Why does Costco pizza suck

[pfraser]

I sometimes go to technical meetings where pizza
is provided before the meetings. The pizza can come
from a number of sources depending on the meeting organizer.

Costco is always the worst by a large margin.
In fact, Costco pizza is much worse than Round Table,
Domino's, Fat Slice, Blondie's, etc, etc.

I don't know why this is on two levels.

Firstly, I don't know what it is about the pizza that makes
me dislike it so much. By the time it is brought to the
meetings it is often lukewarm, but I've had many other pizzas
that are lukewarm (or cold) and that I preferred to the Costco.

Secondly, assuming other people have same the contempt for
Costco pizza that I do, why can Costco they not do better?
I'm used to most Costco products being high quality.
Why do they fail so miserably with their pizza?

Pete

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <ju49mo$blt$1...@dont-email.me>,

pfraser <pete_...@comcast.net> wrote:
>I'm used to most Costco products being high quality.
>Why do they fail so miserably with their pizza?

Whole Foods pizza is also notably bad.

[Steve Pope]

Todd Michel McComb <mcc...@medieval.org> wrote:

>pfraser <pete_...@comcast.net> wrote:

>>I'm used to most Costco products being high quality.
>>Why do they fail so miserably with their pizza?

>Whole Foods pizza is also notably bad.

Are these frozen pizzas, or are they from the prepared food
sections of these stores?

Among frozen pizza, I think Trader Joe's is by far the best.

I've heard Costco is a tough negotiator, and they also tend
to demand large-sized products. (Haven't seen their pizzas
but are they larger than normal?)

Steve

[Peter Lawrence]

Far worse than Costco's IMHO.


- Peter

[Peter Lawrence]

In regards to Costco pizza, unless they have gone downhill the past year
(haven't had one since last year), the combo which I usually get has always
been alright, not great but not awful either, better than most frozen pizzas
but nothing to write home about either. Maybe the quality of Costco pizza
varies by location. From which Costco does your company pick up its pizza?


- Peter

[Peter Lawrence]

On 7/17/12 11:13 AM, Steve Pope wrote:
>
> I've heard Costco is a tough negotiator, and they also tend
> to demand large-sized products. (Haven't seen their pizzas
> but are they larger than normal?)

I presume the OP is referring to the Costco pizza that's made fresh and
baked on the premises of Costco, not any type of frozen variety that Costco
might carry.


- Peter

[Steve Pope]

Peter Lawrence <humm...@aol.com> wrote:

>I presume the OP is referring to the Costco pizza that's made fresh and
>baked on the premises of Costco, not any type of frozen variety that Costco
>might carry.

Do they use actual pizza ovens?

(I haven't been in a Costco in years.)


Steve

[pfraser]

I haven't tried that.
I don't shop at Whole Foods much, but I once bought
one of their prepared sushi packs, and it was
surprisingly bad.

[Peter Lawrence]

Yes.


- Peter

[pfraser]

Steve Pope wrote:
>
> Are these frozen pizzas, or are they from the prepared food
> sections of these stores?

I'm assuming they're ordered hot from the pizza / hot-dog
department.

>
> Among frozen pizza, I think Trader Joe's is by far the best.

Agreed. My current favorite is the Arugula.
Unfortunately they dropped the Gorgonzola and Pear many years ago.
I'm also beginning to fear that they have dropped the
"Three plus Blue" flatbread (though they still have the other
two flatbreads from the same series.

>
> I've heard Costco is a tough negotiator, and they also tend
> to demand large-sized products. (Haven't seen their pizzas
> but are they larger than normal?)

Perhaps.

[pfraser]

Peter Lawrence wrote:
>
> I presume the OP is referring to the Costco pizza that's made fresh and
> baked on the premises of Costco, not any type of frozen variety that
> Costco might carry.

Yes. He is.

[pfraser]

Steve Pope wrote:

>
> Do they use actual pizza ovens?
>
> (I haven't been in a Costco in years.)
>

I think so.

[sf]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 11:08:19 -0700, pfraser <pete_...@comcast.net>
wrote:

I don't have the same contempt for Costco pizza that you have, but I
haven't eaten it for a very long time. Back when I did eat it, I
thought it was superior to most (all that I'd tasted) chain pizzas.

--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

[sf]

Why would anyone expect places like Costco and Whole Foods to have
pizza that's better than your local mom & pop pizzeria?

[pfraser]

Peter Lawrence wrote:
> Maybe the quality
> of Costco pizza varies by location. From which Costco does your company
> pick up its pizza?

It's not my company, so I don't know.
The meetings are usually in Santa Clara, so I assume
they're from round there.

I think the pizza is consistent in quality with the
slices that I can order at Richmond or San Leandro
(but I don't often, because they're not very good).

I do like their large chocolate-dipped ice cream though.
Huge, low-cost, and dipped in chocolate and nuts
while you wait.

[pfraser]

sf wrote:

> Why would anyone expect places like Costco and Whole Foods to have
> pizza that's better than your local mom & pop pizzeria?

I don't, but Costco often has good food (their meat
selection is quite good and reasonably priced).

I wasn't so much comparing them with mom & pop; I had
set the bar pretty low by mentioning Round Table, Blondie's
and Domino's.

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <ju49vr$96l$1...@blue-new.rahul.net>,

Steve Pope <spo...@speedymail.org> wrote:
>Are these frozen pizzas, or are they from the prepared food
>sections of these stores?

I was referring to the hot food pizzas at WF. Much of their hot
food is decent.

[Steve Pope]

pfraser <pete_...@comcast.net> wrote:

>I wasn't so much comparing them with mom & pop; I had
>set the bar pretty low by mentioning Round Table, Blondie's
>and Domino's.

Isn't Blondie's vastly better than either of these other two?


Steve

[sf]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 11:47:04 -0700, pfraser <pete_...@comcast.net>
wrote:

I've never eaten a Blondie's pizza, but I'd rather go hungry than eat
Round Table or Domino's again.

[sf]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 11:43:57 -0700, pfraser <pete_...@comcast.net>
wrote:

> I do like their large chocolate-dipped ice cream though.
> Huge, low-cost, and dipped in chocolate and nuts
> while you wait.

I will try that when I get out of my hot dog phase. I'm too full
after eating one of those to order anything else.

[Steve Pope]

sf <sf.u...@gmail.com> wrote:

>I've never eaten a Blondie's pizza, but I'd rather go hungry than eat
>Round Table or Domino's again.

I agree. They put lots of sugar in the pizza dough, to make it
appealing to kids, and it's really offputting, even if you can
tolerate the low standards of the topping ingredients.


Steve

[pfraser]

I think Domino's is the worst of the three.
I used to work across the street from round table, and
would have them prepare an individual pizza for me.
I often had the jalapeno and anchovies, and it wasn't
bad. Blondie's is just OK.

