Dog Bited me today

[Happy James]

Hi Friends,

 

As a part of my fitness programme, I ride cycle daily in the morning for 4 kms and run for 8 to 10 kms from past 27 days.

 

Today morining, as usual i woke up by 6:00 a.m and finished all my daily activites I took my cylcle outside and started pedalling, Once i crossed the road a dog barked at me.

 

You know, i have read lots of theories about how to escape from the dog bite in this group.

 

I had read in the group "when dog barks you dont even see at it and be patient , I followed this theory  many times previously and i was safe (Thoght this is similar to ghandhijis non violence theory).

 

But today unfortunately  

 

today A  " Dog barked at me from 100 meters distance" I did not even see at it,

 

It came near me in fraction of minute and started to bark at me, " I followed the same theory" - Did not see at it.

 

Finally it came near me in a second and i became an victim, it bited me, and started to stare at me .

 

 to prevent further biting and injuries, I got down from the bike and shouted loudly "aeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy", the dog  went back and stood still and later went away.

 

But the damage was done, I saw my leg;5 inces above the ankle for any injuries but there was only few scratches. I was specifically  seeing for any blood stains or blood oozing from any of the marks.

 

But to my luck there was no blood stains or blood oozing out from the marks, I thought I am safe and nothing to worry  about this dog bit as it is only scratches.

 

I came back to home. Started the first aid.

 

I washed the wound with flowing water for 5 minutes and applied Detol on the scratches.

 

 Suddenly I was able to see very, very small amout of blood coming out of the dog bite scratch.

 

The size of the place where i found the  blood stains is equal to ".",  i.e  you can compare the size of the blood stain to the  size of  a Ball point Nib of the refill.

 

I dont know weather take injection or not, little confused. Will see the doctor today anyway.

 

Friends my request to all of you, be careful with the dogs. None of the theories are effective in handling dogs to escape from its bite.

 

Ride safely, Bye! take care and have a nice day.

 

Regards

Mahesh Mohan Kumar

 

 

 

 

 

[Abhishek Mishra]

Go kill that dog!

The first measure of a dog bite is to wash it with water and dettol. Do go to the doctor for other treatment.
I know those methods of ignoring and stuff are ineffective. One of the options is to get away from the scene as quick as possible on your cycle, but that will probably provoke it.The best defense,when they are just a biting distance away, is to kick them on the head with your leg or use a stick,stone or belt or your long cycle lock. Once you hit them they would'nt dare to come close. Be careful of you do end up hitting them. Biscuit feeding and ignoring does not always work.

I think there is some place where we can report these dog bite incidents. Maybe soneone here knows.

--
biking conversations on the world famous "Bangalore Bikers Club" :)
 
are you a part of the bicycle racing scene?
Visit www.bangalorebicyclechampionships.com for more details

[Basker Ramachandran]

Sorry to hear about the incident Mahesh.. Thoroughly washing the area with Dettol / Savlon is necessary and please do consult a doc. Yes, reporting the incident is important..

Take care and get well !!
Basker
(Basker Ramachandran)
rba...@gmail.com,
+91 9945602485

 

 

 

 

 

--

[arv...@neuro-spine.com]

If you have been bitten you need to be vaccinated immediately.

Rabies is a fatal illness. Nothing can save you if you get it. Vaccination is your only hope.

Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel

---

From: Basker Ramachandran <rba...@gmail.com>

Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com

Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2012 09:17:10 +0530

To: Happy James<mahesh....@gmail.com>

Cc: Bangalore Bikers Club<bangalor...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: Re: [BBC] Dog Bited me today

[Sameer Shisodia]

NOT "today, anyway" Go right now - this qualifies as an emergency.

On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 8:40 AM, Happy James <mahesh....@gmail.com> wrote:
>

> I dont know weather take injection or not, little confused. Will see the
> doctor today anyway.
>

Sameer Shisodia, Bangalore
http://linger.in

[justin joseph]

Sorry to hear this.  Pathetic situation where people here advertise that dogs wont bite.  A dog will bite.  Those here who advertised the dog not biting theory,  have to quit spreading nonsense. 

And you need to start on the anti rabies vaccine.  Take care.

--

[vijay _ A]

Just for Everyone's benefit, I am attaching First aid booklet for all kinds of bites and other injuries that you may sustain during cycling or generally even. Hope this will be useful to others- This booklet is taken out from Regional Labour Institute of Chennai website. 

Have a good day

Regards

Vijay 

 

 

 

 

 

--

biking conversations on the world famous "Bangalore Bikers Club" :)
 
are you a part of the bicycle racing scene?
Visit www.bangalorebicyclechampionships.com for more details

--

with regards
Vijay

"Stress is better than Frustration..!!"

[Shankar Shastry]

I'd say get vaccinated immediately and kill that damn dog. Get treated soon.

[Sameer Shisodia]

Well - along the same lines, men will kill, rob,
// not enough reason to not take precautions/actions against either -
but sweeping statements are just that and grate
// I've had my fair share of run-ins with strays as well, and do NOT
own a dog. But fair's fair.

On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 9:44 AM, justin joseph <justinj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Sorry to hear this.  Pathetic situation where people here advertise that
> dogs wont bite.  A dog will bite.  Those here who advertised the dog not
> biting theory,  have to quit spreading nonsense.
>

--

[arv...@neuro-spine.com]

You need Rabipur vaccine immediately.

You will need 5 maybe 6 doses spread over a period of 28 days.

ASAP

Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel

---

From: vijay _ A <vijhe...@gmail.com>

Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com

Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2012 09:47:05 +0530

To: Happy James<mahesh....@gmail.com>

Cc: Bangalore Bikers Club<bangalor...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: Re: [BBC] Dog Bited me today

[anilk...@gmail.com]

Very sad....please consult the doctor immediately....tc

Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

---

From: Happy James <mahesh....@gmail.com>

Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com

Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2012 08:40:41 +0530

To: Bangalore Bikers Club<bangalor...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: [BBC] Dog Bited me today

--

[Rajanikanth Puttabuddi]

Mahesh,

Sorry to hear this and hope you have listened to what doctors on this forum have said. Vaccination is important.
Did you stop riding when you heard the barking sound for the 1st time ? The chasing and biting comes after the barking and
in case you don't stop your bike. Please stop and get down to remove your helmet ( this is what angers them as far as i know ) and walk slowly.

rk

[deepakvrao]

I think he should adequately 'educate' himself about the vaccine, read
all about the ingredients, and maybe have a consultation with the
'other side', and then form an opinion as to whether he should take
the immunization. LOL.

Do you know what Rabipur contains?

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150875521197989&set=a.10150455123022989.363454.287991907988&type=1&theater

On Jun 5, 9:30 am, arv...@neuro-spine.com wrote:
> You need Rabipur vaccine immediately.
>
> You will need 5 maybe 6 doses spread over a period of 28 days.
>
> ASAP
> Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: vijay _ A <vijhere2...@gmail.com>
>
> Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com
> Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2012 09:47:05

> To: Happy James<mahesh.m.ku...@gmail.com>

> Cc: Bangalore Bikers Club<bangalor...@googlegroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [BBC] Dog Bited me today
>
> Just for Everyone's benefit, I am attaching First aid booklet for all kinds
> of bites and other injuries that you may sustain during cycling or
> generally even. Hope this will be useful to others- This booklet is taken
> out from Regional Labour Institute of Chennai website.
>
> Have a good day
>
> Regards
>
> Vijay
>

> > * Suddenly I was able to see very, very small amout of blood coming out
> > of the dog bite scratch*.
>
> > The size of the place where i found the  blood stains is equal to "*.",*

> > i.e  you can compare the size of the blood stain to the  size of  a Ball
> > point Nib of the refill.
>
> > I dont know weather take injection or not, little confused. Will see the
> > doctor today anyway.
>
> > Friends my request to all of you, be careful with the dogs. None of the
> > theories are effective in handling dogs to escape from its bite.
>
> > Ride safely, Bye! take care and have a nice day.
>
> > Regards
> > Mahesh Mohan Kumar
>
> > --
> > biking conversations on the world famous "Bangalore Bikers Club" :)
>
> > are you a part of the bicycle racing scene?

> > Visitwww.bangalorebicyclechampionships.comfor more details
>
> --
> with regards
> *Vijay*
> *"Stress is better than Frustration..!!"*

[deepakvrao]

Mahesh,

Of course I was joking in above post. You DO need to take the vaccine.
All the best.

> * Suddenly I was able to see very, very small amout of blood coming out of
> the dog bite scratch*.
>
> The size of the place where i found the  blood stains is equal to "*.",*

[Chidambaran Subramanian]

Active ingredients:
• Not less than 2.5 International
Units of inactivated Rabies virus
(Flury LEP strain)
Other ingredients:
• Trometamol
• Sodium chloride
• Polygeline
• Sucrose
• Possible trace amounts:
neomycin, chlortetracycline,
amphotericin B,Monopotassium glutamate,Disodium edetate


The manufacture of this product
includes exposure to bovine derived
materials. No evidence exists that
any case of vCJD (considered to be
the human form of bovine
spongiform encephalitis) has resulted
from the administration of any
vaccine product.

[deepakvrao]

So, should he take the vaccine?

> >https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150875521197989&set=a.10150...

> >> > Visitwww.bangalorebicyclechampionships.comformore details

>
> >> --
> >> with regards
> >> *Vijay*
> >> *"Stress is better than Frustration..!!"*
>
> >> --
> >> biking conversations on the world famous "Bangalore Bikers Club" :)
>
> >> are you a part of the bicycle racing scene?

> >> Visitwww.bangalorebicyclechampionships.comformore details

[anilk...@gmail.com]

Lol....

Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

[Opendro]

As some people have already corrected, it is not your non-violence or
not seeing the dog, which prevents the attack. A few notable things
about dogs:

- dogs away from master's home don't attack people, not even bark.
- a lone dog on street (even an stray one) does not bark at people.
- dogs love chasing scared people. They are expert in sensing it. We
need to counter this by being expert in acting not-scared. Not sure if
they can hear the heart beat. But at least act the body language as if
not scared. This is very very important. The dogs in my layout bark
and even follow my wife and daughter while they walk without me. But
they would never bark when I walk with them or I walk alone.
- Dare to pause and "look back". Dogs in large number will obviously
get more confident. Calculate your own risk while daring them. When
you stop, they would stop. Now you move on. If they come following
again, just quickly sit down as if picking up a stone and act as
throwing something at it. It will run away. Or they will charge more
fiercely!
- Shouting back as you pause helps. They can sense your confidence
well.

Dogs (even upto 10 or 20) have never been a problem for me.

