LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

[MOHANDAS RAO]

Dear Friends,

LIFE CERTIFICATE

Members may be aware that pensioners are required to submit Life Certificates every year during November to their banks/treasuries to enable them to continue draw pension without any interruption. The rule applies to all pensioners like State, Central, Railway, Telecommunication, etc. I have searched the inter net and find varying formats of Life Certificates designed by various authorities.

After introduction of pension in banks for their employees, obtaining of Life Certificates for them also became a practice. The Banks’ Pension Regulations are silent about it, except the following:

“…..54. Manner of payment of pension:-

A pension fixed at a monthly rate shall be payable monthly on or after the first day of the following month.

55. Power to issue instructions:-

The Chairman and Managing Director of the Bank may from time to time issue instruction as may be considered necessary or expedient for the implementation of these regulations……”

So, many banks have issued internal instructions to obtain such life certificates. Some over enthusiastic officials in the Pension Departments of banks have stopped pension temporarily in absence of such certificates (This happened in SBM last year and after intervention of the Unions the matter settled and pension restored immediately).

Most of the bank pensioners are personally known to most of the serving employees of his pension drawing branch in small places and the Branch Manager or any authorized official can straight away sign the life certificate, without the signature/personal appearance of the pensioner, if at all it is needed by the bank.  After all, Life Certificate is to be certified by an authorized official and not by a pensioner.  The pensioner’s signature is being insisted as a proof of personal appearance and for certain declarations such as non-employment certificate (this is for 2 years after retirement for officers and not applicable to award staff, I suppose) or non-marriage or remarriage (applicable to only to family pensioners).  In big cities and in case of the pensioner not frequently visiting the branch or settled in a foreign country, this cannot be done easily, I agree.

If, say life certificate is not available for a pensioner for a year, sky will not fall. In case of an unfortunate death of the pensioner, while fixing the family pension, excess pension paid can be recovered.  Also at the time of claim settlements, such excess payments can also be recovered. This is a very rare case. Hence, obtainment of Life Certificate for all is not required.

Do banks insist on Life Certificates from its employees every year for disbursement of wages? Pension is also a deferred wage. For the time being let this issue be only for a discussion.

K. MOHANDAS RAO, SBM-SVRS 2001

 

 

[GOPALAN JANAKIRAMAN]

Dear Friends,

           (1)  Employees  are attending the  office and registering their presence every day. Indirectly producing Life Certificate daily.

           (2) In my case I am attending the pension disbursing branch during November  only to produce Life Certificate.

           (3) There can be  chances of fraudulant drawal of pension in case of deceased penionsers  where there are no eligible family pensioners. In fact I am aware of one or two instances  in Government Departments  of course in collusion with the Officials.
            (4)I f my memory is correct,  earlier pensioners were to submit  Life Certificates twice in a year during May and  November. In order to  minimise the hardship to genuine pensioners It was changed to once in a year some years back.

                                      JANAKIRAMAN    SVRS IB

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[Prasad C N]

Dear Mr.Mohandas Rao,

You are aware that from our Organisation, we have protested obtaining Life Certificate from our Bank pensioners, for the following reasons :

a. Most of our Pensioners, including family pensioners (from this year) have applied for Reimbursement of Diagnostic Charges and such applications are countersigned by Bank's official. Subsequently, amount has also been credited to Pensioners' Accounts.  For a Pensioner, every Department of the Bank is a Bank.  Therefore, where is the necessity of giving Life Certificate again, which involves cost for Pensioners as well as the Bank.

b. Sweet Packets are distributed on Foundation day every year on 1st October.  Again, Pensioners are present in person.  Where is the necessity of giving Life Certificate again.  Some of the family pensioners are also still employees of the Bank.

c. There is no provision for obtaining Life Certificate in Pension Regulations.  Regulation 55 has no relevance to this subject, as instructions issued by the Managing Director is only for the Bank for implementation of these regulation.  His instruction does not bind a Pensioner.  Even, if so, he has to be notified.

d. One has to understand relevancy of obtaining Life Certificate.  In respect of Central/State Government pensioners,  there are four entities are involved.  Govt (employer), AGs Office (Maintains pension records/issues orders), Treasury (Payment is made) and Banks (Disbursing authority). There is no connection between the Pensioner and the former employer after retirement.  Life Certificate act as link.  But, in Banks, it is only one entity, i.e Bank.  Since, many pensioners may not be in a position to visit the Bank premises for various reasons.  

e. Most important reason is that by handing over Life Certificate, which is not mandated in Regulations, I am waiving my right to protest implementation of Regulations, which are not available and we are estopped from protesting later in respect of other such orders.  This allows creation of precedent.  

Please therefore, do not give Life Certificate.  Protest, if (magnanimous) Managements implement such rules. 

 

Thanks, a Million.

With regards,
Prasad C N

---

From: MOHANDAS RAO <mohand...@gmail.com>
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
Cc: ban...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 2:47 PM
Subject: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

[Prasad C N]

Dear Sir,

Why should Banks punish innocent pensioners, instead of punishing such black sheep.  Life Certificates alone is not possible to eliminate such practice.  Still 12 to 14 months of Pension can be drawn.  What about some Customers who do not visit Branches for years together, but continue to draw Interest/balance in the account at regular intervals.  

 

Thanks, a Million.

With regards,
Prasad C N

---

From: GOPALAN JANAKIRAMAN <gj1...@gmail.com>
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 8:15 PM
Subject: Re: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

[nalini pandya]

Sir,

I am sending life certificate as required by UCO Bank pensioners to be submitted

With best regards

Nalini Pandya

UCO Bank retired VRS2001 officer

UCO BANK

 

LIFE CERTIFICATE                                 Certified that I have seen the Pensioner _____________________________________         _      ____________________________________________________(Name of the Pensioner) holder of the  Pension Payment Order No.__________________________________and that he is alive on this date.    UCO BANK Name__________________________       Signature ______________________   Designation Of authorised officer        _____________________________Branch                      Date:__________________________________   Seal___________________________

Back

 

From: MOHANDAS RAO <mohand...@gmail.com>
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
Cc: ban...@googlegroups.com

[Ramesh Megaravalli]

Dear friends,

Thereis a point in the contention of Mohandas. The life certificate
should be certified by a responsible officer of the branch for having
seen the pensioner and is very much alive. It is ridiculous and
harassing to with held the pension on the grounds of non submission of
the life certicate by the pensioner. Reemployment certificate should
be signed by the pensioner only for 2 years from the retirement date
and the remarriage certificate apllies only to the family pensioners.

our Bank (State Bank of Mysore) has insisted for life certificate
during October itself this time and I had submitted the same to the
branch manager during my last visit to the branch a few days ago.

Sincerely.
Ramesh Megaravalli.

On 10/10/11, MOHANDAS RAO <mohand...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear Friends,
>

> *LIFE CERTIFICATE*

>
> Members may be aware that pensioners are required to submit Life

> Certificates *every year during November* to their banks/treasuries to

> enable them to continue draw pension without any interruption. The rule
> applies to all pensioners like State, Central, Railway, Telecommunication,
> etc. I have searched the inter net and find varying formats of Life
> Certificates designed by various authorities.
>
> After introduction of pension in banks for their employees, obtaining of

> Life Certificates for them also became a *practice.* The Banks’ Pension
> Regulations are *silent *about it, except the following:
>
> “…..*54. Manner of payment of pension:-*

>
> A pension fixed at a monthly rate shall be payable monthly on or after the
> first day of the following month.
>

> *55. Power to issue instructions:-*

>
> The Chairman and Managing Director of the Bank may from time to time issue
> instruction as may be considered necessary or expedient for the
> implementation of these regulations……”
>
> So, many banks have issued internal instructions to obtain such life
> certificates. Some over enthusiastic officials in the Pension Departments of
> banks have stopped pension temporarily in absence of such certificates (This
> happened in SBM last year and after intervention of the Unions the matter
> settled and pension restored immediately).
>
> Most of the bank pensioners are personally known to most of the serving
> employees of his pension drawing branch in small places and the Branch
> Manager or any authorized official can straight away sign the life
> certificate, without the signature/personal appearance of the pensioner, if

> at all it is needed by the bank. After all, *Life Certificate is to be
> certified by an authorized official and not by a pensioner*. The

> pensioner’s signature is being insisted as a proof of personal appearance
> and for certain declarations such as non-employment certificate (this is for
> 2 years after retirement for officers and not applicable to award staff, I
> suppose) or non-marriage or remarriage (applicable to only to family
> pensioners). In big cities and in case of the pensioner not frequently
> visiting the branch or settled in a foreign country, this cannot be done
> easily, I agree.
>
> If, say life certificate is not available for a pensioner for a year, sky
> will not fall. In case of an unfortunate death of the pensioner, while
> fixing the family pension, excess pension paid can be recovered. Also at
> the time of claim settlements, such excess payments can also be recovered.
> This is a very rare case. Hence, obtainment of Life Certificate for all is
> not required.
>
> Do banks insist on Life Certificates from its employees every year for
> disbursement of wages? Pension is also a deferred wage. For the time being
> let this issue be only for a discussion.
>
> K. MOHANDAS RAO, SBM-SVRS 2001
>
>
>
>
>
>

> <http://www.smileyssweet.com/wp/ie.php?plg=ie&subs=gmail&elm=sign>

>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "bankpensioner" group.
> To post to this group, send an email to bankpe...@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> bankpensione...@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/bankpensioner?hl=en-GB.
>
>

--
M.S.Ramesh

[Raja Subbu]

Dear comrades,

I would like to confirm the mail by com.Gopalan Janakiraman.What he said is correct.

With regards,

Rajangam S IB VRS.

---

From: GOPALAN JANAKIRAMAN <gj1...@gmail.com>
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 8:15 PM

Subject: Re: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

[S P Sarma]

I retired from Syndicate Bank under VRS in 2001 at the age of
48.During my service in the bank, I have handled
government transactions dept. for a very very long time. I never used
to insist for the pensioner's coming to the Bank or signing on the
life certificate format every year. I myself used to prepare the life
certificates every year in November and keep the same in the
pensioner's file. No where in the rules it is stated that the
pensioner's signature is required in the life certificate. The life
certificate can be signed by any bank officer so long as he knows that
the pensioner is alive as on the date of his signing the life
certificate. Physical visit by the pensioner to the bank branch is
also not required. Now-a-days, the bank officers are taking the
pensioner's signature on the life certificate, more as matter of
"abundant" caution. If the officer is bold enough, he need not obtain
the pensioner's signature on the life certificate format. However, in
the case of non-employement certificate / non-remarriage certificate
(in case of family pensioner) the signature of the pensioner has to be
obtained compulsorily.