[sf]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 11:32:48 -0700, pfraser <pete_...@comcast.net>
wrote:

> I don't shop at Whole Foods much, but I once bought
> one of their prepared sushi packs, and it was
> surprisingly bad.

I stayed away from grocery store sushi for a long time because it's
always horrible... then the local Safeway put in a sushi station after
they remodeled. I only buy the ones that are hard to mess up, so I
think it's pretty good now.

[pfraser]

sf wrote:
>
> I stayed away from grocery store sushi for a long time because it's
> always horrible... then the local Safeway put in a sushi station after
> they remodeled. I only buy the ones that are hard to mess up, so I
> think it's pretty good now.
>

I used to work at the north end of Alameda, and would
buy Albertson's prepared sushi. It was, much to my surprise,
good. By way of calibration I would rate Costco's as
tolerable, and Whole Food's as intolerable.

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <ju4dj6$4d0$1...@dont-email.me>,

pfraser <pete_...@comcast.net> wrote:
>I think Domino's is the worst of the three.

Domino's recently improved their pizzas, I'm told. I haven't jumped
at the chance to find out personally, but credible sources have
told me so. I imagine it's about on par with Costco now.

(It used to be really terrible, I agree.)

I've managed to avoid Pizza Hut for years, but their TV commercials
have become frightening.

[Peter Lawrence]

It's not difficult to make and bake a *good* tasting pizza. To make & bake
the *best* tasting pizzas take some skill, but like burgers, it shouldn't be
that hard to make and serve a pizza that tastes alright.


- Peter

[Peter Lawrence]

On 7/17/12 11:56 AM, Todd Michel McComb wrote:
>
> I was referring to the hot food pizzas at WF. Much of their hot
> food is decent.

Like what? Please give examples.

I tried three hot items from Whole Foods and gave up. None were worth the
inflated prices but the pizza was downright awful.


- Peter

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <ju4evg$cuv$2...@dont-email.me>,

Peter Lawrence <humm...@aol.com> wrote:
>I tried three hot items from Whole Foods and gave up. None were
>worth the inflated prices but the pizza was downright awful.

Well, I'm not going to argue that it's a good deal, but sometimes
that's the best available choice (for me). Locations might vary,
but their made-to-order Asian noodle soups are perfectly acceptable.
They have some prime rib (or similar) dinners that are as good as
the typical American sitdown place. The Mexican steam tray stuff
is likewise comparable to local Mexican places. Their rotisserie
chickens are pretty good (certainly better than Safeway's).

[Peter Lawrence]

Has any of those items been from the Los Altos Whole Foods or from other
locations?

I tried the hot items from the Los Altos Whole Foods since that's the one
closest to my house and the one I visit most frequently.


- Peter

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <ju4g8l$k96$1...@dont-email.me>,

Peter Lawrence <humm...@aol.com> wrote:
>Has any of those items been from the Los Altos Whole Foods or from
>other locations?

It's a mix, but that's the only place I remember the Asian soup
stand. They also have the meat dinners. These things tend to
regress to the mean on price, meaning their versions of cheap foods
are expensive, and their versions of expensive foods (like prime
rib) aren't so expensive.

[spamtrap1888]

On Jul 17, 11:08 am, pfraser <pete_fra...@comcast.net> wrote:
> I sometimes go to technical meetings where pizza
> is provided before the meetings. The pizza can come
> from a number of sources depending on the meeting organizer.
>
> Costco is always the worst by a large margin.
> In fact, Costco pizza is much worse than Round Table,
> Domino's, Fat Slice, Blondie's, etc, etc.
>
> I don't know why this is on two levels.
>
> Firstly, I don't know what it is about the pizza that makes
> me dislike it so much. By the time it is brought to the
> meetings it is often lukewarm, but I've had many other pizzas
> that are lukewarm (or cold) and that I preferred to the Costco.
>
> Secondly, assuming other people have same the contempt for
> Costco pizza that I do, why can Costco they not do better?

> I'm used to most Costco products being high quality.
> Why do they fail so miserably with their pizza?

Ingredients are cheap and scanty. You can just about count the number
of cheese shreds they used. Think of it as "pizza bread."

[Tim May]

We at the Schadenfreude Institute awarded Whole Foods with the 2005
Medal of Honor for ""Best Libertarian Fake-Out of Leftist,
Granola-Munching, Vegan-Leaning Blissninnies."

Best quote from one of the WF customers surveyed for the Award: "Like,
why do I pay more for 365 Brand at Whole Foods? It's, like, organic!"

--
Tim May

[Al Eisner]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012, pfraser wrote:

> Steve Pope wrote:
>>
>> Are these frozen pizzas, or are they from the prepared food
>> sections of these stores?
>
> I'm assuming they're ordered hot from the pizza / hot-dog
> department.
>
>>
>> Among frozen pizza, I think Trader Joe's is by far the best.
>
> Agreed. My current favorite is the Arugula.
> Unfortunately they dropped the Gorgonzola and Pear many years ago.
> I'm also beginning to fear that they have dropped the
> "Three plus Blue" flatbread (though they still have the other
> two flatbreads from the same series.

Is that the same series as the Alsace? If so, yes, good stuff (both).
Why not just ask customer service at your store? Sometimes it's a local
decision not to carry a product, but if TJ's still provides it the store
might be persuadable to restore it.

>> I've heard Costco is a tough negotiator, and they also tend
>> to demand large-sized products. (Haven't seen their pizzas
>> but are they larger than normal?)
>
> Perhaps.

--

Al Eisner
San Mateo Co., CA

[Al Eisner]

Most local pizzerias aren't very good. The City, with its larger Italian-
American populatio, might be an exception. That is, it sort-of depends
on "whose mom?", "whose pop". On the Peninsula, at least, I would pick
pick Round Table over nearly all of these one-off locals. (Not that I
ever go to Round Table locally unless a group choice.) Actually, I'm
rather surprised that Whole Food doesn't do better than they do.

[Al Eisner]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012, sf wrote:

> On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 11:43:57 -0700, pfraser <pete_...@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>
>> I do like their large chocolate-dipped ice cream though.
>> Huge, low-cost, and dipped in chocolate and nuts
>> while you wait.
>
> I will try that when I get out of my hot dog phase. I'm too full
> after eating one of those to order anything else.

Just one? So I take it you're not competing with Sonya Thomas. (Or,
being less gender-specifc, with Joey Chestnut.)

[pfraser]

Pete:
> I'm also beginning to fear that [TJs] have dropped the

> "Three plus Blue" flatbread (though they still have the other
> two flatbreads from the same series.

Al:

> Is that the same series as the Alsace? If so, yes, good stuff (both).
> Why not just ask customer service at your store? Sometimes it's a local
> decision not to carry a product, but if TJ's still provides it the store
> might be persuadable to restore it.

It's not the same as the Alsace.

The other two in the series are Tomato and Pesto and
Wild Mushroom and Black Truffle.

I have asked a couple of times, and received vague answers.

