Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss
Chinese solder on ebay
163 views
Skip to first unread message
John_H
Apr 9, 2015, 6:10:15 PM4/9/15
to
Is it any good?
Also significant amounts of 63/37 Sn/Pb (the true eutectic point) are
being offered whereas the locally available product has mostly always
been 60/40. Why so (and/or which is preferable)?
--
John H
Also significant amounts of 63/37 Sn/Pb (the true eutectic point) are
being offered whereas the locally available product has mostly always
been 60/40. Why so (and/or which is preferable)?
--
John H
Clocky
Apr 9, 2015, 7:30:03 PM4/9/15
to
chances of board damage when doing repairs?
I don't see a real downside though I still use 60/40 so no direct
experience with it.
Cloaca
Apr 10, 2015, 9:20:53 AM4/10/15
to
the one below. It's shite, it does not appear to work as flux at all and
needs detergent and a scrubbing brush to get it off the board.
<http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/150g-High-quality-Intensity-Soldering-Paste-Solder-Flux-Paste-Grease-For-IC-PCB-/261302866646?pt=AU_B_I_Electrical_Test_Equipment&hash=item3cd6dd52d6>
pedro
Apr 10, 2015, 9:47:02 AM4/10/15
to
Well it's a fair bet it has real lead in it, since they were putting
it into the paint on kids' toys ...
And it has to be better than the shite lead-free crap that causes so
many failures.
<O/T: I have in service some solenoid coils that have been made in
Sydney and under the same part# since 1978, The originals lasted over
20 years, on eventual failure the outer resin shell was
heat-discoloured and showing some cracking. Replacements - with
lead-free solder - are lasting 15 months on average with there being
no visible signs of distress. Without X-ray gear I can't be 100% sure
of the failure mode, but when their product engineer was quizzed about
what had changed from original he eventually conceded that the only
change was the move to lead-free solder.>
Q: Why are aerospace, military, aviation and medical end-uses exempt
from the requirement to use lead-free solder?
A:
it into the paint on kids' toys ...
And it has to be better than the shite lead-free crap that causes so
many failures.
<O/T: I have in service some solenoid coils that have been made in
Sydney and under the same part# since 1978, The originals lasted over
20 years, on eventual failure the outer resin shell was
heat-discoloured and showing some cracking. Replacements - with
lead-free solder - are lasting 15 months on average with there being
no visible signs of distress. Without X-ray gear I can't be 100% sure
of the failure mode, but when their product engineer was quizzed about
what had changed from original he eventually conceded that the only
change was the move to lead-free solder.>
Q: Why are aerospace, military, aviation and medical end-uses exempt
from the requirement to use lead-free solder?
A:
Phil Allison
Apr 10, 2015, 7:16:34 PM4/10/15
to
John_H wrote:
>
> Is it any good?
** Funny thing about using Chinese solder is that after you have made a good joint, couple of hours later you want to do it again.
>
> Is it any good?
.... Phil
John_H
May 4, 2015, 12:45:03 AM5/4/15
to
John_H wrote:
>
>Is it any good?
Can't fault this one, so far....
>
>Is it any good?
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/400535238617?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
It's shiny and clean, flows and wets well... and the flux doesn't
smell like cat's piss. It's also a lot cheaper than Multicore, which
has gotten expensive of late.
--
John H
Trevor Wilson
May 4, 2015, 6:11:54 AM5/4/15
to
Ersin Multicore Savbit and be done with it? A 500g roll lasts me months.
I don't mind buying some Chinese stuff, but when it is mission-critical,
like solder, no chance. I just don't trust them to supply two batches
the same.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com
John_H
May 4, 2015, 5:35:32 PM5/4/15
to
Trevor Wilson wrote:
>On 10/04/2015 8:10 AM, John_H wrote:
>> Is it any good?
>>
>> Also significant amounts of 63/37 Sn/Pb (the true eutectic point) are
>> being offered whereas the locally available product has mostly always
>> been 60/40. Why so (and/or which is preferable)?
>>
>
>**Unless you are using kilos of the stuff every month, why not just buy
>Ersin Multicore Savbit and be done with it? A 500g roll lasts me months.
>I don't mind buying some Chinese stuff, but when it is mission-critical,
>like solder, no chance. I just don't trust them to supply two batches
>the same.
I keep a bit of Savbit on hand (for soldering thin copper wires) but
>On 10/04/2015 8:10 AM, John_H wrote:
>> Is it any good?
>>
>> Also significant amounts of 63/37 Sn/Pb (the true eutectic point) are
>> being offered whereas the locally available product has mostly always
>> been 60/40. Why so (and/or which is preferable)?
>>
>
>**Unless you are using kilos of the stuff every month, why not just buy
>Ersin Multicore Savbit and be done with it? A 500g roll lasts me months.
>I don't mind buying some Chinese stuff, but when it is mission-critical,
>like solder, no chance. I just don't trust them to supply two batches
>the same.
