DIY mudguard stays?

[Shankar Shastry]

As I am a cheapo and didn't want to splurge on SKS longboards for my <10k INR commuter fixie, I bought half assed plastic fenders from decathlon.

The front is a full fender while the rear is around 60% of the longboards in terms of length which doesn't actually bother me. I will attach pictures once I get home and put the bike together.

I tried to use some local mudguard holders and  they don't seem to fit. Instead of bending those things and worrying about when, not if they would fall apart and kill my tyres, I have decided to fabricate mudguard stays.

I can source all types of nuts and bolts and have access to a 13mm drill so fitting the stays on the fender or the axle nuts won't be a bother. What I need to know is what material to use since I don't have access to a blow torch or bench press. 

Any ideas? I'm thinking sheet metal, but have no clue what thickness is ideal and where to source in Bangalore.

Regards,
Shankar

[Sreepathi Pai]

Mudguard stays are essentially stainless steel wires?

Unless you want to create Wald-style stays.

http://www.amazon.com/Wald-952-26-Standard-Bicycle-Fenders/dp/B000C14KO4

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Sreepathi Pai

[Shankar Shastry]

Thanks Sree. Wald type is also fine if I can source it, preferably cut to size. Determining the size is pretty easy and so is drilling holes etc but cutting would be preferably at purchase. What thickness should I be looking for?

Also, I thought of stainless steel wire - I am unable to decide on thickness. So, was wondering if anyone had done something similar before. I guess wires would be generally available at any hardware store, no?

Ideas?

[Sreepathi Pai]

Stainless steel wires thickness is 4mm or 5mm (dia). The thickness
will decide the R-clips or daruma-style bolts you'll need (or vice
versa).

Don't know about Wald-style/Schwinn-style stays. They seem to be
stamped sheet metal for rigidity (?).

[Shankar Shastry]

Thanks Sree. Sheet metal is more difficult to source and not as flexible/cheap I would imagine. I will go check in nearby stores if I can find 5mm steel wires. This seems to be the easier option and hopefully cheaper as well. Will report back.

[Georg Leuzinger]

4-5 mm is far too thick, (i would call that rods in context of cycle parts) use spokes, they are 1.5 - 2mm thick, use extra long spokes, you can bend them and form eyes to put 3mm bolts through........., and at the axle side weld the spoke to a washer and put the washer under the axle nut, that will work fine........

cheers Georg

[Shankar Shastry]

Interesting. Hadn't thought of that, thanks. For now, I have decided to cut old number plates which came with my car and use them as stays. Hopefully the nearest glass and plywood store will cut it for cheap and I can make fine adjustments with a hacksaw and drill at my disposal. Will report back once done, else I will take the spoke route...

An easier DIY with the spokes would actually be making a thin hole in the mudguards, pulling the spokes through and sealing it with nipples on the other side and make eyes on the axle side instead. This would allow slight flexibility in adjustment/ease in taking off the wheels etc.

[Sreepathi Pai]

Whatever you do, post pics! This seems to be an interesting DIY.

The longest spokes available in the marker at 310 (or 300mm). Look for
13 gauge if you want thicker spokes.

[Shankar Shastry]

Version 1 complete

I had a little bit of time before rushing to office today and I started work on the stays. I had those local stays lying around so I split them, drilled holes and punched one end into and out of the plastic fenders in U shape and the other side, I bent them into a hole which I need to bolt on. This was for the left side of the wheel and I had originally done it from outside to inside but since I thought it would poke the tyre at some point(sharp edges ahoy), I reversed it from outside to inside.

For the other end of the wheel, I did the same thing but at a different angle partly because I got lazy bending that damn thing so much and partly because I actually like the look of asymmetrical stays - easy to get the wheel out of one side in the event of a puncture.

Couple of things I learned are 

1. The local mudguard stays are actually 4mm in size and look very very sturdy indeed, but easily bendable. I made 4.5mm holes with a HSS drill bit and the 4mm just slid right in with a little push
2. In comparison, SKS uses what feels like 3mm size but with a very unique eyelid bolt design and kinda difficult to bend with bare hands

For now, I will bolt these on and ride for a while. But since I have some eyelid bolts lying around from my earlier collection of bolts, I think I would go ahead and get some 3mm stainless steel rods, cut them to size and bolt them on with the eyelid bolts a la SKS.