[Al Eisner]

So is their pizza. (There's one function I attend where the host insists
on ordering their pizza.) Domino's used to be comparable, so your news
is interesting, but, like you, I'm not jumping. In fact, in my
experience with the big chains (mostly long past), Round Table was
considerably better than any of the others. And recent (involuntary)
experiences there haven't been all that bad either.

[Al Eisner]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012, Todd Michel McComb wrote:

At Redwood City, the most reliably good item is the teriyaki chicken
rice bowl, preferably with their brown rice. (They have veggie versions
as well.) I've had reasonably fresh fried chicken from them that was
surpringly good, but it's less reliable -- I've also had it dried out.
Their rotisserie chickens are usualy good (various flavorings). And
sometimes they've had good pulled pork or pot roast (best to inspect
first for excessive prportions of fat). Etc.

[Peter Lawrence]

On 7/17/12 2:24 PM, Al Eisner wrote:
> On Tue, 17 Jul 2012, Todd Michel McComb wrote:
>>
>> I've managed to avoid Pizza Hut for years, but their TV commercials
>> have become frightening.
>
> So is their pizza. (There's one function I attend where the host insists
> on ordering their pizza.) Domino's used to be comparable, so your news
> is interesting, but, like you, I'm not jumping.

Well sort of. Domino's used to also be terrible but in a very different way
than Pizza Hut.

Pizza Hut is simply the greasiest, most disgusting pizza I ever had the
displeasure of eating.

Domino's wasn't nearly as greasy but their crust was the definitive example
of a cardboard tasting pizza crust and their cheese was anything but real.
And their toppings tended to taste as synthetic as their cheese.


- Peter

[sf]

I can't tolerate either crust. Just can't focus on anything else.
Horrible, horrible, horrible.

[sf]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 12:14:40 -0700, pfraser <pete_...@comcast.net>
wrote:

I liked Round Table as long as they used a real pizza oven. After
they went to the conveyor belt method of cooking, the relationship was
over AFAIWC.

[sf]

Sad to say that joke whizzed right over my head, but I'll assume
you're talking about hot dog eating contests.

[Peter Lawrence]

On 7/17/12 4:16 PM, sf wrote:
>
> I liked Round Table as long as they used a real pizza oven. After
> they went to the conveyor belt method of cooking, the relationship was
> over AFAIWC.

The older Round Table Pizza locations usually still have the old-style pizza
ovens. I've only seen the conveyor belt ovens at the newest or (some but
not all) of the remolded locations. YMMV.


- Peter

[sf]

I wouldn't have a problem with that and (IMO) there *is* such a thing
as too much sauce or cheese. As far as the other ingredients go, I
prefer vegetables or mushrooms on my pizza, no meat unless it's a
little chicken or preserved meat so it's hard to mess up if they use
fresh vegetables. I am a crust snob and it has to be the way I like
it (thin and crispy, but not crackerlike) or I'm not returning.

[Al Eisner]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012, sf wrote:

> On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 14:19:48 -0700, Al Eisner
> <eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 17 Jul 2012, sf wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 11:43:57 -0700, pfraser <pete_...@comcast.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I do like their large chocolate-dipped ice cream though.
>>>> Huge, low-cost, and dipped in chocolate and nuts
>>>> while you wait.
>>>
>>> I will try that when I get out of my hot dog phase. I'm too full
>>> after eating one of those to order anything else.
>>
>> Just one? So I take it you're not competing with Sonya Thomas. (Or,
>> being less gender-specifc, with Joey Chestnut.)
>
> Sad to say that joke whizzed right over my head, but I'll assume
> you're talking about hot dog eating contests.

Yes, sorry about that. For example,
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/04/nathans-hot-dog-eating-contest-2012-joey-chestunut-wins_n_1649345.html

But, actually, there was nothing to "get" beyond what you got!

[Peter Lawrence]

On 7/17/12 4:28 PM, sf wrote:
>
> I am a crust snob and it has to be the way I like
> it (thin and crispy, but not crackerlike) or I'm not returning.

I guess you're not a fan of Chicago deep-dish pizza then.

;)

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <ju4td2$657$2...@dont-email.me>,

Peter Lawrence <humm...@aol.com> wrote:
>I guess you're not a fan of Chicago deep-dish pizza then.

I like the more Neapolitan thin crust pizzas or their cousins, which
I eat fairly regularly, but I have nothing really against a
Chicago-style. I consider it a different food (and don't eat it
nearly as often).

[Peter Lawrence]

While my preference nowadays is for thin NY York-style thin-crust pizza, I
too still enjoy pizza from a variety of styles, be it Neapolitan to Chicago
deep-dish and any in between just as long as main building blocks of the
pizza, the crust, the sauce, the cheese and any additional toppings, are of
high quality and prepared and cooked in an excellent manner.


- Peter

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <ju4tvh$9dg$1...@dont-email.me>,

Peter Lawrence <humm...@aol.com> wrote:
>While my preference nowadays is for thin NY York-style thin-crust
>pizza, I too still enjoy pizza from a variety of styles, be it
>Neapolitan to Chicago deep-dish and any in between just as long as
>main building blocks of the pizza, the crust, the sauce, the cheese
>and any additional toppings, are of high quality and prepared and
>cooked in an excellent manner.

I can't disagree with this as stated, since who wouldn't like
everything to be excellent, but I can't actually think of any "in
between" crusts that I consider excellent. Perhaps they exist.

(And I eat a lot of no-sauce pizza, so don't think of that as an
independent item.)

Good balance is important too, as I'm sure you'll agree, and the
right balance between a thin Neapolitan crust and a Chicago pie is
very different. The latter really is more like a pie, in some ways
more akin to another meat pie than a pizza, but also can be good.

[Peter Lawrence]

On 7/17/12 5:09 PM, Todd Michel McComb wrote:
>
> I can't disagree with this as stated, since who wouldn't like
> everything to be excellent, but I can't actually think of any "in
> between" crusts that I consider excellent. Perhaps they exist.

Usually what's called "Sicilian-style" pizzas tend to have what I would call
medium-thick crusts. Also some California-style pizzas like those from
Applewood in Menlo Park usually have medium-thick crusts too.


- Peter

[SMS]

On 7/17/2012 11:08 AM, pfraser wrote:

> Secondly, assuming other people have same the contempt for
> Costco pizza that I do, why can Costco they not do better?
> I'm used to most Costco products being high quality.
> Why do they fail so miserably with their pizza?

I find Costco pizza to be far superior to Round Table or Domino's, can't
really say about Fat Slice or Blondie's.

But I find that the only way Costco pizza is any good is if it's heated
up on the rack of an oven or toaster oven, as specified in the reheating
instructions on the box, until the crust is more crispy. Otherwise I
find it way too soggy for my liking.

The real problem is that pizza is a bad food for meetings because
invariably it will be cold by the time it's served.

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <500612f8$0$46628$742e...@news.sonic.net>,

SMS <scharf...@geemail.com> wrote:
>The real problem is that pizza is a bad food for meetings because
>invariably it will be cold by the time it's served.