On Jun 5, 8:10 am, Happy James <mahesh.m.ku...@gmail.com> wrote:

> * Suddenly I was able to see very, very small amout of blood coming out of
> the dog bite scratch*.
>
> The size of the place where i found the  blood stains is equal to "*.",*

[Mayank Rungta]

I did like to know how bad it is not to take the shots. For the cat
scratches and smaller bites we have avoided but we know the cat has been
vaccinated. If not I don't know what kind of issues one has to face.
Kindly let know.

--
MAnY thANKs
http://ngopost.org
http://rideacycle.org
https://gist.com/mayank
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vConnect-Blr/
Small Loans, Big Impacts. Invest in www.rangde.org today!
For a greener Bangalore - http://tiny.cc/blrtreeplanting

--
http://mynk.posterous.com/please-support-my-tcs-10k-run-supporting-asso
o__
_> /__
(_) \(_)... Burn fat not fuel - Byke along to a healthier lyfe and cleaner world! :)
Join the club - http://bangalorebikersclub.com

On Tuesday 05 June 2012 03:55 PM, deepakvrao wrote:
> So, should he take the vaccine?
>
> On Jun 5, 3:00 pm, Chidambaran Subramanian<chi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Active ingredients:

>> � Not less than 2.5 International

>> Units of inactivated Rabies virus
>> (Flury LEP strain)
>> Other ingredients:

>> � Trometamol
>> � Sodium chloride
>> � Polygeline
>> � Sucrose
>> � Possible trace amounts:

>> neomycin, chlortetracycline,
>> amphotericin B,Monopotassium glutamate,Disodium edetate
>>
>> The manufacture of this product
>> includes exposure to bovine derived
>> materials. No evidence exists that
>> any case of vCJD (considered to be
>> the human form of bovine
>> spongiform encephalitis) has resulted
>> from the administration of any
>> vaccine product.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 2:56 PM, deepakvrao<deepakv...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> I think he should adequately 'educate' himself about the vaccine, read
>>> all about the ingredients, and maybe have a consultation with the
>>> 'other side', and then form an opinion as to whether he should take
>>> the immunization. LOL.
>>> Do you know what Rabipur contains?
>>> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150875521197989&set=a.10150...
>>> On Jun 5, 9:30 am, arv...@neuro-spine.com wrote:
>>>> You need Rabipur vaccine immediately.
>>>> You will need 5 maybe 6 doses spread over a period of 28 days.
>>>> ASAP

>>>> Sent from BlackBerry� on Airtel

[chethu gowda]

we are very sorry for ur ugly incident mahesh..

I agree with what rajanikanth said.. I have come across such situations many times while riding two wheelers.. though I have a ferocious German shepherd in my home I am very scared of street dogs and they are very unpredictable.. if there are multiple dogs around, each dog's bark will encourage other dogs and when they get excited too much with it, they can do anything.. so the best thing to do is to stop your vehicle shouting at the dog loudly and once the dog moves away go slowly until ur away from it's territory.. speeding ur vehicle is very dangerous as u can meet with an accident in panic.. Ignoring dogs which just sit and bark is ok but dont ignore when d dog is running towards you and tending to approach u closely..

--

biking conversations on the world famous "Bangalore Bikers Club" :)
 
are you a part of the bicycle racing scene?

[deepakvrao]

It is ESSENTIAL in *my* opinion to take post exposure immunization in
this case. Rabies is fatal, and India has a HUGE number of cases.

I'm sure Chiddu and the anti vaccine lobby will defer in their
opinion, but this is what I feel.

On Jun 5, 6:00 pm, Mayank Rungta <mr.m...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I did like to know how bad it is not to take the shots. For the cat
> scratches and smaller bites we have avoided but we know the cat has been
> vaccinated. If not I don't know what kind of issues one has to face.
> Kindly let know.
>
> --

> MAnY thANKshttp://ngopost.orghttp://rideacycle.orghttps://gist.com/mayankhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/vConnect-Blr/

> Small Loans, Big Impacts. Invest inwww.rangde.orgtoday!
> For a greener Bangalore -http://tiny.cc/blrtreeplanting
>

> --http://mynk.posterous.com/please-support-my-tcs-10k-run-supporting-asso

>   o__
>   _>  /__
> (_) \(_)... Burn fat not fuel - Byke along to a healthier lyfe and cleaner world! :)

>              Join the club -http://bangalorebikersclub.com

>
> On Tuesday 05 June 2012 03:55 PM, deepakvrao wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > So, should he take the vaccine?
>
> > On Jun 5, 3:00 pm, Chidambaran Subramanian<chi...@gmail.com>  wrote:
> >> Active ingredients:

> >> Not less than 2.5 International
> >> Units of inactivated Rabies virus
> >> (Flury LEP strain)
> >> Other ingredients:

> >> Trometamol
> >> Sodium chloride
> >> Polygeline
> >> Sucrose

> >> Possible trace amounts:
> >>     neomycin, chlortetracycline,
> >>    amphotericin B,Monopotassium glutamate,Disodium edetate
>
> >> The manufacture of this product
> >> includes exposure to bovine derived
> >> materials. No evidence exists that
> >> any case of vCJD (considered to be
> >> the human form of bovine
> >> spongiform encephalitis) has resulted
> >> from the administration of any
> >> vaccine product.
>
> >> On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 2:56 PM, deepakvrao<deepakv...@gmail.com>  wrote:
> >>> I think he should adequately 'educate' himself about the vaccine, read
> >>> all about the ingredients, and maybe have a consultation with the
> >>> 'other side', and then form an opinion as to whether he should take
> >>> the immunization. LOL.
> >>> Do you know what Rabipur contains?
> >>>https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150875521197989&set=a.10150...
> >>> On Jun 5, 9:30 am, arv...@neuro-spine.com wrote:
> >>>> You need Rabipur vaccine immediately.
> >>>> You will need 5 maybe 6 doses spread over a period of 28 days.
> >>>> ASAP

> >>>> Sent from BlackBerry on Airtel

[Deepak Rao]

Are you sure Arvind? Facebook says otherwise. Your doctor may not know what goes into the vaccine. LOL

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150875521197989&set=a.10150455123022989.363454.287991907988&type=1&theater 

The anti vaccine lobby on FB is too funny.

[Happy James]

Hi all,

Thank you very much for providing your valuable suggestions.

Today, I got vaccinated from a clinic near my home at 11:30 A.m.

Doctor has given this prescription:

     Totally 6 injections which includes 1 TT and 5 Rabipur doses.

TT was given to the waist and Rabipur to the hand, Thank got i didn't have any allergic reactions till now.

All the best for your rides,  Please take necessary precautions' when you see a street dog. Not all dogs will bite, But few dogs are really dangerous they bite

Regards
Mahesh M

[sriram...@gmail.com]

Guys.. As far as I know. . A rabid stricken will always bite without provocation.. So happy James, by taking the vaccine you have done the right.. Doctors usually advise keeping a watch on the dog's whereabouts, as to check if its rabid.. Already drs arvind and Deepak have told you same** take care

Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

---

From: Happy James <mahesh....@gmail.com>

Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com

Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2012 19:18:58 +0530

To: chethu gowda<chetha...@gmail.com>

Cc: Bangalore Bikers Club<bangalor...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: Re: [BBC] Dog Bited me today

[Apurv Manjrekar]

What has worked for me is stopping and looking the dog in the eye. I
usually walk my dog at night and have faced situations where about 5-6
dogs have surrounded me. This technique has worked every single time. Make
sure u stand and just look the dogs in the eye and at max shout at them.
Any bodily movements will startle them and they may react by attacking.

--
Using Opera's revolutionary email client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

[Chidambaran Subramanian]

These are some of the *observed* side effects of the various Rabies
vaccines (Rabipur is one brand)

1)paresthesia
2) cold sores
3)swelling and pain of the area around injection
4) brain/spinal cord inflammation aka encephalomyelitis
5)Headache/Fever/Chills
6) tachycardia (abnormal heart rate),
7) Autism,
and finally
8) Death


Having said that though, Rabies is a disease without any known cure,
and if you've been bitten, you're likely exposed. I've a cousin who
was bitten by a rabid dog, he had the 14 injections (that was the
older Rabies vaccine) and survived. Keep in mind, this was a confirmed
case of a Rabid dog at an advanced stage of rabies. it went on to bite
15 more children same day before somebody clubbed it to death.
Here it looks like the dog nipped but went away, Rabid dogs , tend to
bite at anything and everything. If I were bitten by a dog in
circumstances similar to Mahesh, I would have taken the vaccine.

However, using this vaccine to further the argument that every
childhood vaccine is necessary, and that people with vaccine injured
children are just crazed out folks who are against vaccines for no
reason is not just unnecessary but in poor taste

Chiddu

On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 6:30 PM, Mayank Rungta <mr....@gmail.com> wrote:
> I did like to know how bad it is not to take the shots. For the cat
> scratches and smaller bites we have avoided but we know the cat has been
> vaccinated. If not I don't know what kind of issues one has to face. Kindly
> let know.
>
> --
> MAnY thANKs
> http://ngopost.org
> http://rideacycle.org
> https://gist.com/mayank
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vConnect-Blr/
> Small Loans, Big Impacts. Invest in www.rangde.org today!
> For a greener Bangalore - http://tiny.cc/blrtreeplanting
>
> --
> http://mynk.posterous.com/please-support-my-tcs-10k-run-supporting-asso
>  o__
>  _>  /__
> (_) \(_)... Burn fat not fuel - Byke along to a healthier lyfe and cleaner
> world! :)
>            Join the club - http://bangalorebikersclub.com
>
>
> On Tuesday 05 June 2012 03:55 PM, deepakvrao wrote:
>>
>> So, should he take the vaccine?
>>
>> On Jun 5, 3:00 pm, Chidambaran Subramanian<chi...@gmail.com>  wrote:
>>>
>>> Active ingredients:

>>> • Not less than 2.5 International

>>> Units of inactivated Rabies virus
>>> (Flury LEP strain)
>>> Other ingredients:

>>> • Trometamol
>>> • Sodium chloride
>>> • Polygeline
>>> • Sucrose

>>> • Possible trace amounts:

>>>    neomycin, chlortetracycline,
>>>   amphotericin B,Monopotassium glutamate,Disodium edetate
>>>
>>> The manufacture of this product
>>> includes exposure to bovine derived
>>> materials. No evidence exists that
>>> any case of vCJD (considered to be
>>> the human form of bovine
>>> spongiform encephalitis) has resulted
>>> from the administration of any
>>> vaccine product.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 2:56 PM, deepakvrao<deepakv...@gmail.com>  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I think he should adequately 'educate' himself about the vaccine, read
>>>> all about the ingredients, and maybe have a consultation with the
>>>> 'other side', and then form an opinion as to whether he should take
>>>> the immunization. LOL.
>>>> Do you know what Rabipur contains?
>>>> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150875521197989&set=a.10150...
>>>> On Jun 5, 9:30 am, arv...@neuro-spine.com wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> You need Rabipur vaccine immediately.
>>>>> You will need 5 maybe 6 doses spread over a period of 28 days.
>>>>> ASAP

>>>>> Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel

[Mayank Rungta]

Thanks for the very valuable inputs Chiddu and doc not funny anymore!!!

