Jaycar "Watts Clever" warning.

[~misfit~]

A few years back I bought a set of three RF remotely-controlled mains
switches from Jaycar called "Watts Clever".

(I'm an invalid and like to watch something 'light' on TV before I sleep
while the night meds kick in. These devices saved me a bit of hassle
re-wakening to turn everything in my home theatre system off.)

A couple of days ago the relay inside the RF switch that turns off my
receiver and powered subwoofer went into a 50 Hz spams mode and since then
my reciever won't come out of standby. :( Being an invalid brings with it a
dire financial situation so if I can't repair the receiver (I haven't been
able to test the subwoofer yet) it will likely be the end of my HT days - at
least for a good long while.

My electronics skills are rudimentary at best. I read some sites and this
newsgroup because I want to improve them. I haven't looked at the receiver
yet but the standby LED coming on rules out a fuse and, aside from any
visual clue, that's about the extent of my repair skills to date. I can
solder and replace but don't have the tools or skills to troubleshoot in
depth.

Just a heads up in case anyone else is using these devices on expensive
equipment.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

[Adrian Jansen]

On 26/02/2016 10:26 AM, ~misfit~ wrote:
> A few years back I bought a set of three RF remotely-controlled mains
> switches from Jaycar called "Watts Clever".
>
> (I'm an invalid and like to watch something 'light' on TV before I sleep
> while the night meds kick in. These devices saved me a bit of hassle
> re-wakening to turn everything in my home theatre system off.)
>
> A couple of days ago the relay inside the RF switch that turns off my
> receiver and powered subwoofer went into a 50 Hz spams mode and since then
> my reciever won't come out of standby. :( Being an invalid brings with it a
> dire financial situation so if I can't repair the receiver (I haven't been
> able to test the subwoofer yet) it will likely be the end of my HT days - at
> least for a good long while.
>
> My electronics skills are rudimentary at best. I read some sites and this
> newsgroup because I want to improve them. I haven't looked at the receiver
> yet but the standby LED coming on rules out a fuse and, aside from any
> visual clue, that's about the extent of my repair skills to date. I can
> solder and replace but don't have the tools or skills to troubleshoot in
> depth.
>
> Just a heads up in case anyone else is using these devices on expensive
> equipment.
>

There wont be much to troubleshoot, or repair, in this sort of consumer
device.

My guess there will be a receiver chip, probably buried under a blob of
plastic, maybe a driver transistor for the relay, and the relay itself.

If there is no obvious fault in the driver transistor or relay ( ie a
burnt looking component ), then your only hope is a new unit.

Prices on this sort of stuff have come down remarkably in the last few
years, so maybe look around at what is available, and start saving.

But also consider whether you can plug all the necessary mains cords
into one power strip, and then just turn that on and off at some
convenient location.

[Adrian Jansen]

For instance this is in Jaycar current listing:

http://www.techbrands.com/store/product/ms6122.aspx

Retail about AU $60.00

[~misfit~]

Once upon a time on usenet Adrian Jansen wrote:
> On 26/02/2016 10:26 AM, ~misfit~ wrote:
>> A few years back I bought a set of three RF remotely-controlled mains
>> switches from Jaycar called "Watts Clever".
>>
>> (I'm an invalid and like to watch something 'light' on TV before I
>> sleep while the night meds kick in. These devices saved me a bit of
>> hassle re-wakening to turn everything in my home theatre system off.)
>>
>> A couple of days ago the relay inside the RF switch that turns off my
>> receiver and powered subwoofer went into a 50 Hz spams mode and
>> since then my reciever won't come out of standby. :( Being an
>> invalid brings with it a dire financial situation so if I can't
>> repair the receiver (I haven't been able to test the subwoofer yet)
>> it will likely be the end of my HT days - at least for a good long
>> while. My electronics skills are rudimentary at best. I read some sites
>> and
>> this newsgroup because I want to improve them. I haven't looked at
>> the receiver yet but the standby LED coming on rules out a fuse and,
>> aside from any visual clue, that's about the extent of my repair
>> skills to date. I can solder and replace but don't have the tools or
>> skills to troubleshoot in depth.
>>
>> Just a heads up in case anyone else is using these devices on
>> expensive equipment.
>>
> There wont be much to troubleshoot, or repair, in this sort of
> consumer device.