Good pizza is perfectly good at room temperature.

Like beer.

[SMS]

It's nothing like beer.

[Steve Pope]

But it uses beer yeast.


S.

[sf]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 16:22:00 -0700, Peter Lawrence <humm...@aol.com>
wrote:

I think the location I frequented was remodeled, but AFAIWC they
remodeled to include that frackin' conveyor belt. It happened at
least 20 years ago, maybe 25 and I haven't been back because their
"new" pizza method sucked. I don't "do" chains, so one is the same as
all the others in my view.

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <sna62ux7...@sqwertz.com>,
Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost> wrote:

>On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 18:10:08 +0000 (UTC), Todd Michel McComb wrote:
>> Whole Foods pizza is also notably bad.

>Not here in Austin.

Interesting. Here they have what looks like it should be decent
pizza, and they have what appears to be a reasonable pizza oven
(this is at multiple locations, but not all), but the results have
been extremely underwhelming -- almost flavorless. I have suspected
that it might be about using "healthful" ingredients, but I don't
really know.

[sf]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 16:29:45 -0700, Al Eisner

Thanks, I only got what I got from the context - not because those
names meant anything to me. :) Getting back to the ice cream, my
husband says he's gotten the bar that they dip in chocolate & roll in
nuts and (I'm quoting here) "it's really good".

[Steve Pope]

Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost> wrote:

>> Steve Pope wrote:

>>> Do they use actual pizza ovens?

>They use conveyors like Pizza Slut. The same CostCo conveyors cook
>other things such as their Chicken/Carne Asada Bake and their Turkey
>Panini thing, so it's one temperature/time cooks all.

If this is true it explains much.


Steve

[sf]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 16:44:34 -0700, Peter Lawrence <humm...@aol.com>
wrote:

I won't say I hate it because it's not real pizza to me, but I haven't
had a deep dish pizza since the peak of the popularity of Uno here in
SF. Additionally, the last couple of times I ate there I ordered a
regular style (thin crust) wild mushroom pizza. :)

[sf]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 18:05:14 -0700, Peter Lawrence <humm...@aol.com>
wrote:

Someday I might find a medium crust pizza that I like in California
someday, but so far the only one's I truly like are in Sicily and of
course, my own.

[sf]

I use bread yeast for pizza.

[spamtrap1888]

On Jul 17, 8:09 pm, sf <s...@geemail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 16:44:34 -0700, Peter Lawrence <hummb...@aol.com>

> wrote:
>
> > On 7/17/12 4:28 PM, sf wrote:
>
> > > I am a crust snob and it has to be the way I like
> > > it (thin and crispy, but not crackerlike) or I'm not returning.
>
> > I guess you're not a fan of Chicago deep-dish pizza then.
>
> > ;)
>
> I won't say I hate it because it's not real pizza to me, but I haven't
> had a deep dish pizza since the peak of the popularity of Uno here in
> SF.  Additionally, the last couple of times I ate there I ordered a
> regular style (thin crust) wild mushroom pizza.   :)

The UNO satellite outlets sucked. The pizza tasted as if it had been
prebaked at some central commissary, frozen and shipped.

It's fun to see what they turned into, though: Chinese buffets, etc.

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <llf3a8pg...@sqwertz.com>,
Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost> wrote:
>They use some non traditional toppings sometimes - a little too
>"adventurous" (phoney) sometimes. But of the standard toppings
>they use are all really good - especially the cheese and the crust
>can't be beat.

Yeah, I'm thinking of their pepperoni pizza (as a reasonable point
of comparison). Who knows.

[Peter Lawrence]

On 7/17/12 6:49 PM, Todd Michel McComb wrote:
>
> Good pizza is perfectly good at room temperature.
>
> Like beer.

+1

[Peter Lawrence]

On 7/17/12 9:51 PM, Sqwertz wrote:
>
> Of course it's true. Well, errr... mostly.
>
> http://www.energysolutionscenter.org/docs/uploads/Case_Studies/Pizza_Oven_Costco.pdf
>
> (Says they sell 20 million pizzas a year - that was in 2005)

According to the case study, "Costco�s natural gas-fired
ovens yield perfect pizzas".

So how could Costco pizzas be anything but the best!

;)

[pfraser]

Sqwertz wrote:
>
> They use some non traditional toppings sometimes - a little too
> "adventurous" (phoney) sometimes. But of the standard toppings they
> use are all really good - especially the cheese and the crust can't be
> beat.

I haven't tried any of their pizzas, but find it quite unlikely
that the cheese can't be beat by the cheeseboard.

[evergene]

Peter Lawrence wrote:

>On 7/17/12 2:24 PM, Al Eisner wrote:
>> On Tue, 17 Jul 2012, Todd Michel McComb wrote:
>>>
>>> I've managed to avoid Pizza Hut for years, but their TV commercials
>>> have become frightening.
>>
>> So is their pizza. (There's one function I attend where the host insists
>> on ordering their pizza.) Domino's used to be comparable, so your news
>> is interesting, but, like you, I'm not jumping.
>
>Well sort of. Domino's used to also be terrible but in a very different way
>than Pizza Hut.
>
>Pizza Hut is simply the greasiest, most disgusting pizza I ever had the
>displeasure of eating.
>
>Domino's wasn't nearly as greasy but their crust was the definitive example
>of a cardboard tasting pizza crust and their cheese was anything but real.
>And their toppings tended to taste as synthetic as their cheese.
>
>
>- Peter

You made me curious about Domino's's history.

Some nifty moments in Domino's's history, from
http://www.dominosbiz.com/Biz-Public-EN/Site+Content/Secondary/About+Dominos/History/

1960
Tom Monaghan and his brother, James, purchase "DomiNick's," a pizza
store in Ypsilanti, Mich. Monaghan borrowed $500 to buy the store.

1961
James Monaghan trades his half of the business to Tom for a Volkswagen
Beetle.

1965
Tom Monaghan, the sole owner of company, renames the business
"Domino's Pizza, Inc."

1998
Domino's Pizza opens its 6,000th store in San Francisco, Calif. in
April.

Domino's Pizza founder, Tom Monaghan, announces retirement and sells
93 percent of the company to Bain Capital Inc. (NOTE: Perhaps you've
heard of Bain Capital; they've been in the news.)

2002
...In August 2002, Domino's kicked delivery up a notch with the
introduction of Domino's Pizza Buffalo Chicken Kickers� and marked the
creation of a whole new surprising category � premium chicken
delivered right to the door!

2003
Domino's combines two culinary classics � pizza and Philadelphia
Cheese Steak � to create Domino's Philly Cheese Steak Pizza.

2004
Domino's launches Domino's Cheesy Dots�, delicious round balls of
dough covered in a blend of zesty melted cheeses.

2009
At year�s end, Domino�s scraps its 49-year-old pizza recipe and
launches its �new and inspired pizza� with an unusual advertising
campaign.