S P Sarma, Kollam

============================

On Oct 10, 2:17 pm, MOHANDAS RAO <mohandasr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear Friends,
>
> *LIFE CERTIFICATE*
>

> Members may be aware that pensioners are required to submit Life

> Certificates *every year during November* to their banks/treasuries to

> enable them to continue draw pension without any interruption. The rule
> applies to all pensioners like State, Central, Railway, Telecommunication,
> etc. I have searched the inter net and find varying formats of Life
> Certificates designed by various authorities.
>
> After introduction of pension in banks for their employees, obtaining of

> Life Certificates for them also became a *practice.* The Banks’ Pension

> Regulations are *silent *about it, except the following:
>

> “…..*54. Manner of payment of pension:-*

>
> A pension fixed at a monthly rate shall be payable monthly on or after the
> first day of the following month.
>

> *55. Power to issue instructions:-*
>

> The Chairman and Managing Director of the Bank may from time to time issue
> instruction as may be considered necessary or expedient for the
> implementation of these regulations……”
>
> So, many banks have issued internal instructions to obtain such life
> certificates. Some over enthusiastic officials in the Pension Departments of
> banks have stopped pension temporarily in absence of such certificates (This
> happened in SBM last year and after intervention of the Unions the matter
> settled and pension restored immediately).
>
> Most of the bank pensioners are personally known to most of the serving
> employees of his pension drawing branch in small places and the Branch
> Manager or any authorized official can straight away sign the life
> certificate, without the signature/personal appearance of the pensioner, if

> at all it is needed by the bank.  After all, *Life Certificate is to be
> certified by an authorized official and not by a pensioner*.  The

> pensioner’s signature is being insisted as a proof of personal appearance
> and for certain declarations such as non-employment certificate (this is for
> 2 years after retirement for officers and not applicable to award staff, I
> suppose) or non-marriage or remarriage (applicable to only to family
> pensioners).  In big cities and in case of the pensioner not frequently
> visiting the branch or settled in a foreign country, this cannot be done
> easily, I agree.
>
> If, say life certificate is not available for a pensioner for a year, sky
> will not fall. In case of an unfortunate death of the pensioner, while
> fixing the family pension, excess pension paid can be recovered.  Also at
> the time of claim settlements, such excess payments can also be recovered.
> This is a very rare case. Hence, obtainment of Life Certificate for all is
> not required.
>
> Do banks insist on Life Certificates from its employees every year for
> disbursement of wages? Pension is also a deferred wage. For the time being
> let this issue be only for a discussion.
>
> K. MOHANDAS RAO, SBM-SVRS 2001
>

>  <http://www.smileyssweet.com/wp/ie.php?plg=ie&subs=gmail&elm=sign>

[perumal maruthu]

Dear Prasadji,

Though I concur with your views, I differ from the Last one. Many banks caution the pensioners that monthly pension will be stopped wef First January, if LC is not submitted in Nov. Unless IBA clears this hurdle uniformly in respect of all banks, submission of LC continues to be quasi-proceedural requirement for the branches.(Quasi: because it is not required by the Regulations but obtained by practice).Only the Banks have to make it clear about the efficacy of the LC in respect of its own ex-staff.

The age old anecdote on the IMPORTANCE of tying a cat in the marriage hall by the Junior of the old Priest is known to all. Habits die hard.

M.Perumal

CB=Chennai

From: Prasad C N <cn_pr...@yahoo.com>
To: "bankpe...@googlegroups.com" <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 8:25 PM
Subject: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

Dear Mr.Mohandas Rao,

You are aware that from our Organisation, we have protested obtaining Life Certificate from our Bank pensioners, for the following reasons :

a. Most of our Pensioners, including family pensioners (from this year) have applied for Reimbursement of Diagnostic Charges and such applications are countersigned by Bank's official. Subsequently, amount has also been credited to Pensioners' Accounts.  For a Pensioner, every Department of the Bank is a Bank.  Therefore, where is the necessity of giving Life Certificate again, which involves cost for Pensioners as well as the Bank.

b. Sweet Packets are distributed on Foundation day every year on 1st October.  Again, Pensioners are present in person.  Where is the necessity of giving Life Certificate again.  Some of the family pensioners are also still employees of the Bank.

c. There is no provision for obtaining Life Certificate in Pension Regulations.  Regulation 55 has no relevance to this subject, as instructions issued by the Managing Director is only for the Bank for implementation of these regulation.  His instruction does not bind a Pensioner.  Even, if so, he has to be notified.

d. One has to understand relevancy of obtaining Life Certificate.  In respect of Central/State Government pensioners,  there are four entities are involved.  Govt (employer), AGs Office (Maintains pension records/issues orders), Treasury (Payment is made) and Banks (Disbursing authority). There is no connection between the Pensioner and the former employer after retirement.  Life Certificate act as link.  But, in Banks, it is only one entity, i.e Bank.  Since, many pensioners may not be in a position to visit the Bank premises for various reasons.  

e. Most important reason is that by handing over Life Certificate, which is not mandated in Regulations, I am waiving my right to protest implementation of Regulations, which are not available and we are estopped from protesting later in respect of other such orders.  This allows creation of precedent.  

Please therefore, do not give Life Certificate.  Protest, if (magnanimous) Managements implement such rules. 

 

Thanks, a Million.

With regards,
Prasad C N

[tvj krishnan]

Dear Shri Prasadji

I am a regular reader of this group mail and your mails are always interesting and contents have a lot of valuable useful information. As far Life Certificate is concerned, to my knowledge, it is obtained from all State/Central/Defence and other pensioners once in a year only to ensure that the pensioner is alive.   I have come across some cases where even after the death of the pensioner, pension is credited to his account for years together because the above procedure is not followed.  In some extreme cases, by means of "Standing Instructions", the pension is credited to other accounts and systematically withdrawn by the deceased pensioner's relatives.   

In order to minimise the difficuly faced by pensioners, my Bank, SBI, has introduced a system whereby any SBI pensioner can go to any of the nearest SBI Branch and sign his Life Certificate in front of the Branch Manager after showing his/her identity.  So the system of signing only in the pension paying branch 

was done away with.   

The system is implemented because of the some of unscrupulous persons have done some malpractices.

Regards

Jayakrishnan

---

From: Prasad C N <cn_pr...@yahoo.com>

To: "bankpe...@googlegroups.com" <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 8:28 PM

[Krishnan]

Dear All

Today is the D Day for all bank retirees and we pray for this community that they get a favorable judgement from the Supreme Court .And heartiest Greetings also to the advocate for taking the necessary action for the benefits of the bank pensioners.

GOOD LUCK TO ALL

Regards

Krishnan

[bass]

Dear Sir,

Obtaining life certificate of the pensioner/family pensioner is a
must, for an employer, may be through its branches or departments. It
is not supposed to pay the pension to a non existing person, but can
pay till it knows the fact and recover the difference as a matter of
right.

Because of huge number of pensioners, it is not practically possible
to verify the existence of all pensioners, every month, it was decided
to obtain the life certificate, at least once in a year. Immediately
or at a later date, after obtaining the life certificate but before
next obtention date, even the pensioner dies, pension can be credited
to the pensioners' account as long as it does not know the fact of
death of the pensioner.

The paying banker also will be protected as long as the payment was
made in good faith and without negligence, as per NI Act. Any drawals
in deceased pensioners' account will be dealt with all concerned,
legally.

So, it is obligatory and necessary to obtain life certificate of the
pensioner/family pensioner, on the part of the employer or its pension
disbursing authorities. And the pensioner, in his own interest, is
better to co operate and see that his life is certified by the
concerned authorities to avoid future complications.

It is also being discussed to find out the short cut methods to obtain
life certificate even without the physical presense of the pensioner.

With regards
S.M.BASHA


On Oct 10, 10:04 pm, perumal maruthu <perumalmaru...@yahoo.co.in>
wrote:

> Dear Prasadji,
> Though I concur with your views, I differ from the Last one. Many banks caution the pensioners that monthly pension will be stopped wef First January, if LC is not submitted in Nov. Unless IBA clears this hurdle uniformly in respect of all banks, submission of LC continues to be quasi-proceedural requirement for the branches.(Quasi: because it is not required by the Regulations but obtained by practice).Only the Banks have to make it clear about the efficacy of the LC in respect of its own ex-staff.
> The age old anecdote on the IMPORTANCE of tying a cat in the marriage hall by the Junior of the old Priest is known to all. Habits die hard.
> M.Perumal
> CB=Chennai
>

> ________________________________
> From: Prasad C N <cn_prasa...@yahoo.com>

> To: "bankpe...@googlegroups.com" <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 8:25 PM
> Subject: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
>
> Dear Mr.Mohandas Rao,
>
> You are aware that from our Organisation, we have protested obtaining Life Certificate from our Bank pensioners, for the following reasons :
>
> a. Most of our Pensioners, including family pensioners (from this year) have applied for Reimbursement of Diagnostic Charges and such applications are countersigned by Bank's official. Subsequently, amount has also been credited to Pensioners' Accounts.  For a Pensioner, every Department of the Bank is a Bank.  Therefore, where is the necessity of giving Life Certificate again, which involves cost for Pensioners as well as the Bank.
>
> b. Sweet Packets are distributed on Foundation day every year on 1st October.  Again, Pensioners are present in person.  Where is the necessity of giving Life Certificate again.  Some of the family pensioners are also still employees of the Bank.
>
> c. There is no provision for obtaining Life Certificate in Pension Regulations.  Regulation 55 has no relevance to this subject, as instructions issued by the Managing Director is only for the Bank for implementation of these regulation.  His instruction does not bind a Pensioner.  Even, if so, he has to be notified.
>
> d. One has to understand relevancy of obtaining Life Certificate.  In respect of Central/State Government pensioners,  there are four entities are involved.  Govt (employer), AGs Office (Maintains pension records/issues orders), Treasury (Payment is made) and Banks (Disbursing authority). There is no connection between the Pensioner and the former employer after retirement.  Life Certificate act as link.  But, in Banks, it is only one entity, i.e Bank.  Since, many pensioners may not be in a position to visit the Bank premises for various reasons.  
>
> e. Most important reason is that by handing over Life Certificate, which is not mandated in Regulations, I am waiving my right to protest implementation of Regulations, which are not available and we are estopped from protesting later in respect of other such orders.  This allows creation of precedent.  
>
> Please therefore, do not give Life Certificate.  Protest, if (magnanimous) Managements implement such rules. 
>
> Thanks, a Million.
>
> With regards,
> Prasad C N
>

> ________________________________
> From: MOHANDAS RAO <mohandasr...@gmail.com>

> To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
> Cc: ban...@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 2:47 PM
> Subject: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
>
> Dear Friends,
> LIFE CERTIFICATE
> Members may be aware that pensioners are required to submit Life Certificates every year during November to their banks/treasuries to enable them to continue draw pension without any interruption. The rule applies to all pensioners like State, Central, Railway, Telecommunication, etc. I have searched the inter net and find varying formats of Life Certificates designed by various authorities.
> After introduction of pension in banks for their employees, obtaining of Life Certificates for them also became a practice. The Banks’ Pension Regulations are silent about it, except the following:
> “…..54. Manner of payment of pension:-
> A pension fixed at a monthly rate shall be payable monthly on or after the first day of the following month.
> 55. Power to issue instructions:-
> The Chairman and Managing Director of the Bank may from time to time issue instruction as may be considered necessary or expedient for the implementation of these regulations……”
> So, many banks have issued internal instructions to obtain such life certificates. Some over enthusiastic officials in the Pension Departments of banks have stopped pension temporarily in absence of such certificates (This happened in SBM last year and after intervention of the Unions the matter settled and pension restored immediately).
> Most of the bank pensioners are personally known to most of the serving employees of his pension drawing branch in small places and the Branch Manager or any authorized official can straight away sign the life certificate, without the signature/personal appearance of the pensioner, if at all it is needed by the bank.  After all, Life Certificate is to be certified by an authorized official and not by a pensioner.  The pensioner’s signature is being insisted as a proof of personal appearance and for certain declarations such as non-employment certificate (this is for 2 years after retirement for officers and not applicable to award staff, I suppose) or non-marriage or remarriage (applicable to only to family pensioners).  In big cities and in case of the pensioner not frequently visiting the branch or settled in a foreign country, this cannot be done easily, I agree.
> If, say life certificate is not available for a pensioner for a year, sky will not fall. In case of an unfortunate death of the pensioner, while fixing the family pension, excess pension paid can be recovered.  Also at the time of claim settlements, such excess payments can also be recovered. This is a very rare case. Hence, obtainment of Life Certificate for all is not required.
> Do banks insist on Life Certificates from its employees every year for disbursement of wages? Pension is also a deferred wage. For the time being let this issue be only for a discussion.
> K. MOHANDAS RAO, SBM-SVRS 2001
>  
>  
>

> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "bankpensioner" group.
> To post to this group, send an email to bankpe...@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to bankpensione...@googlegroups.com.

> For more options, visit this group athttp://groups.google.com/group/bankpensioner?hl=en-GB.

[Prasad C N]

Dear friends,

Please do not place yourself in the place of Management and write about need of submission of Life Certificate.

I am more concerned about bringing in directions/rules which are not part of statutory regulations. Please remember that the 5 Years case and 50% cases are being won because the Bank did not follow Pension Regulations.  But, the moment you hand over Life Certificate to the Branch Manager, you are accepting that the Banks have authority to issue such instructions.  Now, this may be harmless (it is harmful to those who are away from the place for months/years together).  But tomorrow, with some reason they may say that you need to come personally every month.  Then you have to follow.  Do not allow any inclusion of any such 'rights' for the Management.  In the long run it is dangerous. Please give me list of Banks, which is prepared to pay Rs.10/- over and above what is provided in Pension Regulations.  Managements does not unfettered right to meddle in our 'Pension Regulations'.  Please do not compare Bank Pensioner with Govt Pensioners'.  I have already explained the significance of 'Life Certificate' for Govt Pensioners.   