I was talking about repairing the HT receiver, not the Jaycar junk. ;)

> My guess there will be a receiver chip, probably buried under a blob
> of plastic, maybe a driver transistor for the relay, and the relay
> itself.
> If there is no obvious fault in the driver transistor or relay ( ie a
> burnt looking component ), then your only hope is a new unit.
>
> Prices on this sort of stuff have come down remarkably in the last few
> years, so maybe look around at what is available, and start saving.
>
> But also consider whether you can plug all the necessary mains cords
> into one power strip, and then just turn that on and off at some
> convenient location.

That is what I'll do in future. I was using one of the RF devices for the
same thing, switching a powerstrip with my amps plugged into it (totalling
maybe 3A draw so well within specs). The other two 'hard wired' (buried
under the bed) for a fan and a heater respectively.

[Phil Allison]

~misfit~ wrote:
>
>
> A couple of days ago the relay inside the RF switch that turns off my
> receiver and powered subwoofer went into a 50 Hz spams mode and since then
> my reciever won't come out of standby.
>

> I haven't looked at the receiver
> yet but the standby LED coming on rules out a fuse
>

** No it doesn't.

Very likely there is a fuse that feeds the power transformer only and no fuse for the standby circuitry. I have an Onkyo 7ch receiver here now that is like that.

A chattering AC relay would be very likely to blow the transformer fuse ( due to repeated inrush surges ) but do no other harm.

The fuse you are looking for would be marked " T2A " through "T5A" - the T stands for slow acting.


.... Phil

[~misfit~]

Cheers, thanks for that Phil. I'll disconnect it and drag it out when I'm
feeling up to it. I haven't checked it yet as it's just too bloddy
depressing. :-/ That comment gives me hope though. :)

[Adrian Jansen]

Ok, so its not the Jaycar part which failed, thats different.

One other thing you could consider using is a timer set to turn off the
main power board at some preset time ( eg after you go to sleep ). Many
of the electronic ones have a very good range of settings you can use,
and usually only a single push button to switch between off-on-timer
modes. I have a couple of Baun ones from Aldi which do this. Work
well, for a piece of consumer 'junk'.

[Chris Jones]

On 28/02/2016 08:17, Adrian Jansen wrote:
>
> Ok, so its not the Jaycar part which failed, thats different.

The OP said that it failed too (first), later taking out the audio
equipment by buzzing the mains relay on and off.

> One other thing you could consider using is a timer set to turn off the
> main power board at some preset time ( eg after you go to sleep ). Many
> of the electronic ones have a very good range of settings you can use,
> and usually only a single push button to switch between off-on-timer
> modes. I have a couple of Baun ones from Aldi which do this. Work
> well, for a piece of consumer 'junk'.

Some electronic timers can also fail in a mode (dried out electrolytic)
where the mains relay buzzes on and off at 50Hz, just like happened to
the OP with the radio-controlled switch. This will quite likely damage
any loads connected and/or overheat the relay, perhaps to an extent that
it would pose a danger of fire. Perhaps the ones with a little motor and
a rotating drum that operates a mechanical switch might be safer, but I
don't know.

[~misfit~]

Once upon a time on usenet Adrian Jansen wrote:
> Ok, so its not the Jaycar part which failed, thats different.

I thought that my post was clear. The Jaycar device failed with the relay
which switches the mains power cycling at 50Hz. That took out my Receiver.
So they both 'failed' but it's hardly surprising that the amp died with
power being switched 50 times a second while it was operating at a fairly
high level.