I've mostly used the normal Multicore, at least in part because Savbit
only seems to be available in 1.22mm... and now costs around $80 for
500g. The normal stuff is similarly priced (and also seems slightly
better to use).
It's not that I use much of it but sooner or later it has to be
replaced and I particulary object to the price... noting that WES
still sell 60/40 for around $8 per 200g (plus GST) but I've no idea
what it's like, or who makes it.
FWIW Jaycar once gave me a couple of complimentary rolls of whatever
they were selling at the time and it was absolute crap whereas the
Chinese stuff I recently bought on ebay seems OK.
--
John H
Clocky
May 4, 2015, 8:23:20 PM5/4/15
to Phil Allison
Phil Allison
May 4, 2015, 9:46:07 PM5/4/15
to
John_H wrote:
>
> I keep a bit of Savbit on hand (for soldering thin copper wires) but
> I've mostly used the normal Multicore, at least in part because Savbit
> only seems to be available in 1.22mm... and now costs around $80 for
> 500g. The normal stuff is similarly priced (and also seems slightly
> better to use).
>
> It's not that I use much of it but sooner or later it has to be
> replaced and I particulary object to the price... noting that WES
> still sell 60/40 for around $8 per 200g (plus GST) but I've no idea
> what it's like, or who makes it.
** The WES 60/40 solder wire is made by Shenmao in Taiwan.
>
> I keep a bit of Savbit on hand (for soldering thin copper wires) but
> I've mostly used the normal Multicore, at least in part because Savbit
> only seems to be available in 1.22mm... and now costs around $80 for
> 500g. The normal stuff is similarly priced (and also seems slightly
> better to use).
>
> It's not that I use much of it but sooner or later it has to be
> replaced and I particulary object to the price... noting that WES
> still sell 60/40 for around $8 per 200g (plus GST) but I've no idea
> what it's like, or who makes it.
http://www.shenmao.com/
The flux is a "no clean" type, not very effective on tarnished metals.
Works well on newish looking parts.
.... Phil
John_H
May 4, 2015, 11:47:27 PM5/4/15
to
Phil Allison wrote:
>
>** The WES 60/40 solder wire is made by Shenmao in Taiwan.
>
>http://www.shenmao.com/
>
>The flux is a "no clean" type, not very effective on tarnished metals.
Which would probably piss me off!
>
>** The WES 60/40 solder wire is made by Shenmao in Taiwan.
>
>http://www.shenmao.com/
>
>The flux is a "no clean" type, not very effective on tarnished metals.
First thing I tried the Chinese stuff on were a few stray components
with badly tarnished leads and it worked reasonably well. The flux is
pretty effective, with a residue that looks similar to Multicore and
needs a commercial cleaning solvent to remove.
>Works well on newish looking parts.
John H
pedro
May 6, 2015, 9:04:26 PM5/6/15
to
On Tue, 05 May 2015 07:35:29 +1000, John_H <john...@inbox.com> wrote:
>I keep a bit of Savbit on hand (for soldering thin copper wires) but
>I've mostly used the normal Multicore, at least in part because Savbit
>only seems to be available in 1.22mm... and now costs around $80 for
>500g. The normal stuff is similarly priced (and also seems slightly
>better to use).
>
>It's not that I use much of it but sooner or later it has to be
>replaced and I particulary object to the price... noting that WES
>still sell 60/40 for around $8 per 200g (plus GST) but I've no idea
>what it's like, or who makes it.
WES were largely a supplier to the servicing trade (although the
>I keep a bit of Savbit on hand (for soldering thin copper wires) but
>I've mostly used the normal Multicore, at least in part because Savbit
>only seems to be available in 1.22mm... and now costs around $80 for
>500g. The normal stuff is similarly priced (and also seems slightly
>better to use).
>
>It's not that I use much of it but sooner or later it has to be
>replaced and I particulary object to the price... noting that WES
>still sell 60/40 for around $8 per 200g (plus GST) but I've no idea
>what it's like, or who makes it.
balance *may* have shifted a littlle towards consumer lines) so I'd
expect it to be decent. I get my supplies of SnPb from a local
electronics specialist who has the trade as 90% of his business.
John_H
May 9, 2015, 9:41:35 PM5/9/15
to
pedro wrote:
>
>WES were largely a supplier to the servicing trade (although the
>balance *may* have shifted a littlle towards consumer lines) so I'd
>expect it to be decent.
They still are, even though the service trade probably no longer
>
>WES were largely a supplier to the servicing trade (although the
>balance *may* have shifted a littlle towards consumer lines) so I'd
>expect it to be decent.
represents the bulk of their business... Wagner is the retail outlet.
They also sell a considerable amount of junk (which may or may not
include their solder).
