDEN THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN MANAGEMENT AND WORKING CLASS and crash Industrial Harmony  .It is against the bipartite negotiation spirit. It must be discarded at the initial stage.CTC concept is  like a remote control  in the hands of Indian Banks Association  and Government.If it is accepted by UFBEU then it will be the LAST BIPARTITE SETTLEMENT in our public sector banks.After accepting this Banks may say as SORRY, your charter of demands are beyond their Cost to the company and they are not in position to afford these in the prevailing circumstances. At present we are struggling hard to save the present employment against the clutches of recession near by so please forget the hike in salary and perks and join hands with us against the sudden attack of recession to save your jobs. IBA may say that The ministry of finance has grave concern  to the tremendous hike in N.P.A.S'.First dilute these then come before us for wage negotiation. At present economic growth rate they may say it is not appropriate time for wage hike.If situation deteriorated further gradually then we shall left no alternate then to implement economic emergency They may say like this At present we are thinking to curtail and cut in your present wage structure.So we must oppose in totality the present concept of the C.T.C by saying  politicians and leaders first they implement COST TO NATION CONCEPT in their perks and salaries .Next they should come to COST TO PUBLIC CONCEPT for their Government Officers and officials.  then the number of CTC  come .It is correct to say that first implement on yourself before saying others to implement. 

[lakshmanan shankarnaraynan]

Friends,

They are not worried about that now. Already they have achieved 100%DA neutralisation and when they retire they will be better off compared pre Nov.2002 pensioners.

S.Lakshmanan

IB-VRS-2001

---

From: real banker <spal...@gmail.com>
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 6:23 PM

[Daulat Munot]

Dear Comrades, 

It is surprising to know that some of our members are creating differences between working employees and retirees through this plate form.It is not a healthy tradition.

No doubt differences may be from each side but these can be resolved through establishing proper communication  and can be resolved mutually.We are senior citizens and almost all of us are matured enough.There is no benefit to highlight and expose that retirees and employees both are divided themselves.No body can be benefited due to this through division and differences.The call of time is how pensioners and retirees can be one united.We have to work in this direction.

OUR EXPERIENCE AND THEIR POWER IF BOTH ARE UNITED THEN NO BODY CAN DEFEAT US TO OUR MISSION. 

I sincerely request to maintain peace,patience and harmony in our difficult time.If there is peace,there is a solution.Our duty is to raise our voice through different modes of communication.WE HAVE TO DO OUR DUTY HONESTLY NOT ONLY FOR OUR SHAKE BUT ALSO FOR THE FUTURE OF THE PRESENT BANK EMPLOYEES
THOSE WILL RETIRE TOMORROW AND COME TO OUR TRACK SOON ER OR LATTER WHEN WE LEAVE THIS WORLD ANY DAY.

 

[bhaskara sarma]

It is not the intention of the retirees to create differences between working employees and retirees.

The retirees patiently kept quiet for the past 20 years and maintained perfect silence and peace of mind.But their interests are totally forgotten if not bartered beyond all imagination.Now this is a bursting point.It is for the members of IBA and UFBU to understand genuine feelings and difficulties of the retirees and do justice.Honest dissent is a part of democratic process and it should be understood objectively with a sense of accommodation.

With Regards,

P B Sarma

[Daulat Munot]

Respected P.B.Sharma, We understand the gravity of your feelings.Our leaders are patiently working at the desired direction.The pensioners demands did not meet so far at desired level because we have not concentrated enough and raised voice appropriately so far.As I feel  there may  remained  some lacking  in our efforts so we could not get the satisfactory result so far.But this time we are serious to our efforts and definitely reach to the desired goal.The only need is to maintain unity and convincing spirit in our communication.All genuine legitimate demands are within the orbit of our approach.We request  our members to preserve specific care  to maintain diligence and dignity in any of our communication to the pensioners group.WE ARE MOVING IN RIGHT DIRECTION AND HOPE FOR THE BEST.

--

[bhaskara sarma]

I never agree with the contention that our voice was not raised appropriately.I am sure that UFBU leaders are fully aware of the 

problems of the retirees.In 8th bipartite,pension of past retirees was enhanced as 50 percent of last BP drawn but the benefit of enhanced DA was not extended.Nobody need remind the experienced leaders about the poor state of pre 1986 retirees or other pre 2002 retirees.But in 9th bipartite ,all these old and impoverished retirees were completely forgotten.But they have all the force and power to bend IBA to agree for  demands of rs 4800 crores,required for second option for pension.Compared to that what is the cost of other demands?The retirees demands are not pursued in residual issues even.When IBA discriminated leftover retirees  in giving second option ,what is the follow up done by  UFBU?.Everybody is watching the situation.It is high time that IBA and UFBU have to prove their  sincerity.Nobody need remind them about our problems.They are well aware and it is their responsibility to do justice to all sections of employees and retirees.Once they occupy high positions ,they should act as trustees but not as politicians.

With regards,

P B Sarma.

--

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