[deepakvrao]

Yes, it is certainly not funny the way the anti vaccine 'lobby'
willfully mislead people. Vaccines have saved millions of lives, and
this internet propaganda really misleads people. I have seen the
results of this personally.

Recently Chiddambaram posted that same image [the one I linked to on
FB], mocking the paediatrician because he does not know the contents
of the vaccine, yet he is now willing to take a vaccine from a doctor
who also will not know the contents. If that is not double standards,
what is?

Do you think ANY doctor will be able to rattle of contents of every
prescription that he writes. He will know the active ingredient, but I
guarantee you that the best in the world will not know what additives/
preservatives etc goes into the formulation. Yes, easy to laugh and
post stupid pictures but sometime you have to face the reality.

Just to add that I am NOT a paediatrician, so I have no personal axe
to grind, nor any personal monetary incentive.

> > On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 6:30 PM, Mayank Rungta <mr.m...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > I did like to know how bad it is not to take the shots. For the cat
> > > scratches and smaller bites we have avoided but we know the cat has been
> > > vaccinated. If not I don't know what kind of issues one has to face.
> > Kindly
> > > let know.
>
> > > --
> > > MAnY thANKs
> > >http://ngopost.org
> > >http://rideacycle.org
> > >https://gist.com/mayank
> > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vConnect-Blr/

> > > Small Loans, Big Impacts. Invest inwww.rangde.orgtoday!

> > > For a greener Bangalore -http://tiny.cc/blrtreeplanting

>
> > > --
> > >http://mynk.posterous.com/please-support-my-tcs-10k-run-supporting-asso
> > >  o__
> > >  _>  /__
> > > (_) \(_)... Burn fat not fuel - Byke along to a healthier lyfe and
> > cleaner
> > > world! :)

> > >            Join the club -http://bangalorebikersclub.com

[Mayank Rungta]

[OTed]

Before proceeding I did like to clarify I don't have a take on the vaccine debate _as_yet_. I love to watch and hear good stuff about how disease have been eradicated -

http://www.ted.com/talks/larry_brilliant_wants_to_stop_pandemics.html

But I would certainly not trash what the other camp has to say this way!

Doc,

I went thru the FB link _finally_ and it suffers from what most posters of this kind do - so many of the biking posters go overboard sometimes! You seriously can't be using that as an excuse to obviate what is being said!!!

Anti vaccine lobby is misleading people and the vaccine making corporates are not? How does one know - how do you know??? I think the latter have all the money and intent to do it while the formers are working uphill (now who would know better than us bikers about that! :))

Doctors today in my experience -

1. I go to a Doctor with my stitches on the head (from the bike fall) to be removed and he says "Oh are you married? You will need a plastic surgery or those will leave marks!" I hated the thought of going to this special visit doctors that charge you 7-10 times more than regular doctors at St Johns but I did not have a choice for the lack of time. The doctor stitching me clearly told me he is doing his best not to leave any scars and - I need to look _hard_ for them today. I don't know how much money that doc cud make - he was ready operate me then and there.

2. The next day I blacked out after mentioning to this other doctor my issue with blood donation. He asked me to get a MRI done immediately. I went to the emergency. The young doctors (I believe students just beginning) re-examined me and told this happens sometimes -� MRI scan not needed. I have no issues today. I like to believe these young doctors personally as they still have this crazy desire to cure the whole world - I saw one break down when we got the funds in place for one of the kids that would die if not treated (again something in favor of treatments!:)).

3. _Dr_ Rajat Chauhan during a workshop on La Ultra - "Doctors these days recommend knee replacement surgery to even those who don't need it. I feel sorry about the state of affairs!"

I can go on with n number of such instances where you know Doctors are also in a profession as any other wanting to make money. One episode on female foeticide elicits protests by Doctors feeling hurt! :) I don't understand how can they take such a thing personally unless they are doing it themselves!!!

I have seen good doctors also but I really don't how to know a good one from well a _businessperson_! I am really scared of Doctors these days personally. I am not sure their _NOT_ knowing the contents of a vaccine (let alone what the contents can do) is going to get them brownie points!!! I don't expect them to know that but really do hope to find a way to trust them via experience...

Now coming to the Corporates - well they are only getting worse by the day. If you believe otherwise please come and collect a lot of interesting documentaries we have showcasing the work of a lot of corporates and how they are making money. Will not get into that here...

Now when you have vaccines in premium packages which won't hurt your babies to the ordinary ones that do - showing clearly that it is like any other business - one would tend to think that there could be something wrong. In whose interest (monetary) would it be to bring this to anybody's notice - not in the one manufacturing it, not in the doctor's who is administering it, not in the govt's who is siphoning money out of it, etc etc. Now any parent would not want to take a chance with the diseases like polio and such. What are the chances that any genuine study about these vaccines will see the light of the day??? Such a lobby misleading people - must be quite a feat! :)

You can do better than this doc. Since you have no interests you should of all people look at it more neutrally than others.

After watching this documentary - "Closer" I asked the mother of an autistic kid about this whole vaccinations leading to autism and she told "I am not sure it is due to the vaccine being administered. What if the kid actually gets a deadly disease if we asked people not to take the vaccine!"

Pretty twisted!!!

--
MAnY thANKs
http://ngopost.org
http://rideacycle.org
https://gist.com/mayank
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vConnect-Blr/

Small Loans, Big Impacts. Invest in www.rangde.org today!
For a greener Bangalore - http://tiny.cc/blrtreeplanting

-- 
http://mynk.posterous.com/please-support-my-tcs-10k-run-supporting-asso
 o__
 _> /__
(_) \(_)... Burn fat not fuel - Byke along to a healthier lyfe and cleaner world! :)
            Join the club - http://bangalorebikersclub.com

Having said that though, Rabies is a disease without any known cure,
and if you've been bitten, �you're likely exposed. I've a cousin who
was bitten by a rabid dog, he had the 14 injections (that was the
older Rabies vaccine) and survived. Keep in mind, this was a confirmed
case of a Rabid dog at an advanced stage of rabies. it went on to bite
15 more children same day before somebody clubbed it to death.
Here it looks like the dog nipped but went away, Rabid dogs , tend to
bite at anything and everything. If I were bitten by a dog in
circumstances similar to Mahesh, I would have taken the vaccine.

However, using this vaccine to further the argument that every
childhood vaccine is necessary, and that �people with vaccine injured
children are just crazed out folks who are against vaccines for no
reason is not just unnecessary but in poor taste

Chiddu

On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 6:30 PM, Mayank Rungta <mr.m...@gmail.com> wrote:

I did like to know how bad it is not to take the shots. For the cat
scratches and smaller bites we have avoided but we know the cat has been
vaccinated. If not I don't know what kind of issues one has to face.

Kindly

let know.

--
MAnY thANKs
http://ngopost.org
http://rideacycle.org
https://gist.com/mayank
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vConnect-Blr/
Small Loans, Big Impacts. Invest inwww.rangde.orgtoday!
For a greener Bangalore -http://tiny.cc/blrtreeplanting

--
http://mynk.posterous.com/please-support-my-tcs-10k-run-supporting-asso
�o__
�_> �/__
(_) \(_)... Burn fat not fuel - Byke along to a healthier lyfe and

cleaner

world! :)
� � � � � �Join the club -http://bangalorebikersclub.com

On Tuesday 05 June 2012 03:55 PM, deepakvrao wrote:

So, should he take the vaccine?

On Jun 5, 3:00 pm, Chidambaran Subramanian<chi...@gmail.com> �wrote:

Active ingredients:
� Not less than 2.5 International
Units of inactivated Rabies virus
(Flury LEP strain)
Other ingredients:
� Trometamol
� Sodium chloride
� Polygeline
� Sucrose
� Possible trace amounts:
� �neomycin, chlortetracycline,
� amphotericin B,Monopotassium glutamate,Disodium edetate

The manufacture of this product
includes exposure to bovine derived
materials. No evidence exists that
any case of vCJD (considered to be
the human form of bovine
spongiform encephalitis) has resulted
from the administration of any
vaccine product.

On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 2:56 PM, deepakvrao<deepakv...@gmail.com>

�wrote:

I think he should adequately 'educate' himself about the vaccine, read
all about the ingredients, and maybe have a consultation with the
'other side', and then form an opinion as to whether he should take
the immunization. LOL.
Do you know what Rabipur contains?

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150875521197989&set=a.10150...

On Jun 5, 9:30 am, arv...@neuro-spine.com wrote:

You need Rabipur vaccine immediately.
You will need 5 maybe 6 doses spread over a period of 28 days.
ASAP
Sent from BlackBerry� on Airtel
-----Original Message-----
From: vijay _ A<vijhere2...@gmail.com>

patient , I followed this theory �many times previously and i was

safe

(Thoght this is similar to ghandhijis non violence theory).
But today unfortunately
today A �" Dog barked at me from 100 meters distance" I did not even
see
at it,
It came near me in fraction of minute and started to bark at me, " I
followed the same theory" - Did not see at it.
Finally it came near me in a second and i became an victim, it bited
me,
and started to stare at me .
�to prevent further biting and injuries, I got down from the bike
and shouted loudly "aeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy", the dog �went
back
and stood still and later went away.
But the damage was done, I saw my leg;5 inces above the ankle for

any

injuries but there was only few scratches. I was specifically

�seeing

for
any blood stains or blood oozing from any of the marks.
But to my luck there was no blood stains or blood oozing out from

the

marks, I thought I am safe and nothing to worry �about this dog bit

as

it
is only scratches.
I came back to home. Started the first aid.
I washed the wound with flowing water for 5 minutes and applied

Detol

on
the scratches.
* Suddenly I was able to see very, very small amout of blood coming
out
of the dog bite scratch*.
The size of the place where i found the �blood stains is equal to
"*.",*
i.e �you can compare the size of the blood stain to the �size of �a
Ball
point Nib of the refill.
I dont know weather take injection or not, little confused. Will see
the
doctor today anyway.
Friends my request to all of you, be careful with the dogs. None of
the
theories are effective in handling dogs to escape from its bite.
Ride safely, Bye! take care and have a nice day.
Regards
Mahesh Mohan Kumar
--
biking conversations on the world famous "Bangalore Bikers Club" :)
are you a part of the bicycle racing scene?
Visitwww.bangalorebicyclechampionships.comformoredetails

[htedum]

- dogs away from master's home don't attack people, not even bark.
- a lone dog on street (even an stray one) does not bark at people.
- dogs love chasing scared people. They are expert in sensing it. We
need to counter this by being expert in acting not-scared. Not sure if
they can hear the heart beat. But at least act the body language as if
not scared. This is very very important. The dogs in my layout bark
and even follow my wife and daughter while they walk without me. But
they would never bark when I walk with them or I walk alone.
- Dare to pause and "look back". Dogs in large number will obviously
get more confident. Calculate your own risk while daring them. When
you stop, they would stop. Now you move on. If they come following
again, just quickly sit down as if picking up a stone and act as
throwing something at it. It will run away. Or they will charge more
fiercely!
- Shouting back as you pause helps. They can sense your confidence
well.