>I get my supplies of SnPb from a local
>electronics specialist who has the trade as 90% of his business.
outlet which stocks even worse crap (I happen to live in a relatively
remote area). I've previously bought solder from RS Components but
last time around they sent Multicore HMP instead of 60/40 (which
happens to have a very similar looking label). By the time I got
around to using it, and noticed the mistake, it it was too late to
send it back and I don't particularly feel like giving them another
opportunity to stuff up. :(
--
John H
Computer Nerd Kev
May 11, 2015, 6:34:12 PM5/11/15
to
manufacturer. You can buy their solder from Wiltronics and Rockby
Electronics, probably among others. I find it works well.
--
__ __
#_ < |\| |< _#
Clocky
May 12, 2015, 2:20:44 AM5/12/15
to
years ago. It too was made in Australia, I wonder if it's the same but
rebranded by Dick Smith (who don't stock it anymore) because it's good
stuff.
Consolidated Alloys solder is also available at Bunnings BTW.
John_H
May 12, 2015, 8:07:58 PM5/12/15
to
rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label). I'm not familiar with
Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
multimeters.
>Consolidated Alloys solder is also available at Bunnings BTW.
got "CAPALLOY" imprinted on the spool)... of which I've never been a
fan. It doesn't flow nearly as well as Multicore, or the Chinese
brand I recently bought on ebay. It's also a much duller colour,
which seems a bit odd since both are claimed to be 60/40. The Chinese
stuff (claimed to be 63/37) is brighter still, as you'd expect from a
higher Sn content.
--
John H
Clocky
May 12, 2015, 9:48:10 PM5/12/15
to
On 13/05/2015 8:07 AM, John_H wrote:
> Clocky wrote:
>> On 12/05/2015 6:34 AM, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
>>>
>>> Consolidated Alloys (http://www.cagroup.com.au/) are an Australian
>>> manufacturer. You can buy their solder from Wiltronics and Rockby
>>> Electronics, probably among others. I find it works well.
>>>
>>
>> I'm still using a roll of Digitor branded .56mm solder that I bought
>> years ago. It too was made in Australia, I wonder if it's the same but
>> rebranded by Dick Smith (who don't stock it anymore) because it's good
>> stuff.
>
> Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
> rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label).
The label on my roll is peeled and I can only read the Digitor brand and
> Clocky wrote:
>> On 12/05/2015 6:34 AM, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
>>>
>>> Consolidated Alloys (http://www.cagroup.com.au/) are an Australian
>>> manufacturer. You can buy their solder from Wiltronics and Rockby
>>> Electronics, probably among others. I find it works well.
>>>
>>
>> I'm still using a roll of Digitor branded .56mm solder that I bought
>> years ago. It too was made in Australia, I wonder if it's the same but
>> rebranded by Dick Smith (who don't stock it anymore) because it's good
>> stuff.
>
> Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
> rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label).
size and it's old catalog number N2615 so that could well be. I quite
like it in any case.
I'm not familiar with
> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
> multimeters.
>
station though, might be worth a look since I wouldn't mind a second
unit for the shed and it's reasonably priced so thanks for the tip.
>> Consolidated Alloys solder is also available at Bunnings BTW.
>
> Jaycar solder was, and possibly still is, Consolodated Alloys (it's
> got "CAPALLOY" imprinted on the spool)... of which I've never been a
> fan. It doesn't flow nearly as well as Multicore, or the Chinese
> brand I recently bought on ebay. It's also a much duller colour,
> which seems a bit odd since both are claimed to be 60/40. The Chinese
> stuff (claimed to be 63/37) is brighter still, as you'd expect from a
> higher Sn content.
>
to the stuff? I'll give it a shot.
TIA.
John_H
May 12, 2015, 10:56:09 PM5/12/15
to
Clocky wrote:
>On 13/05/2015 8:07 AM, John_H wrote:
>
>> I'm not familiar with
>> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
>> multimeters.
>>
>
>Not the solder however. I didn't know they still sold a soldering
>station though, might be worth a look since I wouldn't mind a second
>unit for the shed and it's reasonably priced so thanks for the tip.
You might do better to check out the Hakko 936 clones on ebay, for
>On 13/05/2015 8:07 AM, John_H wrote:
>
>> I'm not familiar with
>> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
>> multimeters.
>>
>
>Not the solder however. I didn't know they still sold a soldering
>station though, might be worth a look since I wouldn't mind a second
>unit for the shed and it's reasonably priced so thanks for the tip.
which tips and other parts are more likely to be readily available.
The original Hakko was a professional quality iron that's now obsolete
(mine's around 20 y.o and still going strong). Here's one example
but there are others....
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/936E-220V-60W-Thermostat-Constant-Temperature-Soldering-Station-Solder-Iron-Kit-/191384609826?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item2c8f696422
>> Jaycar solder was, and possibly still is, Consolodated Alloys (it's
>> got "CAPALLOY" imprinted on the spool)... of which I've never been a
>> fan. It doesn't flow nearly as well as Multicore, or the Chinese
>> brand I recently bought on ebay. It's also a much duller colour,
>> which seems a bit odd since both are claimed to be 60/40. The Chinese
>> stuff (claimed to be 63/37) is brighter still, as you'd expect from a
>> higher Sn content.