2011
Domino's continues to revamp its menu, launching a new recipe for
Buffalo Wings and Boneless Chicken, a new line of Domino's Artisan�
Pizzas using premium ingredients and two new bread sides � Stuffed
Cheesy Bread and Parmesan Bread Bites.

2012
Domino's debuts its ordering app for Android phones. This, in addition
to its existing iPhone app which debuted in 2011, offers a Domino's
mobile ordering app to more than 80 percent of smartphones.

http://www.dominosbiz.com/Biz-Public-EN/Site+Content/Secondary/About+Dominos/History/

[Al Eisner]

It's also been my impression in RWC that the setup looks like it should
produce decent pizza. The problem might be one of staffing. I sometimes
have trouble with getting a sandwich because the person making it
is ignorant of ingredients (or in one case even how to make a sandwich).
With a sandwich I can guide him or her through the process; obviously
that's not possible with pizza.
--

Al Eisner
San Mateo Co., CA

[Al Eisner]

So far as I can tell, none of the so-called California outlets of Chicago
pizza places produced anything resembling Chicago deep-dish pizza. That
was certainly true for Uno (which I tried a few times in San Diego, not
in SF). The only place in the Bay Area where I've had something in
the right style was at Windy City Pizza in San Mateo -- if I recall, an
Aahz recommendation (apologies if I have that wrong) -- where one has to
ask for the "red-head" version. My last experienc e there, however,
was a few years ago.

[tutall]

On Tuesday, July 17, 2012 12:09:08 PM UTC-7, sf wrote:
> On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 11:47:04 -0700, pfraser &lt;pete_...@comcast.net&gt;
> wrote:
>
> &gt; sf wrote:
> &gt;
> &gt; &gt; Why would anyone expect places like Costco and Whole Foods to have
> &gt; &gt; pizza that&#39;s better than your local mom &amp; pop pizzeria?
> &gt;
> &gt; I don&#39;t, but Costco often has good food (their meat
> &gt; selection is quite good and reasonably priced).
> &gt;
> &gt; I wasn&#39;t so much comparing them with mom &amp; pop; I had
> &gt; set the bar pretty low by mentioning Round Table, Blondie&#39;s
> &gt; and Domino&#39;s.
>
> I&#39;ve never eaten a Blondie&#39;s pizza, but I&#39;d rather go hungry than eat
> Round Table or Domino&#39;s again.
>

Pizza Hut, Domino's and Little Caesars belong in the same category, but certainly not Round Table.

[sf]

On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:18:11 -0700 (PDT), tutall <tut...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

Apparently there are still some Round Tables that cook their pizza the
old fashioned way, but I'm not going to search for one. I liked Pizza
Hut years after I stopped liking RT. Haven't had one in years, but
they were the last chain pizza I stopped eating. I especially liked
their rectangular pizzas... they were a very good value and they
tasted good too. But stuffed crust wasn't even a glimmer in some
company executive's eye back when I started making pizza at home and
stopped ordering chain pizza delivery.

[sf]

On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 21:02:50 -0700 (PDT), spamtrap1888
<spamtr...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> The UNO satellite outlets sucked. The pizza tasted as if it had been
> prebaked at some central commissary, frozen and shipped.

then why bring up the topic?

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <96f7d1fb-4a07-4b17...@googlegroups.com>,

tutall <tut...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Pizza Hut, Domino's and Little Caesars belong in the same category,
>but certainly not Round Table.

I was actually eating Round Table with some regularity when they
took their discrete step downward in quality, so that must have
been around 1995 or so. This was also when they started their "last
honest pizza" campaign, not by coincidence of course.

Being as terrible as Pizza Hut or Little Caesar's (I'll reserve
judgment on the "new" Domino's) would take more work. I haven't
had a Round Table pizza in years, though, so I wouldn't put it past
them, what with the number of TV ads they have.

[sf]

On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:06:20 -0700, Al Eisner
<eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:

>
> So far as I can tell, none of the so-called California outlets of Chicago
> pizza places produced anything resembling Chicago deep-dish pizza. That
> was certainly true for Uno (which I tried a few times in San Diego, not
> in SF). The only place in the Bay Area where I've had something in
> the right style was at Windy City Pizza in San Mateo -- if I recall, an
> Aahz recommendation (apologies if I have that wrong) -- where one has to
> ask for the "red-head" version. My last experienc e there, however,
> was a few years ago.

Aha, so a Chicago pizza is like a NYC bagel or a Philly cheesesteak.
In that case, I don't care. No matter I say, somebody will tell me
I'm wrong.

[Todd Michel McComb]

In article <b21e08p7c3ho1mif3...@4ax.com>,

sf <sf.u...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Aha, so a Chicago pizza is like a NYC bagel or a Philly cheesesteak.

The biggest issue with a real Chicago "pizza pie" is that they take
a long time to bake, and diners aren't that patient. It's not
something that can really be waved away, other than by doing some
precooking or such, which the Uno chain apparently tried, but then
they aren't very good.

I have no idea why someone couldn't serve a NYC bagel or Philly
cheesesteak, in contrast. Well, I guess most bagel places don't
want to go to the trouble of doing the whole process typical in New
York. And frankly, there's nothing special about cheesesteaks in
Philly -- most use really low quality ingredients -- other than
there's a lot of them, so people can find their favorite.

[Al Eisner]

I understand very little of your comment. In what way is there a
resemblance between the three? They are all quite different creatures.

The situation with Chicago depe-dish pizza in California is as I've
summarized it above: most of what is so labelled as such is a far cry
from it (Todd's explanation is plausible), but I've noted one
exception; there may be more. On the other hand, I have no trouble
finding quite adequate bagels in the area -- some people make to much of
a fetish of the subject, in coptrast to the quite real situation with
respect to Chicago pizza. As for Philly cheesesteak, I don't have
sufficeint interest in the stuff to care (although that may well be
because I've only had it in CA, so I should reserve judgment).

[sf]

On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 12:02:35 -0700, Al Eisner

<eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:

> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012, sf wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:06:20 -0700, Al Eisner
> > <eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> So far as I can tell, none of the so-called California outlets of Chicago
> >> pizza places produced anything resembling Chicago deep-dish pizza. That
> >> was certainly true for Uno (which I tried a few times in San Diego, not
> >> in SF). The only place in the Bay Area where I've had something in
> >> the right style was at Windy City Pizza in San Mateo -- if I recall, an
> >> Aahz recommendation (apologies if I have that wrong) -- where one has to
> >> ask for the "red-head" version. My last experienc e there, however,
> >> was a few years ago.
> >
> > Aha, so a Chicago pizza is like a NYC bagel or a Philly cheesesteak.
> > In that case, I don't care. No matter I say, somebody will tell me
> > I'm wrong.
>
> I understand very little of your comment. In what way is there a
> resemblance between the three? They are all quite different creatures.