Despite being almost destitute I can live without the RF switcher - it's not
going to have too big an impact on my QoL. However my financial situation is
such that the loss of the five channel surround-sound amplifier could cause
a downturn, my already rather spartan could become a lot less bearable.

This is the device I'm talking about only mine came with two more 'switches'
and switched three outlets.
http://www.jaycar.co.nz/PRODUCTS/Power-Products-Electrical/Distribution-%26-Interconnect/Mains-Control-%26-Protection-Devices/Wireless-Mains-Remote-and-Single-Outlet/p/MS6145
I bought it about four years ago and one of the 'switches' failed in the off
position a couple of years ago. I never imagined another would fail by
cycling the mains at the AC frequency. The fault is repeatable. If I plug
the switch in and turn it on within a few minutes it goes into spasm again.

> One other thing you could consider using is a timer set to turn off
> the main power board at some preset time ( eg after you go to sleep
> ). Many of the electronic ones have a very good range of settings
> you can use, and usually only a single push button to switch between
> off-on-timer modes. I have a couple of Baun ones from Aldi which do
> this. Work well, for a piece of consumer 'junk'.

I will never again trust irreplaceable electronics to the vagaries of cheap
Chinese switches (though 'cheap' is relative, the "Watts Clever" thing cost
me a months discretionary spending money). Despite the fact that it will
likely inflame my back and upset my sleeping routine I'll get out of bed
after my pre-sleep back-settling period and flick a good old mechanical
circuit breaker.

Thanks to advise from Phil there's a chance I might be able to save the amp
when I feel well enough to slide it out of its shelf, label (if there's the
slightest chance it'll work I'd rather not trace them all again) then
disconect all of the wires so I can open it up and check for the fuse he
mentioned. I'm just really pleased that my TV draws such a small amount of
current on standby that I decided to *not* have that connected to the
spasming switch.

Crazy really. I'm acutely aware of the fact that replacing anything that
fails would be very difficult if not impossible on my income. As such the
audio system and TV have *two* surge protectors between them and the mains.
It never occured to me that this might happen or I would have put the RF
switcher upstream of them..... (Don't know if that would have helped
though.)

[~misfit~]

Once upon a time on usenet Phil Allison wrote:
> ~misfit~ wrote:
>> A couple of days ago the relay inside the RF switch that turns off my

>> receiver and powered subwoofer went into a 50 Hz spasm mode and

>> since then my reciever won't come out of standby.
>>
>> I haven't looked at the receiver
>> yet but the standby LED coming on rules out a fuse
>>
>
> ** No it doesn't.
>
> Very likely there is a fuse that feeds the power transformer only and
> no fuse for the standby circuitry. I have an Onkyo 7ch receiver here
> now that is like that.
>
> A chattering AC relay would be very likely to blow the transformer
> fuse ( due to repeated inrush surges ) but do no other harm.
>
> The fuse you are looking for would be marked " T2A " through "T5A"
> - the T stands for slow acting.

You bloody beauty! Thanks for that.

I'd wrongly assumed that, as the standby LED came on it was unlikely to be a
fuse. However because of your post, instead of disconnecting everything I
was able to slide the amp out of its rack and onto a chair and lift the lid.
Sure enough one of the two T3A fuses was blown (the other and the T6A were
fine). I changed it out, fired it up and all's well.

You saved me a lot of work. I would have found it ultimately but it was so
much quicker and easier to do it this way. Also thank the gods the Klispch
power subwoofer survived the AC switching at 50 Hz for the ~8 seconds it
took for me to realise what was going on then get to the thing to unplug it.

Cheers,

[Heisenberg]

On Mon, 29 Feb 2016 20:18:48 +1300, "~misfit~"
<shaun.at...@gmail.com> wrote:

>"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
>little classification in the DSM*."
>David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
>(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

=-=-

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville