Noticed change in capacity and EV Drive in Georgetown tomorrow morning

[Michael Chamberlain]

Hello, 

The pack seems to be aging gracefully.  An 80% charge was always 10 bars on the range indicator until a few weeks ago.  Now an 80% charge is 9 bars on the range indicator most of the time.  Depending on how you look at it I could be halfway to losing that first capacity bar.  An SOC meter is the only way to know for sure.  

Notes:

Ownership - 10 months

Miles - 15,800

Charging - Longevity setting (80%) from 2am to 5am and 8am to 10am weekdays 

EVSE Upgrade for home charging (charged on L1 at home for the first 8 months)

Chargepoint L2 station at work

I'll be at the Georgetown Recreation Center for the Georgetown East drive tomorrow at 10am.  Videos from the previous drives can be found here:

http://www.bantamgis.com/EV/ 

Happy driving,

Michael

        

[Willie McKemie]

On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 7:18 PM, Michael Chamberlain <mcha...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> The pack seems to be aging gracefully.  An 80% charge was always 10 bars on
> the range indicator until a few weeks ago.  Now an 80% charge is 9 bars on
> the range indicator most of the time.  Depending on how you look at it I
> could be halfway to losing that first capacity bar.  An SOC meter is the
> only way to know for sure.

The Nissan instrumentation is complete crap/eyecandy.

My capacity continues to decline. I am down to ~198 gids for 80% and
~238 for 100%. We are being forced to do more 100% charges. The
remote access thingy reports 73% for 80% charges and 100% for 100%
charges.

To be useful to us, the car MUST have a 70+ mile range. If Nissan
doesn't fix the battery and if the current rate of decline continues,
the car will not be useful to us @ ~30k miles after two years of
service.

[Peter Joseph]

Michael,   Hope the Georgetown East drive went well.    We were in Georgetown this morning but alas a bit out of range for the Leaf, and so used our "tank" (Honda Ody van).    The driving experience is night and day.   

On Friday, July 6, 2012 7:18:05 PM UTC-5, Michael Chamberlain wrote:

Charging - Longevity setting (80%) from 2am to 5am and 8am to 10am weekdays 

Is 2 am to 5 am for weekends (timer 1) and 8 am to 10 am weekdays (timer 2)?   These appear the best times to charge when the ambient temperature dips somewhat (75 to 90 degrees) instead of the daytime pounding we usually get.   The battery temperature gauge shows 7 bars in the afternoons (internal temperature 98 to ~120 degrees).    Apparently this is bad for the battery and was a precursor to many in Phoenix losing their first "capacity" bar.

We too have noticed that 80% charging now shows only 9 out of 12 bars.   Current mileage is 13,350 in under 10 months.   Mckemie is right in that if the range decreases at this rate, the car will become unusable sooner than predicted.    We all are the early adopters but have a $30 K stake in it.   Quite different from the high-tech world where bleeding edge technology leapfrogs current capabilities (and hence is worth the ride) BUT the gear is usually provided at no cost.

Wish Nissan would come up with a plan to "replenish" the batteries even at a nominal cost.

Best to everyone,

Peter

[Michael Chamberlain]

Sorry to hear that Willie. I don't think the instrumentation is completely useless as it was only intended as a reference. Nissan says battery degradation is non linear and most of it occurs early. That has yet to be proven in the field. So far Nissan looks pretty firm on capacity loss issues and I wouldn't expect much help.

Fortunately for me the car only needs a 50 mile range for my normal daily commute. After I'm done with the car my daughter will be a teenager and she will only need enough range to get to school and back. Either way we the car will meet our needs for some time.

You are in a different situation. Hopefully a vehicle with a 30-35 kw pack will become available or quick charging really takes off. Either one of those options look years away.

Thanks,
Michael

[Barksdale]

Hi y'all,
I too have noticed a loss in max charging capacity over the three or four charges.  I usually do an 80% charge (about 4 times a week) and get about 90 miles of range (haven't gotten in the habit of counting bars and I wouldn't know a gid if it hit me in the face!).  When I do a 100% charge (about once a week) I would get about 115 miles of range.  Now my max 80% charge is around 70 miles and my max 100% charge is about 90 miles.  I wonder if it has something to do with sustained nighttime temperatures?

I've owned my lead for about 5 months and have about 3,800 miles on it.  So it seems like since we're having similar issues but y'all have 3x mileage and 2x age the issue might be related to an external factor (like weather???).  I'm really new at this stuff so I might be way off base here....

Best,
Barksdale

On Friday, July 6, 2012 7:18:05 PM UTC-5, Michael Chamberlain wrote:

[Michael Chamberlain]

Thanks Peter, the countryside around Georgetown is very pretty.  The video doesn't do it justice. When I drive my wife's Mazda I'm surprised how mechanical it feels.  Makes me happy to jump back in the LEAF.

I change the start times for timer 1 manually since you can't have both timers set to different times on the same day.  I do this to manage the temperature of the pack and to minimize the amount of polluntants used to refuel the car.  From 2am to 5am there is anywhere from 7,000 to 10,000 megawatts of unused capacity in the electrical grid.  There are zero additional emissions produced for anything you plug into the grid at this time.  

If you need to charge during the day it's best to charge early as the capacity and demand curves come together quickly.  I will post a graph of the typical capacity and demand curves later today.  

We plan to get a long useful life from our LEAF and the battery degradation isn't as much of an issue for our family.

Thanks,

Michael

[Willie McKemie]

On Sun, Jul 8, 2012 at 8:23 AM, Michael Chamberlain <mcha...@gmail.com> wrote:
> You are in a different situation. Hopefully a vehicle with a 30-35 kw pack will become available or quick charging really takes off. Either one of those options look years away.

I bought the car expecting it to maintain 80% + capacity for 5+ years.
That is below the norm for LFP chemistry. I was surprised to learn
Nissan was using LiMn which has the reputation of being shorter lived
than LFP. But, I figured, "Nissan must know what they're doing".

After five or more years, I figured, better, lower cost, and higher
capacity second source batteries would be available. I'm not yet
wrong but the loss of capacity is very troubling. Nissan's efforts to
obscure the problem helps not at all.

I should say: Other than the crappy instrumentation and the apparently
fading battery, I love my Leaf. Well, I hate the automatic
transmission simulating creeping. And, I think regen should be
controllable and much stronger. And, it should default to "eco". And
I shouldn't have to answer a question each time I start it. But I'm
getting down to relatively minor issues.

[Andy Nguyen]

Me too:  starting about a month ago, I started getting only 9 bars when charging to 80%.  Of the last 18 charging events, 8 ended with 9 bars;  the most recent four chargings all ended with 9 bars!  :(

I don't drive a whole lot, so I have not noticed/recorded reduction in range.

--

Andy

--
Andy Nguyen \ aqnaqn at gmail dot com