The first two rules are nonsense. The others are fair assumptions, but not always valid. Dogs are not machines that react predictably to a set of conditions. They are living creatures capapble of random, and seemingly irrational, behaviour. I have personally been attacked by a lone stray.

The only rule I have is this: if you're nice to me, I'm nice to you. If you leave me alone, I'll leave you alone. If you mess with me, I will get back at you. And zenx, this applies to humans as much as to dogs and politicians. :)

[htedum]

I share doc's skepticism about the anti-vaccine camp. Most views are half-baked, pseudoscientific and without data to back them up. For example, there was a recent scare about the HPV vaccine: http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/2011/is-the-hpv-vaccine-safe-v-2-0/, and an outbreak of 'vaccines are not natural, how do we know what is in them' activism. Many people don't know the full picture, and twist facts to suit their outcome.

Chiddu, the rabipur vaccine side-effects you quoted have no significance until you present numbers. How many people died, compared to how many were saved from certain death from rabies? If 1 in 100,000 died from complications of the vaccine, and 10,000 in a 100,000 were saved because of it, it's a risk I would take. No medicine/procedure is 100% safe. Not Rabipur, not Crocin, not Aspririn, not Dabur Chyawanprash, not Baba Ramdev's breathing exercises.

Published side-effects of Rabipur: http://www.nhs.uk/medicine-guides/pages/MedicineSideEffects.aspx?condition=Vaccinations%20%28all%29&medicine=Rabipur

[Banibrata Dutta]

On Wed, Jun 6, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Mayank Rungta <mr....@gmail.com> wrote:

[OTed]

Before proceeding I did like to clarify I don't have a take on the vaccine debate _as_yet_. I love to watch and hear good stuff about how disease have been eradicated -

http://www.ted.com/talks/larry_brilliant_wants_to_stop_pandemics.html

But I would certainly not trash what the other camp has to say this way!

Doc,

I went thru the FB link _finally_ and it suffers from what most posters of this kind do - so many of the biking posters go overboard sometimes! You seriously can't be using that as an excuse to obviate what is being said!!!

Anti vaccine lobby is misleading people and the vaccine making corporates are not? How does one know - how do you know??? I think the latter have all the money and intent to do it while the formers are working uphill (now who would know better than us bikers about that! :))

Doctors today in my experience -

1. I go to a Doctor with my stitches on the head (from the bike fall) to be removed and he says "Oh are you married? You will need a plastic surgery or those will leave marks!" I hated the thought of going to this special visit doctors that charge you 7-10 times more than regular doctors at St Johns but I did not have a choice for the lack of time. The doctor stitching me clearly told me he is doing his best not to leave any scars and - I need to look _hard_ for them today. I don't know how much money that doc cud make - he was ready operate me then and there.

2. The next day I blacked out after mentioning to this other doctor my issue with blood donation. He asked me to get a MRI done immediately. I went to the emergency. The young doctors (I believe students just beginning) re-examined me and told this happens sometimes -  MRI scan not needed. I have no issues today. I like to believe these young doctors personally as they still have this crazy desire to cure the whole world - I saw one break down when we got the funds in place for one of the kids that would die if not treated (again something in favor of treatments!:)).

3. _Dr_ Rajat Chauhan during a workshop on La Ultra - "Doctors these days recommend knee replacement surgery to even those who don't need it. I feel sorry about the state of affairs!"

I can go on with n number of such instances where you know Doctors are also in a profession as any other wanting to make money. One episode on female foeticide elicits protests by Doctors feeling hurt! :) I don't understand how can they take such a thing personally unless they are doing it themselves!!!

I have seen good doctors also but I really don't how to know a good one from well a _businessperson_! I am really scared of Doctors these days personally. I am not sure their _NOT_ knowing the contents of a vaccine (let alone what the contents can do) is going to get them brownie points!!! I don't expect them to know that but really do hope to find a way to trust them via experience...

Now coming to the Corporates - well they are only getting worse by the day. If you believe otherwise please come and collect a lot of interesting documentaries we have showcasing the work of a lot of corporates and how they are making money. Will not get into that here...

Now when you have vaccines in premium packages which won't hurt your babies to the ordinary ones that do - showing clearly that it is like any other business - one would tend to think that there could be something wrong. In whose interest (monetary) would it be to bring this to anybody's notice - not in the one manufacturing it, not in the doctor's who is administering it, not in the govt's who is siphoning money out of it, etc etc. Now any parent would not want to take a chance with the diseases like polio and such. What are the chances that any genuine study about these vaccines will see the light of the day??? Such a lobby misleading people - must be quite a feat! :)

You can do better than this doc. Since you have no interests you should of all people look at it more neutrally than others.

After watching this documentary - "Closer" I asked the mother of an autistic kid about this whole vaccinations leading to autism and she told "I am not sure it is due to the vaccine being administered. What if the kid actually gets a deadly disease if we asked people not to take the vaccine!"

Pretty twisted!!!

Two points..

1) Doctor's association/lobby reaction against Satyamev Jayate was against the 4th eposide, which I believe covered Medical Malpractise, not the 3rd episode which was on Female Foeticide. Just a minor factual correction.

2) "Corporatization"  (i.e. if such a term exists, since "commercialisation" doesn't fit too well... after all, doctors need to make a living), of healthcare and the tightly-knit fabric of general corporate greed, has had a detrimental effect in the current state of healthcare, even though significant strides continue to be made in the field of medicine. Many of those advances would have not been possible, had there been no monetary incentive, since pure "general"/"societal" good, doesn't seem to be a strong-enough incentive. Maslow 's heirarchy of needs, and other such theories have stated this over and over again. The system has some very rotten apples, some that are not-as-bad / indifferent and some which remain very good, i.e. do not indulge in medical malpractise at all. This is true for every industry, and healthcare today is an industry, which we cannot overlook. The web of corporate greed permeates not only healthcare institution itself but other ancillary industries s.a. insurance, pharmaceutical, diagnostic industries, venture capital etc.

And BTW, the state-of-affairs is not limited to India alone, or just developing countries. In highly developed countries too, these problems exist to varying degrees, and manifest themself in various other ways, s.a. very high insurance premium, rejection of insurance policy request, some cases of discrimination etc.

Doctors, I am told (and have no reason to suspect otherwise), have to make some very tough decisions between long-term/short-term impacts, and that of general-good. Many of these decisions may be highly debatable or controversial. And this, is an excellent cover for many malpractices, since often it is used as a mean to keep decision-making opaque. Just because two doctors on the list suggested, what seems like an obvious right-thing-to-do, doesn't mean that we can vent-out :-).
 

Having said that though, Rabies is a disease without any known cure,
and if you've been bitten,  you're likely exposed. I've a cousin who
was bitten by a rabid dog, he had the 14 injections (that was the
older Rabies vaccine) and survived. Keep in mind, this was a confirmed
case of a Rabid dog at an advanced stage of rabies. it went on to bite
15 more children same day before somebody clubbed it to death.
Here it looks like the dog nipped but went away, Rabid dogs , tend to
bite at anything and everything. If I were bitten by a dog in
circumstances similar to Mahesh, I would have taken the vaccine.

However, using this vaccine to further the argument that every
childhood vaccine is necessary, and that  people with vaccine injured
children are just crazed out folks who are against vaccines for no
reason is not just unnecessary but in poor taste

Chiddu

On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 6:30 PM, Mayank Rungta <mr.m...@gmail.com> wrote:

I did like to know how bad it is not to take the shots. For the cat
scratches and smaller bites we have avoided but we know the cat has been
vaccinated. If not I don't know what kind of issues one has to face.

Kindly

let know.

--
MAnY thANKs
http://ngopost.org
http://rideacycle.org
https://gist.com/mayank
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vConnect-Blr/
Small Loans, Big Impacts. Invest inwww.rangde.orgtoday!
For a greener Bangalore -http://tiny.cc/blrtreeplanting

--
http://mynk.posterous.com/please-support-my-tcs-10k-run-supporting-asso
 o__
 _>  /__
(_) \(_)... Burn fat not fuel - Byke along to a healthier lyfe and

cleaner

world! :)
           Join the club -http://bangalorebikersclub.com

On Tuesday 05 June 2012 03:55 PM, deepakvrao wrote:

So, should he take the vaccine?

On Jun 5, 3:00 pm, Chidambaran Subramanian<chi...@gmail.com>  wrote:

Active ingredients:
• Not less than 2.5 International
Units of inactivated Rabies virus
(Flury LEP strain)
Other ingredients:
• Trometamol
• Sodium chloride
• Polygeline
• Sucrose
• Possible trace amounts:
   neomycin, chlortetracycline,
  amphotericin B,Monopotassium glutamate,Disodium edetate

The manufacture of this product
includes exposure to bovine derived
materials. No evidence exists that
any case of vCJD (considered to be
the human form of bovine
spongiform encephalitis) has resulted
from the administration of any
vaccine product.

On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 2:56 PM, deepakvrao<deepakv...@gmail.com>

 wrote:

I think he should adequately 'educate' himself about the vaccine, read
all about the ingredients, and maybe have a consultation with the
'other side', and then form an opinion as to whether he should take
the immunization. LOL.
Do you know what Rabipur contains?

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150875521197989&set=a.10150...