Please tell me whether account holder needs to give 'Life Certificate' once in an year in following cases :

a. A depositor, who has deposits exceeding Rs.One Crore and interest is credited to the account, which is not withdrawn frequently or otherwise ;

b. Rent/Dividend Warrents/Commissions credited to account of a customer regularly for years. But, customer does not visit the branch or sent any of his representative for years.

c. Cheques of the customer is presented, regularly and many of which are returned unpaid.

Now, on the contrary, if in some banks, like ours, what should bank do in following cases :

a. Rs.15,000/- drawn for 'Funeral Expences' under 'Shradanjali Scheme' ;

b. Pensioner has visited Branch for various reasons, like taking cheque book, remitting cash/cheque, etc.

d. He has taken loan and money is being remitted promptly.

Compare, these to situations and decide what we need to do.

BUT PLEASE DO NOT CREATE PRECEDENCE FOR THE MANAGEMENT.  THEY HAVE MEANS TO KNOW AS TO LIFE OF PENSIONERS.  YOU NEED NOT HELP THEM, BUT THIS CAN HARM YOU AT A LATER DATE.  MERE SUBMISSION OF LIFE CERTIFICATE DOES NOT STOP UNSCRUPULOUS ELEMENTS FROM DEFRAUDING THE BANK.  

 

Thanks, a Million.

With regards,
Prasad C N

----- Forwarded Message -----
From: Prasad C N <cn_pr...@yahoo.com>
To: "bankpe...@googlegroups.com" <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>

[bass]

Dear friends,

In case of deposits of an account holder, Banks need not bother about
the existense of the account holder and carry on his instructions,
till it revokes by the concerned account holder, himself. After all
it is his money and no liability on the part of the Bank and it is
essential for the bank to obey the instructions given by the customer.

Whereas, in case of pension, it is the money of the employer
(pension trust fund managed by the bank in our case) liable to pay to
the pensioner/family pensioner till he alive and need not pay
subsequently. This measure of obtaining life certificate is required
to safeguard the interest of the existing pensioners and a proper
check to avoid payment to non existing pensioners/family pensioners.

So it is our moral responsibility to co operate with the employer who
is protecting our interest by taking minimum precautions like
obtaining life certificates that too once in a year.

Unnecessary apprehensions creating in the peaceful minds of the
pensioners is not that much seriously required. Of course, the
managements themselves are thinking to create alternate modes to prove
the lives of the pensioners. Under any circumstances, making payment
without knowing the life of the pensioner OR invoking the existing
practice without making alternative, the chances are remote and
unimaginable.

With regards
S.M.BASHA

> From: MOHANDAS RAO <mohandasr...@gmail.com>

> To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
> Cc: ban...@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 2:47 PM
> Subject: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
>
> Dear Friends,
> LIFE CERTIFICATE
> Members may be aware that pensioners are required to submit Life Certificates every year during November to their banks/treasuries to enable them to continue draw pension without any interruption. The rule applies to all pensioners like State, Central, Railway, Telecommunication, etc. I have searched the inter net and find varying formats of Life Certificates designed by various authorities.
> After introduction of pension in banks for their employees, obtaining of Life Certificates for them also became a practice. The Banks’ Pension Regulations are silent about it, except the following:
> “…..54. Manner of payment of pension:-
> A pension fixed at a monthly rate shall be payable monthly on or after the first day of the following month.
> 55. Power to issue instructions:-
> The Chairman and Managing Director of the Bank may from time to time issue instruction as may be considered necessary or expedient for the implementation of these regulations……”
> So, many banks have issued internal instructions to obtain such life certificates. Some over enthusiastic officials in the Pension Departments of banks have stopped pension temporarily in absence of such certificates (This happened in SBM last year and after intervention of the Unions the matter settled and pension restored immediately).
> Most of the bank pensioners are personally known to most of the serving employees of his pension drawing branch in small places and the Branch Manager or any authorized official can straight away sign the life certificate, without the signature/personal appearance of the pensioner, if at all it is needed by the bank.  After all, Life Certificate is to be certified by an authorized official and not by a pensioner.  The pensioner’s signature is being insisted as a proof of personal appearance and for certain declarations such as non-employment certificate (this is for 2 years after retirement for officers and not applicable to award staff, I suppose) or non-marriage or remarriage (applicable to only to family pensioners).  In big cities and in case of the pensioner not frequently visiting the branch or settled in a foreign country, this cannot be done easily, I agree.
> If, say life certificate is not available for a pensioner for a year, sky will not fall. In case of an unfortunate death of the pensioner, while fixing the family pension, excess pension paid can be recovered.  Also at the time of claim settlements, such excess payments can also be recovered. This is a very rare case. Hence, obtainment of Life Certificate for all is not required.
> Do banks insist on Life Certificates from its employees every year for disbursement of wages? Pension is also a deferred wage. For the time being let this issue be only for a discussion.
> K. MOHANDAS RAO, SBM-SVRS 2001
>  
>  
>

[anantharaman tg]

Dear Shri Prasad,

It is ok what you are saying that Banks have no reason to ask for LC. But when we were in service,

we had abided by the procedure of obtaining LC from Pensioners(I mean here, bothe ex-staff pensioners as well as other pensioners of state/central/defence pensioners) and forwading a copy 

to H.O. pensions in respect of ex=staff of bank.

Supposing failure results in stoppage of pension (it happened once in a case when the pensioner

did not submit it in time) , the pensioner notwithstanding his failure to submit it in time, finding

fault for the delay in pension.

A clear cut procedure for all Banks in this connection is required for their compliance. I know in case of Govt.pensioners, the harrasment by Banks is much more, I have got the experience of my own aged father unable to walk, being put to unwanted mental agony by a Bank every y ear for this purpose!

-- Anantharaman

[Mohan badi]

Dear Sir, Prasadji.

I have visited one site, I shall enclose the file and then kindly respond, which I feel is rather helpful, in solving Pensioners' hue and cry, including me, especially whose pension got denied by nationalized banks, or SBI or their group too.

Its nothing  but LOK ADALAT  I read the history of Madras region, state. which has solved numourous cases, and found to be successful in settling banks pension cases of any kind. Tomorrow I shall attach the same as it is 50+ pages. You must  be knowing   it , I do not know. kindly advise me whether we can take the help of LOK ADALAT, since it should  present in every state. In Gujarat and madras it  is avaialble as per my present reading. Any one or those interested can comment and send their  suggestion to all including me since this is open forum and everything is trasperent.. This is also one of the solution to our problem of rightful  pensions and other banks dispute too.

With high hope ,awaiting, in the interest of all. My case hearing is posted on 12.10.2011, in Bangalore High Court., I will inform you tomorrow after return from court, in the evening Sir.You know I am from United bank of India.

With regards,
Prof.M.R.Badi.
Bangalore
09902910900

With regards.

Prof.M.R.Badi,
Bangalore
09902910900

---

From: Prasad C N <cn_pr...@yahoo.com>
To: "bankpe...@googlegroups.com" <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>

Sent: Tuesday, 11 October 2011 7:21 PM

[sureshbhat M]

Dear Sirs            12/10/2011

       reg Life certificate submission we read different versions. But strongly believe that submission of life certificate once in a year as applicable to all non banking pensioners in not a mistake. As far as future claims by Banks , we can protest in case it is in voilation of present pension rules.

     Regarding safeguarding one's interest, we need to keep the interest of our brother n working in banks.  

     It is common that the giver needs to take more care.  For loan papers Banks take 100+ signatures even for 5000 loan; whereas for our term deposits(even in lakhs) they take just   While crediting pension  

[sureshbhat M]

Dear Sirs            12/10/2011

       reg Life certificate submission we read different versions. But strongly believe that submission of life certificate once in a year as applicable to all non banking pensioners in not a mistake. As far as future claims by Banks , we can protest in case it is in voilation of present pension rules.

     Regarding safeguarding one's interest, we need to keep the interest of our brother n working in banks.  

     It is common that the giver needs to take more care.  For loan papers Banks take 100+ signatures even for 5000 loan; whereas for our term deposits(even in lakhs) they take just one/two+ one for nomination.   While crediting pension the bank officials act as officials of Pension Statutory Body and answerable to the Fund. Safe guarding themselves by our Bank Officials can not be blamed even if we do not support them for asking life certificate.

Pension Dept Officer may not in the position to track the attendance of pensioner to other Depts in big branches and also due to regular transfers, Officers may not be familiar with the Pensioners every time he moves.

 This is my personal opinion

With regards

Suresh Bhat M

Canara Bank SVRS

On Tue, Oct 11, 2011 at 10:16 PM, bass <basha...@rediffmail.com> wrote:

[bass]

Dear Sir,

While we are in bank, we have done so many things regarding pension
payment to state/central/defence pensioners, as a matter of procedure/
practice/responsibility/customer service etc. etc.,

In case of our own pension, for giving life certificate (co operate
the pension disbursing officer to certify our life in our own
interest), why should we express one million doubts ? After all, no
body will take risk for the sake of others and pay pension blindly
without knowing the minimum thing of the pensioner/family pensioners'
life as per the procedure/practice/rule, whatever it may be, in the
force.

For obtaining life certificate, the disbursing officer can not visit
every pensioners whereabouts and no TA&DA will be paid for that
purpose. If the real pensioner does not turned up within the specified
time, the disbursing officer may refuse the payment, for which act he
will not be punished. Whereas, for pensioner, at a later date, has to
prove himself regarding his life and claim pension from the respective
disbursing branch.

So, let us stop thinking of protest like words, and feel respecting
the pension disbursing branch and co operate them to certify our
lives, as per their rules which are in force and framed to protect our
interest, without losing a single paisa from our pocket.

With regards
S.M.BASHA

On Oct 11, 11:00 pm, anantharaman tg <tgananthara...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear Shri Prasad,
> It is ok what you are saying that Banks have no reason to ask for LC. But
> when we were in service,
> we had abided by the procedure of obtaining LC from Pensioners(I mean here,
> bothe ex-staff pensioners as well as other pensioners of
> state/central/defence pensioners) and forwading a copy
> to H.O. pensions in respect of ex=staff of bank.
> Supposing failure results in stoppage of pension (it happened once in a case
> when the pensioner
> did not submit it in time) , the pensioner notwithstanding his failure to
> submit it in time, finding
> fault for the delay in pension.
> A clear cut procedure for all Banks in this connection is required for their
> compliance. I know in case of Govt.pensioners, the harrasment by Banks is
> much more, I have got the experience of my own aged father unable to walk,
> being put to unwanted mental agony by a Bank every y ear for this purpose!
> -- Anantharaman
>

> > *BUT PLEASE DO NOT CREATE PRECEDENCE FOR THE MANAGEMENT.  THEY HAVE MEANS

> > TO KNOW AS TO LIFE OF PENSIONERS.  YOU NEED NOT HELP THEM, BUT THIS CAN HARM
> > YOU AT A LATER DATE.  MERE SUBMISSION OF LIFE CERTIFICATE DOES NOT STOP

> > UNSCRUPULOUS ELEMENTS FROM DEFRAUDING THE BANK.  *

>
> > Thanks, a Million.
>
> > With regards,
> > Prasad C N
> > ----- Forwarded Message -----

> > *From:* Prasad C N <cn_prasa...@yahoo.com>
> > *To:* "bankpe...@googlegroups.com" <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
> > *Sent:* Monday, 10 October 2011 8:25 PM
> > *Subject:* LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

> > ------------------------------
> > *From:* MOHANDAS RAO <mohandasr...@gmail.com>
> > *To:* bankpe...@googlegroups.com
> > *Cc:* ban...@googlegroups.com
> > *Sent:* Monday, 10 October 2011 2:47 PM
> > *Subject:* bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
>
> > Dear Friends,
> > *LIFE CERTIFICATE*

> > Members may be aware that pensioners are required to submit Life

> > Certificates *every year during November* to their banks/treasuries to

> > enable them to continue draw pension without any interruption. The rule
> > applies to all pensioners like State, Central, Railway, Telecommunication,
> > etc. I have searched the inter net and find varying formats of Life
> > Certificates designed by various authorities.
> > After introduction of pension in banks for their employees, obtaining of

> > Life Certificates for them also became a *practice.* The Banks’ Pension
> > Regulations are *silent *about it, except the following:

> > “…..*54. Manner of payment of pension:-*

> > A pension fixed at a monthly rate shall be payable monthly on or after the
> > first day of the following month.