>>
>
>Does your Chinese roll have a decipherable brand or do you have a link
>to the stuff? I'll give it a shot.
>TIA.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/400535238617?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Note that it's 1mm diameter and that particullar roll is around 100g.
I haven't checked what other sizes and quantities might be available.
--
John H
John_H
May 12, 2015, 11:39:50 PM5/12/15
to
John_H wrote:
>
>You might do better to check out the Hakko 936 clones on ebay, for
>which tips and other parts are more likely to be readily available.
>The original Hakko was a professional quality iron that's now obsolete
>(mine's around 20 y.o and still going strong). Here's one example
>but there are others....
>http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/936E-220V-60W-Thermostat-Constant-Temperature-Soldering-Station-Solder-Iron-Kit-/191384609826?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item2c8f696422
This one might be even better, as well cheaper....
>
>You might do better to check out the Hakko 936 clones on ebay, for
>which tips and other parts are more likely to be readily available.
>The original Hakko was a professional quality iron that's now obsolete
>(mine's around 20 y.o and still going strong). Here's one example
>but there are others....
>http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/936E-220V-60W-Thermostat-Constant-Temperature-Soldering-Station-Solder-Iron-Kit-/191384609826?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item2c8f696422
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Yihua-Soldering-Station-YH936C-50W-Lead-Free-Solder-ESD-SAFE-CE-Sydney-1Year-WRT-/271514158500?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item3f378145a4
It's from a GST registered Australian based company who're very good
to deal with and send stuff promptly. They also stock Hakko tips (and
other parts) which I've bought from them previously.
Might also be worth googling Yihua 936 as it's a very popular clone.
--
John H
Phil Allison
May 13, 2015, 12:38:04 AM5/13/15
to
John_H wrote:
>
> Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
> rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label). I'm not familiar with
> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
> multimeters.
** "Digitor" is DSE's own brand, used on heaps of cheap Chinese stuff.
>
> Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
> rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label). I'm not familiar with
> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
> multimeters.
>
> Jaycar solder was, and possibly still is, Consolodated Alloys (it's
> got "CAPALLOY" imprinted on the spool)... of which I've never been a
> fan. It doesn't flow nearly as well as Multicore, or the Chinese
> brand I recently bought on ebay. It's also a much duller colour,
> which seems a bit odd since both are claimed to be 60/40.
1.2mm, 67/43 with "no clean" flux, the label says it came from Holland.
The brand seems to have been acquired by a German company and no longer makes tin/lead solder as it is practically illegal in Europe.
.... Phil
Clocky
May 13, 2015, 1:13:36 AM5/13/15
to
On 13/05/2015 10:56 AM, John_H wrote:
> Clocky wrote:
>> On 13/05/2015 8:07 AM, John_H wrote:
>>
>>> I'm not familiar with
>>> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
>>> multimeters.
>>>
>>
>> Not the solder however. I didn't know they still sold a soldering
>> station though, might be worth a look since I wouldn't mind a second
>> unit for the shed and it's reasonably priced so thanks for the tip.
>
> You might do better to check out the Hakko 936 clones on ebay, for
> which tips and other parts are more likely to be readily available.
> The original Hakko was a professional quality iron that's now obsolete
> (mine's around 20 y.o and still going strong). Here's one example
> but there are others....
> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/936E-220V-60W-Thermostat-Constant-Temperature-Soldering-Station-Solder-Iron-Kit-/191384609826?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item2c8f696422
>
That's the iron I'm currently using, well not that brand but it is
> Clocky wrote:
>> On 13/05/2015 8:07 AM, John_H wrote:
>>
>>> I'm not familiar with
>>> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
>>> multimeters.
>>>
>>
>> Not the solder however. I didn't know they still sold a soldering
>> station though, might be worth a look since I wouldn't mind a second
>> unit for the shed and it's reasonably priced so thanks for the tip.
>
> You might do better to check out the Hakko 936 clones on ebay, for
> which tips and other parts are more likely to be readily available.
> The original Hakko was a professional quality iron that's now obsolete
> (mine's around 20 y.o and still going strong). Here's one example
> but there are others....
> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/936E-220V-60W-Thermostat-Constant-Temperature-Soldering-Station-Solder-Iron-Kit-/191384609826?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item2c8f696422
>
identical. I'm quite happy with it as as I have spare tips galore it
would make sense to simply buy another indeed.
>>> Jaycar solder was, and possibly still is, Consolodated Alloys (it's
>>> got "CAPALLOY" imprinted on the spool)... of which I've never been a
>>> fan. It doesn't flow nearly as well as Multicore, or the Chinese
>>> brand I recently bought on ebay. It's also a much duller colour,
>>> which seems a bit odd since both are claimed to be 60/40. The Chinese
>>> stuff (claimed to be 63/37) is brighter still, as you'd expect from a
>>> higher Sn content.