On Jun 5, 9:30 am, arv...@neuro-spine.com wrote:

You need Rabipur vaccine immediately.
You will need 5 maybe 6 doses spread over a period of 28 days.
ASAP
Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel
-----Original Message-----
From: vijay _ A<vijhere2...@gmail.com>

patient , I followed this theory  many times previously and i was

safe

(Thoght this is similar to ghandhijis non violence theory).
But today unfortunately
today A  " Dog barked at me from 100 meters distance" I did not even
see
at it,
It came near me in fraction of minute and started to bark at me, " I
followed the same theory" - Did not see at it.
Finally it came near me in a second and i became an victim, it bited
me,
and started to stare at me .
 to prevent further biting and injuries, I got down from the bike
and shouted loudly "aeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy", the dog  went
back
and stood still and later went away.
But the damage was done, I saw my leg;5 inces above the ankle for

any

injuries but there was only few scratches. I was specifically

 seeing

for
any blood stains or blood oozing from any of the marks.
But to my luck there was no blood stains or blood oozing out from

the

marks, I thought I am safe and nothing to worry  about this dog bit

as

it
is only scratches.
I came back to home. Started the first aid.
I washed the wound with flowing water for 5 minutes and applied

Detol

on
the scratches.
* Suddenly I was able to see very, very small amout of blood coming
out
of the dog bite scratch*.
The size of the place where i found the  blood stains is equal to
"*.",*
i.e  you can compare the size of the blood stain to the  size of  a
Ball
point Nib of the refill.
I dont know weather take injection or not, little confused. Will see
the
doctor today anyway.
Friends my request to all of you, be careful with the dogs. None of
the
theories are effective in handling dogs to escape from its bite.
Ride safely, Bye! take care and have a nice day.
Regards
Mahesh Mohan Kumar
--
biking conversations on the world famous "Bangalore Bikers Club" :)
are you a part of the bicycle racing scene?
Visitwww.bangalorebicyclechampionships.comformoredetails

Visit www.bangalorebicyclechampionships.com for more details

--
regards,
Banibrata
http://www.linkedin.com/in/bdutta
http://twitter.com/edgeliving

[S Chidambaran]

BTW  I have 2 perfectly healthy kids who have not been vaccinated. I encourage parents who have misgivings about vaccines to get in touch with me. This is my last post on this thread. Feel free to get in touch with me at

http://www.facebook.com/chiddu.
I plan to update my healthblog more frequently
http://vaccinerisks.wordpress.com


Here is an *anectodal* story of somebody's actual experience with the rabies vaccine.

http://birthofanewearth.blogspot.in/2012/02/autism-and-rabies-vaccine-one-familys.html

making money. Will not get into that here...

paarent would not want to take a chance with the diseases like polio and such. What are the chances that any

My blog on the polio vaccine and the immense harm it is causing in India

http://vaccinerisks.wordpress.com/2012/02/17/do-boond-zindagi-ke/

genuine study about these vaccines will see the light of the day??? Such a lobby misleading people - must be quite a feat! :)

The whole medico-pharmacological industry is geared towards producing newer inventions and cures, not to fix or figure problems with existing ones, or even work on non-drug, non-vaccine solutions. There is a race to patent every new drug/vaccine and make use of the 30 year patent period.

to grind, nor any personal monetary incentive.

I share doc's skepticism about the anti-vaccine camp. Most views are half-baked, pseudoscientific and without data to back them up.

Can you share the data that shows that a particular vaccine is safe.Pick your vaccine. Humour me. And let me know if you ever find it. Please don't share some *expert's* opinion. I need to look at data, as raw as possible.

For example, there was a recent scare about the HPV vaccine: http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/2011/is-the-hpv-vaccine-safe-v-2-0/,

Nice page, beautiful colors, that suggests that every one else who opposes the vaccine is basically a BS'er. Picture this, a vaccine that supposedly prevents a form of cancer ( a disease that takes years, sometimes decades to develop) is slated to be tested for a period of 4 years. The manufacturer submits the data to FDA and gets the drug approved using a fast-track mechanism in 18 months. So in 18 months they have figured that this vaccine is going to prevent an amazing number of cancers for the next 50 years.  If that is not absurd enough, 73% of the recipients of the vaccine during the trial period, went on to develop *new* medical conditions which were not pre-existent and were *determined not to be because of the vaccine*.

And amazingly enough. "The vaccine has not been teratogenicity and carcinogenicity" - English translation : We can't guarantee against cancer and birth defects because of the vaccine.

  Many people don't know the full picture, and twist facts to suit their outcome.

 And you get the full facts by consulting a web-site you rely on, or by listening to a Doctor, right?

Chiddu, the rabipur vaccine side-effects you quoted have no significance until you present numbers. How many people died, compared to how many were saved from certain death from rabies?

How do you know contraction of Rabies is 100% in the unvaccinated? I doubt if such a study has been clearly done.  I think it is fine and dandy if you want to trust official sources of information only, but I think it is important that you hear independent voices as well.

Here are a couple of sample reports I've taken from VAERS.

1) Information has been received from a physician concerning a 24 year old female with no pertinent medical history and no drug reaction and allergies who on an unspecified day was vaccinated IM with the first 0.5ml dose of GARDASIL (lot number not provided). Concomitant therapy included oral contraceptive. In December 2009, some time after the first dose of GARDASIL, the patient had an abnormal Papanicolaou (pap) smear. The smear revealed a ""CIM-3 abnormality with carcinoma in situ."" On 12-FEB-2010 the physician performed a LEAP procedure on the patient. On 08-SEP-2010 this patient's follow-up smear revealed that no HPV was present. The physician also mentioned that the patient received a second dose of GARDASIL (lot number not provided) late on 10-NOV-2010. At time of the report the patient was recovered. Upon internal review, a ""CIM-3 abnormality with carcinoma in situ"". was determined to be an other important medical event. Additional information has been requested. (Carcinoma in situ - localized cancer of the cervix - contacted *after* administration of the vaccine - no doubt, unrelated to the vaccine )

2) 445500,12/15/2011,,23.0,,,F,12/14/2011,"This report was identified from a line listing obtained on request by the Company from the FDA under the Freedom of Information Act. A 23 year old female with PHENERGAN allergy and a history of hypothyroidism, partial thyroidectomy in 2006, total thyroidectomy in 2007 and benign thyroid nodule who on 14-FEB-2007 was vaccinated IM into gluteus maximus with the first dose of GARDASIL (lot # 653978/0955F). Concomitant therapy included LEVOXYL and DEPO-PROVERA. The patient was diagnosed with acute promyelocytic leukemia (APL) on 11-MAR-2007. No family history. Acute onset, no tangible symptoms until roughly 10 days before diagnosis (anemia, fever, night sweats). Consultant records (hematology/oncology) showed diagnosis: APL. The patient was diagnosed with acute promyelocytic leukaemia on 11-MAR-2007 accompanied by mild disseminated intravascular coagulation (DIC). Several office visits for chemotherapy. The patient had received induction, consolidation and maintenance therapy; presently in histologic and molecular remission. The patient underwent several bone marrow aspirations. The patient was being monitored as outpatient. Obstetrics and gynecology records on 05-MAR-2007 showed well woman exam. No health issues documented. Labs/diagnostics in March 2007 included: WBC 0.5 K/mm3 (low), hemoglobin 8.0 g/dL (low), hematocrit 21.4% (low), platelet 10 k/mm3 (low), neutrophil 12% (low), lymphocyte 80% (high), blast 70% (high), AST 87 U/L (high), ALT 149 U/L (high). Bone marrow aspirate: no abnormal myeloid cell population identified. CT of chest, abdomen and pelvis showed pleural effusion with bilateral lower lobe atelectasis vs consolidation; periportal oedema of liver; ascites in pelvis; left adnexal cyst. Numerous additional tests related to monitoring of health condition were performed since diagnosis. The status of the patient was unknown at the time of this report. APL, DIC, several bone marrow aspirations, chemotherapy, anemia, fever and night sweats were considered to be immediately life-threatening by the agency. The original reporting source was not provided. The VAERS ID is 434266. No further information is available. A lot check has been initiated. A standard lot check investigation has been finalized. All in-process quality checks for the lot number in question were satisfactory. In addition, an expanded lot check investigation was performed. The testing performed on the batch prior to release met all release specifications. The lot met the requirements of the Center for Biologics Evaluation and Research and was released.",,,Y,Y,Y,,Y,,U,02/14/2007,03/01/2007,15,"bone marrow biopsy, 03/??/07, Bone marrow aspirate: no abnormal myeloid cell population identified.; chest computed axial, 03/??/07, pleural effusion with bilateral lower lobe atelectasis vs consolidation; computed axial, 03/??/07, pelvis: ascites in pelvis, left adnexal cyst; abdominal computed, 03/??/07, periportal oedema of liver; WBC count, 03/??/07, 0.5 K/mm; hemoglobin, 03/??/07, 8 g/dl; hematocrit, 03/??/07, 21.4%; platelet count, 03/??/07, 10 K/mm; neutrophil count, 03/??/07, 12%; lymphocyte count, 03/??/07, 80%; bone marrow blast cell, 03/??/07, 70%; serum aspartate, 03/??/07, 87 U/L; serum alanine, 03/??/07, 149 U/L",OTH,OTH,LEVOXYL; DEPO-PROVERA,Drug h.../

[Thampi Sabari]

Its official. 

BBC henceforth will be Bow Bow Chat !

www.sgthampi.blogspot.com

[anilk...@gmail.com]

Lol....

Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

---

From: Thampi Sabari <sgth...@gmail.com>

Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com

Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2012 11:04:14 +0530

To: Banibrata Dutta<banibra...@gmail.com>

Cc: Mayank Rungta<mr....@gmail.com>; deepakvrao<deepa...@gmail.com>; Bangalore Bikers Club<bangalor...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: Re: [BBC] [OT] Re: Dog Bited me today

[Rajanikanth Puttabuddi]

Slowly getting back this thread from vaccination to cycles :-)
I read in TOI the other day that for every 30+ folks in B'lore we have 1 stray dog with Srinagar having most ( 17:1 ).
And i think the cyclist to 2/4 wheeler ratio would be 1:1000 or 1:5000. The best thing we can do is increase the no of biker's out there,
so that the dogs get used to US wearing helmets and lycras. How much they will bark/chase ? They have to give up.

[Chidambaran Subramanian]

1) Keep in mind, even if all of us are in favour of eliminating all
stray dogs, we can't do it. It is best that we learn how to deal with
it. Diff approaches have worked for diff people.
2) Unless you are *dead* confident of speeding off, don't try.
3) I get down, talk to the dog. ( I know the Dog does not understand
English, but I try to manage with my limited Doglish, and eye
expressions, cooing noises, etc, generally enough to confuse or calm
down the dog).
4) If you are paranoid, avoid riding alone at night.
5) Don't panic. Important.
6) And this is not just with dogs. Last Friday while cycling through
Bandipur, a Bear crossed in front of me. Not to mention 2 female
elephant and a calf were browsing on the side of the road.
Not that if you keep your cool you are guaranteed of survival, but if
you lose it, your chances reduce significantly.