The products are different, the situations are the same.

>
> The situation with Chicago depe-dish pizza in California is as I've
> summarized it above: most of what is so labelled as such is a far cry
> from it (Todd's explanation is plausible), but I've noted one
> exception; there may be more. On the other hand, I have no trouble
> finding quite adequate bagels in the area -- some people make to much of
> a fetish of the subject, in coptrast to the quite real situation with
> respect to Chicago pizza. As for Philly cheesesteak, I don't have
> sufficeint interest in the stuff to care (although that may well be
> because I've only had it in CA, so I should reserve judgment).
>

-Well, I haven't gone to Chicago to order deep dish so I have no
benchmark. Uno was my deep dish experience here and I was
unimpressed. End of story.

-I can find chewy bagels that I like here and what people pontificate
on as NY bagels are not as prevalent in Manhattan as West Coasters
would like me to believe. I once tried pointedly to find a decent
bagel within a few blocks of where I was staying in MidTown and it
didn't happen. When I was told to go to the other side of town, I
knew finding a decent bagel in Manhattan was just a snipe hunt.

-Philly cheesesteaks, according to a conversation on rfc, are *not*
made with cheez whiz. Although the two most famous tourist traps do
that, other places don't - so it sounds like the way I make them at
home is close enough; which means I don't have to make a pilgrimage to
Philly to find the holy grail.

[Al Eisner]

On Wed, 18 Jul 2012, sf wrote:

> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 12:02:35 -0700, Al Eisner
> <eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012, sf wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:06:20 -0700, Al Eisner
>>> <eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> So far as I can tell, none of the so-called California outlets of Chicago
>>>> pizza places produced anything resembling Chicago deep-dish pizza. That
>>>> was certainly true for Uno (which I tried a few times in San Diego, not
>>>> in SF). The only place in the Bay Area where I've had something in
>>>> the right style was at Windy City Pizza in San Mateo -- if I recall, an
>>>> Aahz recommendation (apologies if I have that wrong) -- where one has to
>>>> ask for the "red-head" version. My last experienc e there, however,
>>>> was a few years ago.
>>>
>>> Aha, so a Chicago pizza is like a NYC bagel or a Philly cheesesteak.
>>> In that case, I don't care. No matter I say, somebody will tell me
>>> I'm wrong.
>>
>> I understand very little of your comment. In what way is there a
>> resemblance between the three? They are all quite different creatures.
>
> The products are different, the situations are the same.

Your exposition below proves exactly the opposite. The statement is
simply nonsense.

>> The situation with Chicago depe-dish pizza in California is as I've
>> summarized it above: most of what is so labelled as such is a far cry
>> from it (Todd's explanation is plausible), but I've noted one
>> exception; there may be more. On the other hand, I have no trouble
>> finding quite adequate bagels in the area -- some people make to much of
>> a fetish of the subject, in coptrast to the quite real situation with
>> respect to Chicago pizza. As for Philly cheesesteak, I don't have
>> sufficeint interest in the stuff to care (although that may well be
>> because I've only had it in CA, so I should reserve judgment).
>>
> -Well, I haven't gone to Chicago to order deep dish so I have no
> benchmark. Uno was my deep dish experience here and I was
> unimpressed. End of story.

It's okay, I have no expectation whatsoever that you (sf) will
actually read my posts.

> -I can find chewy bagels that I like here and what people pontificate
> on as NY bagels are not as prevalent in Manhattan as West Coasters
> would like me to believe. I once tried pointedly to find a decent
> bagel within a few blocks of where I was staying in MidTown and it
> didn't happen. When I was told to go to the other side of town, I
> knew finding a decent bagel in Manhattan was just a snipe hunt.
>
> -Philly cheesesteaks, according to a conversation on rfc, are *not*
> made with cheez whiz. Although the two most famous tourist traps do
> that, other places don't - so it sounds like the way I make them at
> home is close enough; which means I don't have to make a pilgrimage to
> Philly to find the holy grail.

Cheese whiz is fundamentally evil.

[spamtrap1888]

On Jul 18, 11:45 am, sf <s...@geemail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 21:02:50 -0700 (PDT), spamtrap1888
>

> <spamtrap1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > The UNO satellite outlets sucked. The pizza tasted as if it had been
> > prebaked at some central commissary, frozen and shipped.
>
> then why bring up the topic?
>

You mentioned it as a place where you had Chicago deep-dish pizza,
before you switched to their thin crust. I mentioned it because Uno's
was not a good representative of Chicago deep-dish.

[sf]

On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 12:37:19 -0700, Al Eisner

<eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:

> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012, sf wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 12:02:35 -0700, Al Eisner
> > <eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:
> >
> >> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012, sf wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:06:20 -0700, Al Eisner
> >>> <eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>> So far as I can tell, none of the so-called California outlets of Chicago
> >>>> pizza places produced anything resembling Chicago deep-dish pizza. That
> >>>> was certainly true for Uno (which I tried a few times in San Diego, not
> >>>> in SF). The only place in the Bay Area where I've had something in
> >>>> the right style was at Windy City Pizza in San Mateo -- if I recall, an
> >>>> Aahz recommendation (apologies if I have that wrong) -- where one has to
> >>>> ask for the "red-head" version. My last experienc e there, however,
> >>>> was a few years ago.
> >>>
> >>> Aha, so a Chicago pizza is like a NYC bagel or a Philly cheesesteak.
> >>> In that case, I don't care. No matter I say, somebody will tell me
> >>> I'm wrong.
> >>
> >> I understand very little of your comment. In what way is there a
> >> resemblance between the three? They are all quite different creatures.
> >
> > The products are different, the situations are the same.
>
> Your exposition below proves exactly the opposite. The statement is
> simply nonsense.

Obviously, you have blinders on.

>
> >> The situation with Chicago depe-dish pizza in California is as I've
> >> summarized it above: most of what is so labelled as such is a far cry
> >> from it (Todd's explanation is plausible), but I've noted one
> >> exception; there may be more. On the other hand, I have no trouble
> >> finding quite adequate bagels in the area -- some people make to much of
> >> a fetish of the subject, in coptrast to the quite real situation with
> >> respect to Chicago pizza. As for Philly cheesesteak, I don't have
> >> sufficeint interest in the stuff to care (although that may well be
> >> because I've only had it in CA, so I should reserve judgment).
> >>
> > -Well, I haven't gone to Chicago to order deep dish so I have no
> > benchmark. Uno was my deep dish experience here and I was
> > unimpressed. End of story.
>
> It's okay, I have no expectation whatsoever that you (sf) will
> actually read my posts.

I do, but they make no sense to me.