>>>
>>
>> Does your Chinese roll have a decipherable brand or do you have a link
>> to the stuff? I'll give it a shot.
>> TIA.
>
> Yong Chang Long Soldering Co Ltd....
> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/400535238617?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
>
> Note that it's 1mm diameter and that particullar roll is around 100g.
> I haven't checked what other sizes and quantities might be available.
>
Clocky
May 13, 2015, 1:24:43 AM5/13/15
to
another. They work well enough for mine.
Thanks John.
Computer Nerd Kev
May 13, 2015, 7:28:28 PM5/13/15
to
mention of Dick Smith, got it with some electronics parts so I don't
know where it was purchased.
Same as this:
http://www.powertoolsdirect.com/multicore-m7-ersin-5-core-solder-60-40-0-7mm-diameter
That says this is the same as the "Savbit" stuff.
I've also got a roll of plain Dick Smith branded stuff, no Multicore
logo.
I guess I might have to buy some of the Chinese stuff and have a
"solder-off", though I'd really need a scientific way to judge
quality.
Here's a recent thread on the EEVblog forums that I just found:
http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/solder-quality/
They tend to be pretty rude about the Chinese stuff.
Computer Nerd Kev
May 13, 2015, 7:43:55 PM5/13/15
to
Clocky <notg...@happen.com> wrote:
> On 13/05/2015 8:07 AM, John_H wrote:
>> Clocky wrote:
>>> On 12/05/2015 6:34 AM, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
>>>>
> I'm not familiar with
>> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
>> multimeters.
>>
> Not the solder however. I didn't know they still sold a soldering
> station though, might be worth a look since I wouldn't mind a second
> unit for the shed and it's reasonably priced so thanks for the tip.
The popular 2000 series Dick Smith soldering stations have all actually
> On 13/05/2015 8:07 AM, John_H wrote:
>> Clocky wrote:
>>> On 12/05/2015 6:34 AM, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
>>>>
> I'm not familiar with
>> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
>> multimeters.
>>
> Not the solder however. I didn't know they still sold a soldering
> station though, might be worth a look since I wouldn't mind a second
> unit for the shed and it's reasonably priced so thanks for the tip.
been made by Xytronic:
http://www.xytronic-usa.com/shop/category.aspx?catid=8
The 2000 series model they currently sell has been through a lot of
price changes over the years.
John_H
May 13, 2015, 9:50:23 PM5/13/15
to
>> Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
>> rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label). I'm not familiar with
>> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
>> multimeters.
>
>> rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label). I'm not familiar with
>> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
>> multimeters.
>
>I've got a little bit left on an old reel branded Multicore with no
>mention of Dick Smith, got it with some electronics parts so I don't
>know where it was purchased.
>Same as this:
>http://www.powertoolsdirect.com/multicore-m7-ersin-5-core-solder-60-40-0-7mm-diameter
>That says this is the same as the "Savbit" stuff.
FWIW what I've always known as "Savbit" isn't 60/40 since it has a
>mention of Dick Smith, got it with some electronics parts so I don't
>know where it was purchased.
>Same as this:
>http://www.powertoolsdirect.com/multicore-m7-ersin-5-core-solder-60-40-0-7mm-diameter
>That says this is the same as the "Savbit" stuff.
significant copper content, otherwise it wouldn't work. It's also got
a higher melting point (and wider molten range) than conventional
60/40 and hence isn't as nice to use IMHO. The "quick overview" would
appear to be a plug for Savbit rather than a description of the
advertised item.
>I've also got a roll of plain Dick Smith branded stuff, no Multicore
>logo.
DSE could well have used more than one supplier.
>I guess I might have to buy some of the Chinese stuff and have a
>"solder-off", though I'd really need a scientific way to judge
>quality.
IMHO.
>Here's a recent thread on the EEVblog forums that I just found:
>http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/solder-quality/
>They tend to be pretty rude about the Chinese stuff.
featured some pretty rough soldering in the past, but I'm still happy
to judge it as I find it and the aforementioned solder is both nice to
use and makes good looking joints. Whether the quality is consistent
between batches remains to be seen although many of the once
run-of-the mill Chinese manufacturers seem to be improving rapidly in
that regard.
Interesting comment on 63/37 as well, which I hadn't previously used.
So far I'm impressed and can't see any problem with the lack of a
molten temperature range. It's the reverse I find a PITA.
Similar with the comment on 350° being too high for lead solders. I'd
seriously doubt if any experienced tech would agree, with the object
being to complete the joint as quickly as it's practical to do without
compromising quality.
--
John H
Clocky
May 14, 2015, 7:07:53 PM5/14/15
to
250gm 60/40 .56mm resin cored solder and it has CAPALLOY on the spool.