> > *55. Power to issue instructions:-*

> > The Chairman and Managing Director of the Bank may from time to time issue
> > instruction as may be considered necessary or expedient for the
> > implementation of these regulations……”
> > So, many banks have issued internal instructions to obtain such life
> > certificates. Some over enthusiastic officials in the Pension Departments of
> > banks have stopped pension temporarily in absence of such certificates (This
> > happened in SBM last year and after intervention of the Unions the matter
> > settled and pension restored immediately).
> > Most of the bank pensioners are personally known to most of the serving
> > employees of his pension drawing branch in small places and the Branch
> > Manager or any authorized official can straight away sign the life
> > certificate, without the signature/personal appearance of the pensioner, if

> > at all it is needed by the bank.  After all, *Life Certificate is to be
> > certified by an authorized official and not by a pensioner*.  The

> > pensioner’s signature is being insisted as a proof of personal appearance
> > and for certain declarations such as non-employment certificate (this is for
> > 2 years after retirement for officers and not applicable to award staff, I
> > suppose) or non-marriage or remarriage (applicable to only to family
> > pensioners).  In big cities and in case of the pensioner not frequently
> > visiting the branch or settled in a foreign country, this cannot be done
> > easily, I agree.
> > If, say life certificate is not available for a pensioner for a year, sky
> > will not fall. In case of an unfortunate death of the pensioner, while
> > fixing the family pension, excess pension paid can be recovered.  Also at
> > the time of claim settlements, such excess payments can also be recovered.
> > This is a very rare case. Hence, obtainment of Life Certificate for all is
> > not required.
> > Do banks insist on Life Certificates from its employees every year for
> > disbursement of wages? Pension is also a deferred wage. For the time being
> > let this issue be only for a discussion.
> > K. MOHANDAS RAO, SBM-SVRS 2001
>

> >  <http://www.smileyssweet.com/wp/ie.php?plg=ie&subs=gmail&elm=sign>

> >  --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "bankpensioner" group.
> > To post to this group, send an email to bankpe...@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > bankpensione...@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/bankpensioner?hl=en-GB.
>
> >  --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "bankpensioner" group.
> > To post to this group, send an email to bankpe...@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > bankpensione...@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group at
>

> ...
>
> read more »

[MOHANDAS RAO]

Dear Friends,

Myth:  Banks cannot pay pension if Life Certificate is not produced by the Pensioner.

Truth: Banks cannot stop pension in the absence of a death certificate.

Rationale: Pension is payable up to the death of the pensioner. Proof of death is required and not proof of life.

Ultimate decision is yours. This is only an opinion.

 

K. MOHANDAS RAO, SBM-SVRS 2001

[Prasad C N]

Dear Mr.Basha and others,

I have clearly explained why Central/State Government pensioners need to give Life Certificate. Central/State Civil Pension rules mandates submission of Life Certificate and also prescribed a format.  But our regulations neither have mandated rules nor format prescribed.

Please understand principles of Waiver and Estopals before you comment.  I have explained in detail about it.

In case of death of depositor, premature closure of deposit have to be effected.  In case of reduced and applicable interest rates or no interest means, bank is also likely to lose money.  What happens, if there is loan ?

Tomorrow, if your bank mandates that you should personally receive pension every month, can you refuse ?

Please think. 

 

Thanks, a Million.

With regards,
Prasad C N

---

From: bass <basha...@rediffmail.com>
To: bankpensioner <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, 12 October 2011 12:43 PM
Subject: Re: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

> > bankpensioner+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/bankpensioner?hl=en-GB.
>
> >  --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "bankpensioner" group.
> > To post to this group, send an email to bankpe...@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

> > bankpensioner+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

> > For more options, visit this group at
>
> ...
>
> read more »

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "bankpensioner" group.
To post to this group, send an email to bankpe...@googlegroups.com.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to bankpensioner+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

[bass]

Dear Sir,

Pension disbursing officer must ensure that the pensioner is alive, so
as to pay pension in further months by the employer of the pensioner.
For this, it is the responsibility of the pensioner to get his life
certified by the disbursing officer. It is not the bounded duty of the
disbursing officer to ascertain the fact of pensioner's life and
certify to that effect. In the absence of the life certificate, it may
be deemed that the concerned pensioner is no more/deceased and pension
will be stopped. If the pensioner is really alive but not certified
by the disbursing officer, it will become pensioner's responsibility
to get his life certified and claim continuation of the pension.

Banks can stop pension till they get clarity about the life of the
pensioner...........Practice and reality.

Pension is payable till the death of the pensioner ....... means
proof of life is required to pay and proof of death to stop.

Personal opinions will not stand and leads to confusion in the
peaceful minds of the pensioners. Ultimate is laid down procedures and
broad mind to understand, co operate and to follow.

With regards
S.M.BASHA

On Oct 12, 9:39 pm, MOHANDAS RAO <mohandasr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear Friends,
>

> *Myth:*  Banks *cannot pay pension* if Life Certificate is not produced by
> the Pensioner.
>
> *Truth:* Banks *cannot stop pension* in the absence of a death certificate.
>
> *Rationale:* Pension is payable up to the death of the pensioner. Proof of

> death is required and not proof of life.
>

> *Ultimate decision is yours. This is only an opinion.*
>
> **

> ...
>
> read more »

[bass]

Dear Sir,

Some rules are explicable and some to understand. It is left to
individual's wisdom to follow.

NI Act has been taking care of every point about payment of deposit of
a deceased customer. We are all almost CAIIBs/experienced bankers and
know pretty well about payment procedure of a deposit which was under
lien for a loan.

I have explained very clearly that the banks are on the job to
simplify the procedure of obtaining life certificate with alternate
modes to avoid it to obtain once in a year, but you are saying that
they may impose physical presence, every month. Both views are at
extreme ends like optimism and pesimism.

My final view is very clear and to follow the existing and laid down
procedure and never think even in dream about to protest OR
apprehension about imposing physical presense every month, by the
banks.

With regards
S.M.BASHA

On Oct 12, 10:58 pm, Prasad C N <cn_prasa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Dear Mr.Basha and others,
>
> I have clearly explained why Central/State Government pensioners need to give Life Certificate. Central/State Civil Pension rules mandates submission of Life Certificate and also prescribed a format.  But our regulations neither have mandated rules nor format prescribed.
>
> Please understand principles of Waiver and Estopals before you comment.  I have explained in detail about it.
>
> In case of death of depositor, premature closure of deposit have to be effected.  In case of reduced and applicable interest rates or no interest means, bank is also likely to lose money.  What happens, if there is loan ?
>
> Tomorrow, if your bank mandates that you should personally receive pension every month, can you refuse ?
>
> Please think. 
>  
> Thanks, a Million.
>
> With regards,
> Prasad C N
>
> ________________________________

> From: bass <basha_4...@rediffmail.com>

> ...
>
> read more »

[Prasad C N]

Dear friends,

Some of us have decided not to give Life Certificate.  We ensure that there is no balance in the account and Cheques for the amount equal to Pension amount would be issued.  If they return the cheque, then we intend to file damages claim suit.

Please do not assume.  Please provide me Regulation by which or on account of which I may be directed to hand over Life Certificate.

I also know many of you were senior officers.  Please understand, what you are doing and why should you do something.  

If you agree that Pensioner has to prove his existence to receive pension, Please let me know my visit to branch for various transactions have no value.

As Mr.Mohandas Rao, has stated, I am entitled to receive Pension.  Management has to prove my death to stop payment.  

I will not respond to further mails on this issue.  I have explained implication of handing over Life Certificate, which is not accordance with Pension Regulations.  If you still feel you should give, aap ka Marzi. 

 

Thanks, a Million.

With regards,
Prasad C N

---

From: bass <basha...@rediffmail.com>
To: bankpensioner <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>

Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2011 12:30 AM
Subject: Re: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

--
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To post to this group, send an email to bankpe...@googlegroups.com.

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[bass]

Dear Sir,

Your cheques in pension account will be honoured till grace period of
3 months. After that, they are supposed to be returned. If by chance,
honoured and cleared, it will not be treated as a payment in due
course and without negligence and the concerned officer has to face
the consequences.

The employer may ensure the life of the pensioner by any means. Of
which, one way in practice, is to obtain life certificate.

Because of your regular visits to the branch, the branch may certify
your life even without your personal approach to them for this
specific reason. The same is not applicable for every body. The
certifying officer may or may not do the same in each and every bodys
case. The ultimate sufferers will be non visitors and regular visitors
but not known to the certifying officer unless explained their
identity, by themselves.

So, better to be certified of their lives to avoid future
complications without hesitation instead of protesting or waiting for
somebody, on their own, to certify their lives.

With regards
S.M.BASHA

On Oct 13, 12:33 am, Prasad C N <cn_prasa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Dear friends,
>

> Some of us have decided not to give Life Certificate.  We ensure that there is no balance in the account and Cheques for the amount equal to Pension amount would be issued.  If they return the cheque, then we intend to file damages claim suit.
>
> Please do not assume.  Please provide me Regulation by which or on account of which I may be directed to hand over Life Certificate.
>
> I also know many of you were senior officers.  Please understand, what you are doing and why should you do something.  
>
> If you agree that Pensioner has to prove his existence to receive pension, Please let me know my visit to branch for various transactions have no value.
>
> As Mr.Mohandas Rao, has stated, I am entitled to receive Pension.  Management has to prove my death to stop payment.  
>
> I will not respond to further mails on this issue.  I have explained implication of handing over Life Certificate, which is not accordance with Pension Regulations.  If you still feel you should give, aap ka Marzi. 
>  
> Thanks, a Million.
>
> With regards,
> Prasad C N
>
> ________________________________

> From: bass <basha_4...@rediffmail.com>

> ...
>
> read more »

[Prasad C N]

Dear Mr.Basha,

Please refresh your knowledge with regard Negotiable Instruments Act.  I had said earlier that I will not comment on this issue any further.

Aap ka Marzi.

 

Thanks, a Million.

With regards,
Prasad C N

---

From: bass <basha...@rediffmail.com>
To: bankpensioner <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2011 2:00 AM

[perumal maruthu]

Dear Sureshji,

I am not differeing with your views. However, I find a valid reason for Mr.Prasad's argument. Kindly refer to the proceedings of Argument in Pradeepkumar's case on 11/10/11. It must be an eye-opener to all as to how an inocuous, formal and routine undertaking given by Pradeep for getting arrears of pension on a/c of restoration at par with 1684 points has been mischieously interpreted by the Bank to suit its own purpose. That is the reason why Prasad feels that in the abscence of requirement of LC, voluntarily giving such thing (though appears to be harmless at present) should not give the managements a handle to beat us at the most unexpected time.

Unfortunately, many people miss the well intended meaning of his point.

M.Perumal

[saradindu basu]

In my Bank I have to submit a composite Life Certificate every November. A portion of the certificate contains a declaration as to whether I am in any eployment or not. Employed pensioners are required to furnish compensation particulars .I feel it is quite reasonable.
 
-Saradindu Basu,
 Greater Noida. 
 

---

Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 22:09:51 +0530
Subject: Re: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
From: mohand...@gmail.com
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com

[perumal maruthu]

Dear sir,

I agree with your opinion. Atleast in the context of Pradeepkumar's predicament in SC on 11/10/11, everyone may pl re-think on his view.

M.Perumal

From: MOHANDAS RAO <mohand...@gmail.com>
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com

[Mohan badi]

Dear Prasadji,

I am enclosing  the attachment of Lokadalat. Kindly comment and Highlight your ideas.Please advise in open forum.

With regards.

Prof.M.R.Badi.

