Partial closure of Upfield line & free travel!!
Iming chan
Dear all,
My apology for the cross posting of this message.
According to yesterday and today's "Herald Sun", the Upfield line, between
North Melbourne and Flemington Bridge will be closed from May 1997. This
is to allow the construction of western section of the CityLink. Buses
will be available between Flemington Bridge and Newmarket (on Broadmeadows
line) stations. The reason for the closure over this section is due to
the safety reasons. While in yesterday's article, commuters on that line
will travel for free and yearly ticket holders are eligible for refund.
The length of closure is approximately 6 months.
Regards,
I.C.
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Anthony Morton
[crossposted to melb.general for the benefit of other Melburnians]
Iming chan <ch...@minyos.its.rmit.EDU.AU> wrote:
>
>According to yesterday and today's "Herald Sun", the Upfield line, between
>North Melbourne and Flemington Bridge will be closed from May 1997. This
>is to allow the construction of western section of the CityLink.
Thanks for spreading the word, Iming. This is the worst news for Melbourne's
public transport users since the announcement of CityLink itself.
>Buses
>will be available between Flemington Bridge and Newmarket (on Broadmeadows
>line) stations.
Keep in mind, dear reader, that Newmarket is further from the city than
Flemington Bridge. Surely they could at least run substitute buses in the
general direction of the city! North Melbourne's not that far away and it
has more trains.
>The reason for the closure over this section is due to
>the safety reasons.
Yes, I heard someone saying they don't want another Granville. It's never
stopped anyone building overpasses over operating railway lines in the past
(at Watsonia, Newport, Laverton, Frankston etc.). I can't help thinking this
is really just another cost-cutting measure for Transurban.
>While in yesterday's article, commuters on that line
>will travel for free and yearly ticket holders are eligible for refund.
Even with free travel, I don't think people will put up with that level of
inconvenience for months on end. They'll just get in their cars instead.
>The length of closure is approximately 6 months.
Uh-huh, and the automated ticket machines were supposed to be fully installed
2 years ago. Don't expect the government to put any pressure on Transurban to
complete the work in 6 months.
Again, thanks Iming for letting everyone know about this. I was just making
up my mind whether to post a report myself. There was a big rally at
Flemington Bridge station this morning, which hopefully should be all over
the news tonight (Thursday).
Peevishly,
Tony M.
Ashley Wright
>Dear all,
>
>My apology for the cross posting of this message.
>
>According to yesterday and today's "Herald Sun", the Upfield line, between
>North Melbourne and Flemington Bridge will be closed from May 1997. This
>is to allow the construction of western section of the CityLink. Buses
>will be available between Flemington Bridge and Newmarket (on Broadmeadows
>line) stations. The reason for the closure over this section is due to
>the safety reasons. While in yesterday's article, commuters on that line
>will travel for free and yearly ticket holders are eligible for refund.
>The length of closure is approximately 6 months.
>
>Regards,
>
Why don't they close the line alltogether and extend the number 19
tram all the way to upfield. Or could this closure be used at a later
date for that very purpose.
-------------------------------------------------------
| Ashley Wright, Now in Sydney Australia |
| ajwr...@ozemail.com.au or |
| a.wr...@student.canberra.edu.au |
-------------------------------------------------------
Iming chan
On Thu, 6 Feb 1997, Ashley Wright wrote:
> Why don't they close the line alltogether and extend the number 19
> tram all the way to upfield. Or could this closure be used at a later
> date for that very purpose.
Ashley,
I don't think closing the entire Upfield line is a good idea. After if
you compare tram journey to trains during peak hours, I am certain trains
are still much faster (ie. Sydney Road is not a six lane divided highway
at all!!). Luckily, the newspaper did indicate that the CEO of the PTC,
Mr. Dobbs, is not happy with the closure. Just another example of bias
towards freeways (I don't remember any railway construction require
closure of such length of roads or highways!).