I quite like it but that is not to say that there isn't better stuff out
there.
Computer Nerd Kev
May 15, 2015, 6:46:45 AM5/15/15
to
John_H <john...@inbox.com> wrote:
> Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
>>John_H <john...@inbox.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
>>> rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label). I'm not familiar with
>>> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
>>> multimeters.
>>
>>I've got a little bit left on an old reel branded Multicore with no
>>mention of Dick Smith, got it with some electronics parts so I don't
>>know where it was purchased.
>>Same as this:
>>http://www.powertoolsdirect.com/multicore-m7-ersin-5-core-solder-60-40-0-7mm-diameter
>>That says this is the same as the "Savbit" stuff.
>
> FWIW what I've always known as "Savbit" isn't 60/40 since it has a
> significant copper content, otherwise it wouldn't work. It's also got
> a higher melting point (and wider molten range) than conventional
> 60/40 and hence isn't as nice to use IMHO. The "quick overview" would
> appear to be a plug for Savbit rather than a description of the
> advertised item.
Thought so, but searching online didn't quickly come up with a conclusive
> Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
>>John_H <john...@inbox.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Since at least the 1980's any DSE solder I've ever used has been
>>> rebranded Multicore (it said so on the label). I'm not familiar with
>>> Digitor solder but DSE still sell Digitor brand soldering stations and
>>> multimeters.
>>
>>I've got a little bit left on an old reel branded Multicore with no
>>mention of Dick Smith, got it with some electronics parts so I don't
>>know where it was purchased.
>>Same as this:
>>http://www.powertoolsdirect.com/multicore-m7-ersin-5-core-solder-60-40-0-7mm-diameter
>>That says this is the same as the "Savbit" stuff.
>
> FWIW what I've always known as "Savbit" isn't 60/40 since it has a
> significant copper content, otherwise it wouldn't work. It's also got
> a higher melting point (and wider molten range) than conventional
> 60/40 and hence isn't as nice to use IMHO. The "quick overview" would
> appear to be a plug for Savbit rather than a description of the
> advertised item.
description of it. I gather Ersin (who don't seem to have a website, seems
they used to have multicore.com) make both the Multicore and Savbit
products, the latter they sometimes call Multicore Savbit.
>>I've also got a roll of plain Dick Smith branded stuff, no Multicore
>>logo.
>
> The two remnant rolls I've got both have Multicore on the label though
> DSE could well have used more than one supplier.
>
>>I guess I might have to buy some of the Chinese stuff and have a
>>"solder-off", though I'd really need a scientific way to judge
>>quality.
>
> Ease of use and final appearance are the main criteria that matter
> IMHO.
think I'd end up with quite a complicated set-up if I did decide
to do this, or maybe I'll just have to wait until a Spectrometer
comes my way.
>>Here's a recent thread on the EEVblog forums that I just found:
>>http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/solder-quality/
>>They tend to be pretty rude about the Chinese stuff.
>
> Probably deservedly so since many Chinese manufactured devices have
> featured some pretty rough soldering in the past, but I'm still happy
> to judge it as I find it and the aforementioned solder is both nice to
> use and makes good looking joints. Whether the quality is consistent
> between batches remains to be seen although many of the once
> run-of-the mill Chinese manufacturers seem to be improving rapidly in
> that regard.
who have haunted the assembly lines up in Asia.
> Interesting comment on 63/37 as well, which I hadn't previously used.
> So far I'm impressed and can't see any problem with the lack of a
> molten temperature range. It's the reverse I find a PITA.
>
> seriously doubt if any experienced tech would agree, with the object
> being to complete the joint as quickly as it's practical to do without
> compromising quality.
And without having to keep the heat on components too long waiting for
> being to complete the joint as quickly as it's practical to do without
> compromising quality.
the solder to melt. I think I've seen 350C recommended in a few places
and its certainly around what I use.
John_H
May 15, 2015, 6:07:25 PM5/15/15
to
Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
>John_H <john...@inbox.com> wrote:
>>
>> FWIW what I've always known as "Savbit" isn't 60/40 since it has a
>> significant copper content, otherwise it wouldn't work. It's also got
>> a higher melting point (and wider molten range) than conventional
>> 60/40 and hence isn't as nice to use IMHO. The "quick overview" would
>> appear to be a plug for Savbit rather than a description of the
>> advertised item.
>
>Thought so, but searching online didn't quickly come up with a conclusive
>description of it. I gather Ersin (who don't seem to have a website, seems
>they used to have multicore.com) make both the Multicore and Savbit
>products, the latter they sometimes call Multicore Savbit.
AFAIK this is the only one Multicore call Savbit....
>John_H <john...@inbox.com> wrote:
>>
>> FWIW what I've always known as "Savbit" isn't 60/40 since it has a
>> significant copper content, otherwise it wouldn't work. It's also got
>> a higher melting point (and wider molten range) than conventional
>> 60/40 and hence isn't as nice to use IMHO. The "quick overview" would
>> appear to be a plug for Savbit rather than a description of the
>> advertised item.
