Cadence training

[Prashanth Chengi]

Hi guys,

I'm a guy who commutes to work on a bike right through the year and does some longer rides on weekends. I did the Vätternrundan, a 300 km ride (http://vatternrundan.se) earlier this year and managed it while averaging 24.3 kmph. I'd like to train to be able to ride faster, my target average being closer to 30 kmph. I recently purchased a cadence sensor to allow me to see what rpms I was doing.  

I see that I tend to stick to the 70-75 rpm range on possibly the hardest gears.  When I try dropping a gear, I indeed get more rpm, but seem to think that I'm not really being efficient (a mental thing, I guess).  When I ride with my colleague who is a lot faster than I am, I see that he has a cadence which is far higher than mine. When I drop the gear and go for higher cadences, I also drop out on the speed and I really can't seem to push myself to higher cadences on the toughest gears. 

Training videos and material on the internet suggests that higher cadences are the key, so how should I train to be able to hit the higher cadences consistently? 

Should I try the hardest gear on which I can get close to 90 rpm and try pushing to get 90 and then when I do that, start training with a harder gear? Or is there any other better way?

Thanks,

Prashanth.

[Opendro]

I have never measured my cadence though I assume that it would be at about 100. That is what my friends tell when I pedal in sync with them and they had cadence meter.

Here is my armchair theory on it. The key to high cadence is a smooth pedaling stroke and choosing a gear just right for that. By smooth stroke, I meant, your foot should tend to rotate round - apply the forces more tangential to the crank arm and the other leg in the return stroke should perfectly sync with the down stroke leg. If your pedaling force is hard downward all the time, you will tend to ride in bigger ring and cadence will be usually low.

I don't know how else I can explain. I happened to have this cadence naturally. Apparently I also run around that many steps per minute, i.e. about 90 steps for each leg or 180 steps together for both legs per minute. So, you might want to try running and see if you are struggling around that number of steps. If so, it could be some restriction in your hip flexor functioning.... not sure.

[Prashanth Chengi]

Hmmmm
I think my problem is the hard downwards stroke. In fact, I just might be using only one for at a time, pushing straight down. I'll have to try to consciously correct it till I get used to it and do it automatically.  Thanks for the insight. Also, I think my saddle height is not optimal. People say that it shouldn't be so high that the knee straightens all the way, but is there any better formula?

/Prashanth

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[suman paul]

Bike - fit

thank you & regards

suman  

+91      9886300685

[Prashanth Chengi]

Thanks Opendro and Suman.  I'm now running higher gears and bumping up the cadence. I'm now reaching speeds of 26-30 kmph at 90-105 RPM at far lesser effort levels than earlier, when I'd do the same speed at 65-75 RPM with far greater effort levels.

/PC

[M S Sriram]

Prashanth I guess you mean now you're running "lower" gears which leads to increased cadence..

[Shyam Sundar S Iyer]

Thanks Opendro....I am also open to your advise.

 

Smooth pedalling stroke and tangential to crank arm....I need some personal help and feel for this....Can you help me?

 

I believe the two terms are key...the TRIGGER to high Cadence....

 

can you help me kick the old habit and put me on the correct practice?

 

Thanks

[Opendro]

Even if I had known everything well, I would still be a very bad coach, because I take so many things for granted. Having said that, I would be happy to see how you do and comment on what is wrong when we meet on a ride. However, note that I'm not a strong rider compared to many in this community. But I believe that I'm efficient and am commenting based on this notion :)

For tangential pedaling, focus on pedal positions from 1 O'clock till 6 O'clock, which is the downward stroke. The force should be more or less circular instead of too much downward. Force will of course be weak beyond 4 O'clock, which is okay instead of pounding downward which will simply burn the muscles without translating into forward motion.

As Prashanth mentioned, seat height is also an important factor to smooth pedaling. Too high or too low seats will make the legs uncomfortable following the circular pedal motion in perfect smooth stroke. You have to find the correct height yourself depending on how your muscles feel.

[Shyam Sundar S Iyer]

looking forward to show you my ride in person....

 

I am a very very bad example for pedalling....I am a masher...no no..a Smasher.....

 

I have very ugly strokes and legs moving all over...to transmit all the power all the time and all the place...

 

I take you for my first Spin doctor...ha ha

[Prashanth Chengi]

Being a masher is exactly what I'm trying to cure myself of.  Higher torque with lower revs doesn't sound bad at all, but it certainly keeps one from higher average speeds is what I feel.

/PC

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[Shyam Sundar S Iyer]

Exactly.....I dont know what to do...or say it otherwise...do whatever to get higher averages

[Prashanth Chengi]

I think  a common feature amongst mashers is a tendency to have a marked dislike for higher cadence.  After installing a cadence sensor, I was observing my gear shifting and overall RPM preference and I could see that I was shifting to smaller cogs on the rear (higher? Lower?) right after I passed 70 RPM. I found myself often riding the hardest gear between the 65-75 RPM range.  Over the past couple of days, I've been trying two things: a conscious attempt for the tangential stroke and using larger cogs on the rear. I'm now getting more and more comfortable riding at the 90-105 RPM range. The next step would be to try going to even smaller cogs while keeping the cadence up there. That would of course require getting fitter, but I hope to get there with time and practice.

/PC

On Tue, Aug 26, 2014 at 9:17 AM, Shyam Sundar S Iyer <shyamsu...@gmail.com> wrote:

Exactly.....I dont know what to do...or say it otherwise...do whatever to get higher averages

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[Opendro]

Just to add one more thing that most people might already know: irrespective of the state of fitness (leg muscle strength), the optimum cadence is constant. This indirectly means that if you are fitter/stronger, you will still ride at the same cadence, but at higher gear (bigger crank in front or smaller cog in the rear), thereby translating to higher speed. Conversely, if you are less fit, ride with the same cadence, with lower gear.

Bottom line is that always maintain the optimum cadence irrespective of speed and fitness. The only exception might be if you are running out of gear. For instance, you are climbing a mountain and you are already in gear 1x1 with cadence at mere 60. You cannot further shift down the gear. Nor can you increase the cadence as legs are not capable of it. That was just an example.