Regards
Chiddu

[Abhijit Shylanath]

BTW  I have 2 perfectly healthy kids who have not been vaccinated. I encourage parents who have misgivings about vaccines to get in touch with me. This is my last post on this thread. Feel free to get in touch with me at

Don't mean to insult or attack, and I wish the best of health to you and your family, but correlation does not imply causation. Just because they are not vaccinated and healthy does not mean that they are healthy because they are not vaccinated. I am vaccinated and healthy myself. So is my sister, and so are my cousins. That is like saying I have never used a condom, and I am HIV-negative, so condoms are a load of crock. 

I did not read through the blogs that you linked because my argument is questioning your method of inquiry, not the content.

> Can you share the data that shows that a particular vaccine is safe.Pick your vaccine. Humour me. And let me know if you ever find it. > Please don't share some *expert's* opinion. I need to look at data, as raw as possible.

Like I said, no medicine/cure is a silver bullet. There ARE casualties to it, and there are mistakes. Medicine/science is not a 100% sure of anything, but the fact is that there is a statistical advantage to vaccination.

> Nice page, beautiful colors, that suggests that every one else who opposes the vaccine is basically a BS'er.

If you look beyond the beautiful design (good design does not imply a lack of method/content, as you seem to assume), you will see this sentence on the page: As ever, all our data, sources and calculations: http://bit.ly/HPVsafety. Complete with references.

> And you get the full facts by consulting a web-site you rely on, or by listening to a Doctor, right?

Yes, I'd rather believe someone I consider an expert on the subject, whose mind and method I respect, than a bunch of hysterical people with grapevine knowledge. I'm not saying you are one of them, you are clearly putting some thought into it Not all doctors, of course, but when someone presents data in a convincing manner, of course I will trust them, because I don't know better. I trust modern medicine/allopathy over all sorts of other quackery because you know what, life expectancy has jumped from 31 years in the beginning of the 20th century to 67 years now. Bitch all we want about corporations and patents and all that, clearly they are doing something right. And I also believe they are going about it the right way. By trying to understand mechanisms, statistics and patterns, rather than just cause-and-effect or pseudo-science (ref: Homeopathy).

AND, I understand that medicine is not infallible. If they misdiagnose me, or they treat me with something that causes me harm, I will not be up in arms against that medicine. It is just my bad luck that my body is not reacting well to that medicine. They don't know better, AT THIS POINT, and to the best of their knowledge, they tried to treat me. If it is a case of negligence or laziness, it is a different issue, but if it is a genuine case of being an outlier, then hey, I understand.

> How do you know contraction of Rabies is 100% in the unvaccinated?

It is not. Like I said in my previous post, the numbers are still in favour of vaccination.

> Here are a couple of sample reports I've taken from VAERS. [snip]

Fair enough, and I don't doubt the authenticity of these cases. You have quoted two cases. Let me quote two more: my father was bitten as a child. He took a full anti-rabies course. He is fine now. Another friend of mine was bitten by a pack. He underwent an anti-rabies course. He is fine now (though deathly scared of dogs). There, I have matched your two. What now? Is vaccination as safe as non-vaccination? You are considering outliers, which was my initial point. For every one person who has suffered from the vaccine, I can show you a hundred people who haven't.

[Apurv Manjrekar]

Hi,

I believe parents are to be blamed here more than docs.
Certain vaccinations to diseases which are endemic to a particular region
are generally recommended. TB/Typhoid/Hepatitis fall into this category.
There are a lot other vaccines, which are for diseases which may be
considered low risk. Its a doctors responsibility to inform the parents
about all vaccinations that are available. If you ask the doctor, is rota
virus vaccination important, the doctor will most certainly say yes, since
that is the right answer. Its upto the parents to research and decide what
they would like to do. Most parents choose all possible vaccinations.

Thanks and Regards,
Apurv Manjrekar

[anilk...@gmail.com]

+1

Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

-----Original Message-----
From: Chidambaran Subramanian <chi...@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2012 11:17:21
To: Rajanikanth Puttabuddi<rajani...@gmail.com>
Cc: <anilk...@gmail.com>; Thampi Sabari<sgth...@gmail.com>; <bangalor...@googlegroups.com>; Banibrata Dutta<banibra...@gmail.com>; Mayank Rungta<mr....@gmail.com>; deepakvrao<deepa...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [BBC] [OT] Re: Dog Bited me today

[deepakvrao]

Absolutey sensible points. ALL of them.

Al the anti vaccine guys do is quote anecdotal evidence or 'studies'
that have been discredited, but then they say that it's big pharma
that is behind the discrediting.

To all those who say that I should provide evidence, I would like to
point out that the burden of proof is on them. Vaccine effectiveness
is clearly proved and accepted EXCEPT by them, so the burden of proof
falls on them, and saying that 'I have 2 healthy unvaccinated kids'
passes only in places like this.

I'm done here too.

I AGAIN resolve that I will stick to only cycling in BBC, BZ and FB.
Hope I can stick to it this time.

My aim here has been to avoid people from being completely misled by
the stuff they post, but then I guess if someone is going to follow
Facebook/BBC advice for health, then they deserve what they get.
Unfortunately the sufferers will be their kids who were not part of
the decision to avoid immunization.

On Jun 6, 11:07 am, Abhijit Shylanath <abhijit.shylan...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> > **

>
> > BTW  I have 2 perfectly healthy kids who have not been vaccinated. I
> > encourage parents who have misgivings about vaccines to get in touch with
> > me. This is my last post on this thread. Feel free to get in touch with me
> > at
>
> Don't mean to insult or attack, and I wish the best of health to you and
> your family, but correlation does not imply causation. Just because they
> are not vaccinated and healthy does not mean that they are healthy because
> they are not vaccinated. I am vaccinated and healthy myself. So is my
> sister, and so are my cousins. That is like saying I have never used a
> condom, and I am HIV-negative, so condoms are a load of crock.
>
> I did not read through the blogs that you linked because my argument is
> questioning your method of inquiry, not the content.
>
> > Can you share the data that shows that a particular vaccine is safe.Pick
>
> your vaccine. Humour me. And let me know if you ever find it. > Please
> don't share some *expert's* opinion. I need to look at data, as raw as
> possible.
>
> Like I said, no medicine/cure is a silver bullet. There ARE casualties to
> it, and there are mistakes. Medicine/science is not a 100% sure of
> anything, but the fact is that there is a statistical advantage to
> vaccination.
>
> > Nice page, beautiful colors, that suggests that every one else who
>
> opposes the vaccine is basically a BS'er.
>
> If you look beyond the beautiful design (good design does not imply a lack
> of method/content, as you seem to assume), you will see this sentence on

> the page: *As ever, all our data, sources and calculations:http://bit.ly/HPVsafety*. Complete with references.

[Rajaram]

I guess most of the theories have two sided views including the fact
whether GOD exists or not.

As per the current trend, the docs are taking lesser risks nowadays
with facilities at hand. e.g. doing an MRI for black outs. Lets assume
that the doc in good faith says not required and the patient conks off
the next day, who is to blame. Every doc uses his judgement,
experience and his learnings to diagnose and suggest checks which can
tell him / confirm to the right treatment. If the tests are not done,
then hes using his judgement. I had a doc saying that he gets lot of
patients saying that they have headaches; cause could be anything
right from haemorrage to acidity. He says he cannot recommend MRI to
everyone, he has to use judgement and every one may not be comfortable
taking judgement calls day in and day out for numerous patients. I
mean everything has a flip side. You take it or leave it. We know
several cases where heart attacks were not treated as they were
assumed to be acidity. Each 'mistake' a doc makes, and he has to go
through the grind of why, how and give his justifications. Its a
double edged sword.

Due to this trend, there are fewer toppers NOT opting for medicine,
and maybe in 20 years we may have LESSER bright doctors. All
professions make money. I know docs who feel they made a mistake in
their career when they realise that society does not expect them to
make money. He was still studying at age 28 (and working for a meagre
salary compard to his skillsets) while his BE comp science counterpart
owns a luxury 3 BHK apt in Bangalore.

The profession would be become like a loan processor where the entire
stuff becomes standardised. You may have ATM like machines where you
answer questions which a doc typically asks and depending on the yes /
no you reply, you would be prescribed a test/ medicine etc.

Nothing above is funny except for the last para :-)
BTW I am not trying to defend anyone. Everyone have their own views.
Its imp to know why things are not as they are before. How many of us
are in profession where we make a mistake and it could mean someone
losing their life .. Hardly anyone takes risks in their profession
even when its not a matter of life and death.

> > vaccine, I can show you a hundred people who haven't.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Happy James]

Hi all,

 

This is to some of my friends , who have provided infomation on side effects of vaccination.

 

 You know? I got scared, knowing about the many side effects of Rabbies vaccination.

 

 As there are side effects of Rabbis vaccination! I have some queries?

 

    1) Can i run 10 kms as usual everyday.

    2) I am on a diet and Nutrition plan, any restrictions on the food i consume.

 

I request Doctors in this group to provide your inputs on this, this will help me in preventing self injuries or any allergic reactions.

 

Regards

Mahesh M

 

 

[Apurv Manjrekar]

Any vaccination contains emnacipated germs that have caused the ailment.
In essence your body has a controlled (intended) infection.
The infection could be bigger than what it was intended and cause the
mentioned side effects. Be safe for a while and rest your body.


On Wed, 06 Jun 2012 15:54:34 +0530, Happy James <mahesh....@gmail.com>
wrote:

[arv...@neuro-spine.com]

Absolutely. No second opinion on this.

[Opendro]

I'm myself not vaccinated and my medicinal bill is an absolute zero
(assuming the food I eat is not considered as medicine). My wife and
kids are/were vaccinated and their medicinal bills are also absolute
zero. We are active; we don't lose a working day or school day because
of illness.

So, I'm kind of agnostic, i.e. neither against vaccination nor a
strong supporter.

If someone asks me if I believe in vaccination or for that matter any
allopathy medicine, my answer would be "yes". Should I prefer taking
them? My answer would be "no" until I really need them. I believe that
doctors of today are pushing too many medicines into us and it is not
helping us in any way. I see that people who depend on medicine are
becoming more and more prone to illness and more dependent on
medicines. Some people might be fine with this, but I believe most
people would not be fine if they realize that it is not helping them
in the real sense. For me, even if a drug is going to help me cut down
10 mins from my 10 km run timing, I would still not take drugs, unless
it is a part of my regular food. I almost treat all drugs in the same
way.

However, if I'm in a bad condition that would not get better for a
really prolonged time and it has affected my life and routine, then I
would take the drugs. Or if the condition is something I cannot do
without, e.g. incisive surgery, then I will most probably need drugs
to subside the pain and so on. But I don't like doctors giving TT,
pain killers, antibiotics, etc. etc. just like that. But every doctor
of today does that.