>
>Thought so, but searching online didn't quickly come up with a conclusive
>description of it. I gather Ersin (who don't seem to have a website, seems
>they used to have multicore.com) make both the Multicore and Savbit
>products, the latter they sometimes call Multicore Savbit.
http://au.rs-online.com/web/p/solders/0554939/
Noting that the melting point is 215, with a molten range of 215 -
183, whereas 63/37 has a melting point of 183 with no molten range.
Multicore is now part of Henkel... a German company that also owns
Loctite. Not absolutely certain but I think the Ersin part only
refers to the flux.
Savbit goes back to the days when soldering irons had unplated copper
bits. Nowadays its main use is for soldering thin copper wires, which
are rapidly dissolved by conventional Sn/Pb solders. It's also
available in small quantities (20g or so) which is the convenient way
to buy it for occasional use.
--
John H
John_H
May 16, 2015, 12:36:03 AM5/16/15
to
>> Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
>>
>>>I guess I might have to buy some of the Chinese stuff and have a
>>>"solder-off", though I'd really need a scientific way to judge
>>>quality.
>>
>> Ease of use and final appearance are the main criteria that matter
>> IMHO.
>
>Thing is that if I do a test I tend to want it to be objective. I
>think I'd end up with quite a complicated set-up if I did decide
>to do this, or maybe I'll just have to wait until a Spectrometer
>comes my way.
All you need is an accurate soldering tip thermometer, since the
>>
>>>I guess I might have to buy some of the Chinese stuff and have a
>>>"solder-off", though I'd really need a scientific way to judge
>>>quality.
>>
>> Ease of use and final appearance are the main criteria that matter
>> IMHO.
>
>Thing is that if I do a test I tend to want it to be objective. I
>think I'd end up with quite a complicated set-up if I did decide
>to do this, or maybe I'll just have to wait until a Spectrometer
>comes my way.
initial melting point and molten range are what you need to know.
Apart from the flux quality (which is always going to be a subjective
assessment).
For mine I'm happy to run test strips on a piece of veroboard. The
ease with which it wets indicates flux quality and the appearance of
the finished product is a good indication of the molten range... those
with a wide range have a matte appearance after they've set.
Running 60/40 Multicore, 60/40 Capalloy and the Yong Chang Long side
by side all three are bright and shiny but the Capalloy doesn't wet as
well as the other two, which suggests that the flux isn't as
effective. I also tried Multicore HMP, Multicore Savbit and WES lead
free, all of which have a matte finish.
The Yong Chang Long also has an ROHS sticker on it. No idea who put
it there but it's probably meant to fool the Euros into thinking it's
lead free (RoHS) when sold in that market, which it definitely isn't.
Nor is the composition stated on the label even though it's being sold
on Ebay au as 63/37, and probably is.
--
John H
Phil Allison
May 16, 2015, 2:16:56 AM5/16/15
to
John_H wrote:
>
> For mine I'm happy to run test strips on a piece of veroboard. The
> ease with which it wets indicates flux quality and the appearance of
> the finished product is a good indication of the molten range... those
> with a wide range have a matte appearance after they've set.
>
> Running 60/40 Multicore, 60/40 Capalloy and the Yong Chang Long side
> by side all three are bright and shiny but the Capalloy doesn't wet as
> well as the other two, which suggests that the flux isn't as
> effective. I also tried Multicore HMP, Multicore Savbit and WES lead
> free, all of which have a matte finish.
** Crikey - what sort to "Savbit" are you using ?
>
> For mine I'm happy to run test strips on a piece of veroboard. The
> ease with which it wets indicates flux quality and the appearance of
> the finished product is a good indication of the molten range... those
> with a wide range have a matte appearance after they've set.
>
> Running 60/40 Multicore, 60/40 Capalloy and the Yong Chang Long side
> by side all three are bright and shiny but the Capalloy doesn't wet as
> well as the other two, which suggests that the flux isn't as
> effective. I also tried Multicore HMP, Multicore Savbit and WES lead
> free, all of which have a matte finish.
I just tried a few solders on a thin strip of copper foil removed from an old V91 dial up modem - so you know how old that is.
The only Pb free type ( Multicore 99C ) was slow to wet and set very dull.
Two others were 60/40 and used "no clean" flux, so were a bit slow to wet and set a tad dull.
OTOH, Savbit wet like greased lighting and set with a mirror finish.
IME (over 40 years) this is how Savbit always performs, soldering tin and nickel plated metals instantly when other solders just dribble off.
... Phil
John_H
May 16, 2015, 6:05:25 PM5/16/15
to
Phil Allison wrote:
>John_H wrote:
>
>>
>> For mine I'm happy to run test strips on a piece of veroboard. The
>> ease with which it wets indicates flux quality and the appearance of
>> the finished product is a good indication of the molten range... those
>> with a wide range have a matte appearance after they've set.