>
> > -I can find chewy bagels that I like here and what people pontificate
> > on as NY bagels are not as prevalent in Manhattan as West Coasters
> > would like me to believe. I once tried pointedly to find a decent
> > bagel within a few blocks of where I was staying in MidTown and it
> > didn't happen. When I was told to go to the other side of town, I
> > knew finding a decent bagel in Manhattan was just a snipe hunt.
> >
> > -Philly cheesesteaks, according to a conversation on rfc, are *not*
> > made with cheez whiz. Although the two most famous tourist traps do
> > that, other places don't - so it sounds like the way I make them at
> > home is close enough; which means I don't have to make a pilgrimage to
> > Philly to find the holy grail.
>
> Cheese whiz is fundamentally evil.

At least we can agree about that.

[tutall]

On Tuesday, July 17, 2012 11:13:53 PM UTC-7, Peter Lawrence wrote:
> On 7/17/12 6:49 PM, Todd Michel McComb wrote:

> &gt;
> &gt; Good pizza is perfectly good at room temperature.
> &gt;
> &gt; Like beer.
>
> +1

That works well, in England, and the room is a cellar.

*That's* what "room temp" means there; ambient temp.

Most Merkins hearing that think they mean 68F.
or somesuch.

[sf]

I said there *is* such a thing as too much sauce, too many toppings
and too much cheese so you brought up deep dish. I've only eaten
Uno's pizza so that's what I told you about. Back at the beginning of
the craze, the only deep dish this side of the Rocky's was at Pizzeria
Uno (which is probably an overstatement, but it makes my point). It
was the only game in town at the time. Uno's was wildly popular, with
lines out the door and long wait times. It was fun at first because
it was novel, but it got old quickly. In any case, I learned from
deep dish what it is that I like or don't like about conventional
pizzas.

[spamtrap1888]

On Jul 18, 2:23 pm, sf <s...@geemail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 13:07:21 -0700 (PDT), spamtrap1888
>

> <spamtrap1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Jul 18, 11:45 am, sf <s...@geemail.com> wrote:
> > > On Tue, 17 Jul 2012 21:02:50 -0700 (PDT), spamtrap1888
>
> > > <spamtrap1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > The UNO satellite outlets sucked. The pizza tasted as if it had been
> > > > prebaked at some central commissary, frozen and shipped.
>
> > > then why bring up the topic?
>
> > You mentioned it as a place where you had Chicago deep-dish pizza,
> > before you switched to their thin crust. I mentioned it because Uno's
> > was not a good representative of Chicago deep-dish.
>
> I said there *is* such a thing as too much sauce, too many toppings
> and too much cheese so you brought up deep dish.

That was Peter L.

> I've only eaten
> Uno's pizza so that's what I told you about.  Back at the beginning of
> the craze, the only deep dish this side of the Rocky's was at Pizzeria
> Uno (which is probably an overstatement, but it makes my point).  It
> was the only game in town at the time.  Uno's was wildly popular, with
> lines out the door and long wait times.  It was fun at first because
> it was novel, but it got old quickly.  In any case, I learned from
> deep dish what it is that I like or don't like about conventional
> pizzas.

I never ate at the one in SF, only at the S. Bay ones after the
corporation made a big push to open them up.

[sf]

On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 14:09:43 -0700 (PDT), tutall <tut...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

SF isn't "most" of the US, so we aren't "most Merkins". My house is
at 60� or less unless it's the middle of a heat wave.

Educate yourself sometime and look up the real meaning of "merkin".

[tutall]

On Wednesday, July 18, 2012 3:30:34 PM UTC-7, sf wrote:
> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 14:09:43 -0700 (PDT), tutall &lt;tut...@hotmail.com&gt;
> wrote:

> &gt; That works well, in England, and the room is a cellar.
> &gt;
> &gt; *That&#39;s* what &quot;room temp&quot; means there; ambient temp.
> &gt;
> &gt; Most Merkins hearing that think they mean 68F.
> &gt; or somesuch.
>
> SF isn&#39;t &quot;most&quot; of the US, so we aren&#39;t &quot;most Merkins&quot;.


Wherever you go, there you are. How enlightening, thanks for that.

> My house is
> at 60� or less unless it&#39;s the middle of a heat wave.
>
> Educate yourself sometime and look up the real meaning of &quot;merkin&quot;.

I don't care what you like to wear. You seemed to have understood just fine anyway.

[Al Eisner]

No point in arguing with you about this. Others can judge your remarks
for themselves.

>>>> The situation with Chicago depe-dish pizza in California is as I've
>>>> summarized it above: most of what is so labelled as such is a far cry
>>>> from it (Todd's explanation is plausible), but I've noted one
>>>> exception; there may be more. On the other hand, I have no trouble
>>>> finding quite adequate bagels in the area -- some people make to much of
>>>> a fetish of the subject, in coptrast to the quite real situation with
>>>> respect to Chicago pizza. As for Philly cheesesteak, I don't have
>>>> sufficeint interest in the stuff to care (although that may well be
>>>> because I've only had it in CA, so I should reserve judgment).
>>>>
>>> -Well, I haven't gone to Chicago to order deep dish so I have no
>>> benchmark. Uno was my deep dish experience here and I was
>>> unimpressed. End of story.
>>
>> It's okay, I have no expectation whatsoever that you (sf) will
>> actually read my posts.
>
> I do, but they make no sense to me.

Right. Even when a possible alterantive for Chicago-style pizza in the
Bay Area is presented to you, and even though you actually quote that
possibility (above), you just know what you know, "end of story".

>>> -I can find chewy bagels that I like here and what people pontificate
>>> on as NY bagels are not as prevalent in Manhattan as West Coasters
>>> would like me to believe. I once tried pointedly to find a decent
>>> bagel within a few blocks of where I was staying in MidTown and it
>>> didn't happen. When I was told to go to the other side of town, I
>>> knew finding a decent bagel in Manhattan was just a snipe hunt.
>>>
>>> -Philly cheesesteaks, according to a conversation on rfc, are *not*
>>> made with cheez whiz. Although the two most famous tourist traps do
>>> that, other places don't - so it sounds like the way I make them at
>>> home is close enough; which means I don't have to make a pilgrimage to
>>> Philly to find the holy grail.
>>
>> Cheese whiz is fundamentally evil.
>
> At least we can agree about that.
--

[sf]

On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 16:18:51 -0700, Al Eisner

<eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:

> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012, sf wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 12:37:19 -0700, Al Eisner
> > <eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:
> >
> >> It's okay, I have no expectation whatsoever that you (sf) will
> >> actually read my posts.
> >
> > I do, but they make no sense to me.
>
> Right. Even when a possible alterantive for Chicago-style pizza in the
> Bay Area is presented to you, and even though you actually quote that
> possibility (above), you just know what you know, "end of story".

Yes. This is decades later. However, I was able to extrapolate the
genre from what I was exposed to... apparently unlike you. Also, )
apparently unlike you), I don't throw good money after bad. I decided
the genre isn't of any interest to me and that's that.