While I agree that vaccines have helped in controlling devastation in
history, I'm skeptical of the majority view that we need to take every
vaccination listed in the chart. I'm not at all concerned about the
0.001% probability of contracting the disease, if at all, without the
vaccination. The way I look at is that our chances of dying due to
other factors other than viral attacks is a lot higher. For instance,
a safer car is far more important to me than the vaccinations. The
argument that others give against this opinion of mine is that virus
spread, accidents don't. But we know that the number of cars also do
spread :) The analogy sounds a little odd. But I think everyone gets
the point.

Am I really worried about the vaccines? Not really. I give all the
mandatory vaccines (only India) and skip the non-mandatory ones (even
if they are mandatory in our master's country (US :)). I'm a guy who
gives BWSSB tap water to my infant baby as well. I don't separate my
kids from anybody ill around. So, whatever that thing in vaccines, I
don't really bother. So, giving mandatory vaccine to my kids is like
myself going to vote in our general elections. I don't really believe
that it would really make a difference, but it is a kind of obligation
that I should do, even though nobody is going to punish me for not
doing it.

So, chill. Whoever wants to vaccinate, vaccinate. Whoever does not
want, don't :-D

On Jun 6, 10:26 am, S Chidambaran <chi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> BTW  I have 2 perfectly healthy kids who have not been vaccinated. I
> encourage parents who have misgivings about vaccines to get in touch
> with me. This is my last post on this thread. Feel free to get in touch
> with me at
>
> http://www.facebook.com/chiddu.

> I plan to update my healthblog more frequentlyhttp://vaccinerisks.wordpress.com

>
> Here is an *anectodal* story of somebody's actual experience with the
> rabies vaccine.
>

> http://birthofanewearth.blogspot.in/2012/02/autism-and-rabies-vaccine...

> making money. Will not get into that here...
>
> >     paarent would not want to take a chance with the diseases like
> >     polio and such. What are the chances that any
>
> My blog on the polio vaccine and the immense harm it is causing in India
>
> http://vaccinerisks.wordpress.com/2012/02/17/do-boond-zindagi-ke/
>
> >     genuine study about these vaccines will see the light of the
> >     day??? Such a lobby misleading people - must be quite a feat! :)
>
> The whole medico-pharmacological industry is geared towards producing
> newer inventions and cures, not to fix or figure problems with existing
> ones, or even work on non-drug, non-vaccine solutions. There is a race
> to patent every new drug/vaccine and make use of the 30 year patent period.
>
> > to grind, nor any personal monetary incentive.
>
> > I share doc's skepticism about the anti-vaccine camp. Most views are
> > half-baked, pseudoscientific and without data to back them up.
>
> Can you share the data that shows that a particular vaccine is safe.Pick
> your vaccine. Humour me. And let me know if you ever find it. Please
> don't share some *expert's* opinion. I need to look at data, as raw as
> possible.
>
> > For example, there was a recent scare about the HPV vaccine:

> >http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/2011/is-the-hpv-vaccine-safe-v-...,

[sriram...@gmail.com]

We all need to take a sedative on this thread.. And I completely believe that it is required ;)

Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

-----Original Message-----

[arv...@neuro-spine.com]

The accusations being hurled against doctors on this forum- "But every doctor
of today does that"- are completely unfounded.

You guys need to get FACTS right before you say anything else accusatory and defamatory.


Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel

[Shreedhar Ramachandra]

@Rajaram: I'm sure you havent see the episode in Satyamev Jayate (the show hosted by Amir Khan) about doctors
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Lg0kUtS8ic
Once you watch this, you'll realise that doctor is not advising for an MRI to be safe, but is purely for monetary benefits.
The point is that when a doctor has invested so many years and almost a crore rupees (in a private college) to complete his degree, he surely needs to exploit people to get it back. Of course you cannot expect him to be honest and work for a government hospital with which he cant even pay the interest for amount invested for his education.
Root cause: Lack of government medical colleges. Healthcare gets a low priority in govt. spending since the lobbying by the private hospitals prevents the govt from opening quality government hospitals.

[Sameer Shisodia]

+1 Sweeping generalizations are just that - and grate. Pls avoid if
there's to be a sane discussion, even if its OT.

On Wed, Jun 6, 2012 at 7:04 PM, <arv...@neuro-spine.com> wrote:
> The accusations being hurled against doctors on this forum- "But every doctor
> of today does that"- are completely unfounded.

--

Sameer Shisodia, Bangalore
http://linger.in

[Opendro]

Why not? If that made you or any other doctor feel bad, let me confess
that it is not the fault of the doctor. People also want doctor to
give a quick fix and also not take the slightest risk. If the doctor
does not do that, less people visit.

Forget the drug prescriptions, you see that most deliveries of babies
are through C-section. Do you really think that all of those mothers
who went through C-section didn't have ability to deliver normally?
But try to reason with any gynae and they would scare the hell out of
you and go for a C-section. I do understand that C-section is a safer
route. But whether it is the correct course of action all the time - I
beg to differ.

In the same example, today's every gynae would suggest chores of scans
and procedures during pregnancy. Please don't tell me that it is a
sweeping statement again. They call it preventive. I call it forcing,
because majority of the concerns are equally unfounded. They rarely go
case-by-case.

It was not an accusation. It was a fact! They do prescribe a lot of
drugs.

On Jun 6, 6:34 pm, arv...@neuro-spine.com wrote:
> The accusations being hurled against doctors on this forum- "But every doctor
> of today does that"- are completely unfounded.
>
> You guys need to get FACTS right before you say anything else accusatory and defamatory.
>
> Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: sriram.bm...@gmail.com
>
> Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com
> Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2012 13:00:06

> To: Opendro<open...@gmail.com>; <bangalor...@googlegroups.com>
> Reply-To: sriram.bm...@gmail.com

> > in histologic and molecular remission. The...
>
> read more »

[arv...@neuro-spine.com]

You're making as much sense as the anti-vaccine lobby.

Those are not facts. Do you have insIde knowledge of every gynaec's practice and what and when they advise and why the do so?

My mom is a OBG specialist in the city for the last 60 years and I know for a fact that she does her very best to avoid C sections.

Like I said, get your FACTS right before you pass judgment.

Aamir Khan's show was nothing but a dramatized charade against doctors. He only brought out the bad. For every negative issue he brought out there are a million positives every day, all over the world. If you can't see them, then you're cerebrally blind.

[arv...@neuro-spine.com]

Just so you know there is more than one side to every story

http://m.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=249149598531605&id=697557670&src=email_notif

Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel

-----Original Message-----

From: arv...@neuro-spine.com
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2012 14:20:28
To: Opendro<ope...@gmail.com>; <bangalor...@googlegroups.com>

Reply-To: arv...@neuro-spine.com
Subject: Re: [BBC] Re: [OT] Re: Dog Bited me today

You're making as much sense as the anti-vaccine lobby.

Those are not facts. Do you have insIde knowledge of every gynaec's practice and what and when they advise and why the do so?

My mom is a OBG specialist in the city for the last 60 years and I know for a fact that she does her very best to avoid C sections.

Like I said, get your FACTS right before you pass judgment.

Aamir Khan's show was nothing but a dramatized charade against doctors. He only brought out the bad. For every negative issue he brought out there are a million positives every day, all over the world. If you can't see them, then you're cerebrally blind.

[Opendro]

Forgot to mention:
It is not just the scan... other things like calcium, iron, tablets,
folic acid, blah blah... I don't even give cows milk or complan or
horlic to my kids but my wife has to take these tablets as I'm
supposed to consult a doctor at least for the delivery procedure. I
was surprised to learn that most parents (again sweeping?) in city
give supplements to their young children. I grew up knowing them only
fancy TV ads :)

> > > of the report the patient was recovered. Upon internal review, a ""CIM-3...
>
> read more »

[justin joseph]

Isn.t it sick to profit out of others sickness.. Some big names in the health care industry are publicly traded companies.  hope people have watched documentary sicko.  There are lot of good doctor s but as long as healthcare is a business, there will be pressure to profiteer.  Kerala government health department has rule now for providing written stats of c section.  If docs were all fine this would not have been necessary. 

[S Chidambaran]

That link comes out weird on a regular computer. I think this link is better

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=697557670

>> read more �

[S Chidambaran]

Oops,

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=453448197999996&set=a.379082572103226.99044.357809444230539&type=1&theater

[Opendro]

I'm never on one side. I'm somewhere in the middle, but you see me as
on the other side because majority are in one side :-D

If you are quoting Amir Khan for that killing of female fetus, here is
my opinion too (it might help as it would be different from most
people): I don't blame the parents or doctors. It is our society that
is sick. If parents don't want girls, there is a reason and we should
try to understand the reason. I always say, the world is for men and
women have always been slaves all over the world, though they are
mostly happy slaves :-) Again a sweeping statement? I don't think so.

Both my mother and father worked to earn and equal in educational
qualification and equal contribution towards social works and I hated
the fact that mother always had less respect in the society and had to
do all the more dirty work at home. I'm not even talking about other
male egoistic surname, blood line, inheritance, etc. etc.

Ironically, the societies or religions that talk about more respect,
dignity and protection of women are the ones who commit more crimes
(not just physical, but other injustices) against women. India is one
such society.

We have a long way to go.

On Jun 6, 7:20 pm, arv...@neuro-spine.com wrote:
> You're making as much sense as the anti-vaccine lobby.
>

[S Chidambaran]

On Wednesday 06 June 2012 07:50 PM, arv...@neuro-spine.com wrote:
> You're making as much sense as the anti-vaccine lobby.
>

You should realize that the so-called anti-vaccine lobby mostly consists
of people who have seen their children die or permanently disabled after
one or more childhood recommended vaccines, after being told by their
doctor that serious reactions are really rare.

At least try and accept that a zillion people out there have not
becoming suddenly part of co-ordinated anti-vaccine lobby after being
bit by a rabid dog.

Pun well and truly intended.

You guys are well meaning but you should also understand that because
you cannot empathise with a view point, does not mean its some random
act of nonsense.

REgards
Chiddu

[arv...@neuro-spine.com]

Rare does not mean that they never happen.

As long as the benefits outweigh the risks by a huge margin, I think its acceptable.

Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel

-----Original Message-----
From: S Chidambaran <chi...@gmail.com>
Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2012 20:12:25
To: <arv...@neuro-spine.com>
Cc: Opendro<ope...@gmail.com>; <bangalor...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [BBC] Re: [OT] Re: Dog Bited me today

[deepakvrao]

Love the way you say you spend a crore to become a Doc. I joined on
merit and paid 500 bucks or so a semester. Got all the money back when
I passed out to. So please keep your bullshit to yourself.