I also need to extend the front mudguard all the way down like the longboards, will look at bolting on a reflector as well during that extension process. Will also work on rear mudguards later - that needs a lot of extension and I'm thinking of hacking up something from motorbike chainguards or really thin plywood.

Will share full bike pictures once it looks kind of nice :P

[Opendro]

Spokes won't work, because they are too flexible/bendable. I made tongs for compost bin using three spokes a year ago. It was mostly unusable. Mud guards need more rigidity than a compost bin tong.

[Shankar Shastry]

Good thing I didn't use spokes then. Check out my post with pictures for version 1. Will make better stays a little later

[Karthick Gururaj]

Hi Shankar,

Just curious.. from the last two pics (..091018.. and ..091010..), it
looks like the stays attached to the mud guard asymmetrically.. is
that correct? Was it intentional? Also, from the ..084727.. pic, looks
like the clearance between the mudguard and the tyre is very less..?
- Karthick

[Shankar Shastry]

In 084727 the front bit is not mounted so it is actually hanging. There is actually about 5mm spacing between the fully inflated tyre and mudguard after fitting. So I guess it's not much of a bother.

The asymmetrical mounting was intentional. I thought it would be easy to flick off the wheel by opening up only one of the stays. Yet to test this of course...

[Shankar Shastry]

In 084727 the front bit is not mounted so it is actually hanging. There is actually about 5mm spacing between the fully inflated tyre and mudguard after fitting. So I guess it's not much of a bother.

The asymmetrical mounting was intentional. I thought it would be easy to flick off the wheel by opening up only one of the stays. Yet to test this of course...

On Thu, Oct 30, 2014 at 5:16 PM, Karthick Gururaj <karthick...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Shankar Shastry]

And so it didn't work. The stays are really small so the wheel well is not spaced out enough for the tyres to move unobstructed. Will try the number plate next and report back.

[Shankar Shastry]

Success. Instead of the number plate, I used an easy to cut college library flex board (no arguments on how it was sourced :P) which I had lying around. Used a hacksaw to cut it only to realise I can use a regular paper cutter.

Although the stays look a bit flimsy and waver around a little bit, I think I got the fitting downright perfect. The stays have been fit using 6mm zip ties which look as good as factory fit so I won't bother mounting them with screws. I also took this opportunity to upgrade brake housing to some jagwire ones I flicked from another bike, install a new seat post, lube brake cables, wrap stem cap in carbon fiber vinyl, true the wheels to perfection and remove overspray on the brake calipers with some acetone, thereby bringing them back to their original condition and colour. I must say I am quite satisfied with how the thing looks and rides now. Win.



PS : removed chainstay guard cuz it doesn't belong there.

[Opendro]

Don't tell me that you don't have a metal sheet cutter scissors and nail to make hole on metal sheet. You cannot do a DYI on such things without these two tools. You cannot use paper cutter scissors for cutting metal sheets. And it is total waste of effort using hacksaw blade and it will be unclean job. But yes, you need hacksaw blade, metal file, etc. too.

[Opendro]

Apparently, a quick googling showed me that the name is snips : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snips I still don't know what the other nail is called. I just describe the job to a hardware shop in city market and get the tool.

[Shankar Shastry]

Nope. I don't have metal sheet cutter scissors. This is a flex board so there's hardly a need for such heavy cutting tools.

[R. Venkatachalam]

is that mudguard cheapo 299 decathlon city fenders? the guy in the store told me it will be difficult to fit it in my bike (fixie). Need to see how you have done it.

On Monday, November 17, 2014 12:14:42 PM UTC+5:30, Shankar Shastry wrote:

[R. Venkatachalam]

btw, do you commute on this regularly? If so, I will be proud to say I know a certain someone who has a certain high end car yet is so simple and down to earth and commute by a simple bicycle! :)

On Monday, November 17, 2014 12:14:42 PM UTC+5:30, Shankar Shastry wrote:

[Opendro]

Car should be more down to earth than bicycle, right?

[R Venkatachalam]

Depends.... I am measuring ground clearance when the pedal position on a small size bike frame with 180 mm crank arm is at 6 'o' clock, against scorpio ground clearance.

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Best Regards,
R. Venkatachalam

[Opendro]

Oh! I forgot that people call scorpio a car too ;-)

[Shankar Shastry]

Lol. yes I know that certain someone too, obviously :P.