[sf]

On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 16:01:09 -0700 (PDT), tutall <tut...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> On Wednesday, July 18, 2012 3:30:34 PM UTC-7, sf wrote:
> > On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 14:09:43 -0700 (PDT), tutall &lt;tut...@hotmail.com&gt;
> > wrote:
>
> > &gt; That works well, in England, and the room is a cellar.
> > &gt;
> > &gt; *That&#39;s* what &quot;room temp&quot; means there; ambient temp.
> > &gt;
> > &gt; Most Merkins hearing that think they mean 68F.
> > &gt; or somesuch.
> >
> > SF isn&#39;t &quot;most&quot; of the US, so we aren&#39;t &quot;most Merkins&quot;.
>
>
> Wherever you go, there you are. How enlightening, thanks for that.
>
> > My house is

> > at 60� or less unless it&#39;s the middle of a heat wave.

> >
> > Educate yourself sometime and look up the real meaning of &quot;merkin&quot;.
>
> I don't care what you like to wear. You seemed to have understood just fine anyway.

It's more like what *you* like to wear or else you wouldn't have
mentioned it in the first place.

[JC Dill]

On 17/07/12 11:37 AM, pfraser wrote:
> Unfortunately they dropped the Gorgonzola and Pear many years ago.
> I'm also beginning to fear that they have dropped the
> "Three plus Blue" flatbread (though they still have the other
> two flatbreads from the same series.

TJs has an annoying habit that the minute I *really* like something,
they drop it. Like you, I really liked the Gorgonzola and Pear pizza.
Someone suggested I try their flatbread replacement (which has pear and
ham and something else), and it was horrible. I also tried, once, their
mushroom flatbread - ICK. The bread part never really cooked, even when
the cheese was hot and melted and the bread was starting to burn on the
edges, it was still gummy and doughy in the center. I ended up throwing
most of it away.

I hadn't looked for the Three Plus Blue lately, but it definitely
doesn't surprise me that it, too, has been cut.

jc

[Steve Pope]

JC Dill <jcdill...@gmail.com> wrote:

>TJs has an annoying habit that the minute I *really* like something,
>they drop it. Like you, I really liked the Gorgonzola and Pear pizza.
>Someone suggested I try their flatbread replacement (which has pear and
>ham and something else), and it was horrible. I also tried, once, their
>mushroom flatbread - ICK.

I think the gorgonzola/pear was one of their made-in-Italy pizzas,
whereas none of their flatbreads are.

Steve

[Al Eisner]

On Wed, 18 Jul 2012, sf wrote:

> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 16:18:51 -0700, Al Eisner
> <eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012, sf wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 18 Jul 2012 12:37:19 -0700, Al Eisner
>>> <eis...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>> It's okay, I have no expectation whatsoever that you (sf) will
>>>> actually read my posts.
>>>
>>> I do, but they make no sense to me.
>>
>> Right. Even when a possible alterantive for Chicago-style pizza in the
>> Bay Area is presented to you, and even though you actually quote that
>> possibility (above), you just know what you know, "end of story".
>
> Yes. This is decades later. However, I was able to extrapolate the
> genre from what I was exposed to... apparently unlike you. Also, )
> apparently unlike you), I don't throw good money after bad. I decided
> the genre isn't of any interest to me and that's that.

You can certainly make your own decisions -- your gain or loss. But
don't ascribe some non-existent behavior to me. I had more or less
reached the same conclusion as you, a long time ago, about the non-
existence of Chicago-style deep-dish pizza in CA. But I took seriously
the one ba.food recommendation I mentioned, tried it, and found it
rather good. There is no issue of "good" or "bad" money. I tend to
take seriously the recommendations on ba.food, tempered by my knowledge
of the person or persons making them; that method more often than
not works out. You seem to largely choose to ignore recommendations --
it's of course entirely your choice and your right to do so, even if
some may regard that behavior as excessively rigid.

[pfraser]

Peter Lawrence wrote:

>
> Unfortunately, CPK doesn't include their Gorgonzola and Pear pizza in
> their frozen pizza offerings.

How are their frozen offerings?

I have only eaten at CPK once, and that was in NV, so it
probably invalidates the sample. I remember it as being
reasonable, but nothing special. That was probably about
twenty years ago though.

[Peter Lawrence]

On 7/19/12 2:12 PM, pfraser wrote:
> Peter Lawrence wrote:
>>
>> Unfortunately, CPK doesn't include their Gorgonzola and Pear pizza in
>> their frozen pizza offerings.
>
> How are their frozen offerings?

They're above average as frozen pizzas go, especially their thin-crust
varieties. They're a decent price if you buy them through Costco (or on
sale, elsewhere).

> I have only eaten at CPK once, and that was in NV, so it
> probably invalidates the sample. I remember it as being
> reasonable, but nothing special. That was probably about
> twenty years ago though.

That's about right. Reasonably tasting pizzas, some with unique topping
combinations, but nothing extraordinary nowadays about them. There are
better pizzas served elsewhere, but there are a lot worse pizzas served
elsewhere too.

One thing that they're above way average though is if you're dining solo.
Solo diners get good and prompt service (including the full menu) when
dining at their bar. You don't feel like an afterthought as in some
restaurants.


- Peter

[pfraser]

JC Dill wrote:

> TJs has an annoying habit that the minute I *really* like something,
> they drop it.

> I also tried, once, their
> mushroom flatbread - ICK. The bread part never really cooked, even when
> the cheese was hot and melted and the bread was starting to burn on the
> edges, it was still gummy and doughy in the center. I ended up throwing
> most of it away.

I don't have that experience.
To me, the Wild Mushroom and Black Truffle Flatbread, and the
Pesto and Tomato Flatbread heat up about the same as the
Three Plus Blue -- They're just not as tasty.

Where I had the gummy doughy experience was with something they
called (IIRC) Alsace Tart. It has onion and ham, with a very thin
crust that almost looks like thin filo dough.
I find it very tasty but stopped buying it because of the gummy
doughy center, which would often collapse and burn me, or drip
molten stuff over the floor of the oven.

>
> I hadn't looked for the Three Plus Blue lately, but it definitely
> doesn't surprise me that it, too, has been cut.

Verified for sure at TJ's yesterday. Sigh.

Pete

[Peter Lawrence]

On 7/19/12 8:23 AM, JC Dill wrote:
> On 17/07/12 11:37 AM, pfraser wrote:
>>
>> Unfortunately they dropped the Gorgonzola and Pear many years ago.
>> I'm also beginning to fear that they have dropped the
>> "Three plus Blue" flatbread (though they still have the other
>> two flatbreads from the same series.
>
> TJs has an annoying habit that the minute I *really* like something, they
> drop it. Like you, I really liked the Gorgonzola and Pear pizza.

I know it's not the same thing as buying it frozen and baking it at home,
but if you ever want to satisfy your Gorgonzola and pear pizza cravings, you
could always go to CPK, the creator of the Gorgonzola and pear pizza, and
order one there to eat in or as take out.

Unfortunately, CPK doesn't include their Gorgonzola and Pear pizza in their
frozen pizza offerings.

- Peter