Stranded

[Willie McKemie]

I had to call the Leaf "roadside assistance" today, 877 664-2738. My
Leaf went into "turtle" at 62 miles, about 6 miles short of the
destination. Started with "100%" charge, drove in "eco" at less than
60 mph the whole trip. Pre-heated the cabin on shore power before
departure this morning and did not use the heater afterward. The car
has become useless to me.

I expect it to get to South Point this afternoon. I don't want to get
it back without a new battery.

--
ONWARD! Through the fog!

[ac]

This doesn't sound good. Please keep us posted on progress. I have been reading about all the consumer testing in Phoenix and Nissan buying back a few Leafs under lemon laws.

[Andy Nguyen]

I am more than a bit miffed that the LEAF's battery capacity is turning out to be less robust that Nissan had indicated.  However, given the language of the non-warranty and my signature on it, it'd be an uphill fight to remedy that.  I don't see recourses other than heaping a lot of negative publicity on the LEAF.  Nissan might respond to that more readily.  Unfortunately, they now can point to the less than a handful of cases in Arizona and claim that they are acting with the consumer in mind.

--

Andy

On Wed, Nov 28, 2012 at 9:51 PM, ac <acl...@austin.rr.com> wrote:

This doesn't sound good. Please keep us posted on progress. I have been reading about all the consumer testing in Phoenix and Nissan buying back a few Leafs under lemon laws.

--
Andy Nguyen \ aqnaqn at gmail dot com

[Kathy Sokolic]

This is a two-sided problem for me.  On one hand, I want EVs to succeed, and hate to make a stink about anything that is less than ideal (plus, my car is still completely ideal for my situation).  However, I want Willie to be properly taken care of by Nissan.  Willie - if there is anything we can do to help, let us know.  If pressure on Nissan helps, I can make some phone calls or send some emails.  I do that already anyway, and am happy to support you in any way I can.  

There are bound to be hiccups along the way with new technology, and we all took a chance on these cars.  Nissan should partner with those willing to bet on them and make something work.  To do otherwise would be the long, slow death of the leaf, which I certainly do not want to see.

Kathy

--
Kathy Sokolic

512-809-3497

[Peter Joseph]

It appears the cold streak has reduced range quite a bit.   As compared to the warm summers we are used to having.

Wish Nissan would come up with a contingency plan to replace the batteries piecemeal.   The Leaf has been a novel, enjoyable ride, but it is our secondary car.   The odometer is at 19,485 miles (in 14+ months) and the third charging bar (at 80% charge) is disappearing while still parked, before the start of the morning commute.

Hope it will be all worked out somehow.   What did Joey Cardosi (sales guy at South Point) have to say?

Best wishes,

Peter

[Andy Nguyen]

Kathy, there you go again, being the voice of reason.  :)

--

Andy

[Willie McKemie]

On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 10:18 AM, Peter Joseph <pjos...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hope it will be all worked out somehow. What did Joey Cardosi (sales guy
> at South Point) have to say?

I called South Point first and happened to get Joey. He gave me the
national number. That was not very satisfactory. "Where is the car?"
"It's about 2 miles south of Lytton Springs on FM1854" "What mile
marker or exit is that near?" "It is a rural Texas farm-to-market
road. There are no exits, no mile markers and not nearby businesses"
"Well, I sorry but I am unable to help you if you can not give me an
exit number or a mile marker" This stupidity went back and forth for
about 10 minutes until the girl finally talked to a supervisor and he
found FM1854. The car got to South Point pretty quickly, about three
hours.

Just finished talking to "Kyle" at South Point. He opined that using
a Panasonic @ 240vac was somehow significant. He further opined that
the car took a "full" charge at South Point and should have a range of
over 80 miles. He wants me to waste my time coming to get it. "With
usable range of only 50 miles, the car has no value to me. I want you
to keep it until Nissan comes up with a fix for the defective
battery." "Well, we are going to have to charge you storage for
keeping it." "Fine, keep it until your storage charges exceed the
value of the car; since the car has no value to me, that is right now
as far as I'm concerned."

And that's where we are right now.

[IAN BLADUELL]

I suggest you file a case with BBB, call Nissan customer caren to get a case number and see how the Texas Lemmon law may help you.

Ian B

[Peter Joseph]

The dealer's main motivation is to move cars.   But we are looking at a model with a significant design flaw that Nissan is unwilling to address.   The Leaf appears to have battery longevity only in Goldilocks weather.  

On Thursday, November 29, 2012 4:58:05 PM UTC-6, mckemie wrote:

On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 10:18 AM, Peter Joseph <pjos...@gmail.com> wrote:

Just finished talking to "Kyle" at South Point.  He opined that using
a Panasonic @ 240vac was somehow significant.  

IIRC, this is the service guy that inadvertently charged me for an oil change on the Leaf.   Need i say more?

 

He further opined that
the car took a "full" charge at South Point and should have a range of
over 80 miles.  

My guess is that this is the current GOM reading, the vagaries of which are well known to us.  So much so, Nissan is replacing it with a (remaining) battery percentage readout in the 2013 model.

i applaud you for taking a stand.   Nissan has bought back just 2 to 4 cars (out of the 16,484 cars sold in the US as of October (per Wikipedia)).  The MNL forums have the excruciating details.   It might be worth a try.