Anyway, "difficult" is a clue. These are the same el cheapo decathlon mudguards which were a difficult fit on my fixie. A little bit of cutting on the rear mudguard, a bit of drilling and zip tying the stays and it is as good as a basic SKS - and light too.

I don't see why you shouldn't try this on your fixie. If you want white mudguards to go with your bike's theme, all you have to do is spray paint the hell out of it. That's what I did to the whole bike which was purple to start with and is now a nice flat black.

[Sandeep]

First, you have brakes(excusable). But then, you have mud guards and to top it off you have a saddle bag. Fixie blasphemy :-)
You might as well put some gears on it and complete the sacrilege :-D

[R Venkatachalam]

+100

Shankar - please throw away that fixie asap, you are a disgrace to the fixie community

(PS: Let me know where you are throwing it, and when)

On Mon, Nov 17, 2014 at 5:17 PM, Sandeep <san...@gmail.com> wrote:

First, you have brakes(excusable). But then, you have mud guards and to top it off you have a saddle bag. Fixie blasphemy :-)
You might as well put some gears on it and complete the sacrilege :-D

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Best Regards,
R. Venkatachalam

[R Venkatachalam]

Ok will try this... might not paint white because this is for temporary use. Will eventually get white sks fenders + p clamps. for now, this would do I think.

another option : http://fixieindia.com/collections/fenders/products/ass-savers

[Abhishek Madan]

As Eddie Merckx famously said. "Show me a man without brakes on his fixie, and I will show you a potential LIC customer."

[Shankar Shastry]

Lol. Hilarious, the lot of you. And I ride only SS side these days so technically all this is allowed.

In other news, the stays held on after a commute day with a heavy chain resting on the stays, local cycle shop flat fixing and very very rough roads. Also figured out the valve extenders I have on the bike are schrader pump compatible. Total win.

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[Shankar Shastry]

You can make this ass saver at home. There are many templates online. I made a DIY mudguard(fork saver) for my MTB with the HCC components template and a 20 rupees stick file.

SKS chromoplastic mudguards are really nice. I had them on the schwin cutter and it stayed white and round beautifully. Let me know if you want to do a group buy on CRC.

[Shankar Shastry]

Update :  I tested the mudguard stays against toe overlap today. Toe -1, Stays - 0. Need to work on a different design - number plate is looking really good now.

[Prashanth Chengi]

Toe? Your toe hits the mudguard when you turn? Are you turning super-big or is it sticking out that much? The sticking out didn't seem so apparent in the pics. Thanks for the DYI info. I might try something similar myself!

/Prashanth

[Shankar Shastry]

It doesn't really "stick out" per se. Most compact frames have toe overlap and it really doesn't bother you much or is noticeable while riding. This particular frame has a very slight toe overlap.

I deliberately swiped the mudguard stay from the bottom to see how strong it is and the stay failed to keep up. A bit harsh of me, but I'd rather have it fail while I'm still testing it out.

[Sreepathi Pai]

Need photos of the stays, not the bike ;) But since you provided one, co-incidentally I saw this yesterday:

http://imgur.com/8ZARSHP

You're missing the purple crank and stem!

[Shankar Shastry]

Oh I destroyed the stays today and working on a new design. I'll send pictures once done. The crank on this bike was purple and is painted over in flat black.

[Shankar Shastry]

But yeah, I did wanna show off. lol

[Shankar Shastry]

I've been a bit busy since I updated this thread and was able to go on only one more ride before I decided on a new material for stays. Hacked these stays with a drill and you can see the haphazard cutting though the holes are pretty neat for my skillset. Anyway, here are some pictures. Yet to test this over a couple of rides. These stays feel slightly less flimsy, wonder how long before they crumble.

[Opendro]

First, they look horrible. Second, that is not the right material. Even a regular steel wire would have been better.

Is there some website where we can make an entry for worst DYI? :-P

[Shankar Shastry]

Lol. I find them plenty nice for a commuter. It looks ghetto enough to not be stolen anyway. As long as it works, I can always paint it or wrap it in carbon fiber vinyl as well ;). Let us see how long this even lasts before taking such extreme steps.

[Shankar Shastry]

Rode the bike today to office and this works just perfect, for now. A couple toe overlaps didn't deter the stays and they have stayed for 12kms. Will report back in a week or two and take measurements so I can make new ones without trial and error, next time.