John Wayman
> Keep in mind, dear reader, that Newmarket is further from the city than
> Flemington Bridge. Surely they could at least run substitute buses in
the
> general direction of the city! North Melbourne's not that far away and
it
> has more trains.
All but the the idiot railfan traveller will simply transfer to a tram at
Flemington Bridge, for a trip straight to the CBD.
The bus link will be to allow rail access to North Melbourne and Western
suburban lines.
Note that a frequent tram service exists along this proposed bus link!
It would be logical for the PTC to add additional short workings on this
tram service between Flemington Bridge and the city in peak hours when the
trams obn this trunk route are probably overcrowded.
--
Cheers
John Wayman
Chris Brownbill
Iming chan wrote:
>
> Dear all,
>
> My apology for the cross posting of this message.
>
> According to yesterday and today's "Herald Sun", the Upfield line, between
> North Melbourne and Flemington Bridge will be closed from May 1997. This
> is to allow the construction of western section of the CityLink. Buses
> will be available between Flemington Bridge and Newmarket (on Broadmeadows
> line) stations. The reason for the closure over this section is due to
> the safety reasons. While in yesterday's article, commuters on that line
> will travel for free and yearly ticket holders are eligible for refund.
> The length of closure is approximately 6 months.
>
> Regards,
>
>
But that's not all, apparently during the closure of the North Melb to
Flemington Bridge Section, the shuttle trian service north from
Flemington Bridge will terminate at Gowrie rather than Upfield for some
reason which is beyond my comprehension, and there will be a bus
connection to Upfield. This means that someone travelling from the city
to Upfield is expected to:
1) Board a train to Newmarket
Change
2) Travel by bus to Flemington Bridge
Change
3) Travel by Train to Gowrie
Change
4) Travel by bus to Upfield.
:<
Roderick Smith
AFAIK, one of the reasons for the apparently-strange bus routing is the
traffic flow. A lot of patronage is not city-loop commuting; apparently
there is an institution beyond North Melbourne which attracts many.
Apart from the lower speed of trams in city traffic, this is one reason
for not replacing the line with route 19 trams. Another scheme proposed
for the duration was operation from Royal Park, with B2 articulated trams
from Flinders St. The route was upgraded, and B2s have been in use since
December.
--
Regards,
Roderick Smith
(Rail News Victoria editor)
*** Elvis isn't dead; he's waiting 6 months for the next
train home.
David Bromage
Aside from the roadwork, will the PTC take the opportunity of reduced
services to perform the much promised upgrading of the Upfield line?
Replacing the hand operated gates with booms and double line block with
automatic signals is difficult at the best of times with trains running.
This is the perfect opportunity to do the upgrading while there are
restricted services.
I assume the route via Somerton is still open. I doubt The Met will want
the train running the shuttle service stranded for 6+ months.
Cheers
David
Fraser Bryden
ajwr...@ozemail.com.au (Ashley Wright) wrote:
>>According to yesterday and today's "Herald Sun", the Upfield line, between
>>North Melbourne and Flemington Bridge will be closed from May 1997. This
>>is to allow the construction of western section of the CityLink. Buses
>>will be available between Flemington Bridge and Newmarket (on Broadmeadows
>>line) stations. The reason for the closure over this section is due to
>>the safety reasons. While in yesterday's article, commuters on that line
>>will travel for free and yearly ticket holders are eligible for refund.
>>The length of closure is approximately 6 months.
> Why don't they close the line alltogether and extend the number 19
>tram all the way to upfield. Or could this closure be used at a later
>date for that very purpose.
If they closed the line then they'd probably never re-open it. In any
case, the Government promised that the line wouldn't be closed for the
construction of Citystink, and now they've gone and partially closed
it. Sounds like a broken promise to me.
The article in the Age said that commuting time would be increased by
'only' 15 minutes (!)
It was interesting to read an article late last year which went along
the lines of 'the Government has demonstrated it's commitment to
public transport by NOT closing the Upfield line!!!' What a crock!