On Jun 6, 6:59 pm, Shreedhar Ramachandra

<shreedharramachan...@gmail.com> wrote:
> @Rajaram: I'm sure you havent see the episode in Satyamev Jayate (the show

> hosted by Amir Khan) about doctorshttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Lg0kUtS8ic

> Once you watch this, you'll realise that doctor is not advising for an MRI
> to be safe, but is purely for monetary benefits.
> The point is that when a doctor has invested so many years and almost a
> crore rupees (in a private college) to complete his degree, he surely needs
> to exploit people to get it back. Of course you cannot expect him to be
> honest and work for a government hospital with which he cant even pay the
> interest for amount invested for his education.
> Root cause: Lack of government medical colleges. Healthcare gets a low
> priority in govt. spending since the lobbying by the private hospitals
> prevents the govt from opening quality government hospitals.
>
> On Wed, Jun 6, 2012 at 4:02 PM, Apurv Manjrekar

> <apurv.manjre...@gmail.com>wrote:

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Any vaccination contains emnacipated germs that have caused the ailment.
> > In essence your body has a controlled (intended) infection.
> > The infection could be bigger than what it was intended and cause the
> > mentioned side effects. Be safe for a while and rest your body.
>

> > On Wed, 06 Jun 2012 15:54:34 +0530, Happy James <mahesh.m.ku...@gmail.com>

> > wrote:
>
> >  Hi all,
>
> >> This is to some of my friends , who have provided infomation on side
> >> effects of vaccination.
>
> >>  You know? I got scared, knowing about the many side effects of Rabbies
> >> vaccination.
>
> >>  As there are side effects of Rabbis vaccination! I have some queries?
>
> >>    1) Can i run 10 kms as usual everyday.
> >>    2) I am on a diet and Nutrition plan, any restrictions on the food i
> >> consume.
>
> >> I request Doctors in this group to provide your inputs on this, this will
> >> help me in preventing self injuries or any allergic reactions.
>
> >> Regards
> >> Mahesh M
>

> >>> Visit www.**bangalorebicyclechampionships.**com<http://www.bangalorebicyclechampionships.com>for more details

>
> > --
> > Using Opera's revolutionary email client:http://www.opera.com/mail/
>
> > --
> > biking conversations on the world famous "Bangalore Bikers Club" :)
>

> > are you a part of the bicycle racing scene?Visit www.**
> > bangalorebicyclechampionships.**com<http://www.bangalorebicyclechampionships.com>for more details

[anilk...@gmail.com]

Hi,

Just now I was bited by a dog (so strange it was a pet Lab).

After returning from work just went out for some work, it was my regular route, a downhill road. 4 people were talking outside a compound, I was just passing them, suddenly from no where this Labrador came. I don't have a second to react, it has already bited my calf (I was so lucky, no scratch, no blood...may strong calf muscle....lol...it just stopped) muscle.

I stopped the cycle, I asked them whose dog it is, they acted so smart, we don't no it is not ours. I just told them ok, (dog was still there...)lifted my bike and decided to beat the dog with the bike.
Now they were scared, told me it is their dog. With bit of some argument I left the place telling them If I see the dog on road again chasing me, will definitely beat it left right center.

What was most surprising me was, no scratch or blood and why the dog stop after a bite!!!!

Very truly,
aNIL s kadsur

Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

-----Original Message-----
From: arv...@neuro-spine.com
Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com

[deepakvrao]

Yup

On Jun 6, 7:45 pm, arv...@neuro-spine.com wrote:
> Rare does not mean that they never happen.
>
> As long as the benefits outweigh the risks by a huge margin, I think its acceptable.
> Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: S Chidambaran <chi...@gmail.com>
>
> Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com
> Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2012 20:12:25
> To: <arv...@neuro-spine.com>

> Cc: Opendro<open...@gmail.com>; <bangalor...@googlegroups.com>

[deepakvrao]

Just to clarify, I got my money back because of my results, before
someone says that there was some underhand means.

[deepakvrao]

Not strange about it being a pet. Dog owners in India have no idea how
to train/look after a dog. Not all, but I would safely say 'most'.

Sorry to hear it though.

On Jun 6, 8:14 pm, anilkad...@gmail.com wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Just now I was bited by a dog (so strange it was a pet Lab).
>
> After returning from work just went out for some work, it was my regular route, a downhill road.  4 people were talking outside a compound, I was just passing them, suddenly from no where this Labrador came.  I don't have a second to react, it has already bited my calf (I was so lucky, no scratch, no blood...may strong calf muscle....lol...it just stopped) muscle.
>
> I stopped the cycle, I asked them whose dog it is, they acted so smart, we don't no it is not ours.  I just told them ok, (dog was still there...)lifted my bike and decided to beat the dog with the bike.
> Now they were scared, told me it is their dog. With bit of some argument I left the place telling them If I see the dog on road again chasing me, will definitely beat it left right center.
>
> What was most surprising me was, no scratch or blood and why the dog stop after a bite!!!!
>
> Very truly,
> aNIL s kadsur
>
> Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: arv...@neuro-spine.com
>
> Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com
> Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2012 14:45:05
> To: S Chidambaran<chi...@gmail.com>; <bangalor...@googlegroups.com>
> Reply-To: arv...@neuro-spine.com

> Cc: Opendro<open...@gmail.com>

> Visitwww.bangalorebicyclechampionships.comfor more details

[Sameer Shisodia]

[I'm going way OT on this cycling group. Advance apologies. But this
thread has too many heels dug in.]

Doc - thats whats being questioned. I dunno what to believe - but its
a fair question. The "lobby" isn't even one - they represent nobody
but their concerns. And the "other side" has a marketing machine at
their disposal. Its dangerous to merely shrug these questions of with
a "irrational lobby" response. Science has often sided with the short
term, long term risks have been uncovered over time thru such
questions. Purging, radiation, pesticides, increasingly-antibiotics(or
at least the ways in which they're being used) have all been
questioned by a small minority for whom some empirical observations
around them didn't tie in with established, "proven" facts and
practices of the time.

So while we go ahead and do whats considered right now - let's keep an
open mind as well.

- sameer

[rushi]

I feel you Arvind, and I'm not even a real doctor.

[rushi]

Wow. Sodium choride, sucrose.. Sounds like an ideal recovery drink. Just add some chocolate milk and whey protein and you're all set.

On Tuesday, June 5, 2012 3:30:06 PM UTC+5:30, Chidambaran S( Chiddu) wrote:

Active ingredients:
• Not less than 2.5 International
Units of inactivated Rabies virus
(Flury LEP strain)
Other ingredients:
• Trometamol
• Sodium chloride
• Polygeline
• Sucrose
• Possible trace amounts:
   neomycin, chlortetracycline,
  amphotericin B,Monopotassium glutamate,Disodium edetate


The manufacture of this product
includes exposure to bovine derived
materials. No evidence exists that
any case of vCJD (considered to be
the human form of bovine
spongiform encephalitis) has resulted
from the administration of any
vaccine product.

On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 2:56 PM, deepakvrao <deepa...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think he should adequately 'educate' himself about the vaccine, read
> all about the ingredients, and maybe have a consultation with the
> 'other side', and then form an opinion as to whether he should take
> the immunization. LOL.
>
> Do you know what Rabipur contains?
>

> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150875521197989&set=a.10150455123022989.363454.287991907988&type=1&theater

>
> On Jun 5, 9:30 am, arv...@neuro-spine.com wrote:
>> You need Rabipur vaccine immediately.
>>
>> You will need 5 maybe 6 doses spread over a period of 28 days.
>>
>> ASAP

>> Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----

>> From: vijay _ A <vijhere2...@gmail.com>
>>

>> Sender: bangalore-bikers@googlegroups.com

>> Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2012 09:47:05
>> To: Happy James<mahesh.m.ku...@gmail.com>

>> Cc: Bangalore Bikers Club<bangalore-bikers@googlegroups.com>

>> > --
>> > biking conversations on the world famous "Bangalore Bikers Club" :)
>>
>> > are you a part of the bicycle racing scene?
>> > Visitwww.bangalorebicyclechampionships.comfor more details
>>

>> --
>> with regards
>> *Vijay*
>> *"Stress is better than Frustration..!!"*
>>

>> --
>> biking conversations on the world famous "Bangalore Bikers Club" :)
>>
>> are you a part of the bicycle racing scene?

>> Visitwww.bangalorebicyclechampionships.comfor more details

[sriram...@gmail.com]

Welcome back rushi.. :)

Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

---

From: rushi <rush...@gmail.com>

Sender: bangalor...@googlegroups.com

Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2012 09:47:45 -0700 (PDT)

To: <bangalor...@googlegroups.com>

Cc: deepakvrao<deepa...@gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [BBC] Re: Dog Bited me today

[Happy James]

Dear all,

 

 

Thank you for your suggestions, this thread have taken different direction. Request you to please stop replying to this thred.

Regards

Mahesh M

[Chidambaran Subramanian]

Welcome to Social Networking

Regards
Chiddu

[nilesh dhumal]

reminds be of this song....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0goZ1ONx57Q 

nelly

[rush...@gmail.com]

I missed you, buddy :) how's the RAMM preparation coming along?

Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel

---

From: sriram...@gmail.com

Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2012 16:50:10 +0000

To: rushi<rush...@gmail.com>; <bangalor...@googlegroups.com>

ReplyTo: sriram...@gmail.com

[Sampath Herga]

Brilliant!!

[ana...@gmail.com]

will add something light.

It should be "dog bit me today".
AND
"I was bitten by dog"  (not bited)

[dhawal]

... to which, Mahesh can say -- bite me! ;P

on a serious note -- i had a 'dog day afternoon' few days back.  it was little past noon, i was on the back road (challaghatta side), close to EGL software park.  couple of dogs started barking and running after me.  has happened occasionally on this stretch.  i followed my usual 'dog protocol' -- keep riding at a moderate pace, and usually the dogs stop pursuit after some time.

at times, some local guy also shouts at the dogs, and they seem to take heed.  i heard one guy shout this time, so i took heart.  then i slowed down, as there was a extra bad dip in the usually bad road.  as i slowed down, i felt a drag on my bike.  i turned and saw one dog was few feet away.  was not sure what had happened, but suspected that the dog had grabbed some part of the bike, possibly the pannier bags on the rear.  after reaching work, i checked the pannier bag, and did see a cut in one corner.  did look like the dogs doing.

that was quite unnerving.  what if it was my leg that it had had a go at. :(  now when a dog barks and runs after me when i'm bicycling, i can't help thinking of that incident

i was searching on the net to see where to report stray dogs.  any pointers?  (I found info about CUPA and www.strays.in, but not sure if they  concern themselves with these incidents.)

thanks,  -{db}.