Nandi Hill analysis
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Mark D. Anderson
Jan 11, 2015, 11:33:33 AM1/11/15
to Bangalore Bikers Club
It is somewhat embarrassing, but even after living in Mysore for a year, I never rode Nandi HIll til
yesterday. I must have ridden Chamundi Hill a hundred times. But various circumstances foiled
multiple times I almost went to Nandi.
Anyhow, having ridden it, I must say I like the climb a lot. Not overly technical, good tree shade,
good road quality, not too much traffic, and not too long.
I decided to do some analysis of the climb.
It is 7.4km with 404m of climbing (4.6 miles, 1326ft), with an average grade of 5%,
at least for "Nandi Climb (proper)" on Strava:
http://www.strava.com/segments/8257421?filter=overall
Here is how I would classify various ride times. Note that bike geeks will know that VAM
increases with grade for the same w/kg, so the fact that much of Nandi is shallow penalizes
VAM calculations. For more than you want to know, see this article by my long-time
friend Dan Connelly:
http://djconnel.blogspot.in/2009/07/effect-of-vam-on-road-grade.html
So the watts/kg estimates here are just estimates, and I'm taking
Gradient factor = 2 + (% grade / 10) = 2.5
so that w/kg = VAM / 250
29min (VAM=830, w/kg=3.2) - fit recreational rider
(What I just did yesterday, on a borrowed bike, out of shape, sneezing gobs of
"chip sauce" out of my nose every mile.)
27min (VAM=900, w/kg=3.6) - club rider (or out-of-shape ex-racer, or first time racer (USA "cat 5"))
(What I could probably do right now, in my current shape, but on my own bike
and without a cold)
24min (VAM=1000, w/kg=4.0) - entry-level amateur racer (USA "cat 4")
(What I could have done in 2013, before my health issues in 2014 - still not "race fit".
This is the about the best you can probably get being a "weekend warrior", with only
training on weekends.)
22min (VAM=1100, w/kg=4.4) - mid-level amateur racer (USA "cat 3")
(To get to this level requires disciplined and scientific training, and riding nearly every
day. I might try to get to this level again in 2015, life permitting.)
20min (VAM=1210, w/kg=4.85) - high-level amateur racer (USA "cat 2")
(I could probably never do this no matter how hard I trained - I would have to lose a lot
of lean muscle mass which I don't want to do. In general, this is around the level where hard
work alone is not enough, and genetics/age limitations kick in.)
18min (VAM=1350, w/kg=5.4) - top amateur racers, and pros who aren't great climbers (sprinters, classics riders)
(Yes, there really are a lot of amateurs who can do this. In the San Francisco area, I regularly
get passed by top amateurs who can do 30kph up climbs like this. These guys aren't doping either.)
16min (VAM=1515, w/kg=6) - pro stage race specialists
(At this point, wind resistance becomes an issue, so let's assume drafting a domestique.)
14min (VAM=1730, w/kg=6.9) - world record level, probably with PEDs
(I don't honestly know if anyone could do this without doping, but maybe it is.)
The above is for a man aged 18-50, rested (not after a week of 100+ mile races), going for a PR.
For women, add 10% to the times (and therefor lower 10% from VAM and w/kg) in the above.
-mda
yesterday. I must have ridden Chamundi Hill a hundred times. But various circumstances foiled
multiple times I almost went to Nandi.
Anyhow, having ridden it, I must say I like the climb a lot. Not overly technical, good tree shade,
good road quality, not too much traffic, and not too long.
I decided to do some analysis of the climb.
It is 7.4km with 404m of climbing (4.6 miles, 1326ft), with an average grade of 5%,
at least for "Nandi Climb (proper)" on Strava:
http://www.strava.com/segments/8257421?filter=overall
Here is how I would classify various ride times. Note that bike geeks will know that VAM
increases with grade for the same w/kg, so the fact that much of Nandi is shallow penalizes
VAM calculations. For more than you want to know, see this article by my long-time
friend Dan Connelly:
http://djconnel.blogspot.in/2009/07/effect-of-vam-on-road-grade.html
So the watts/kg estimates here are just estimates, and I'm taking
Gradient factor = 2 + (% grade / 10) = 2.5
so that w/kg = VAM / 250
29min (VAM=830, w/kg=3.2) - fit recreational rider
(What I just did yesterday, on a borrowed bike, out of shape, sneezing gobs of
"chip sauce" out of my nose every mile.)
27min (VAM=900, w/kg=3.6) - club rider (or out-of-shape ex-racer, or first time racer (USA "cat 5"))
(What I could probably do right now, in my current shape, but on my own bike
and without a cold)
24min (VAM=1000, w/kg=4.0) - entry-level amateur racer (USA "cat 4")
(What I could have done in 2013, before my health issues in 2014 - still not "race fit".
This is the about the best you can probably get being a "weekend warrior", with only
training on weekends.)
22min (VAM=1100, w/kg=4.4) - mid-level amateur racer (USA "cat 3")
(To get to this level requires disciplined and scientific training, and riding nearly every
day. I might try to get to this level again in 2015, life permitting.)
20min (VAM=1210, w/kg=4.85) - high-level amateur racer (USA "cat 2")
(I could probably never do this no matter how hard I trained - I would have to lose a lot
of lean muscle mass which I don't want to do. In general, this is around the level where hard
work alone is not enough, and genetics/age limitations kick in.)
18min (VAM=1350, w/kg=5.4) - top amateur racers, and pros who aren't great climbers (sprinters, classics riders)
(Yes, there really are a lot of amateurs who can do this. In the San Francisco area, I regularly
get passed by top amateurs who can do 30kph up climbs like this. These guys aren't doping either.)
16min (VAM=1515, w/kg=6) - pro stage race specialists
(At this point, wind resistance becomes an issue, so let's assume drafting a domestique.)
14min (VAM=1730, w/kg=6.9) - world record level, probably with PEDs
(I don't honestly know if anyone could do this without doping, but maybe it is.)
The above is for a man aged 18-50, rested (not after a week of 100+ mile races), going for a PR.
For women, add 10% to the times (and therefor lower 10% from VAM and w/kg) in the above.
-mda
Opendro
Jan 12, 2015, 2:11:09 AM1/12/15
to bangalor...@googlegroups.com
That is a very interesting way to measure and rate climbs/riders. http://djconnel.blogspot.in/2009/07/effect-of-vam-on-road-grade.html
is a lot of formulas there!
You probably forgot to include others who do in 40 mins, 39 mins, etc. etc. :)
You probably forgot to include others who do in 40 mins, 39 mins, etc. etc. :)
Anil Kadsur
Jan 12, 2015, 3:45:26 AM1/12/15
to Opendro, Sharath Chandar
Mark,
That is awesome of peace of information for someone like me who do not understand too much technical things....thank you for this mail, one of the best mail in the forum in recent times "where we all lost in that alkaline theory and I am right philosophy"
thank you once again.
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