09902910900

---

From: Prasad C N <cn_pr...@yahoo.com>
To: "bankpe...@googlegroups.com" <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>

Sent: Tuesday, 11 October 2011 7:21 PM

[Heramba Dongre]

Friends,

 

If particular person is pensioner, and he is alive

what  is there is submitting the  life certificate/

non remarriage certificate as required by law or

practice   submitting life certificate is good for the

pensioner.  It isvery much surprising  seasoned

retired Bankers are  now questioning the authority

of life certificate

 

Regards

 

Sushma Dongre

[Rao Nallapaneni]

Do Pensioners are facing any problem to submit a Life Certificate once in a year?

Do the subject matter is so essential to be discussed at length in this forum?

Regards, Rao

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to bankpensione...@googlegroups.com.

For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/bankpensioner?hl=en-GB.

--
Best Regards,
Rao

[Mohan badi]

Dear Sirs

I am sending -cut and paste---

Department of pension and pensioner’s welfare has issued OM for regularising the pension and other retirement benefits of employees who were on extraordinary leave, unauthorised absence or suspension as on 1.1.2006 and retired or died thereafter without joining duty.

It is observed by government that in accordance with Rule 33 of the CCS (Pension) Rules, for calculation of pension the emoluments which the employee drew immediately before proceeding on such leave or being placed under suspension shall be the emoluments.

It was also clarified by government that for the purpose of gratuity the emoluments shall also include DA admissible on the date of retirement/death of the government servant.

Further, detailed clarifications have been issued for three categories in this issue viz., government servant who was on extraordinary leave or absence, the period whereof does not count as qualifying service, government servant who was on extraordinary leave, the period whereof count as qualifying service and government servant who was under suspension as on 1.1.2006 and retired thereafter without joining duty.

For further details download the OM No: 38/37/08-P&PW(A) dated 15.06.2010------

Sirs, i have sent this, since this new ammendment shall help many. in getting pension. I hope you will like it.


With regards,

Prof.M.R.Badi
Bangalore,

---

From: MOHANDAS RAO <mohand...@gmail.com>
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, 12 October 2011 10:09 PM

Subject: Re: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

[Mohan badi]

Dear Sirs,

I am enclosing for you all,just see whether it is useful----

The Department of Pension, and Pensioner's Welfare, New Delhi, is creating a  Web based Pensioner's Portal, as a part of the Mission Mode Project under  national e-Governance.

For inclusion in the web portal, the Department has called for information of all the 27 Pensioner's Associations, for facilitating release of funds for the year 2010-11.

For further details, read the Department's Letter No. 41/88/07-P&PW(C) dated 30.09.2010.---------------------------

With Regards to all


Prof.M.R.Badi
Bangalore.

---

From: bass <basha...@rediffmail.com>

To: bankpensioner <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, 12 October 2011 12:43 PM

Subject: Re: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

> > bankpensioner+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/bankpensioner?hl=en-GB.
>
> >  --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "bankpensioner" group.
> > To post to this group, send an email to bankpe...@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

> > bankpensioner+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

> > For more options, visit this group at
>
> ...
>
> read more »

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "bankpensioner" group.
To post to this group, send an email to bankpe...@googlegroups.com.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to bankpensioner+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

[bass]

Dear Sir,

Yes, really not at all necessary, but here things are happening like
this only on many occasions/issues.

People who took VRS, a decade back and have been submitting the life
certificate all these years, suddenly getting doubts and putting their
personal opinions in this forum is the cause for a long debate, may be
worthless and funny.

After all submitting a life certificate is not a herculean task and
harmful for the future of the pensioner. It is nothing but a creative
apprehension causing unnecessary mental agony.

Let us forget and live in our own world.

With regards
S.M.BASHA

On Oct 13, 10:09 am, Rao Nallapaneni <hr.nallapan...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Do Pensioners are facing any problem to submit a Life Certificate once in a
> year?
>
> Do the subject matter is so essential to be discussed at length in this
> forum?
>
> Regards, Rao
>

> On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 10:14 AM, Prasad C N <cn_prasa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Dear Mr.Basha,
>
> > Please refresh your knowledge with regard Negotiable Instruments Act.  I
> > had said earlier that I will not comment on this issue any further.
>
> > Aap ka Marzi.
>
> > Thanks, a Million.
>
> > With regards,
> > Prasad C N

> > ------------------------------
> > *From:* bass <basha_4...@rediffmail.com>
> > *To:* bankpensioner <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
> > *Sent:* Thursday, 13 October 2011 2:00 AM
> > *Subject:* Re: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

> ...
>
> read more »

[perumal maruthu]

Dear sir,

I am unable to understand the first two sentences of your mail. Kindly amplify.

M.Perumal

[J SOMASEKARA]

Last week Canara bank has posted following message on its website:

Please note that we shall deduct proportionate Income Tax from the pension payable for December 2011 onwards till 

February 2012. Hence, you are requested to assess your Income Tax and submit investment details/proof to update our 

records and deduct tax accordingly. Further, please submit the Life Certificate (copy attached) to the Pension Drawing 

Branch during November 2011. Please note that Non-Employment Certificate is to be submitted by those Pensioners for 

whom it is applicable. In case of non submission of the above certificates the pension payment will be stopped.

soma

[yoge...@indiatimes.com]

why so much fuss about life certificate.We were accepting it when we were in service now when we are on otherside of table there should not be any reservations .This is not a case to make a prestige point.Please stop discussing such matters.when there are other bigger and important issues .
yogeshwar sharma

----- Original Message -----

From: Mohan badi

To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 22:24:27 +0530 (IST)

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to bankpensione...@googlegroups.com.

[yoge...@indiatimes.com]

When you were in service why you did not raise these objections and withold the pension till concerned certificates are received.
Y P Sharma

----- Original Message -----

From: saradindu basu

To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Thu, 13 Oct 2011 09:52:45 +0530 (IST)

Subject: RE: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

[bass]

Dear Sir,

Yes. It is correct. Further discussion on life certificate issue is
worthless and funny. Already several members have expressed their
opinions and it is upto indivifual's wisdom to take a decision.

With regards
S.M.BASHA

On Oct 13, 2:00 pm, yogesh...@indiatimes.com wrote:
> why so much fuss about life certificate.We were accepting it when we were in service now when we are on otherside of table there should not be any reservations .This is not a case to make a prestige point.Please stop discussing such matters.when there are other bigger and important issues .
> yogeshwar sharma
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: Mohan badi
>
> To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
>
> Sent: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 22:24:27 +0530 (IST)
>
> Subject: Re: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
>
> Dear Sirs,
>
> I am enclosing for you all,just see whether it is useful----
>
> The Department of Pension, and Pensioner's Welfare, New Delhi, is creating a  Web based Pensioner's Portal, as a part of the Mission Mode Project under  national e-Governance.
>
> For inclusion in the web portal, the Department has called for information of all the 27 Pensioner's Associations, for facilitating release of funds for the year 2010-11.
>
> For further details, read the Department's Letter No. 41/88/07-P&PW(C) dated 30.09.2010.---------------------------
>
> With Regards to all
>
> Prof.M.R.Badi
> Bangalore.
>

> From: bass
>
> <basha_4...@rediffmail.com>

> ...
>
> read more »

[bass]

Dear Sir,

While in service as branch manager, I withhold several accounts and
advise the concerned pensioners to produce life certificates and draw
pension.

After retirement, my banker has freezed all debits in my personal
account for want of life certificate and reversed after producing the
same. (delay due to my stay at out of station for more than a month)

It is my practical experience. There is no need for me to impose
unnecessary things which are not known to me, in this blog. Whatever
the opinion expressed by me is for the information of the respected
members. Decision is left to the wisdom of individual member.

With regards
S.M.BASHA

On Oct 13, 2:03 pm, yogesh...@indiatimes.com wrote:
> When you were in service why you did not raise these objections and withold the pension till concerned certificates are received.
> Y P Sharma
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: saradindu basu
>
> To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
>
> Sent: Thu, 13 Oct 2011 09:52:45 +0530 (IST)
>
> Subject: RE: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
>
> In my Bank I have to submit a composite Life Certificate every November. A portion of the certificate contains a declaration as to whether I am in any eployment or not. Employed pensioners are required to furnish compensation particulars .I feel it is quite reasonable.
>
> -Saradindu Basu,
>
>  Greater Noida.
>

> Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 22:09:51 +0530
> Subject: Re: bankpensioner LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

> From: mohandasr...@gmail.com

> To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
>
> Dear Friends,
>
> Myth:  Banks cannot pay pension if Life Certificate is not produced by the Pensioner.
>
> Truth: Banks cannot stop pension in the absence of a death certificate.
>
> Rationale: Pension is payable up to the death of the pensioner. Proof of death is required and not proof of life.
>
> Ultimate decision is yours. This is only an opinion.
>
> K. MOHANDAS RAO, SBM-SVRS 2001
>

> ...
>
> read more »

[bass]

Dear Sir,

Thanks for giving right information at right time. Whether some of us
are willing or not, this is the real fact. Banks are asking life
certificates and pensioners have been producing the same. No body
feels fault with the system and never think of future consequences for
submission like that.

With regards
S.M.BASHA

On Oct 13, 1:50 pm, J SOMASEKARA <jsomasekara2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Last week Canara bank has posted following message on its website:
>

> *Please note that we shall deduct proportionate Income Tax from the pension
> payable for December 2011 onwards till *
> *tFebruary 2012. Hence, you are requested to assess your Income Tax and
> submit investment details/proof to update our *
> *records and deduct tax accordingly. Further, please submit the Life
> Certificate (copy attached) to the Pension Drawing *
> *Branch during November 2011. Please note that Non-Employment Certificate is
> to be submitted by those Pensioners for *
> *whom it is applicable. In case of non submission of the above certificates
> the pension payment will be stopped.*
> *
> *
> *soma*

>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 10:09 PM, MOHANDAS RAO <mohandasr...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
> > Dear Friends,
>

> > *Myth:*  Banks *cannot pay pension* if Life Certificate is not produced by
> > the Pensioner.
>
> > *Truth:* Banks *cannot stop pension* in the absence of a death
> > certificate.
>
> > *Rationale:* Pension is payable up to the death of the pensioner. Proof of

> > death is required and not proof of life.
>

> > *Ultimate decision is yours. This is only an opinion.*
>
> > **

>
> > K. MOHANDAS RAO, SBM-SVRS 2001
>

> ...
>
> read more »

[Mohan badi]

Dear Perumaji,

I have one doubt, kindly make me understand, for my knowledge sake.
Life Certificate, whether can it be sent by speed post with AD. or is it compulsory to be handed over in person to that branch  alone where we draw our pension. Whether can it be submitted in any branch of the same bank. like payable at Par in case of cheque.. In case one shifts his family from one station to another. Kindly give me your contact no. Sir.

Thanking you in anticipation. With regards.

Prof.M.R.Badi.
Bangalore.
09902910900

---

From: perumal maruthu <perumal...@yahoo.co.in>
To: "bankpe...@googlegroups.com" <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: "sures...@gmail.com" <sures...@gmail.com>; "mohand...@gmail.com" <mohand...@gmail.com>; "cn_pr...@yahoo.com" <cn_pr...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, 12 October 2011 10:11 PM

[perumal maruthu]

Dear sir,

Banks insist upon personal appearance. Hence, LC sent in any other mode is as good as NOT submitted. However, incase of extreme need, you may request the Bank to depute its Official at a mutually convenient time for personal verification. In cases of Defence/Railways pensioners, most of us as Scale I/II/III would have done this.

LC has to be normally submitted at the Pension drawing/disbursing Branch only so as to enable the Branch to keep a track record and confirm the same to the respective Higher Authorities. In some Banks LC can be submitted at a Branch other than the Pension paying Branch. If they comply with the request it is well and good; otherwise it has to be sumitted at the required Branch only to avoid any unpleasant consequences.

Incase of transfer to another place the pensioner should not have any loan liability.Pl submit a request to Your HO-Pension Deptt through your home Branch informing the 13 Digit number of your A/C at the new place along with xerox copies of your PPO and PAN card. If the transfer is effected during OCT-NOV, pl incorporate in your requst that you have submitted LC at the home Branch. There are no restrictions on the number of times the A/c to be transferred from one Br to another.