Best,

Peter

[IAN BLADUELL]

Do we have an update on your Leaf or still at dealer?

Ian B

[Willie McKemie]

On Thu, Dec 6, 2012 at 1:01 PM, IAN BLADUELL <ibla...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Do we have an update on your Leaf or still at dealer?

I plan to pick it up tomorrow, Friday. "Nothing wrong with the
battery". They suggest that the problem may be using an upgraded
Panasonic for some of the charging. I have a folding electric bicycle
I will start carrying in the back of the Leaf. I expect it to be
towed in again soon.

I am talking to a "lemon law" attorney.

[IAN BLADUELL]

Keep us updated and best of luck. What are the Texas lemon Law steps?

Ian B

[mckemie]

On Thursday, December 6, 2012 9:04:00 PM UTC-6, IAN BLADUELL wrote:

Keep us updated and best of luck. What are the Texas lemon Law steps?

Ian B

I noticed some traffic on this list and looked in the archives.  Thought I would post about my Leaf.

I took delivery on a Tesla in April 2013 and then sold my Leaf about a month later to a friend/neighbor.  They don't expect 70 miles of range and are pretty happy with it.  Of course, I took a beating on value.

I now have about 35k miles on my Tesla and couldn't be happier with it.  It's battery capacity has declined by a minuscule amount compared to the Leaf.  I've made a couple of trips to Galveston, one to north of Wichita, and one north of Madison Wisconsin.

What is the story on other Austin Leaf batteries?  Anyone got (or need) satisfaction from Nissan? 

[Kathy Sokolic]

That's great news, Willie.  I know a few Tesla folks and they all LOVE their cars.  Counting down until the "for the masses" models come out!!!

I haven't had much issue with the Leaf except during the cold.  Very cold temperatures seem to reduce the range.  Other than that, still happy.

ᐧ

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Kathy Sokolic

512-809-3497

[Andy Nguyen]

Ditto with my LEAF's range.  I drive only about 7500 miles a year, so even a reduced range still suits me fine.  I can still easily get to the airport from my house (and back! :) ), about 45 miles.  The furthest roundtrip I make is to the Circuit of The Americas, about 54 miles.  It's now probably on the edge of the range.  But, the Whole Foods HQ store is right in the middle of all my trips so I can always recharge there.

[Mike Butterfield]

I too, have been quite disappointed in the range, especially on cold weather days. As far as the battery, I was quite annoyed when I received a class action notice where the settlement is a battery warranty that guarantees me 9 bars. This was AFTER receiving an updated warranty section to be added to my user manual. Staying in the settlement will prevent further action against Nissan, so I opted out of the settlement, not that I intend to pursue anything specific at this time. I at least wanted to keep my options open.

My actual driving distance RARELY matches the GOM value, even after the Nissan software updates. Still serves my needs in a commuting environment (as a second car), just have to manage my day more than I might expect. Still a blast to drive though!

I still have the demo burned into my head when Nissan was giving demos at the Domain and stated that range can be expected to be over 100 miles with slight reduction due to climate controls.

I guess I paid the price of being an early adopter. Too bad Nissan is choosing to ignore the very people who helped spread the word about electric cars in the early days of their program.



Mike Butterfield

[Don Shin]

I still enjoy driving my LEAF, but I'd have to say that any future car purchase will probably not be a Nissan due to the battery degradation and expectations set earlier on. I live in northeast Austin (right on the border of Pflugerville), and a trip to southwest Austin and back gets scary. I have a mental map of every EVSE in the city, but I now have a toddler - and the idea of charging for 2-3 hours (I have the 3.3kw charger with no option of upgrading to 6.6) with a tired child in tow is anathema to me. I really wish there was a 6.6kW charger upgrade option.

So my next car will probably be a gen3 Tesla.

Don

For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[Willie]

On 03/07/2014 07:59 AM, Mike Butterfield wrote:
> I too, have been quite disappointed in the range, especially on cold
> weather days. As far as the battery, I was quite annoyed when I
> received a class action notice where the settlement is a battery
> warranty that guarantees me 9 bars. This was AFTER receiving an
> updated warranty section to be added to my user manual. Staying in the
> settlement will prevent further action against Nissan, so I opted out
> of the settlement, not that I intend to pursue anything specific at
> this time. I at least wanted to keep my options open.

Ah, yes. The "warranty"! Nissan's extremely crappy instrumentation
seems to be intended to hide from the driver the information he needs:
battery capacity and current energy stored and available. "Bars"!
"Trees"! Horse hockey! Nissan hides the capacity and THEY decide when
the capacity drops below their threshold. AND they commit to only
maintaining 70% capacity by their measures. I had lost only one "bar"
but had lost 30% of my range. I am reminded of my ire before I sold the
thing.

Before I bought it, I knew the weaknesses of LiMn but figured "Nissan
must know what they are doing". I was wrong.

Nissan should adopt a better battery AND replace any installed battery
that gives less than 80 miles of range.

Tesla is quite a contrast; they are out there fixing things before most
owners know there is anything that needs fixing.