---
"In real life, there IS no reset button"
Fraser Bryden
mailto:ski...@blackadder.cse.rmit.edu.au
http://blackadder.cse.rmit.edu.au/~skiman
Michael Fuller
amo...@ee.mu.OZ.AU (Anthony Morton) writes:
>Uh-huh, and the automated ticket machines were supposed to be fully installed
>2 years ago. Don't expect the government to put any pressure on Transurban to
>complete the work in 6 months.
Uh, don't you mean 10-15 years ago? Remember, when Museum Station first
opened, sitting in the foyer were automatic ticket machines ... that were
never used.
Michael
David Bromage
Flinders Street had WORKING ticket machines in about 1980.
Cheers
David
David Johnson
Iming chan wrote:
> Mr. Dobbs, is not happy with the closure. Just another example of bias
> towards freeways (I don't remember any railway construction require
> closure of such length of roads or highways!).
How about Devonshire Street at Central in Sydney? It was a big hole in
the ground for years while they were building platforms 24/25/26/27.
--
David Johnson - Rail Services Authority
trai...@ozemail.com.au
http://www.ozemail.com.au/~trainman
David McLoughlin
Roderick Smith wrote:
Another scheme proposed
> for the duration was operation from Royal Park, with B2 articulated trams
> from Flinders St. The route was upgraded, and B2s have been in use since
> December.-
Do you mean B2s running to West Coburg, or just as some kind of
short-working from the city to Royal Park? What sort of service is being
operated? Has the crappy trackwork through the park finally been fixed?
Thanks
David McLoughlin
Auckland New Zealand
Roderick Smith
The proposal in conjunction with Upfield was short working. The
actuality is through running (allowing Essendon panto Z3s to be cascaded
to Brunswick, and Brunswick pole Z3s to be cascaded to Malvern to allow
for the reopening of route 72). This also gives route 55
airconditioning.
AFAIK the work through the park in 1996 was on overhead wiring, not on
track.
--
Regards,
Roderick Smith
(Rail News Victoria editor)
*** Elvis isn't dead; he's waiting at Macaulay station.
Craig Haber
David Bromage wrote:
>
> Aside from the roadwork, will the PTC take the opportunity of reduced
> services to perform the much promised upgrading of the Upfield line?
They already are. On Sat 18/Feb I saw a works train with at least 1 T
class loco on the down side of Coburg. The track is being welded for
track-circuiting.
For the guys working the ballast trains, this line must be a real crock
- all those handgates to operate! And what happens with the Interlocked
gates, do the signal boxes have to be manned for the night?
Cya,
Craig.
--
Craig Haber
alba...@harnessnet.com.au
Manufacturing Systems Engineer (almost)
Web Page Designer, Harness Racing, Railways, and Essendon Football Club
fanatic
http://www.harnessnet.com.au/
Bernard Morey
Anthony Morton wrote:
>
> Thanks for spreading the word, Iming. This is the worst news for Melbourne's
> public transport users since the announcement of CityLink itself.
One man's meat is another's...&c Actually, Citylink was _good_ news
(unless one is an anti-technology throwback). And at last the Upfield
line will have automatic crossings, instead of the present
turn-of-the-century system.
--
Bernie Morey (daily train commuter -- Hurstbridge and Frankston lines)
David McLean
Bernard Morey wrote:
> One man's meat is another's...&c Actually, Citylink was _good_ news
> (unless one is an anti-technology throwback).
Nice to see someone with a simple (or even naieve) and comforting view
of the world. There's a lot more to this than being an "anti-technology
throwback", but I admit it is much easier to contribute meaningless
one-liners that deal with the issues.
> And at last the Upfield
> line will have automatic crossings, instead of the present
> turn-of-the-century system.
That's an independent issue.
David McLean
Chris Brownbill
Roderick Smith wrote:
> AFAIK the work through the park in 1996 was on overhead wiring, not on
> track.