This is the procedure in our Bank. It may differ to some extent in other Banks.

M.Perumal

Canara Bank(SVRS)

Chennai

From: Mohan badi <banking...@yahoo.com>
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2011 5:44 PM
Subject: Re: bankpensioner Re: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

Dear Perumaji,

I have one doubt, kindly make me understand, for my knowledge sake.
Life Certificate, whether can it be sent by speed post with AD. or is it compulsory to be handed over in person to that branch  alone where we draw our pension. Whether can it be submitted in any branch of the same bank. like payable at Par in case of cheque.. In case one shifts his family from one station to another. Kindly give me your contact no. Sir.

Thanking you in anticipation. With regards.

Prof.M.R.Badi.
Bangalore.
09902910900

[bass]

Dear Sir,

Sorry for the interference. Pension must be payable to the living
persons. Life certificate means the pension disbursing officer has to
certify that the concerned pensioner has been alive. This is possible
only when the pensioner presents himself before the officer and get
his life certified.

Sending the certificate by post means it is nothing but self
declaration and without verification by third party i.e.disbursing
officer. Hence it is required to submit it at the pension disbursing
branch only.

If any body shifts to some other place, better to transfer the pension
account also to such place or the nearest branch.

With regards
S.M.BASHA

On Oct 13, 5:14 pm, Mohan badi <banking_facu...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Dear Perumaji,
>
> I have one doubt, kindly make me understand, for my knowledge sake.
> Life Certificate, whether can it be sent by speed post with AD. or is it compulsory to be handed over in person to that branch  alone where we draw our pension. Whether can it be submitted in any branch of the same bank. like payable at Par in case of cheque.. In case one shifts his family from one station to another. Kindly give me your contact no. Sir.
>
> Thanking you in anticipation. With regards.
>
> Prof.M.R.Badi.
> Bangalore.
> 09902910900
>
> ________________________________

> From: perumal maruthu &lt;perumalmaru...@yahoo.co.in&gt;
> To: &quot;bankpe...@googlegroups.com&quot; &lt;bankpe...@googlegroups.com&gt;
> Cc: &quot;sureshbh...@gmail.com&quot; &lt;sureshbh...@gmail.com&gt;; &quot;mohandasr...@gmail.com&quot; &lt;mohandasr...@gmail.com&gt;; &quot;cn_prasa...@yahoo.com&quot; &lt;cn_prasa...@yahoo.com&gt;

> Sent: Wednesday, 12 October 2011 10:11 PM
> Subject: Re: bankpensioner Re: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
>
> Dear Sureshji,

> I am not differeing with your views. However, I find a valid reason for Mr.Prasad&#39;s argument. Kindly refer to the proceedings of Argument in Pradeepkumar&#39;s case on 11/10/11. It must be an eye-opener to all as to how an inocuous, formal and routine undertaking given by Pradeep for getting arrears of pension on a/c of restoration at par with 1684 points has been mischieously interpreted by the Bank to suit its own purpose. That is the reason why Prasad feels that in the abscence of requirement of LC, voluntarily giving such thing (though appears to be harmless at present) should not give the managements a handle to beat us at the most unexpected time.

> Unfortunately, many people miss the well intended meaning of his point.
> M.Perumal
>  
>  
>
> From: sureshbhat M &lt;sureshbh...@gmail.com&gt;
> To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 12 October 2011 11:24 AM
> Subject: Re: bankpensioner Re: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
>
> Dear Sirs            12/10/2011
>
>        reg Life certificate submission we read different versions. But strongly believe that submission of life certificate once in a year as applicable to all non banking pensioners in not a mistake. As far as future claims by Banks , we can protest in case it is in voilation of present pension rules.
>

>      Regarding safeguarding one&#39;s interest, we need to keep the interest of our brother n working in banks.  

>
>      It is common that the giver needs to take more care.  For loan papers Banks take 100+ signatures even for 5000 loan; whereas for our term deposits(even in lakhs) they take just   While crediting pension  
>

> On Tue, Oct 11, 2011 at 10:16 PM, bass &lt;basha_4...@rediffmail.com&gt; wrote:
>
> Dear friends,
> &gt;
> &gt;In case of deposits of an account holder, Banks need not bother about
> &gt;the existense of the account holder and carry on his instructions,
> &gt;till it revokes by the concerned account holder, himself.  After all
> &gt;it is his money and no liability on the part of the Bank and it is
> &gt;essential for the bank to obey the instructions given by the customer.
> &gt;
> &gt;Whereas,  in case of pension,  it is the money of the employer
> &gt;(pension trust fund managed by the bank in our case) liable to pay to
> &gt;the pensioner/family pensioner till he alive and need not pay
> &gt;subsequently. This measure of obtaining life certificate is required
> &gt;to safeguard the interest of the existing pensioners and a proper
> &gt;check to avoid payment to non existing pensioners/family pensioners.
> &gt;
> &gt;So it is our moral

>  responsibility to co operate with the employer who

> &gt;is protecting our interest by taking minimum precautions like
> &gt;obtaining life certificates that too once in a year.
> &gt;
> &gt;Unnecessary apprehensions creating in the peaceful minds of the
> &gt;pensioners is not that much seriously required. Of course, the
> &gt;managements themselves are thinking to create alternate modes to prove
> &gt;the lives of the pensioners. Under any circumstances, making payment
> &gt;without knowing the life of the pensioner OR invoking the existing
> &gt;practice without making alternative, the chances are remote and
> &gt;unimaginable.
> &gt;
> &gt;With regards
> &gt;S.M.BASHA
> &gt;
> &gt;
> &gt;On Oct 11, 6:51 pm, Prasad C N &lt;cn_prasa...@yahoo.com&gt; wrote:
> &gt;&gt; Dear friends,
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Please do not place yourself in the place of Management and write about need of submission of
>  Life Certificate.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; I am more concerned about bringing in directions/rules which are not part of statutory regulations. Please remember that the 5 Years case and 50% cases are being won because the Bank did not follow Pension Regulations.  But, the moment you hand over Life Certificate to the Branch Manager, you are accepting that the Banks have authority to issue such instructions.  Now, this may be harmless (it is harmful to those who are away from the place for months/years together).  But tomorrow, with some reason they may say that you need to come personally every month.  Then you have to follow.  Do not allow any inclusion of any such &#39;rights&#39; for the Management.  In the long run it is dangerous. Please give me list of Banks, which is prepared to pay Rs.10/- over and above what is provided in Pension Regulations.  Managements does not unfettered right to meddle in our &#39;Pension Regulations&#39;.
>   Please do not compare Bank Pensioner with Govt Pensioners&#39;.  I
> &gt;&gt;  have already explained the significance of &#39;Life Certificate&#39; for Govt Pensioners.   
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Please tell me whether account holder needs to give &#39;Life Certificate&#39; once in an year in following cases :
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; a. A depositor, who has deposits exceeding Rs.One Crore and interest is credited to the account, which is not withdrawn frequently or otherwise ;
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; b. Rent/Dividend Warrents/Commissions credited to account of a customer regularly for years. But, customer does not visit the branch or sent any of his representative for years.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; c. Cheques of the customer is presented, regularly and many of which are returned unpaid.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Now, on the contrary, if in some banks, like ours, what should bank do in following cases :
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; a. Rs.15,000/- drawn for &#39;Funeral Expences&#39; under &#39;Shradanjali Scheme&#39;
>  ;
> &gt;&gt; b. Pensioner has visited Branch for various reasons, like taking cheque book, remitting cash/cheque, etc.
> &gt;&gt; d. He has taken loan and money is being remitted promptly.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Compare, these to situations and decide what we need to do.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; BUT PLEASE DO NOT CREATE PRECEDENCE FOR THE MANAGEMENT.  THEY HAVE MEANS TO KNOW AS TO LIFE OF PENSIONERS.  YOU NEED NOT HELP THEM, BUT THIS CAN HARM YOU AT A LATER DATE.  MERE SUBMISSION OF LIFE CERTIFICATE DOES NOT STOP UNSCRUPULOUS ELEMENTS FROM DEFRAUDING THE BANK.  
> &gt;&gt;  
> &gt;&gt; Thanks, a Million.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; With regards,
> &gt;&gt; Prasad C N
> &gt;&gt;
>
> &gt;&gt; ----- Forwarded Message -----
> &gt;&gt; From: Prasad C N &lt;cn_prasa...@yahoo.com&gt;
> &gt;&gt; To: &quot;bankpe...@googlegroups.com&quot; &lt;bankpe...@googlegroups.com&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 8:25 PM
> &gt;&gt; Subject: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Dear Mr.Mohandas Rao,
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; You are aware that from our Organisation, we have protested obtaining Life Certificate from our Bank pensioners, for the following reasons :
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; a. Most of our Pensioners, including family pensioners (from this year) have applied for Reimbursement of Diagnostic Charges and such applications are countersigned by Bank&#39;s official. Subsequently, amount has also been credited to Pensioners&#39; Accounts.  For a Pensioner, every Department of the Bank is a Bank.  Therefore, where is the necessity of giving Life Certificate again, which involves

>  cost for Pensioners as well as the Bank.

> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; b. Sweet Packets are distributed on Foundation day every year on 1st October.  Again, Pensioners are present in person.  Where is the necessity of giving Life Certificate again.  Some of the family pensioners are also still employees of the Bank.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; c. There is no provision for obtaining Life Certificate in Pension Regulations.  Regulation 55 has no relevance to this subject, as instructions issued by the Managing Director is only for the Bank for implementation of these regulation.  His instruction does not bind a Pensioner.  Even, if so, he has to be notified.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; d. One has to understand relevancy of obtaining Life Certificate.  In respect of Central/State Government pensioners,  there are four entities are involved.  Govt (employer), AGs Office (Maintains pension records/issues orders), Treasury

>  (Payment is made) and Banks (Disbursing authority). There is no connection between the Pensioner and the former employer after retirement.  Life Certificate act as link.  But, in Banks, it is only one entity, i.e Bank.  Since, many pensioners may not be in a position to visit the Bank premises for various reasons.  

> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; e. Most important reason is that by handing over Life Certificate, which is not mandated in Regulations, I am waiving my right to protest implementation of Regulations, which are not available and we are estopped from protesting later in respect of other such orders.  This allows creation of precedent.  
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Please therefore, do not give Life Certificate.  Protest, if (magnanimous) Managements implement such rules. 
> &gt;&gt;  
> &gt;&gt; Thanks, a Million.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; With regards,
> &gt;&gt; Prasad C N
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; ________________________________
> &gt;&gt; From:
>  MOHANDAS RAO &lt;mohandasr...@gmail.com&gt;
> &gt;&gt; To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
> &gt;&gt; Cc: ban...@googlegroups.com
> &gt;&gt; Sent: Monday, 10
>
> ...
>
> read more »

[SBMPC Blore]

Dear Mr.Perumalji,

Most our friends are still do not understand the meaning of my opinion. 

In our Bank, the stand of the Bank in regard to 5 years case is that they have informed those who opted to retire under VRS that they are not entitled to the benefit of notional addition of five years of service.  Having applied for VRS with full knowledge, they are estopped from claiming this benefit.  

I am worried that the Management might use same logic at a later date and give example of Life Certificate and assert their right to tweak benefits available under Pension Regulations.

I have seen that you have understood my line of thinking.  Now, by seeing response of Mr.Pradeep Kumar in Supreme Court, I am feeling some amount of uneasiness.  

Thanking you,

With regards,

Prasad C N

[pady nabs]

Sir, your view point in the subject  is correct.   There are lot of problems pertaining to various bank pensioners is there.   e.g,Five year notional  was implemented in almost all the nationalised banks and in very few banks the matter is not solved.  Please call for which of the banks have not implemented . Put up the same in abrf to to redress their grievance instead of analysing life certificateissue.   regards, padmanabhan --- On Thu, 13/10/11, bass <basha...@rediffmail.com> wrote:

> I am not differeing with your views. However, I find a valid reason for Mr.Prasad's argument. Kindly refer to the proceedings of Argument in Pradeepkumar's case on 11/10/11. It must be an eye-opener to all as to how an inocuous, formal and routine undertaking given by Pradeep for getting arrears of pension on a/c of restoration at par with 1684 points has been mischieously interpreted by the Bank to suit its own purpose. That is the reason why Prasad feels that in the abscence of requirement of LC, voluntarily giving such thing (though appears to be harmless at present) should not give the managements a handle to beat us at the most unexpected time.