>>
>> Running 60/40 Multicore, 60/40 Capalloy and the Yong Chang Long side
>> by side all three are bright and shiny but the Capalloy doesn't wet as
>> well as the other two, which suggests that the flux isn't as
>> effective. I also tried Multicore HMP, Multicore Savbit and WES lead
>> free, all of which have a matte finish.
>
>
>** Crikey - what sort to "Savbit" are you using ?
One that looks like this.... http://tinyurl.com/mn39597
>John_H wrote:
>
>>
>> For mine I'm happy to run test strips on a piece of veroboard. The
>> ease with which it wets indicates flux quality and the appearance of
>> the finished product is a good indication of the molten range... those
>> with a wide range have a matte appearance after they've set.
>>
>> Running 60/40 Multicore, 60/40 Capalloy and the Yong Chang Long side
>> by side all three are bright and shiny but the Capalloy doesn't wet as
>> well as the other two, which suggests that the flux isn't as
>> effective. I also tried Multicore HMP, Multicore Savbit and WES lead
>> free, all of which have a matte finish.
>
>
>** Crikey - what sort to "Savbit" are you using ?
The hidden part of the label says "SAVBIT ALLOY".
>I just tried a few solders on a thin strip of copper foil removed from an old V91 dial up modem - so you know how old that is.
>The only Pb free type ( Multicore 99C ) was slow to wet and set very dull.
>
>Two others were 60/40 and used "no clean" flux, so were a bit slow to wet and set a tad dull.
>
>OTOH, Savbit wet like greased lighting and set with a mirror finish.
Multicore 60/40 certainly performs as you describe and at least one
vendor seems to have confused 60/40 with Savbit (see Kev's earlier
cite).
>IME (over 40 years) this is how Savbit always performs, soldering tin and nickel plated metals instantly when other solders just dribble off.
days of plain copper bits) and I honestly don't remember how it
performed but from the stated composition and melting points
(50/48.5/1.5, 183-215) I wouldn't have expected it to be any different
to what I've currently got.
--
John H
Phil Allison
May 16, 2015, 10:50:20 PM5/16/15
to
John_H wrote:
>
>
> >
> >** Crikey - what sort to "Savbit" are you using ?
>
> One that looks like this.... http://tinyurl.com/mn39597
> The hidden part of the label says "SAVBIT ALLOY".
>
> >I just tried a few solders on a thin strip of copper foil
> > removed from an old V91 dial up modem - so you know how old that is.
>
> >The only Pb free type ( Multicore 99C ) was slow to wet
> > and set very dull.
> >
> >Two others were 60/40 and used "no clean" flux, so were
> > a bit slow to wet and set a tad dull.
> >
> >OTOH, Savbit wet like greased lighting and set with a mirror finish.
>
>
> Is it definitely labled Savbit?
** Been using Savbit since I was a teenager, when it came in a 1 pound cardboard box. For a long time it was just about the only solder on offer for electronic work. Got mine from Radio Despatch Service, then DSE and finally Farnell / Element14.
>
>
> >
> >** Crikey - what sort to "Savbit" are you using ?
>
> One that looks like this.... http://tinyurl.com/mn39597
> The hidden part of the label says "SAVBIT ALLOY".
>
> >I just tried a few solders on a thin strip of copper foil
> > removed from an old V91 dial up modem - so you know how old that is.
>
> >The only Pb free type ( Multicore 99C ) was slow to wet
> > and set very dull.
> >
> >Two others were 60/40 and used "no clean" flux, so were
> > a bit slow to wet and set a tad dull.
> >
> >OTOH, Savbit wet like greased lighting and set with a mirror finish.
>
>
> Is it definitely labled Savbit?
http://au.element14.com/multicore-loctite/ds18-500g-reel/solder-wire-savbit-1-22mm-500g/dp/419450?ost=419450
.... Phil
Phil Allison
May 16, 2015, 11:02:47 PM5/16/15
to
Phil Allison wrote:
>
> ** Been using Savbit since I was a teenager,
> when it came in a 1 pound cardboard box.
** See pic:
>
> ** Been using Savbit since I was a teenager,
> when it came in a 1 pound cardboard box.
http://blog-imgs-45.fc2.com/o/c/4/oc44/ersin02.jpg
... Phil
~misfit~
May 17, 2015, 9:47:52 PM5/17/15
to
was when recently buying a "1 litre tin of IPA". I can always use IPA
(although I normally buy it in smaller quantities) and I have a brother in
law who collects tins. However despite the picture on their site and the
description on the invoice I was annoyed to discover my IPA came in a one
litre plastic bottle. :-/
--
Shaun.
"Humans will have advanced a long, long, way when religious belief has a
cozy little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
0 new messages