In early '96 there were large piles of rail placed alongside the track
in Royal Park just on the up side of the first road crossing near the
zoo - so I presume that the work did include trackwork.
And to answer David's question - yes B2s regularly work through to West
Coburg now.
Also, to co-incide with the opening of the new Casino at southbank,
Sunday services will be re-introduced to William Street and route 55
will operate 7 days per week to Domain Interchange in place of route 68
(West Coburg to Elizabeth Street).
Martin Gleeson
In article <32FE26...@aardvark.apana.org.au>,
bmo...@aardvark.apana.org.au wrote:
>Anthony Morton wrote:
>> Thanks for spreading the word, Iming. This is the worst news for Melbourne's
>> public transport users since the announcement of CityLink itself.
>One man's meat is another's...&c Actually, Citylink was _good_ news
>(unless one is an anti-technology throwback).
Good news for whom? Transurban and their backers maybe. Tolls on roads
already built and paid for, tolls guaranteed to rise at the inflation rate
or 4.5%, whichever is higher (and it sure looks like being the latter), and
so on. Government complicity in ensuring returns to Transurban by closing
roads and forcing people onto the toll roads.
Good news for whom?
>And at last the Upfield line will have automatic crossings, instead
>of the present turn-of-the-century system.
What does that have to do with CityLink?
Cheers,
Marty.
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Peter Shute
I read an official notice about the Upfield line at flinders Street.
It said that there will be free travel FROM the Upfield line to any
city station, and to Richmond.
Does that mean it's not free if you want to go the other way? Not very
convenient for those who normally buy weekly/monthly tickets: you'd
have to buy a 2 hour ticket every evening.
And how are they going to check tickets now? Everyone from every other
line will claim they came from the Upfield line if they don't want to
buy a ticket.
Are they going to hand out boarding passes or something? I wonder if
they've thought of any of this.
Anthony Morton
John Wayman <way...@c031.aone.net.au> wrote:
>
>All but the the idiot railfan traveller will simply transfer to a tram at
>Flemington Bridge, for a trip straight to the CBD.
Even so, compare this with the existing situation for Upfield travellers.
A train can travel between Flemington Bridge and the city in five to ten
minutes. Once in the city it can drop you at any one of five stations around
the Loop; transferring onto another train to get out the other side of the
city is simple.
From the eastern end of Racecourse Road, depending on traffic and loading, the
57 tram takes between 20 and 30 minutes to meander through North Melbourne and
down Elizabeth Street. I guess you could walk a block instead and catch the
59 tram down Flemington Road, which might be marginally quicker, but if you're
mobility-impaired it's not really an attractive option. Add up to fifteen
minutes of waiting time and you've more or less tripled the time for your
original journey from Coburg or Fawkner. Plus, if your final destination
isn't close to Elizabeth Street you've got more transfers to make. Overall,
even with the tram service available, the level of inconvenience is likely to
drive people away from the system.
>The bus link will be to allow rail access to North Melbourne and Western
>suburban lines.
Even if this is the intention, it hardly makes sense to run buses to Newmarket
instead of North Melbourne. The former connects with just one western suburbs
line, the latter with all of them. No doubt having the bus go to Newmarket is
easier from the operator's point of view, but this has never been the way to
keep passengers.
>Note that a frequent tram service exists along this proposed bus link!
>
>It would be logical for the PTC to add additional short workings on this
>tram service between Flemington Bridge and the city in peak hours when the
>trams obn this trunk route are probably overcrowded.
This makes all sorts of sense, but I'm not holding my breath.
Cheers,
Tony M.
Public Transport Users Association http://www.vicnet.net.au/~ptua/firstpt.htm
Clive Newall
I read an official notice about the Upfield line at flinders Street.
It said that there will be free travel FROM the Upfield line to any
city station, and to Richmond.