> Unfortunately, many people miss the well intended meaning of his point. > M.Perumal >   >   > > From: sureshbhat M <sureshbh...@gmail.com> > To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, 12 October 2011 11:24 AM > Subject: Re: bankpensioner Re: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS > > Dear Sirs            12/10/2011 > >        reg Life certificate submission we read different versions. But strongly believe that submission of life certificate once in a year as applicable to all non banking pensioners in not a mistake. As far as future claims by Banks , we can protest in case it is in voilation of present pension rules. >

>      Regarding safeguarding one's interest, we need to keep the interest of our brother n working in banks.

> >> I am more concerned about bringing in directions/rules which are not part of statutory regulations. Please remember that the 5 Years case and 50% cases are being won because the Bank did not follow Pension Regulations.  But, the moment you hand over Life Certificate to the Branch Manager, you are accepting that the Banks have authority to issue such instructions.  Now, this may be harmless (it is harmful to those who are away from the place for months/years together).  But tomorrow, with some reason they may say that you need to come personally every month.  Then you have to follow.  Do not allow any inclusion of any such 'rights' for the Management.  In the long run it is dangerous. Please give me list of Banks, which is prepared to pay Rs.10/- over and above what is provided in Pension Regulations.  Managements does not unfettered right to meddle in our 'Pension Regulations'. >   Please do not compare Bank Pensioner with Govt Pensioners'.  I > >>  have already explained the significance of 'Life Certificate' for Govt Pensioners.    > >> > >> Please tell me whether account holder needs to give 'Life Certificate' once in an year in following cases :

> >> > >> a. A depositor, who has deposits exceeding Rs.One Crore and interest is credited to the account, which is not withdrawn frequently or otherwise ; > >> > >> b. Rent/Dividend Warrents/Commissions credited to account of a customer regularly for years. But, customer does not visit the branch or sent any of his representative for years. > >> > >> c. Cheques of the customer is presented, regularly and many of which are returned unpaid. > >> > >> Now, on the contrary, if in some banks, like ours, what should bank do in following cases : > >>

> >> a. Rs.15,000/- drawn for 'Funeral Expences' under 'Shradanjali Scheme' >  ;

> >> b. Pensioner has visited Branch for various reasons, like taking cheque book, remitting cash/cheque, etc. > >> d. He has taken loan and money is being remitted promptly. > >> > >> Compare, these to situations and decide what we need to do. > >> > >> BUT PLEASE DO NOT CREATE PRECEDENCE FOR THE MANAGEMENT.  THEY HAVE MEANS TO KNOW AS TO LIFE OF PENSIONERS.  YOU NEED NOT HELP THEM, BUT THIS CAN HARM YOU AT A LATER DATE.  MERE SUBMISSION OF LIFE CERTIFICATE DOES NOT STOP UNSCRUPULOUS ELEMENTS FROM DEFRAUDING THE BANK.   > >>   > >> Thanks, a Million. > >> > >> With regards, > >> Prasad C N > >> > > >> ----- Forwarded Message ----- > >> From: Prasad C N <cn_prasa...@yahoo.com> > >> To: "bankpe...@googlegroups.com" <bankpe...@googlegroups.com> > >> Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 8:25 PM > >> Subject: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS > >> > >> Dear Mr.Mohandas Rao, > >> > >> You are aware that from our Organisation, we have protested obtaining Life Certificate from our Bank pensioners, for the following reasons : > >>

> >> a. Most of our Pensioners, including family pensioners (from this year) have applied for Reimbursement of Diagnostic Charges and such applications are countersigned by Bank's official. Subsequently, amount has also been credited to Pensioners' Accounts.  For a Pensioner, every Department of the Bank is a Bank.  Therefore, where is the necessity of giving Life Certificate again, which involves

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[VeeraswamiV]

Sir,
It is not necessary to transfer the pension account, I think, I feel we can get the life certificate signed by an officer from the arrest branch and send the certificate to pension paying branch,
Ifeel there are provisions for those bed ridden pensioners a separate system.
Pl verify

Veeraswami. V
Sent from my iPad

[Chinnagourishankar]

Instead of asking pensioners not to submit the life certificate,it will be better to take up the matter with the authorities concern I.e. I B A or banks to get the practice of submission of L.C. Discontinued/ withdrawn by the leaders concerned.
Gourishankar Shankar united bank VRS 2001

Sent from my iPad

[Mohan badi]

Dear Bashaji,

I thank you very much for your valuable advise, and I need to ask you plenty of queries with me , Just to develop my knowledge and pass on to my MBA students , that of HR streams. Hope and request to cooperate me  time to time. Remaining   highly indebted.. With regards.Kindly give me your contact no. if you don't mind.

Prof.M.R.Badi
Bangalore.
09902910900

---

From: bass <basha...@rediffmail.com>
To: bankpensioner <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2011 9:57 PM

> I am not differeing with your views. However, I find a valid reason for Mr.Prasad's argument. Kindly refer to the proceedings of Argument in Pradeepkumar's case on 11/10/11. It must be an eye-opener to all as to how an inocuous, formal and routine undertaking given by Pradeep for getting arrears of pension on a/c of restoration at par with 1684 points has been mischieously interpreted by the Bank to suit its own purpose. That is the reason why Prasad feels that in the abscence of requirement of LC, voluntarily giving such thing (though appears to be harmless at present) should not give the managements a handle to beat us at the most unexpected time.

> Unfortunately, many people miss the well intended meaning of his point.
> M.Perumal
>  
>  
>
> From: sureshbhat M &lt;sureshbh...@gmail.com&gt;
> To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 12 October 2011 11:24 AM
> Subject: Re: bankpensioner Re: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
>
> Dear Sirs            12/10/2011
>
>        reg Life certificate submission we read different versions. But strongly believe that submission of life certificate once in a year as applicable to all non banking pensioners in not a mistake. As far as future claims by Banks , we can protest in case it is in voilation of present pension rules.
>

>      Regarding safeguarding one's interest, we need to keep the interest of our brother n working in banks.  

> &gt;&gt; I am more concerned about bringing in directions/rules which are not part of statutory regulations. Please remember that the 5 Years case and 50% cases are being won because the Bank did not follow Pension Regulations.  But, the moment you hand over Life Certificate to the Branch Manager, you are accepting that the Banks have authority to issue such instructions.  Now, this may be harmless (it is harmful to those who are away from the place for months/years together).  But tomorrow, with some reason they may say that you need to come personally every month.  Then you have to follow.  Do not allow any inclusion of any such 'rights' for the Management.  In the long run it is dangerous. Please give me list of Banks, which is prepared to pay Rs.10/- over and above what is provided in Pension Regulations.  Managements does not unfettered right to meddle in our 'Pension Regulations'.
>   Please do not compare Bank Pensioner with Govt Pensioners'.  I
> &gt;&gt;  have already explained the significance of 'Life Certificate' for Govt Pensioners.   
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Please tell me whether account holder needs to give 'Life Certificate' once in an year in following cases :

> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; a. A depositor, who has deposits exceeding Rs.One Crore and interest is credited to the account, which is not withdrawn frequently or otherwise ;
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; b. Rent/Dividend Warrents/Commissions credited to account of a customer regularly for years. But, customer does not visit the branch or sent any of his representative for years.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; c. Cheques of the customer is presented, regularly and many of which are returned unpaid.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Now, on the contrary, if in some banks, like ours, what should bank do in following cases :
> &gt;&gt;

> &gt;&gt; a. Rs.15,000/- drawn for 'Funeral Expences' under 'Shradanjali Scheme'
>  ;

> &gt;&gt; b. Pensioner has visited Branch for various reasons, like taking cheque book, remitting cash/cheque, etc.
> &gt;&gt; d. He has taken loan and money is being remitted promptly.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Compare, these to situations and decide what we need to do.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; BUT PLEASE DO NOT CREATE PRECEDENCE FOR THE MANAGEMENT.  THEY HAVE MEANS TO KNOW AS TO LIFE OF PENSIONERS.  YOU NEED NOT HELP THEM, BUT THIS CAN HARM YOU AT A LATER DATE.  MERE SUBMISSION OF LIFE CERTIFICATE DOES NOT STOP UNSCRUPULOUS ELEMENTS FROM DEFRAUDING THE BANK.  
> &gt;&gt;  
> &gt;&gt; Thanks, a Million.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; With regards,
> &gt;&gt; Prasad C N
> &gt;&gt;
>
> &gt;&gt; ----- Forwarded Message -----
> &gt;&gt; From: Prasad C N &lt;cn_prasa...@yahoo.com&gt;
> &gt;&gt; To: &quot;bankpe...@googlegroups.com&quot; &lt;bankpe...@googlegroups.com&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 8:25 PM
> &gt;&gt; Subject: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Dear Mr.Mohandas Rao,
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; You are aware that from our Organisation, we have protested obtaining Life Certificate from our Bank pensioners, for the following reasons :
> &gt;&gt;

> &gt;&gt; a. Most of our Pensioners, including family pensioners (from this year) have applied for Reimbursement of Diagnostic Charges and such applications are countersigned by Bank's official. Subsequently, amount has also been credited to Pensioners' Accounts.  For a Pensioner, every Department of the Bank is a Bank.  Therefore, where is the necessity of giving Life Certificate again, which involves

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[lakshmanan shankarnaraynan]

Dear Friends,

 

I think it is possible to submit the LC to the nearest branch of the concerned Bank for onward transmission to the disbursing branch if the pensioner is on a short/long visit elsewhere. If need be the pensioner can enclose a copy of his PPO.

 

S.Lakshmanan

From: bass <basha...@rediffmail.com>
To: bankpensioner <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>

> I am not differeing with your views. However, I find a valid reason for Mr.Prasad's argument. Kindly refer to the proceedings of Argument in Pradeepkumar's case on 11/10/11. It must be an eye-opener to all as to how an inocuous, formal and routine undertaking given by Pradeep for getting arrears of pension on a/c of restoration at par with 1684 points has been mischieously interpreted by the Bank to suit its own purpose. That is the reason why Prasad feels that in the abscence of requirement of LC, voluntarily giving such thing (though appears to be harmless at present) should not give the managements a handle to beat us at the most unexpected time.

> Unfortunately, many people miss the well intended meaning of his point.
> M.Perumal
>  
>  
>
> From: sureshbhat M &lt;sureshbh...@gmail.com&gt;
> To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 12 October 2011 11:24 AM
> Subject: Re: bankpensioner Re: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
>
> Dear Sirs            12/10/2011
>
>        reg Life certificate submission we read different versions. But strongly believe that submission of life certificate once in a year as applicable to all non banking pensioners in not a mistake. As far as future claims by Banks , we can protest in case it is in voilation of present pension rules.
>

>      Regarding safeguarding one's interest, we need to keep the interest of our brother n working in banks.  