Does that mean it's not free if you want to go the other way? Not very
convenient for those who normally buy weekly/monthly tickets: you'd
have to buy a 2 hour ticket every evening.
Why? Tickets are rarely checked at the suburban stations. (Certainly I've
never been checked at Coburg or Batman).
And how are they going to check tickets now? Everyone from every other
line will claim they came from the Upfield line if they don't want to
buy a ticket.
Are they going to hand out boarding passes or something? I wonder if
they've thought of any of this.
Since the only way to get from the Upfield line to the City (as a replacement
for being on the train the whole way) is to use the Flem.Bridge-Newmarket bus,
handing out a pass of some sort would appear a not-too-difficult task.
Of course, if most people take other alternative routes, the lost revenue
to the PTC is considerably reduced.
Refunding yearly ticket holders (including those that are in pay-as-you-go
yearly ticket schemes) will be much more difficult.
Also:
This is being talked about as a 6 month closure...but I noted the other day
that Grant St./St.Kilda Road is still closed etc due to the CityLink works.
The signs there say (quite clearly) "12 June 1996 - January 1997".
Looking at the state of things, I can't see the roads there reopening
for several more months...
So will it be 6 months? Or will construction delays make it 9 or 12 months?
I doubt there are any firm commitments about this anywhere.
Clive.
Resigned to spending an extra 20-30min each way getting to/from work.
--
Clive Newall <c...@bby.com.au> / Burdett Buckeridge & Young Ltd Melb Australia
"I think Casper is the ghost of Richie Rich. I wonder how Richie died?"
"Perhaps he realized how hollow the pursuit of money is and took his own life"
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Fraser
Thus spake the keyboard of Chris Brownbill <cbrn...@enternet.com.au>:
>Also, to co-incide with the opening of the new Casino at southbank,
>Sunday services will be re-introduced to William Street and route 55
>will operate 7 days per week to Domain Interchange in place of route 68
>(West Coburg to Elizabeth Street).
I wonder if the PTC will be smart enough to remove the signs on
William Street saying that Sunday services run via Elizabeth Street?
;-)
Anthony Morton
Chris Brownbill <cbrn...@enternet.com.au> wrote:
>
>Also, to co-incide with the opening of the new Casino at southbank,
>Sunday services will be re-introduced to William Street and route 55
>will operate 7 days per week to Domain Interchange in place of route 68
>(West Coburg to Elizabeth Street).
So what does this mean for those who train in from the suburbs and want to
take the tram to the Zoo (thus avoiding the closed Upfield line)? Given that
Flagstaff station is now to be closed all weekend, they'll either have to walk
the two city blocks from Elizabeth Street to William Street, or change trams
in the middle of Flemington Road.
Don't get me wrong, I think having the 55 tram service run 7 days is a good
idea. But if it's to replace the 68 tram on Sundays, I think there's a real
case for keeping Flagstaff open (particularly with the Upfield closure).
Cheers,
Tony
Leslie Brown
Bernard Morey <bmo...@aardvark.apana.org.au> wrote:
>Anthony Morton wrote:
>>
>> Thanks for spreading the word, Iming. This is the worst news for Melbourne's
>> public transport users since the announcement of CityLink itself.
>One man's meat is another's...&c Actually, Citylink was _good_ news
>(unless one is an anti-technology throwback). And at last the Upfield
>line will have automatic crossings, instead of the present
>turn-of-the-century system.
>--
>Bernie Morey (daily train commuter -- Hurstbridge and Frankston lines)
I agree with you. I too think that the Citylink project is a good
idea. The best advantage is that the users actually pay for the
infrastructure rather than the taxpayer.
One benefit of the toll must be to encourage people to use public
transport. How many people will now park their cars at say Sunbury
station, for example, and use public transport for the rest of the way
in, I really wouldn't like to guess, but I don't think that it will
encourage people to take their cars all the way through when
previously they would have used public transport. If the freeway will
be free, I think it will be a different story.
Les Brown