> &gt;&gt; I am more concerned about bringing in directions/rules which are not part of statutory regulations. Please remember that the 5 Years case and 50% cases are being won because the Bank did not follow Pension Regulations.  But, the moment you hand over Life Certificate to the Branch Manager, you are accepting that the Banks have authority to issue such instructions.  Now, this may be harmless (it is harmful to those who are away from the place for months/years together).  But tomorrow, with some reason they may say that you need to come personally every month.  Then you have to follow.  Do not allow any inclusion of any such 'rights' for the Management.  In the long run it is dangerous. Please give me list of Banks, which is prepared to pay Rs.10/- over and above what is provided in Pension Regulations.  Managements does not unfettered right to meddle in our 'Pension Regulations'.
>   Please do not compare Bank Pensioner with Govt Pensioners'.  I
> &gt;&gt;  have already explained the significance of 'Life Certificate' for Govt Pensioners.   
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Please tell me whether account holder needs to give 'Life Certificate' once in an year in following cases :

> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; a. A depositor, who has deposits exceeding Rs.One Crore and interest is credited to the account, which is not withdrawn frequently or otherwise ;
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; b. Rent/Dividend Warrents/Commissions credited to account of a customer regularly for years. But, customer does not visit the branch or sent any of his representative for years.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; c. Cheques of the customer is presented, regularly and many of which are returned unpaid.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Now, on the contrary, if in some banks, like ours, what should bank do in following cases :
> &gt;&gt;

> &gt;&gt; a. Rs.15,000/- drawn for 'Funeral Expences' under 'Shradanjali Scheme'
>  ;

> &gt;&gt; b. Pensioner has visited Branch for various reasons, like taking cheque book, remitting cash/cheque, etc.
> &gt;&gt; d. He has taken loan and money is being remitted promptly.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Compare, these to situations and decide what we need to do.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; BUT PLEASE DO NOT CREATE PRECEDENCE FOR THE MANAGEMENT.  THEY HAVE MEANS TO KNOW AS TO LIFE OF PENSIONERS.  YOU NEED NOT HELP THEM, BUT THIS CAN HARM YOU AT A LATER DATE.  MERE SUBMISSION OF LIFE CERTIFICATE DOES NOT STOP UNSCRUPULOUS ELEMENTS FROM DEFRAUDING THE BANK.  
> &gt;&gt;  
> &gt;&gt; Thanks, a Million.
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; With regards,
> &gt;&gt; Prasad C N
> &gt;&gt;
>
> &gt;&gt; ----- Forwarded Message -----
> &gt;&gt; From: Prasad C N &lt;cn_prasa...@yahoo.com&gt;
> &gt;&gt; To: &quot;bankpe...@googlegroups.com&quot; &lt;bankpe...@googlegroups.com&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Sent: Monday, 10 October 2011 8:25 PM
> &gt;&gt; Subject: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; Dear Mr.Mohandas Rao,
> &gt;&gt;
> &gt;&gt; You are aware that from our Organisation, we have protested obtaining Life Certificate from our Bank pensioners, for the following reasons :
> &gt;&gt;

> &gt;&gt; a. Most of our Pensioners, including family pensioners (from this year) have applied for Reimbursement of Diagnostic Charges and such applications are countersigned by Bank's official. Subsequently, amount has also been credited to Pensioners' Accounts.  For a Pensioner, every Department of the Bank is a Bank.  Therefore, where is the necessity of giving Life Certificate again, which involves

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[lakshmanan shankarnaraynan]

Dear Mr. Perumal,

 

The important issue is to how to make the submission hassle free for the pensioners. Like in your Bank,  all other banks can also advise their branches to accept the LCs for onward transmission to the pension disbursing branches. If need be they can obtain a copy of the PPO. This will help the pensioners who are on a temporary visit elsewhere. The Bank retirees' forum can also take up this issue with IBA for suitable advice to the member banks.

 

S.Lakshmanan

From: perumal maruthu <perumal...@yahoo.co.in>
To: "bankpe...@googlegroups.com" <bankpe...@googlegroups.com>

Cc: "banking...@yahoo.com" <banking...@yahoo.com>; "mohand...@gmail.com" <mohand...@gmail.com>; "vinod....@gmail.com" <vinod....@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2011 9:22 PM

[J SOMASEKARA]

Mr.Prasad
    Now we are all retired persons. Now we have certain freedom to think independently and sense that procedures like LC is wrong. However for officers in charge of pension matters in branches they cannot afford to take a different view other than what bank circular says. 

Canara Bank in its website has clearly informed its pensioners that LC and Marriage certificates has to be submitted during NOV 2011. It also warns that if certificates not submitted pension will be stopped. 

Bank also instructed its staff to obtain these certificates and send confirmation to Employees Pension Cell. So whatever may be the opinion of officer in charge in branch

he has to just obey the orders of HO. Pensioners also should follow the same if they want

to continue receiving pension.

Bank may stop pension as it has already informed pensioners.

So there is nothing an individual can do about it. Only pensioners associations/unions should take up the matter with management.

My wife is EPF pensioner drawing pension through Canara bank.Though she submits LC at branch it is not sent to Regional Provident Fund office promptly.So From February next pension stops and will be restored only from May. This is happening to many EPF pensioners since last 3 years.

So we cannot speak law to them. They only go by circulars.

Under no circumstances we can say that we do not submit LC.If they stop pension only two options left either submit LC or go to court.

Can Individual pensioner afford to do that?

[bass]

Dear Sir,

Before going to court for the reason of non payment of pension due to
non submission of life certificate, the concerned pensioner has to
think twice.

After all, it is a matter of common sense and the basic eligibility to
get continuation of pension, is nothing but life of the pensioner. How
can we argue or demand the employer to pay pension ignoring the fact
of live status of us ? What unions, associations and courts will do
in this matter ? It is our duty to prove ourselves that we are alive
and submit a certificate so as to get continuation of pension.

The modus operandi for this proof of life may be different depending
up on the circumstances like pensioner's physical presense before the
disbursing branch/head office/any of its branches if core banking
permits/telephonic conversation and sending confirmation subject to
the satisfaction of the employer/request to depute an official who can
certify the life, in case of bed-ridden or hospitalised etc. etc.,

The Branch Managers who worked in metros or at branches where the
number of pensioner accounts are in hundreds and thousands, might have
known very well about the practical difficulties in dealing with
pension payments and following the laid down rules and its
implications since decades.

I request all the respected pensioners to follow the existing simple
and minimum guidelines given by the respective banks and live
peacefully without expecting unnecessary and undue future
complications.

With regards
S.M.BASHA

> On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 9:57 PM, SBMPC Blore <sbmpension...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
> > Dear Mr.Perumalji,
>
> > Most our friends are still do not understand the meaning of my opinion.
>
> > In our Bank, the stand of the Bank in regard to 5 years case is that they
> > have informed those who opted to retire under VRS that they are not entitled
> > to the benefit of notional addition of five years of service.  Having
> > applied for VRS with full knowledge, they are estopped from claiming this
> > benefit.
>
> > I am worried that the Management might use same logic at a later date and
> > give example of Life Certificate and assert their right to tweak benefits
> > available under Pension Regulations.
>
> > I have seen that you have understood my line of thinking.  Now, by seeing
> > response of Mr.Pradeep Kumar in Supreme Court, I am feeling some amount of
> > uneasiness.
>
> > Thanking you,
>
> > With regards,
> > Prasad C N
>

> > On 12 October 2011 22:11, perumal maruthu <perumalmaru...@yahoo.co.in>wrote:
>
> >> Dear Sureshji,
> >> I am not differeing with your views. However, I find a valid reason for
> >> Mr.Prasad's argument. Kindly refer to the proceedings of Argument in
> >> Pradeepkumar's case on 11/10/11. It must be an eye-opener to all as to how
> >> an inocuous, formal and routine undertaking given by Pradeep for getting
> >> arrears of pension on a/c of restoration at par with 1684 points has been
> >> mischieously interpreted by the Bank to suit its own purpose. That is the
> >> reason why Prasad feels that in the abscence of requirement of LC,
> >> voluntarily giving such thing (though appears to be harmless at present)
> >> should not give the managements a handle to beat us at the most unexpected
> >> time.
> >> Unfortunately, many people miss the well intended meaning of his point.
> >> M.Perumal
>

> >>   *From:* sureshbhat M <sureshbh...@gmail.com>
> >> *To:* bankpe...@googlegroups.com
> >> *Sent:* Wednesday, 12 October 2011 11:24 AM
> >> *Subject:* Re: bankpensioner Re: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

>
> >> Dear Sirs            12/10/2011
>
> >>        reg Life certificate submission we read different versions. But
> >> strongly believe that submission of life certificate once in a year as
> >> applicable to all non banking pensioners in not a mistake. As far as future
> >> claims by Banks , we can protest in case it is in voilation of present
> >> pension rules.
>
> >>      Regarding safeguarding one's interest, we need to keep the interest
> >> of our brother n working in banks.
>
> >>      It is common that the giver needs to take more care.  For loan papers
> >> Banks take 100+ signatures even for 5000 loan; whereas for our term
> >> deposits(even in lakhs) they take just   While crediting pension
>

> ...
>
> read more »

[ravi jain]

sir,

a good discussion on the matter is healthy but what is their in life cerificate which bank branch is to certify themselves and not  taking any sign from us. so when we use to go to meet our freinds/withdraw pensions in banks they will themselves put the certificate in files and for those persons which dont know any one in branch may give his identity and everyone will help you as ex-bankers. even if pension get stopped due to it , nothing to worry, go and meet branch officials and they will maximum take  a simple application from you and pension will restart.

be happy

ravi jain (PSB) 

[njayabalan]

[Rao Nallapaneni]

Hi,

The other alternative is to fight in court of law against the Bank by those whose pension was stopped for non-submission of LC.

Can we have the luxury of waiting to receive monthly pension without LC through Court verdict.

It may be prudent to live with simple hurdles which can be easily cross by individuals, while Associations / Federations can fight for establsihing law related to submission of LC by pensioners and streamline for future convenience.

Regards, Rao

Best Regards,
Rao

[ravi jain]

sir,

what will be fate of persons who have gone abroad. in my knowledge they can submit their life certificate from foreign country by getting it attested from notary. so what is problem for permanent residents of india.

be happy

ravi jain (PSB)

[Ramesh Pandey]

IS IT WORTH SUCH SERIOUS AND  UNENDING  DISCUSSION?????  ITS A NON-ISSUE....

CAPT PANDEY

---

Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 12:08:06 +0530

Subject: Re: bankpensioner Re: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

From: ravij...@gmail.com
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com

[Chandrashekar Belsare]

Dear all,
Discussion on the subject "Life Certificate for pensioners"  is stopped hereafter. It is unnecessarily increasing email messages. Already more than 65 messages are received on this subject. This is enough for the simple yearly activity of submitting life certificate. All  group members are requested not to post further messages on "Life certificate".  However members with genuine queries regarding Life certificate can post the messages.

Moderator

[crajagopalan]

Dear Sir,

                          You are perfectly right in putting an end to the life certificate business. After all it is a small matter compared to the larger issues confronting the retired people today. The certificate in our bank runs like this   “ I have seen the pensioner------------------ “ and there is no provision for taking the signature of the pensioner. Simply present yourself before any of the officer of the Bank nearest to you with your identity card and he will be able to give a certificate which can be forwarded to the pension paying branch.

C Rajagopalan

Syndicate bank pensioner

 

From: bankpe...@googlegroups.com [mailto:bankpe...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Chandrashekar Belsare
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 1:51 PM
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: bankpensioner Re: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

 

Dear all,

Discussion on the subject "Life Certificate for pensioners"  is stopped hereafter. It is unnecessarily increasing email messages. Already more than 65 messages are received on this subject. This is enough for the simple yearly activity of submitting life certificate. All  group members are requested not to post further messages on "Life certificate".  However members with genuine queries regarding Life certificate can post the messages.

Moderator

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[Narayana Melkote]

Sir,

This information is for the kind attention of those pensioners living/staying overseas.   They have to approach the office of Indian Embassy/Consulate along with the passport.   At the Embassy office you are issued with an application to be filled and signed and to be submitted then and there(please also carry a copy of your passport photo).   The same evening you are issued a life certificate signed by the consul.   The certificate is to be mailed to the pension paying branch.   An email can also be sent to the branch confirming obtaining the certificate and mailing it.

Narayana Melkote

---

From: ravi jain <ravij...@gmail.com>
To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Friday, 14 October 2011 5:38 PM

[satyendra kumar bansal]

Sir,

Thanks for intervening, as it was unneccessarily using the space in the blog.

Regards.

Satyendra Kumar Bansal,
77,Vivek Vihar,
New Sanganer Road, Sodala,
Jaipur-302019

Mobile: +919413971245

Life is uncertain, Start savings

---

Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2011 01:21:08 -0700
From: crbe...@gmail.com

To: bankpe...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: bankpensioner Re: LIFE CERTIFICATE FOR BANK PENSIONERS

Dear all,
Discussion on the subject "Life Certificate for pensioners"  is stopped hereafter. It is unnecessarily increasing email messages. Already more than 65 messages are received on this subject. This is enough for the simple yearly activity of submitting life certificate. All  group members are requested not to post further messages on "Life certificate".  However members with genuine queries regarding Life certificate can post the messages.

Moderator

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